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User Topic: BS Questions for WS's
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 10:17 AM, July 9th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

forgivingone -

He said he felt so bad about himself, that is the issue that led him to have the A, and now he feels even worse about himself. Low self esteem, no self respect.

Isn't that the ultimate Catch- 22,??

Yes, it is. But when the A is developing, the outcome of feeling like slime afterward is not on your mind. The OP is feeding your need for positive feedback about who you are. They are only to glad to compliment you on how awesome you are. And at the time, I like an idiot soaked it all up.

The time the blinders come off and you realize how you've made yourself an even lower person is after it all comes crashing down and you have to face reality. By then, it's too late.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
Ingrid
♀ Member
Member # 20126
Default  Posted: 10:18 AM, July 9th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Listening closely said:

"It seems completely appropriate given your circumstances. The key will be how you follow up. If he chooses the OW, you need to be prepared to follow through on the D filing."

In the e-mail I just wrote to him LC, I pointed it out quite clear, that he needs to make a decision NOW. Either A) me and his family who love him, or B) his inappropriate relationship(s). But I didn't give any sort of time frame. Should I have? Like by the end of August or something exact?

What if he never responds with HIS CHOICE.

I really need to know time frames here.
How much time did your wife give you? Did she demand you answer her then and there when she found out about your A? Were you separated LC?

Now, I'm really doubting if I did the right thing by asking him to leave when I found out about the stripper. HE claims "I'm the one who kicked him out". Well, there's just no way I could have him in our home while he's carrying on. No way. Just too hurtful for me!!!!

I'd like to hear how your wife handled it exactly.

I really appreciate your advice! Thanks.

P.S. LC: you said this:
"The time the blinders come off and you realize how you've made yourself an even lower person is after it all comes crashing down and you have to face reality. By then, it's too late."

WHAT made the blinders come off for you???? What would it take to make the blinders come off for any man who's engaged in an A???

BS (me)
WS (him)
Married 18 years, 2 teens
WS, sex-addict for entire marriage
D/Day: 5/29/08

[This message edited by Ingrid at 10:22 AM, July 9th (Wednesday)]


Posts: 232 | Registered: Jul 2008 | From: L.A. CA
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 10:25 AM, July 9th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

SoSleepless -

why cant he be looking at me one day and just appologise out of the blue so i actually feel like its coming from and isnt being prodded out of him

why cant he ever initiate any conversations, or strike up one when he can see how low im feeling.

i still feel like i am the one doing all the work and thats not how its meant to go

Coming out of the fog and looking at reality was highly disorienting for me. While I was buried in my A, my family figured out how to survive without a husband and father a lot. My company continued to operate without me being a focused leader.

I've often described it as getting off a long train that is moving at about 80 MPH. You close your eyes and then open them. The car you were on and what you saw from that perspective are now gone. Everything is changed. And you now have to try to jump back on the train while it's still moving at 80 MPH from a stand still. It's scary as anything!

Basically, my IC helped me sort out who I am, what I want and what weaknesses I had to fix. My BW has been a saint. She has "retrained" me to get in tune with the "rythm of our household". My career coach is helping me regain my footing in my business life. And SI is helping me validate the things that work from the things that don't. After over a year of work, I am just starting to feel I might have some sense of orientation to where I am and what is going on around me.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 11:32 AM, July 9th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Ingrid -

But I didn't give any sort of time frame. Should I have? Like by the end of August or something exact?

It would probably help. For us, it was over the course of a weekend. D-Day was on a Saturday morning (around 9 AM). Wells made it clear I needed to commit to stay in it. She didn't give a date and time that I recall, but I knew it was pretty much immediately. I made the commitment to R on Sunday morning just before church, and we sat down with our pastor that night to start to figure out where we should go for help.

What if he never responds with HIS CHOICE.

A lack of a response from him IS a response from him. It demonstrates a lack of willingness to commit to you and your family. If I had not committed within about 24 to 48 hours, I have no doubt Wells would have forced the issue assuming I was not committed to R.

How much time did your wife give you?

Basically that weekend, and that was it.

Did she demand you answer her then and there when she found out about your A?

No, not then and there. But I knew the fuse was very very short.

Were you separated LC?

Thankfully we never separated. I believe that if we were I would still have been a cake eater until Wells pulled the plug.

Now, I'm really doubting if I did the right thing by asking him to leave when I found out about the stripper.

He made the choice, not you. If he had told you right then and there he was done with the OW, and showed you he was committed to you, would you have let him stay?

I'd like to hear how your wife handled it exactly.

You have a PM from my BW (dreamingofwells)

WHAT made the blinders come off for you???? What would it take to make the blinders come off for any man who's engaged in an A???

A lot of things go into it, but there were three big ones for me:

1. Seeing the pain in Wells' face on D-Day.

2. Time away from xMOW through NC allowing me to sort it out without the "noise" caused by her non-supportive views of my M.

3. Work in IC that surfaced my own flaws and helped me understand my addiction and it's impact.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
lilliolly
Member
Member # 19647
Default  Posted: 1:47 PM, July 9th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks Beach

That all made perfect sense, everything you put describes him.

Do you think that's why he has become distant with his children aswell then?? he was always such a doting dad?

Also how can an addictive relationship last?? epecially based upon lies?

What leads a ws into this sort of relationship if they had a healthy relationship with their BS??

Lastly will this fantasy ever end?

Lilliolly


Posts: 71 | Registered: May 2008 | From: England
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 2:10 PM, July 9th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

lilliolly -

Do you think that's why he has become distant with his children as well then?? he was always such a doting dad?

Following on Beach's input, the same principle applies. In order to maintain the environment of no commitment and no responsibilities, your WH needs to create distance between himself and the obligations he already has. Distancing from the kids is part of that space he is trying to create.

He's also probably seeing them as something that prevents him from enjoying time with OW rather than a priority in his life.

Also how can an addictive relationship last?? especially based upon lies?

It will last as long as it goes unchallenged. Basically until one or the other is held fully accountable for what they are doing and the impact it is having, the relationship could theoretically continue forever.

What leads a ws into this sort of relationship if they had a healthy relationship with their BS??

It's different for each WS. In my case I was looking for people to tell me I was a great guy because I didn't believe it myself. xMOW was willing to do so. My relationship with my BW had it's rough edges, but overall it was good. I just chose to let me need for constant ego stroking emphasize the negative aspects of our M beyond what they truly were.

Lastly will this fantasy ever end?

Again, it will end when one or the other are held fully accountable for their actions. Fully accountable specifically meaning D papers, the threat of paying child support or spousal support, outing the A to others that they don't want to know about it for fear of tarnishing their image, etc. Until that time, it could continue on unchecked.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
bear
♂ Member
Member # 19859
Default  Posted: 2:25 PM, July 9th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

lilliolly, if you don't mind I'll jump in on your question, because it was beach's 'addictive relationship' post that kicked my butt into gear.

I can almost guarantee that your WH didn't know he was an addict...probably still doesn't unless he's going through IC or has been reading these threads himself. I absolutely did not. He didn't choose an additive relationship, he got caught in his own internal trap.

He absolutely has been effected by his additive fog at home. When you're so 'hooked' everything is surreal. Real life is the period of time between your 'fix'. It's horrible.

The relationship will last until he is able to free himself from the Fantasy Fog, if only in his mind. I'm still struggling, and I've been at it for months, even without contact with xOW.

'Something' else was lacking in his character that made him vulnerable to an A. The big question is going to be 'what was that?' I'm still working on that one, too.

Believe me, he is addicted. It's a scary place for all concerned.

I'm sure beach, Listeningclosely, and others will be able to give you some great feedback, but this one is REALLY close to home for me.

[This message edited by bear at 2:55 PM, July 9th (Wednesday)]


WH (me): 59
BW: 56
M: 34 years
Together: 38 years
2 DDs: 21 & 25
d'day: 2-11-2008
A: EA & PA 6 months


Posts: 102 | Registered: Jun 2008 | From: South
beach
♀ Member
Member # 7533
Default  Posted: 3:07 PM, July 9th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks LC and bear for adding input.

I am kind of adding my own "aha" moment from my experience.

lilliolly -

What leads a ws into this sort of relationship if they had a healthy relationship with their BS??


Let me briefly say, for some people, it was started out as a friendship, and it was becoming slipperly slope and her/his mental boundary became fuzzy and then selfishly emotionally cross the boundary, before they know it, it became a part of their daily life and made them think like they couldn't live without it.

For some, it started out as FWB/hooked up at online site , and thinking that they could handle it by compartmentalizing, and the time goes by, mental boundary became fuzzy and then selfishly emotionally cross the boundary and before they know it, it went deeper and stuck.

Also some of them are like my sitch, we were open to start with and sex only meeting was ok, but as time goes by, mental boundary become fuzzy and selfishly emotionally cross the boundary and before we know it, it went deeper and stuck. At that stage, it became a part of our life and couldn't stop.


The way the OPs made FWSs feel fuels the addictive relationship. Many stroking egos....My XOM was out of league (younger, artistic, lean athretic, musician looks). Over time, I made him up as a fantasy boyfriend. Even though I was married, but I was thinking of myself as a wife and I was a royal girlfriend to xOP at the same time and I wanted to be connected with him 24/7. XOM's telling me we were hot looking couple and that having xOM being into me made me feel I still 'got' it, didn't help. It made me fell like I was acting in the fantasy world. Acting out with the ideal fantasy lover in the limited time, sex became intense and leaving me the feeling of wanting for more and looking forward to the next meeting. It gave me the high and was getting addictive activities for me.

Speaking from my own experience, when most FWSs were not in the normal 24/7 relationship with xAP and not in the marrieage where there is no domestic responsibilities, taking care of kids, or paying the bills, most WS tend to rominticize xAP looking through the rose colored glasses and think xAP is ideal person in their view. Limited time meetings/communication fuels the fantasy world and it enabled FWSs to perpetuate the fantasies and became the intense meeting/chat session and look forward to the next session.

I hope this makes sense.

[This message edited by beach at 3:08 PM, July 9th (Wednesday)]


If you don't find peace with yourself, you cannot find anywhere else.
Appreciate and cherish what I have.

Posts: 8680 | Registered: Jul 2005 | From: midwest
lilliolly
Member
Member # 19647
Default  Posted: 3:43 PM, July 9th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks Beach, it makes perfect sense.

L.C Husband is already paying child maintainence,spousal maintainence he has seen a solicitor.Also everyone inc friends & family know the truth now about the 2 of them having an affair, my husband went mad blaming me for telling her family(which it wasn't)he was also mad when i told her xbf why?

Her family are discusted with what she has done and remain good friends with her xbf, even with her family knowing now they continue to see each other.!?!?

Also why hasn't my H introduced his family and our kids to the OW afterall they have been together 7-8 months??

If there are no strings attached in this relationship, why did he say she would never cheat on me?

I have tried the 180 turn on him, but nothing seems to be working??

Lilliolly

[This message edited by lilliolly at 3:54 PM, July 9th (Wednesday)]


Posts: 71 | Registered: May 2008 | From: England
beach
♀ Member
Member # 7533
Default  Posted: 4:08 PM, July 9th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

lilliolly,

IMHO, 180 is not the manipurate tool to make WS come back to their family. It is for you to heal and preparation to live without WS.

Also as long as you put focus on the OP or relationship of , you are giving them too much power.

If everyone around them know and they are still going out openly, it is now their reality, they have nothing to hide. As LC mentioned in his other response, when people are in separated situation, some think it is ok to see other people. They will continue seeing each other until either of them hit the rock bottom, ie, lose the jobs or live or death situation (Illness).

Also why hasn't my H introduced his family and our kids to the OW afterall they have been together 7-8 months??

Why would you want him to confuse your children? He only wants to be with OW for fantasy, and it was not like trying to find the next wife, that maybe a part of reason he didn't want to introduce to his family and children yet.

[This message edited by beach at 4:19 PM, July 9th (Wednesday)]


If you don't find peace with yourself, you cannot find anywhere else.
Appreciate and cherish what I have.

Posts: 8680 | Registered: Jul 2005 | From: midwest
Ingrid
♀ Member
Member # 20126
Default  Posted: 6:13 PM, July 9th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Question for LC or anybody following my scenario:

I sent 3 mails to my WS this morning. This was what one of them said.

In one of the e-mails I just wrote to him LC, I pointed it out quite clear, that he needs to make a decision NOW. Either A) me and his family who love him, or B) his inappropriate relationship(s).

Then 2 others--1 suggesting for his own good he needs to eliminate the stripper so he can see clearly the choices before him and have the fog lifted from his eyes. That no one ever recovers from an addiction when engaged in the substance; and then one saying, he either drop the stripper immediately or our marriage is over and I will be filing for Divorce. I didn't tell him when, or give any time frames.

He wrote me back to these saying exactly, "You continue to threaten, doesn't work that way, go file if thats what you want."

Don't know what to make of this. Also got a phone message from him today, telling me to stop demanding, trying to control the situation, that "if I want to call the girl and say it's over it will up to me, and then I don't even know if I'd want to come back home."

WHAT SHOULD I DO/RESPOND?

For now nothing. Just returned from my counselor, she said that's good I posed these choices to him, but not to make any decisions until totally and completely rational, which I am NOT these days, I'm in complete turbulence. It's only been 1 mo. separated.

Do you think by him saying this, "go ahead and file today if thats what you want", he really means it? That, his choice is not with his family, or is HE not thinking clearly either. And it's just his way of saying, DONT PRESSURE ME.

LC? Your views? How should I take this?

Dear Bear: My WS is a sex addict and has been one our whole marriage of 18 yrs. He's in an addictive relationship with a stripper. UGH

[This message edited by Ingrid at 6:17 PM, July 9th (Wednesday)]


Posts: 232 | Registered: Jul 2008 | From: L.A. CA
dmb364041
♀ Member
Member # 19710
Default  Posted: 6:14 PM, July 9th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

IMHO, 180 is not the manipurate tool to make WS come back to their family. It is for you to heal and preparation to live without WS.


Everyone says to do the 180, but IMO I don't think that will work. My situation is so very close to situation being discussed here. He seems to be getting close to letting OW go, but he has admitted that he is addicted to her and can't stop and sometimes doesn't want to, although he knows and feels guilty about hurting me and family. All of his friends and family know about the A. My family does not except for sister. The reason I classify it as an A is because I didn't know and it began two weeks prior to our S. We are currently S, but have been trying to R despite OW in picture. I know I will not have R unless she is not in the picture and I have begun letting him know that I am reaching the end of my rope. At the beginning he would have chose her, then me, now he isn't sure again. I don't want him back becasue of an ultimatim, nor do I want to be second best. I want him back becasue he decided that is what he wants.


Me (36) BW
Him FWH (37)
Status in R

DD 4, DD 2yr
D-Day 4-7-08
"Celebrate we will...cause life is short, but sweet for certain." DJM

Posts: 258 | Registered: May 2008
Ingrid
♀ Member
Member # 20126
Default  Posted: 6:28 PM, July 9th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Dear dmb:

Hi! I can relate perfectly to what you're saying!!! And I feel the exact same way.

"I don't want him back becasue of an ultimatim, nor do I want to be second best. I want him back becasue he decided that is what he wants."

I totally and fully realize I have been very demanding and controlling and you cannot be that way with a WS, it will drive them away from you. I'm just completing my Step One in S-ANON, realize and accepting you cannot make someone change. It is 100% completely out of our control. I'm just starting to realize this now, and do what I need to for me and my kids. Protect myself/have boundaries.

Nice to talk with you--we'll keep in touch.

PS: dmb: how long do you estimate you will wait for your WS to come around?

I know in my heart, I cannot wait for too long, and feel if he hasn't decided something pretty quick after just the fact of being separated, then they must not care to come back, or this fact alone would budge them back towards us, their wives who love them and their families.

BS - Me
WS - him, SA/porn on/off
Married 18 years, 2 teenaged boys
D/Day 5/29/08 w/ stippper,

[This message edited by Ingrid at 6:32 PM, July 9th (Wednesday)]


Posts: 232 | Registered: Jul 2008 | From: L.A. CA
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 8:07 PM, July 9th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Ingrid -

He wrote me back to these saying exactly, "You continue to threaten, doesn't work that way, go file if thats what you want."

Those words are the key. "What you want.". Right now, he has given you two choices. One is to back off, let things remain status quo, and put up with whatever he feels like doing. And at least right now, it appears he feels like keeping his relationship with the OW while hanging onto you as a backup.

The other is to follow up on your words. They aren't threats if you do what you say. But if you say them and then don't follow through, they become idle threats. And the next time you decide you've had enough and express it, he'll blow it off assuming you won't follow through then either.

I have been very demanding and controlling and you cannot be that way with a WS, it will drive them away from you.

I would respectfully rephrase and disagree. If you are stating what you are willing to accept and live with, it is neither demanding or controlling. It is a statement of facts. And the choices a BS makes do not drive a WS away. The WS makes the choice of whether or not to fight for their M from their side. They may blame your hard line stance for the decision, but they have the choice to stay or run. It is not forced upon them.

Do you think by him saying this, "go ahead and file today if thats what you want", he really means it?

I think often times these words are levied by someone as their way of regaining control. They don't believe you will file, and they are "putting you on notice" that you will lose them. The irony is you've already lost him if he can't see his way clear to want you. You can't turn this into a contest between you and the OW. I chose my BW because I love her with all my heart, and there is no competition for her. She is the only one I want as my partner in life.

Just returned from my counselor, she said that's good I posed these choices to him, but not to make any decisions until totally and completely rational

I understand, but nor should the strain you are going through in S be an indefinite purgatory for you either. You need to decide what actions allow you and your kids to remain strong and healthy.

If you haven't yet, you should read the PM Wells sent you. It lays out pretty clearly how she handled me on D-Day weekend (it was neither demanding nor controlling. It was, however, very clear what she was willing to accept).

Filing for D does not mean a D will happen. It is the first step in a process, and can be adjusted mid stream if he were to change his thinking. If D papers don't change him, then I'm not sure anything will. In that case, you would remain legally married to a man who would play the field because he felt free to do so.

Others may have different experiences and opinions. I can only reiterate that by Wells making it clear what she was willing to do, and my knowing she never makes idle threats, it was the shock my system needed to start the process of becoming the man I should have been.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
Sicofitall
♀ Member
Member # 18508
Default  Posted: 11:02 PM, July 9th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My question....

My WH and I were talking the other day about our marriage and he said that he needs excitement in his life. He can't just sit at home (as if I ever asked him to). Of course I know that. He's a type A personality and always has been.
My thoughts went straight to a question I asked him months ago. Since he said that they couldn't go anywhere together for fear of being discovered just what exactly did they do with all of the time they spent together (besides the obvious answer). He told me at the time that they basically just sat around and watched TV.

So I reminded my WH of that conversation and told him I was confused as to how he could just sit around with her and not with me.
He got angry and gave me the "it's not about her it's about us" speech.

Why does he not seem to see the connection? Why does he get angry with me instead of just answering the question.
And finally, although I realize you may not have the answer to this one, why WAS he able to just sit around with her and not with me?


BW (me)52
WH 53
Maried 31yrs
Together 36yrs
DS's 24 & 29

DD 6/28/07
SD 8/29/07
2nd DD 1/13/08
DD #3 9/21/08


Posts: 497 | Registered: Mar 2008 | From: Smack dab in the middle
Fallen
♀ Member
Member # 4313
Default  Posted: 12:18 AM, July 10th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((Sic)))

So he says he wants to "do" something. He says they sat around and watched TV, and at home that's doing nothing. Hmm, seems to me that when he was watching TV with her he was doing something: he was cheating.

What he may be asking for is more quality time with you. You might want to read the book The Five Languages of Love. He may not be able to articulate that what he needs to feel loved by you is face to face, alone, together time.


You can't heal what you won't feel.

"There would be no grand absolution, only forgiveness meted out in these precious sips. It would well up from his heart in spoonfuls, and he would feed it to me. And it would be enough."


Posts: 23475 | Registered: May 2004
Sicofitall
♀ Member
Member # 18508
Default  Posted: 1:37 AM, July 10th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

What he may be asking for is more quality time with you. You might want to read the book The Five Languages of Love. He may not be able to articulate that what he needs to feel loved by you is face to face, alone, together time.

You don't know how much I wish that were the case, but unfortunately, no.
This is about his addictive personality and the things he likes to do for excitement.

Golf- I don't play. He didn't either until YS starting playing. Then all the sudden it was the most important thing in life!
I've taken lessons. I suck and I hate it!
She played with him often, usually entertaining clients and many times having to go out of town to do so.

Betting on the horses-
We went a few times with friends when we were first married. We had fun. Then he started being consumed by it. Not losing a lot of money mind you. Just the idea of trying to win, period.
We would go and he would spend the entire time with his nose burried in the racing form or one of the many tip sheets he subscribed to. No conversation. Just study, race to the window and bet, come back and root his horses on, then onto the next race. All day long, then bet the simulcasts!
It was all work and no fun, and to tell the truth he was no fun to be around. So I stopped going. He can now do all of this on the Internet from home. GREAT!

The stock market-
Just glorified betting if you ask me. But when he was home the TV had to be on the stock market channel. Alllll the time. And he has more than one trading account on which he likes to day trade. Again, it's not like he loses money. It's just all the time he uses to study the reports he subscribes to and try to beat the system, and so little to show for it.

These are all things that consumed him when he was home with me, but, besides the golf, he never did when he was with her. I don't understand it and it hurts me terribly.

THAT's what the discussion was about. I've told him I'll take golf lessons again and will go to the track with him again, but he has to be willing to give some too. Don't pretend I'm not there when I'm right next to him and maybe, just maybe, do something I like to do every once in awhile.

But the question remains, why was he not like this with her? Why did she get the best of him and I got the worst? Oh, but, it's not about her. It's about us.


Sorry for the long explanation. I guess I'm just venting now.



BW (me)52
WH 53
Maried 31yrs
Together 36yrs
DS's 24 & 29

DD 6/28/07
SD 8/29/07
2nd DD 1/13/08
DD #3 9/21/08


Posts: 497 | Registered: Mar 2008 | From: Smack dab in the middle
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 6:33 AM, July 10th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

sic -

Why does he not seem to see the connection? Why does he get angry with me instead of just answering the question.
And finally, although I realize you may not have the answer to this one, why WAS he able to just sit around with her and not with me?

My thoughts were along the same line as Fallen's:

he was doing something: he was cheating.

Remember that the A is about a fantasy, thus, an escape from his reality. Sitting in your home that he is surrounded by on a daily basis is mundane. Sitting in someone else's home with a different person, different conversations, etc. is a change, and thus exciting to him.

This is about his addictive personality and the things he likes to do for excitement.

IMHO, it goes beyond being addictive. He sounds a lot like me. I readily admit (and somehow Wells accepts) that I am about as ADHD as they come when it comes to hobbies. Attend a golf tournament and suddenly playing is all I'm focused on. Travel to the shore and I'm obsessed with boating. Go to a concert and I need to buy an instrument and learn that style of music. Each phase lasts until the next thing catches my attention, and off I go onto another path.

I guess as long as I don't drive my family to the poorhouse with impulse purchases there's no major harm. But since Wells is more stable in her approach to interests, I know it can drive her batty sometimes.

As time goes on, I am trying to find the happy medium wherever I can. I've been in a barbershop harmony chorus for about three years now, and have arranged to give her a singing valentine (with yours truly in the quartet) so she can share in the enjoyment of my hobby. If golf is the fascination of the moment, perhaps you can simply walk the course with him as he plays (no harm in that on anyone's part, and it gives you a good 4-5 hours of quality conversation in the process). Since he seems interested in areas of wagering, perhaps starting a small group of neighbors or friends to play cards with on a regular basis would be both entertaining and engage in conversation since it is a game involving wagering but also involves interactive conversation. You could wager over potato chips for all it matters - it doesn't have to involve losing money.

The key is to get creative and find ways to participate together in interests that will change frequently.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
Blackbird
♀ New Member
Member # 19511
Default  Posted: 11:26 AM, July 10th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have been floundering in understanding where my WS is coming from and hoped I could gain some insight in this forum. It has been almost 3 months since our D-Day. We are fully in R and my WS is doing everything in his power to show me all the love and support he can muster. He has been the perfect partner. We have been doing MC and it is going great. We feel as though we were made for each other. His EA began June of 07 and was a phone long distance relationship which then turned into a planned meeting in Nov to turn it into a PA. The evening did not turn out successful, he says due to guilt I say because she was physically everything he disliked all our lives. I am a fit tan brunette and she was an overweight very pale red head,it didn't help that she was 23 and I am 42. At that point the phone EA kept going till they scheduled another meeting to end the EA and just be friends which went without any sexual physical contact. He tried to end the EA but she wouldn't let him. It finished when I found out and forced it to end. NOW: my question is he says he is struggling with the feeling that he loves her like he has never loved before and even though he loves me deeply he still feels the same as before DDay for the OP. What can I expect? Is this something that will pass? Will I lose him to this feeling because he can't feel it for me? I am so scared and feel so desperate. Please give me some insight on the feelings of WS's. I'm not sure if I can help him or if I should be helping him. I feel that our recovery will go more quickly if the feelings can be transformed but I just want to tell him to quit and get over it.


Married 23 years
WS-46
Me-42
2children Daughter-16 Son-14
Dday 4/13/08
Recovering and moving on together

Posts: 18 | Registered: May 2008 | From: california
prettyfuture
♀ Member
Member # 17293
Default  Posted: 11:43 AM, July 10th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi blackbird, I posted to your question when it was in WS so I will paste my answer to you here. Thanks.

If he really loved OW the right way, he would be with her. It is more of a fantasy love-- infatuation, lust, and mostly, loving the way she makes him feel about herself. ESPECIALLY with the age difference. If he remains NC with her, he will have more time and space to think in REALITY instead of fantasy world and he will probably eventually come to think, "what was I doing/ thinking??? How could I have almost thrown it all away for her?" And if he goes to IC (which I strongly recommend for him), he can explore the issues behind what led him to get involved with someone outside his marriage and he will eventually realize that love can't be so selfish and destructive.

This is way more about HIM than her or "love" or even you... he will come to realize that if he keeps doing things the right way. Best wishes to you and if you need anything else PM me, I may not know where you thread's been moved to.


Me: FWF (fiance), 28
I broke off engagement: May '07, then he found out about EA
I confessed PA: Oct. '07 and we started R.
In true R since Feb. '08
RE-ENGAGED: 10/08/09
Getting married in Oct. 2010 :)

Posts: 1090 | Registered: Dec 2007
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