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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: BS Questions for WS's
lookinforward
♀ Member
Member # 20577
Question  Posted: 11:09 AM, August 11th (Monday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I am new. My story is in my profile. I have read through many post trying to find anyone who is in similar situation but have not.

I want to know if any other WS went through what my WH is going through and does it make sense?

I made a decision to use the EA/PA as a catalyst to build a more loving relationship. We have been M 12 yrs and had not been intimate with one another for over 6 months before the PA due to a stressful family situation that has nearly sucked the life out of both of us. And before that we were very sporadic, mostly due to me. I had always told WH how terrible I felt about it and I didn't want it to be that way, but I was always tired it seemed in addition to the fact that we have had stressful situations in our life for the past 5 or 6 years (infertility, job losses, deaths, etc). His response was that it was okay...so I took him at his word and hoped that once we had a little less stress in our lives we could really work on it.

So now that the stress has eased except for the EA/PA aftermath, I am ready to work on being intimate but he says he cannot. He says he wants to but that he is not feeling that way toward me right now.

I am convinced he is not still having a PA because MOW is in another state. I am telling myself to trust him everyday that he is not still continuing EA via phone.

He says I am closer to the finish line than he is. I am trying to be patient, but I told him everyday I tell myself it doesn't matter trying to protect myself and I am worried that if it takes too long I will have told myself that so many times that I will not longer care.

We are in MC and I am in IC. I am hoping he will enter IC too to help him understand what he is feeling so he can make some headway. He doesn't believe it will help but is willing.

He feels like he is making an effort. He does give me a peck in the morning and the evening , but I feel he is doing the bare minimum to keep things cordial.

Does this make sense to any WS out there? Have any of you felt that way and if so were you able to overcome this and regain your intimacy? Did you ever discover why you felt this way?

I have asked him, but he says he doesn't know. Thank you in advance to any WS who can assist me in understanding what is going on with my WH.


~Without Struggle, There is no Progress

Posts: 1992 | Registered: Aug 2008
wannabenormal
♀ Member
Member # 19772
Default  Posted: 11:20 AM, August 11th (Monday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Have any WS had any 'bad' contact from the OP's BS? Seems like stuff here is starting to go that way and I'm not sure how to handle?

If WS haven't here in this forum, I will ask in the Wayward Side, if that's okay...I know not everyone's had the same situations and I kinda want an answer to this.


BW, divorced: 03/09


Posts: 14252 | Registered: Jun 2008
emeraldisle
♀ Member
Member # 20480
Default  Posted: 3:11 PM, August 11th (Monday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks to the WS who replied to my post. I know when my WH gets angry about anything, he usually takes it out on me...snapping, blaming, etc. So it's reasonable to assume that he is very mad at himself for cheating, and he's taking every little thing out on me. It just feels like a double knife, though. And I sometimes wonder if he's just trying to push me away and get me to leave.

I think at this point he's lost all respect in my eyes, and I see him as very weak, so it wouldn't surprise me if he's doing whatever he can to make ME be the one to call the M off. (trust me; if I had an exit plan available at the moment, he wouldn't have to wait long)


Me: BW, married 14yrs
D-Day 04/2008; 07/2008; 10/2008; 03/2010 & 08/2010
DIVORCED, and moving forward

Posts: 1016 | Registered: Aug 2008 | From: Texas
Ron7127
♂ Member
Member # 10145
Default  Posted: 5:37 PM, August 11th (Monday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Did your BS feel humilated by your choosing the OP over him or her? I look at the OM and wonder what he has that I do not.

Posts: 2273 | Registered: Mar 2006 | From: Minnesota
NoLongerWantHim
♀ Member
Member # 19934
Default  Posted: 10:47 AM, August 12th (Tuesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'm not sure what I'm dealing with here.

Yesterday, I found a pair of worn women's panties in a ziplock bag hidden in a shoe box.

Of course I asked - My concern was a souvenir of his A. So far there have been a few versions of what they are: 1. I have no clue; 2. I bought them on E-Bay; 3. I did buy them, not on E-bay, about 3 years ago, and I'm embarrassed you found them; because now you'll think I'm a "sick freak".

Of course today I had to look harder in the that closet. I found 2 worn training bras.

What's confusing me is that I don't now, nor did I ever have a problem with his having an interest in looking or amusing himself.

FWH seems to totally humiliated; I told him that I've always believed honestly that "kinky" doesn't exist.

If I'm cool knowing with this; why isn't he?


Me & the kids are having the malignancy removed.

If I went to Hogwarts, my Patronus would be my Big Sister - GWADW


Posts: 4117 | Registered: Jun 2008 | From: Where I want to be, on the road to the future
cyclewife
♀ Member
Member # 17922
Default  Posted: 1:55 PM, August 12th (Tuesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

He said it was an exit affair.Wanted out for years. Why did he come home? Four month long EA/PA with single older woman-no kids. He lived with her for about three months. We have three kids. He also said he was looking to peace and found it with her. Also said he found love and happiness after feeling like he was not loved by me. Why in the world did he come home? We are 8 months into R.


BS(me)-37,WS-40
3 kids-s-13, d-7, d-5
married 13 years
Affair started Aug 2007
He moved out 9/15/2007-Said he was moving in with his sister, he moved in with the OW.
OW-51,no one special, just a serial whore
R-hope he's not trying to trick me

Posts: 1314 | Registered: Jan 2008 | From: Texas
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 7:06 AM, August 13th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

unaware -

Can a WS share with me if he is also suffering even though there is no remorse? Is guilt the only emotion? Do the unremorseful miss the good? It would help me to know that he's feeling at least some pain through this.

Believe it or not, there is a tremendous amount of stress that a WS places on themselves while in their fog. It takes a tremendous amount of effort just to keep up the lies and deceit. Then add on top of that the effort invested by the WS in trying to woo their OP, which is significant, while still trying to "fake their normal life" and work, take care of the house, etc. Inside it can be very emotionally draining.

In some ways, D-Day was a tremendous relief for me. It took off the pressure I had built on myself. Granted, it was replaced with the pressure of R, but somehow it's far easier working through the tough issues when what you are working for is something good. That relief never comes to a WS who remains in their fog.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 7:48 AM, August 13th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

lookinforward -

Does this make sense to any WS out there? Have any of you felt that way and if so were you able to overcome this and regain your intimacy? Did you ever discover why you felt this way?

While I didn't feel the way your WH felt, a couple of things make sense.

He says I am closer to the finish line than he is.

The reason for this can be boiled down to two letters: IC. He had the A not because there was something wrong with you, but because there was something messed up inside himself. Until he does the hard work of exploring and figuring out where he is flawed, he will remain stuck and answering "I don't know" to everything.

You cannot work on the "us" until he fixes the "me".

He feels like he is making an effort. He does give me a peck in the morning and the evening , but I feel he is doing the bare minimum to keep things cordial.

Consider looking at "The Five Love Languages". It is entirely possible that the two of you are both working hard, but what you are doing for each other is not being received in the same way it was intended. My BW and I have touched on this area, and are considering reading the full content for better understanding of each other.

At a minimum though, IC for him should be a requirement for R.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 7:53 AM, August 13th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

wannabenormal -

Have any WS had any 'bad' contact from the OP's BS? Seems like stuff here is starting to go that way and I'm not sure how to handle?

I never did, because xMOW had kept everything from her BH through my D-Day. He traveled a good deal for work and their relationship was already trashed due to her withdrawing from him.

Hopefully one of the other FWS's can chime in.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
lookinforward
♀ Member
Member # 20577
Default  Posted: 8:40 AM, August 13th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Listeningclosely - Thank you for responding.

We have both read the book and I thought it was very good. unfortunately, what seems to be a pattern, is that I went full force and began doing and saying things based on his language but he has not. His are affirmation and service and I have been working hard on both. Mine is affirmation and physical touch both of which seem elusive to him.

Last MC session was rough. He feels as though I am telling him what to do, asking him to read books, even get on this board. He feels I am demanding things from him. He says he doesn't process things like I do, that he just has to mull things over in his head.

T said for me to try to find other ways to sooth myself so as not to unleash it on him and for him to try to talk to me more. I walked away in tears mostly because I feel like I can't do it anymore, I'm tired and I am getting to the point where I don't care anymore. He did hug me last night and I could tell he meant it as if he were comforting me (not loving me). For the first time I felt nothing. NOTHING - that was a scary feeling because when someone hugs you especially your spouse you should feel comforted, loved, and cared for but it was just two arms around me and I was numb.

I'm at loss for what to do so for now my decision is to do nothing in regards to our R. I'm not snooping, I'm not asking him if he called the T for IC, not talking about our R. The only action I have decided to take is to work on me who he so thoughtlessly shattered, not in terms of our R, but in picking up the broken pieces of me that he has been scattering in the aftermath.


~Without Struggle, There is no Progress

Posts: 1992 | Registered: Aug 2008
28and sad
♀ New Member
Member # 19926
Default  Posted: 8:43 AM, August 13th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

wannabenormal -

Have any WS had any 'bad' contact from the OP's BS? Seems like stuff here is starting to go that way and I'm not sure how to handle?

I have the XOM W has called my BH a number of times and said things that were not true or has streched the truth. I think that she does this to hurt me and BH R. My BH told her on D Day. I feel bad because I know that she needs answers but I think that she needs to get them from WH. I have posted about this same topic in WW and R forums. I am sending another NC letter but to the XOMW. If it still happens I am going to get legal help. For this is not helping anyone.


Yes it is a long road but I have walking shoes on and I hope we can get you a pair

Posts: 50 | Registered: Jun 2008
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 8:46 AM, August 13th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

emeraldisle -

I think at this point he's lost all respect in my eyes, and I see him as very weak, so it wouldn't surprise me if he's doing whatever he can to make ME be the one to call the M off. (trust me; if I had an exit plan available at the moment, he wouldn't have to wait long)

Maybe it's because I see things much more clearly now than I did a year ago (it's tough to see when your head is up your a$$!). But there are three paths that can happen after D-Day. R, D and marital limbo (I put S in the ML category).

R takes both parties fully vested in it to succeed. If one or the other is not giving full effort, it will fail.

D provides a clear path because it is based on fact and legal processes.

ML creates pain for all involved. And while I don't discount all of the reasons people give for not moving to D (financial, kids, etc.), it just seems to me that it causes more destruction than the downside of D could possibly cause. In essence, everyone is living a lie. It puts stress on everyone until a path toward resolution (R or D) is settled.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 8:50 AM, August 13th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Ron -

Did your BS feel humilated by your choosing the OP over him or her?

Tough question for a FWS to answer. It seems more like a question to ask another BS about to get their feelings directly rather than by proxy.

What I can say is that I have no doubt Wells took a hit from D-Day forward, wondering why what she offered me wasn't enough. It took a lot of time and understanding through IC and MC, but the reality is who she is and what she offers is all I could ever want. But like any relationship, we will need to consistently work at our communication with each other, and find ways to both improve so that collectively we keep getting better as a couple.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 9:07 AM, August 13th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

nolongerwanthim -

If I'm cool knowing with this; why isn't he?

Ok, here's a little hint from my experience as a WS (before I earned the F in front of it). I HATED being forced to confront myself!

Conflict avoidance in and of itself is bad. But it's at it's worst when the conflict arises from your own actions/behavior/words not matching who you are - or at least who you think you are.

So my read would be you've hit an area he is ashamed of - one he does not want to have to face down and deal with. Don't let it drop. don't let him hide from it. He needs to deal with it in order to heal himself.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 9:14 AM, August 13th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

cyclewife -

Why in the world did he come home?

Because it's safe. Despite all the turmoil of the A, there's still a certain stability about being in familiar surroundings, with familiar people. Most of all, it's a place to hide from having to face the consequences of your actions. All the words, threats and "discussions" are tolerable. What isn't is having to face the finality of D - of having to accept the outcome of your own decisions and to realize that the person you have been able to rely upon - even in an angered and hurt state - is no longer there.

I think this is the reason why so many WS's don't "flip back to being themselves" until they are served papers or some other formal process. Even booting them out of the house isn't enough, because it just allows them to feel like they can continue their Wayward lifestyle, and play "family man/woman" when they feel like it.

It's only when there are only two options - in or out of the M - that most WS's are shaken enough to make the call and deal with the results.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 9:23 AM, August 13th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Lookinforward -

T said for me to try to find other ways to sooth myself

It always boggles my mind when an MC or IC will suggest this approach. Clearly, one of the largest casualties in an A is the breakdown of communication between the BS and WS. How is focusing on doing something alone going to help with communication?

I would think finding different ways to communicate would help more. I had trouble communicating in direct conversation with Wells. So rather than pull more inward, I have evolved to putting things in writing (usually here) and then we can talk about my posts. That seems far more productive than keeping everything inside.

He feels as though I am telling him what to do

he just has to mull things over in his head.

There is a huge communication gap exemplified. You need action, he fears it. He is backing down from conflict by trying to stall and buy time "mulling it over". The reality? He is not helping healing - his and yours - because he is not facing his own demons.

I go back to my original point. This will not get better until he goes to IC and faces his own flaws. It's probably time to set it as a requirement of R. He needs to demonstrate his commitment to you through the action of fixing himself in counseling.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
cyclewife
♀ Member
Member # 17922
Default  Posted: 10:32 AM, August 13th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thank you LC, this is exactly what happened. I took him to court, he wanted to come home three weeks later. After he was given ovenights with the kids, when he had never taken care of them all alone ever. He was not allowed to let the OW have any contact with the kids, so he was really on his own for the first time in ten years. However, this does make me feel like I am Plan B. I don't want to be anyone's Plan B.


BS(me)-37,WS-40
3 kids-s-13, d-7, d-5
married 13 years
Affair started Aug 2007
He moved out 9/15/2007-Said he was moving in with his sister, he moved in with the OW.
OW-51,no one special, just a serial whore
R-hope he's not trying to trick me

Posts: 1314 | Registered: Jan 2008 | From: Texas
peachy40
♀ Member
Member # 20108
Default  Posted: 3:28 PM, August 13th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Have any WS had any 'bad' contact from the OP's BS?

My FWS and I received many nasty text messages and emails from the OW's H in the weeks immediately following D-Day. Some were taunting my H and some were just calling him an a-hole.

Then the OW's H had the nerve to send ME an email telling me the OW's version of events of the A! Keep in mind...we used to be very good friends with this couple. We used to travel with them, and go out to dinner together. The OW's H knows me, and has no reason to hurt me. She told her H that my H was the aggressor, and she was just the 'innocent victim'. I know that is not true, b/c I saw the cell phone records, where she called him, just as much as he called her. Also, one of their first physical encounters was at her parents house. Ummm...who does he think invited my H over there? Then, he proceeded to tell me intimate details of the A, some of which were true, many were exaggerated, and some were flat out lies! I was pissed!

My H was fully disclosing info. at that point, but I wasn't ready for that flood of information. I had to send the OW's H a letter of NC!

What is so ironic, is that he had an A two years ago! He was the one who started this whole mess This was definitely a revenge A for the OW. I am not discounting my H's role in all of this, but had the OW's H kept his d**k in his pants, she would have kept her slutty legs closed!

[This message edited by peachy40 at 3:34 PM, August 13th (Wednesday)]


Status: Happily Reconciled!
Me: BS 40
Him: FWS 42
Together: 19 years; Married: 17 years
Beautiful daughter: 15
Amazing son: 13
Affair: 18month EA; last 6 month PA w/ former close friend and former neighbor (we have moved)

Posts: 132 | Registered: Jul 2008 | From: Atlanta
nooneeverthought
♀ Member
Member # 20157
Default  Posted: 4:15 PM, August 13th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Things are going really well in our R'ing. One thing my H and I had started doing was writing poetry at night as part of our healing. My H had taken the book to work to transcribe in a journal bought just for that. He works with OW, opposite shifts, but, he had forgotten the book in a bag on the desk. She not only looked in his bag, opened the books and read them but felt ok enough with doing that to have a discussion with my h the next day at work about it. he thought it was okay since he said he was working on his marriage and starting fresh with his wife. i said no---nc means No F'ing Contact. Not only did she invade something very personal to me and my healing, she got you alone enough to talk about it. We did S for 4 months and he has been home 2, I know he talked to her because he still feels badly for her and didn't want to hurt her feeling....I asked him if he could give me what i need, he said he can, this is so frustrating, I told him at this point he cannot care what her feelings are, mine needs to be the only ones he cares about......My H really is a NICE guy and that is why he cannot work OT when she is there, how do I express my need to him so that he completely understands?


it doesn't matter where you go in life ,it's who you have the beside you

Posts: 8493 | Registered: Jul 2008
hawthorne_08
♀ Member
Member # 17687
Default  Posted: 7:37 PM, August 13th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

nooneeverthought -

there are a few WSs on this thread who are very patient and well versed, i tend to just get to it, so please continue to ask me questions if my answer does not satisfy. ok?

starting from the end and working back, "how do i express my need to him so he gets it?" - if he doesn't get it now, than he won't until he understands he is in a position to lose everything. have you laid out the conditions of R? have you told him the consequences of breaking said conditions? are you willing to stick to them?

believe me, these tools work. my BH 180'd and filed so fast i didn't know what hit me. but it worked!

you tell him point blank "even a hello to her is an active display of disrespect to me which will not be tolerated one more second. your partnering with her to humiliate our marriage is not acceptable."

now, you must also thank him for being honest with you and share that you realize that he might be afraid of telling you about her shenanigans - but first you need from him a display of unity which means NC. then the two of you will deal with her antics as a united front.

on a different note - not to be disparaging - but i have a hard time believing she went in his bag. sorry, i just do...is she a documented psycho? if she has that little regard for boundaries, than he needs a new job. but why would she do that? that just seems very weird to me. i'll bet it was more like she caught him with it, maybe even while writing and asked him what he was doing and he shared. i don't want to plant ugly seeds - and maybe i am missing info - but really? in professional environment somebody is going to enter somebody else's workspace and sift through their personal belongings, read it and go unnoticed? nope. don't buy it.

is he in a cubicle? tell him to lock his things in a cabinet. or he must have a locker? or leave it in the car.

i think writing poetry together is a beautiful exercise.

here if you need me,
Hawthorne


FWW
I am married with R on top
Me: 42
H: 43
DDay: 11/10/07

Remember that STRESSED spelled backwards is DESSERTS.


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