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User Topic: Long Term Affairs X I I I
Whatnow28
♀ Member
Member # 19345
Default  Posted: 2:47 PM, September 25th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

LH- Wow! That's quite the mistake. Glad to hear that you've got some support & I am SO glad SI is back so we can all lend a shoulder or hand...or whatever else you need. ((HUGS))


Why does this A stuff have to be such a GAME, when there are no winners?

This ^^ along with the discussion about staying vs. leaving has made me think about how at this point, my M ....or life is such a gamble. Do I stay and hope that not only can he be faithful (what a huge unreasonable expectation I have) but CAN we heal from the damage that he has caused to move forward and be happy? Will I ever be happy again? So, the flip side of that is to leave the M- continue working on becoming happy with myself and hope that one day I find someone else that I fall in love with and is just perfect. But isn't that the problem? I'll never trust anyone the same again- that blind trust thing....and since I didn't know previously...how will I know what i'm getting myself into with another relationship? Maybe we're all better off single. I have a friend who has dated for years and wants another child so desparately and I see the torture she goes through- dating & finding out the new "boy" has done something wrong....or they just don't work out.... again- more time wasted. Isn't it horrible to look at life like that? AGH


So...somehow I've gone back into shock mode. I was driving into work today thinking, OMG- how did he do this? I spent 2.5 years of picking up the kids, coming home, cooking, cleaning, having sex, becoming best friends with the OW, memories of all of us, conceiving another child, having another child, maternity leave, birthdays, christmas's, anniversaries, work changes, new vehicles, blah blah blah....and ALL THE WHILE my f'in WH was greedy enough that he could lie to me- daily. He could have sex with OW#1 or #2 and have sex with me the same day. He could wait for me to go into the shower & sneak downstairs to have sex with OW#2. HOW HOW HOW can someone do that to another person that they LOVE so deeply? And no one gave a shit. It kills me. Every memory I have with OW...2 years of fun times, doing stuff with the kids, drinking, dancing, going out to eat, poker, etc. and all of it was while she's fucking my husband- she believed he was madly in love with her (yet there was no relationship until she offered drunk sex). how can 2 people be so cruel & heartless? (I know it's bad when cruel & heartless in back into my vocabulary) I'm just lost & confused, and unbelievably hurt. When D-day first happened and I started reading and I somehow believed this would not damage my self-esteem, my self-worth....and I have more difficulty with the change in the way I feel about/think about/doubt myself. At this point I really want to go into IC...but I only have 40 sessions/year and we're using them weekly with MC right now.

I want to cry again....


[This message edited by Whatnow28 at 3:01 PM, September 25th (Thursday)]


ME: BW, 30 H: WH, 30 2 little boys

D-day 3/4/08 Whole "truth" from OW 3/12/08
Ow#1, 6 months PA
Ow#2, 2 years PA & EA

"It takes 3 seconds to say "I love you", 3 hours to explain it, & a lifetime to prove it".


Posts: 517 | Registered: Apr 2008 | From: NE Coast
weepy
♀ Member
Member # 8790
Default  Posted: 3:38 PM, September 25th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((whatnow))). Don't let this spiral you. I know easier said than done. Find something to do, clean out a drawer, put up old clothes for charity, bake a cake. Do something but sit there and brood over him.

He did it. It's not for YOU to figure out HOW, it's for him and then HE gets to explain it to you.

LH. My psychiatrist just prescribed Valium for my anxiety attacks. He said not to exceed like 3 a week, maybe just at night. I asked about the combination and he said there was no problem with the combo of Wellbutrin and Valium, just to watch I don't get hooked on the V.


Dday: 9/12/05
M: 29 yrs( me anyway )
BS(me): 55 And I'm ok with that
FWS: 57- Multiple PAs, LTA 7? yrs.

Try not. Do or do not, there is no try. -- Yoda


Posts: 9340 | Registered: Nov 2005 | From: SE PA
hurt789
♀ Member
Member # 20937
Default  Posted: 3:45 PM, September 25th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

now what28...i am so sorry. i had the same kind of moment last night...how, why, i could f'ing kill her! i went and has a good cry then told my WH he needed to hold me a listen to me while I vented. I know we will never understand how the one person who loves us more than anyone else in the world could hurt us this deeply. I dont think there is anything wrong with a good cry, and maybe a glass or two of wine with it! crying is healing. can you go to mc every other week and ic the following?


BS 40
WS 43
MARRIED 20
TOGATHER 22
1 PERFECT DAUGHTER
DDAY7/13/08
LTA - ALWAYS


Posts: 240 | Registered: Sep 2008
Lost Heart
♀ Member
Member # 11515
Default  Posted: 3:35 AM, September 26th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

((((whatnow))))

You will find that you will dip in and out of the dark place, but as time goes, these WILL become more infrequent and you will be able to bounce back quicker.

What do you need to help you through this patch? Communicate this to your H, and hopefully, he will be able to be there for you. However, (and I have learned this the hard way), be prepared that he may NOT always be able to be there for you, and that whilst you can lean on us here, you must also be able to pull your own self out. So when the goings are good, utilise that time to rebuild YOU and your inner strength. The M can wait. Your H can sort his own issues out. But to survive this and thrive, YOU need to be getting stronger.

Hi hurt789,
I dont think I have welcomed you yet, so welcome to our sanctuary.

I know we will never understand how the one person who loves us more than anyone else in the world could hurt us this deeply

Mmmm...
I am going to disagree with you on this, Hurt. They (WS) did not love us more than anyone else in the world...their very actions indicate otherwise. However, thats not to say that they (WS) are not capable of loving us better going forward.

Also I am learning (slowly )that the person you should love "greatest" in the world, should truly be your self. If you loved your self, you would not indulge in any action that would bring shame to you. And when you love your self truly, then you are able to love another genuinely.

I know I am being verbally challeging at the moment, and hopefully someone more wordskilled can help me out...but it has been discussed here by the "oldies" before, that to survive and thrive this LTA crap, we have to learn to love ourselves again. And for people like me (whose self hatred knows no boundaries), it quite a challenge.

***
Hi Weepy.
You know, I would have usually checked and doublechecked all the drug info prior to popping. I guess I was just so darn frustrated at getting my back hurt, cos it was so darn inconvenient, and I just wanted a quick fix.Boy, have I learned my lesson.


Everyday is a winding road
I get a little bit closer
Everyday is a faded sign
I get a little bit closer to feeling fine

Posts: 2471 | Registered: Aug 2006 | From: London
BorrowTrouble
♀ Member
Member # 2435
Default  Posted: 6:58 AM, September 26th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Lost,

What complete and utter incompetence. I hope you go ahead with this complaint because that so-called doctor almost killed you. He can't be allowed to do that to anyone else.

Holy crap. I am out of SI practice. I signed my name instead of my moniker.

[This message edited by BorrowTrouble at 5:22 PM, September 26th (Friday)]


D-day 7/29/04.

Posts: 5711 | Registered: Oct 2003
Whatnow28
♀ Member
Member # 19345
Default  Posted: 8:19 AM, September 26th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Also I am learning (slowly )that the person you should love "greatest" in the world, should truly be your self. If you loved your self, you would not indulge in any action that would bring shame to you. And when you love your self truly, then you are able to love another genuinely

I agree. I had a week long off/on discussion with WH about this a few weeks ago and he kinda agrees....but somehow we continued to argue about it forever. I think he's stuck in that defensive mode when we begin to talking about the possibility of him being "broken" even if it's as simple as not truly loving yourself....which I think almost all of us could work/improve on. Some things that i question about myself...and WH should certainly be questioning based on everything....he just doesn't. I don't know- maybe it's just that he can't accept his own faults that is his issue right now.


anyways...from a fortune cookie last week (I saved it of course)

Our first and last love is....Self Love.

[This message edited by Whatnow28 at 8:20 AM, September 26th (Friday)]


ME: BW, 30 H: WH, 30 2 little boys

D-day 3/4/08 Whole "truth" from OW 3/12/08
Ow#1, 6 months PA
Ow#2, 2 years PA & EA

"It takes 3 seconds to say "I love you", 3 hours to explain it, & a lifetime to prove it".


Posts: 517 | Registered: Apr 2008 | From: NE Coast
weepy
♀ Member
Member # 8790
Default  Posted: 9:00 AM, September 26th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Fortune cookie for me last week

"Do not fear competition"


Dday: 9/12/05
M: 29 yrs( me anyway )
BS(me): 55 And I'm ok with that
FWS: 57- Multiple PAs, LTA 7? yrs.

Try not. Do or do not, there is no try. -- Yoda


Posts: 9340 | Registered: Nov 2005 | From: SE PA
Whatnow28
♀ Member
Member # 19345
Default  Posted: 9:41 AM, September 26th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Weepy, we should get together for chinese sometime!


ME: BW, 30 H: WH, 30 2 little boys

D-day 3/4/08 Whole "truth" from OW 3/12/08
Ow#1, 6 months PA
Ow#2, 2 years PA & EA

"It takes 3 seconds to say "I love you", 3 hours to explain it, & a lifetime to prove it".


Posts: 517 | Registered: Apr 2008 | From: NE Coast
hurtshirley
Member
Member # 16197
Default  Posted: 10:31 AM, September 26th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Here mine from last Sat night!!

"A fair face my fade, but a beautiful soul lasts forever."

I have it in my wallet to help me remember my self-worth.


"Forgiveness is the grace by which you enable the other person to get up, and get up with dignity, to begin anew" Desmond Tutu

Posts: 2170 | Registered: Sep 2007
Whatnow28
♀ Member
Member # 19345
Default  Posted: 11:05 AM, September 26th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Okay...we all need to head out for chinese!

Did you guys ever add "in bed" to the end of all your fortunes? Silly little thing we used to do here.

Our first and last love is....Self Love "in bed"

Do not fear competition "in bed"

A fair face my fade, but a beautiful soul lasts forever." "in bed"

Maybe those aren't the best idea for SI.


ME: BW, 30 H: WH, 30 2 little boys

D-day 3/4/08 Whole "truth" from OW 3/12/08
Ow#1, 6 months PA
Ow#2, 2 years PA & EA

"It takes 3 seconds to say "I love you", 3 hours to explain it, & a lifetime to prove it".


Posts: 517 | Registered: Apr 2008 | From: NE Coast
Lost Heart
♀ Member
Member # 11515
Default  Posted: 11:51 AM, September 26th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

whatnow, you are sounding much better.
Laughter is a good medicine. FSA used to make us giggle with her poems and vents.

I miss you, FSA.

***
BT
I have just now launched the complaints investigation, with firstly, the GP for prescribing, and secondly, the pharmacy for dispensing.
The regional pharmacy manager did confirm that I was given the maximun dose and that that should have sent some alarm bells ringing on their side, so they are launching their own internal investigation re the dispensing pharmicist.
Looks like its going to be a long haul battle, and I am just so tired. I still cant sleep, but at least the hallucinations have stopped.

I know this needs to be done...but darn it.

***
Hey Shirley!
How you doin'?
And where's FNF?

***
Ukg and I plan to meet up in 2 weeks, so if anyone wants to join us cuz lunch is on her.


Everyday is a winding road
I get a little bit closer
Everyday is a faded sign
I get a little bit closer to feeling fine

Posts: 2471 | Registered: Aug 2006 | From: London
forgivenotforget
♀ Member
Member # 11053
Default  Posted: 5:02 PM, September 26th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

LH - I cannot believe this happened to you. How utterly horrific. Somebody should lose their license over this. I thank the heavens you survived their incompetence.
How are you feeling now that the meds are hopefully wearing off? Can you feel a significant difference and have all S thoughts left?
I am just so thankful you discovered what was going on. This is one of the main reasons I have been afraid of meds. There are always side effects and when they are not prescribed correctly, they are extremely dangerous.
This week has been a bit hectic that's why I haven't been able to check in too often. My D's H is away on business so she and my grandson have been spending time with us. He is absolutely adorable but full of energy.
HS - I was wondering if your IC came up with any interesting new advice. I have been thinking so much about what she told you on your last visit. I spent today trying to move toward my H and tried to keep my negative thoughts at bay. It turned out to be a pretty nice day KWIM??
We need those every now and then.
I hope everyone has a good weekend. I am just so glad SI is up and running again. What a catastrophe it would be to ever lose this site completely.
Hugs to all.


D-day - 12/23/05 LTA - 8 years.
"Love's a matter of trust and I just want to believe in us." M McBride

Posts: 1901 | Registered: Jun 2006 | From: A tunnel where I'm beginning to see the light
So Lost
♀ Member
Member # 16801
Default  Posted: 6:13 PM, September 26th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I am just stunned at the medication issue. Stunned. The outcome could have just been horrific. How do you feel now? Are you feeling more yourself with less suicidal thoughts? I have thought about you a lot while SI was out.


Me: BS
Wh: WS
Dday 10/28/07
LTA with coworker
Attempting Reconciliation
he is remorseful, I am willing, we'll see what happens

Posts: 671 | Registered: Oct 2007
Lost Heart
♀ Member
Member # 11515
Default  Posted: 3:14 AM, September 27th (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Good morning all.

Fnf, yay the good times!!!

***
SoLost,
I am still a bit numb. Yesterday when I was speaking to the pharmacy manager, I started shaking. I think the reality of what happened is sinking in, and I am feeling out of sorts.I am trying to get some joy from moment to moment and at times I can, but I just want to be left alone, KWIM? Just hide under my duvet with a book. Thanks for asking.

And how are you doing??


Everyday is a winding road
I get a little bit closer
Everyday is a faded sign
I get a little bit closer to feeling fine

Posts: 2471 | Registered: Aug 2006 | From: London
hurtshirley
Member
Member # 16197
Default  Posted: 8:08 AM, September 27th (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi all, things are going okay. One baby step forward at a time. I wanted to let everyone know that I found some "interesting" forums while SI was down. First, I had never gone to some of the OW websites. Mostly a big old but after some extensive reading I learned something that helped me. In general, these OW are really desperate types that are willing to do whatever it takes to get some crumbs of "luv". Aside from the complete nutjobs, they are, in general, honestly in love and believe all the crap that the men are telling them. They are waiting (yes as are OW probably did) for years for the men to leave their wives and spend the rest of their lives with them. Interestingly, from what I could see reading, that RARELY happens and they are STILL shocked when it doesn't. The heartbreak on their part is palpable. I don't care as they were stupid enough to put themselves in that place but they are really genuinely hurt when things don't work out as they planned. Anyway, I asked my H if he EVER implied (other than his actions ) that he was willing to leave me. His reactions was honestly shock. He said NO, I never told them that. He even said that the second LTA asked him and he said "of course not". Now, I know from where we sit, it is painful but imagine being in their shoes and doing all the ego stroking and giving them whatever they need for a crumb of affection and then to get completely bitch-slapped when asking for a shred of commitment. Kinda makes the whole thing easier on me...not sure why.

FNF, I am really starting to like my new IC. She is very smart and picks up on my moods very quickly. This week we spent a lot of time talking about the OW. I still have this desire to confront/write/email them to tell them what scum they are and how they contributed to my hurt. She really doesn't want me to do this for a lot of reasons (how it will make me feel, unintended consequences, etc). We argued about this for about 15 minutes before she brought a degree of clarity to the situtation for me. Again, it is all about "control". She asked if I really believed they would accept what I have to say and believe it. Of course not as they are obviously from a completely different planet. So she proceeded into the whole "you can't control what other people think/do" topic and for the first time I think I really "got it". I could meet them face to face with my H holding my hand and they would probably think "well he is just doing that to make her feel better but deep down he still luuuuuvvvvs ME" . I will never be able to change their warped view of the world so why bother. I think this is a big step for me. For now at least, I can set them aside and look forward. Okay, everybody cross your fingers and toes that this little baby step holds for me.


"Forgiveness is the grace by which you enable the other person to get up, and get up with dignity, to begin anew" Desmond Tutu

Posts: 2170 | Registered: Sep 2007
Lost Heart
♀ Member
Member # 11515
Default  Posted: 3:00 AM, September 28th (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Yay Shirley!!!

So she proceeded into the whole "you can't control what other people think/do" topic and for the first time I think I really "got it".

Sweetie, that is not a baby step, that is HUGE!

So good on ye!

I am not even going to go into H leaving me for them topic, cos it going to bring me down and right now, I am just fine, thank you. But I will get into it when I get in a venting mood.

***
In the midst of my medical crisis last week, I made the mistake of reaching out to my youngest sister. I KNOW I should not count on anyone to "get it", but boy, did she lay into me. I know she does it out of love and she wants me to be strong again. All I wanted was...well some TLC. not somebody blasting me about how selfish I am, how tired everyone is with my moods, how I am always whining about how bad my life is yet I never do anything to change etc etc.

Now she has been sending me books about beating depression and thinking positively etc etc. Good books, I know...its up to 5.I mailed her after the 2nd one and told her to stop, and rather contribute to my LIBE Fund (thats liposuction/breast enhancement ).
She arrives today and despite now knowing that it was all a medicall f-up, she still thinks that I just need to be positive and be more pro=active in my life. She is HUGE on The Secret and I can appreciate it that. Just the thought of having these "conversations", which are more like she telling me what to do and how to do it, whilst she is here..sigh.

Going to need alot of mojo to get through this week. Its going to be very challenging as we have a big family do, and I have been running around doing my share and trying to appear as "normal" as possible.

Enough venting.

Gee, I missed this place. I used to have these conversations to you guys all the time. I even woke up one morning with Ukg's name on my lips.


Everyday is a winding road
I get a little bit closer
Everyday is a faded sign
I get a little bit closer to feeling fine

Posts: 2471 | Registered: Aug 2006 | From: London
forgivenotforget
♀ Member
Member # 11053
Default  Posted: 9:20 AM, September 28th (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

LH - I think you need to find a book that gives your sister a clue as to how she can be supportive. If I come across one, you can bet I'll post it for you. Unfortunately some people think they can badger someone out of a bad period and instead they become part of the problem. Like you said, all you needed was some TLC. Why should she feel like giving this to you would encourage weakness. It has the opposite effect. I am going on a search for a book but if anyone knows of one, please let us know so that LH can pass this along to her sister.
(((LH)))
HS - It's always surprising to me how each of us feels so differently about contacting the OW. It is the absolute last thing in the world I would ever want to do. To me, it is the greatest insult to treat her as the nothing she is. I sometimes wonder if she hopes I will contact her and it gives me pleasure to think that she might and that I deny her this.
These women knew exactly what they were getting into - they took a risk and that their hearts are broken and that they are suffering is merely the consequence of the choices they made. I have no sympathy and in fact I hope she is suffering as much - no, so much more, than I am.
I was listening to a Mamma Mia CD and there is a song on there and it made me smile. The words were, "One of us is crying, one of us is lying in a lonely bed" and this is what I wish for her. This is justice to me. We didn't deserve the pain we suffer because of their choice to fuck our H's. THEY DO!!!!
I could never go to the site you were talking about. It would set me off and I'd be a raving lunatic but I do hope it helped you in some way. For the record, I agree completely with your IC's advice. You can never anticipate the consequences of any contact and that is reason enough to avoid it. I cannot imagine getting any satisfaction from this but then that's just me.

[This message edited by forgivenotforget at 9:22 AM, September 28th (Sunday)]


D-day - 12/23/05 LTA - 8 years.
"Love's a matter of trust and I just want to believe in us." M McBride

Posts: 1901 | Registered: Jun 2006 | From: A tunnel where I'm beginning to see the light
forgivenotforget
♀ Member
Member # 11053
Default  Posted: 10:14 AM, September 28th (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Back to the topic of the OW and being in love . Here's what I tell my H.
The OW did not love you. She thought she did and in the shallow sense that she might have been capable of love, maybe she did. But if she had really loved you, she would never have wanted you to lose your self-respect, your integrity, or the respect and love of those who mean the most to you. She would have encouraged you to go back to your wife, to seek professional help if you were truly unhappy and if, after all of that, you couldn't make your M work, then to leave honestly. That to me is true love. When we love someone, we don't bring that person down to their lowest point. We don't want the worst for them. We want what is best for them and for those they love. Nothing about their relationship with our H's contributed to bringing out what was best in our H's. It contributed to their spiritual and moral demise. How is that love?????
Their so-called love is really about their own neediness and their own lack of self worth. Any woman willing to settle for a life as the OW with no possibility of commitment and involving themselves with someone who has proven to be incapable of commitment, has to have the lowest self-esteem imaginable. Their is no hope for a future with these men, there is only the seedy, fleeting moments that hold no promise of anything other than an empty, lonely self-hatred once they realize exactly what they meant to the men they only thought they loved.
That's my humble opinion for what it's worth.


D-day - 12/23/05 LTA - 8 years.
"Love's a matter of trust and I just want to believe in us." M McBride

Posts: 1901 | Registered: Jun 2006 | From: A tunnel where I'm beginning to see the light
hurtshirley
Member
Member # 16197
Default  Posted: 10:42 AM, September 28th (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

The OW did not love you. She thought she did and in the shallow sense that she might have been capable of love, maybe she did. But if she had really loved you, she would never have wanted you to lose your self-respect, your integrity, or the respect and love of those who mean the most to you.

Their so-called love is really about their own neediness and their own lack of self worth. Any woman willing to settle for a life as the OW with no possibility of commitment and involving themselves with someone who has proven to be incapable of commitment, has to have the lowest self-esteem imaginable.

FNF - Absolutely spot on! I couldn't have said it better.

Lost Heart - I am sorry that your sister can't give you the TLC you need. The good news is that you recognize what she is doing is out of love...it is just not the kind of love you need. I have some minor analysis on her "just be positive thinking" like this:

she still thinks that I just need to be positive and be more pro=active in my life.

I am learning that a lot of times when people give us advice like this the person they are really talking to is THEMSELVES. This is HER way of coping not yours. As she is talking, if you can just imagine that she is talking to herself and trying to take her own advice it might make it easier to take. (Or I can hope for your sake
)


"Forgiveness is the grace by which you enable the other person to get up, and get up with dignity, to begin anew" Desmond Tutu

Posts: 2170 | Registered: Sep 2007
UKgirl
♀ Member
Member # 17062
Default  Posted: 4:17 PM, September 28th (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Im here. Im lurking. Got temperamental telecom and broadband probs. Just caught up with my w/end mail and now copied/pasted SI LTA to read safely later. In case I get cut off again.

Hugs Tribe. I hate this techno stuff!!!


D-Day: 30 July 2006 LTA: 5yrs
Me, BS, 56 y/o Him, WS, 57 y/o
MOW, pathetic ex-fiancee.
3 grown boys and one 18 y/o
I don't consider myself married anymore.
There are some words once spoken split the world in two. Before you say them and after.

Posts: 3328 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: UK
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