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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: BS Questions for WS's II
Kwills
♀ Member
Member # 13172
Default  Posted: 10:51 AM, November 21st (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

What exact "things" have you done to "improve" yourself since you wandered? (I'm looking for some "gauge" or enlightenment as to what "work" should/must be done by the fWS to show that they're "working" on themselves.)

I think that there is no prescription for what each individual FWS should/must do, but I can share what I've done to work on myself that seems to have helped:

--Read every infidelity book I could get my hands on to better understand myself, my choices, and my husband

--Kept reading SI faithfully, even thought I didn't initially take all of the advice when I was ready I had an idea of what needed to be done as far as NC and setting limits

--Went to individual counseling

--Got on antidepressant meds (I think this has been the biggest piece for me personally--I needed meds for years and without them I don't think I could have made many of the other changes--go Prozac!!!)

--Finally got the courage to change jobs--this was important not only to get me away from FOM but to clear up a lot of personal issues that were causing me to feel frustrated and resentful in my marriage and opened the door for an A--I learned that nobody was holding me back but myself. This has been almost as important as the meds and NC.

--Finally shared what I really and truly think and feel about a lot of things wtih my husband, stopped "tiptoeing." If we're still together and he can hack it after what I've done, there is pretty much no reason to hide anymore. And this works better because I've found we want a lot of the same things anyway but were both too scared to say them before.

--Kept working out before, during and since the A--this keeps me sane, without exercise I get depressed and it is as important to me as eating in maintaining my physical and mental health

I'm not sure what other changes there have been, but I'm sure there have been some. These are pretty individual, but there are couple changes too:

--We go to the gym together on weekends, which we did not do before.

--We call/email each other during the workday just to check in, which we never did before (we both grew up with parents where unless it was broken or bleeding nobody ever bothered anybody at work, that was just an unspoken rule)

--We don't have duty sex anymore, although we're still struggling in this area at least when it does happen it is honest and real and when it doesn't that is honest and real too.

Hope this helps.

Kwills


Posts: 1052 | Registered: Jan 2007
wannabenormal
♀ Member
Member # 19772
Default  Posted: 10:16 AM, November 22nd (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

editing - no answer needed

[This message edited by wannabenormal at 4:29 PM, November 24th (Monday)]


BW, divorced: 03/09


Posts: 14252 | Registered: Jun 2008
smackydoodle
♀ Member
Member # 21195
Default  Posted: 4:33 PM, November 22nd (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Did any of you feel 'better' after the A was found out? WH has for the whole A been very emotional here at home. He'd been happy and then depressed acting, angry etc. I thought he was stressed at work but I can almost pin point the time the A started by his actions.

Since I found out about the A he's been even keeled and better to be around - like he's back to the guy I married. (He does feel bad about the A and is remorseful, NC, MC etc) It's like he felt bad the whole time the A was going on but didn't stop it. I also think he had to vilify me to justify the A. D day we talked and sorted out a lot of 'problems' that were huge in his mind but once explained from my point of view are now small misunderstandings.

thanks for any responses!


Me -BS- 40
Him-WS-42
DD-7
D-Day 10/04/08
Trying to R

Posts: 85 | Registered: Oct 2008
wheat
♀ Member
Member # 18918
Default  Posted: 5:47 PM, November 22nd (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Did any of you feel 'better' after the A was found out?

Smacky, I wish my A had been discovered prior to my NC. I'dve owned my shit immediately and done what I could've to answer any questions. The BS in my situation was someone I did not know, only the MM. I switched departments, moved, etc, while the A was still undiscovered and never spoke to him again. I do not know to this day if it ever has been found out. I would have been more than willing to have owned my responsibility in it if it had been.

Hindsight and the BS's on SI make me wish now that I'd proactively said something at the time, but unfortunately I chose to cut ties immediately. Wrong answer now, but I felt it was right at the time.


"Every new day is another chance to change your life."

FSOW - late 30's, married now.


Posts: 209 | Registered: Mar 2008 | From: midwest
wheat
♀ Member
Member # 18918
Default  Posted: 6:00 PM, November 22nd (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Devastated -

What exact "things" have you done to "improve" yourself since you wandered?

I married a former BS from his first marriage. He knew when we were dating up front about my A with a MM. I realized pretty quickly that he may expect me to do the same thing to him that his XWW did. So I opened up totally, answered every question he had and still has, mostly about what his XWW was thinking when she had her A and blamed him for it. My ongoing transparency helps him to avoid triggers from his first marriage that I would expect he would have with me. Even though I was not the one that cheated on him, I did cheat with someone and thus I still feel he as a BS is owed transparency so as to not feel emotionally vulnerable in his current marriage.

I hope that helps.


"Every new day is another chance to change your life."

FSOW - late 30's, married now.


Posts: 209 | Registered: Mar 2008 | From: midwest
Copeland
♂ Member
Member # 21005
Default  Posted: 6:21 PM, November 22nd (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Smacky...besides the initial horror and shame of being found out - I did notice some relief. I think I wanted it to end, but was too emeshed and selfish to stop. God, I wish I had, but that's not how it worked. Anyway, I was glad the sneaking was over. I was glad to get off-line...I was glad to realize how much i loved spending time with my SO. I mean really, REALLY loved it. I wish she still felt the same about me, but that's another story...


Male 49-No longer defining myself by fidelity roles...been both. Time for a new start.
"Ring the bells that still can ring
Forget your perfect offering
There is a crack in everything. That's how the light gets in."-Leonard Cohen

Posts: 854 | Registered: Sep 2008 | From: Midwest
smackydoodle
♀ Member
Member # 21195
Default  Posted: 7:29 PM, November 22nd (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

thanks Copeland and Wheat- I appreciate you answering.


Me -BS- 40
Him-WS-42
DD-7
D-Day 10/04/08
Trying to R

Posts: 85 | Registered: Oct 2008
Mommaplus4
♀ Member
Member # 21690
Default  Posted: 11:33 AM, November 23rd (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi, advice needed on what to do to get WH to open up.....

My WH and myself haven't talked about his A really at all. I'm afraid to bring it up because I don't want him to feel attacked and withdraw again. Since one of our issues is not feeling safe to express our feelings to one another and all that goes along with it, how do I go about letting him know that it's o.k. to talk to me? That I won't hold it against him; I won't belittle him; I won't get angry; etc., etc. Thanks for any help you can pass along.


BS: Me (40)
WS - XH: Him (41)
Kids: 4 awesome kids
D-Day: 09/20/08
Married 1998
OW: 32, skanky ho snatchface
Divorced
WxH moved out of OW house 4/2011 and moved in with his mom - guess the grass wasn't all that greener

Posts: 151 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: WA
careerlady
♀ Member
Member # 16958
Default  Posted: 1:59 PM, November 23rd (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Yeah, well my WH is now at the point where he is so sick of me questioning him (honestly, maybe an hour every few days) which he calls torture, and daring not to trust him on a VERY suspicious photo I found, that he is fed up. He also won't agree to total transparency (me checking his email, phone, etc).

I feel like this is indicative that he didn't really want to R, is that so? Sucks cause I really like my new ring


Me (BS, 35); The Snake (WS, 36) 13yrs together; 1 baby boy (DOB 7/12)
Serial cheater-Multiple OWs, Multiple D-Days
Divorcing! Stupid in house separation though

Posts: 864 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: Northern California
Jade1964dream
♀ Member
Member # 21362
Default  Posted: 2:50 PM, November 23rd (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

to WNB's question;

BW here; I have no idea if STBXH and MOW have pictures of each other or together, so I can't answer that part.

I can answer though, the part about him avoiding - pictures, our daughter - too hard for them to look at the destruction they've left or too hurt to see what they've lost. This is what comes to mind - when I threw him out, I had boxed pictures, us, his mother, his family, anything that had him in it. He re-boxed them in the garage, and when he came inside to get more stuff, he was sniffling. When we were going over furniture to divide, he was sniffling some more. Then he looked at me and said "I'm not crying about you, I'm crying about my mom." (His mom passed away August 07). OK, kick me in the stomach some more, you immature baby!

[This message edited by Jade1964dream at 2:50 PM, November 23rd (Sunday)]


Jadie

Posts: 588 | Registered: Oct 2008 | From: Paradise
TracyFace
♀ Member
Member # 21104
Default  Posted: 9:04 PM, November 23rd (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I really want help understanding what my WS is going through - and if I should hang in there and believe in him.

My WH has left me about 2 months ago, moved in with OW, and since then has talked with me repeatedly about R.

Initially, I think it was just the shock of the massive change in his life and missing the kids and seeing them cry, and it wasn't real, and when I placed requirements about NC and outing the A, time frames, he balked and couldn't follow through.

But about a month into the actual separation, he seemed different whenever we talked and he told me that I was right and this relationship was not what he wanted or needed right now, that he wanted time to be alone to focus on his own thoughts, to get clarity. I suggested, like a friend would do, that if he was feeling pressured by this relationship, that maybe he should ask her for space and move into the spare bedroom so he could think about what he really wants. I wasn't thinking R at the time, just thinking of him and how confused he was. But I definitely was hoping.

He told me that he had done this, that she was disappointed and confused but that she was respecting this wish and he had moved bedrooms. He started spending more time with me and the kids and started asking me if I would go to MC with him. He asked if we could not sign the papers and wait a little while. I have desperately wanted R, so I was happy to agree to MC and holding off on the actual D. But somehow I ended up in R without any of my demands having been followed. Do you think he completely manipulated that or just that he really thinks he can have R while sharing an apartment with her?

I tried to focus on us, but I found that I was always wondering about what was going on over there, and if the OW really understood that he was this sure that he was going to R with me. I contacted her and told her about the conversations that we had been having and asked what her understanding of their relationship was. It didn't jive with what he'd been telling me. They weren't physical anymore and he WAS living in the other room, but she's "waiting" to see what happens. She didn't know that he and I had been intimate again since they'd separated bedrooms, and she texted him while we were emailing and he denied it to her again that anything physical was going on with me.

So, my question is this. Is this really over? He's still lying - less than before, but he's obviously letting her think that there's still hope, he's stringing her along, right. And I guess me too. I wonder if he's still in the fog and just isn't seeing clearly yet. I had thought he'd cleared and understood and was willing to do the hard work in R. I told him I'm going to see the lawyer. But I guess a part of me is just so reticent to do that because I just want to believe that he's going to come out of this. Is there anything that I can do to make him see? Apart from the 180, which is probably the best advice.

I really hope the WS's can help me see this situation more clearly. I'm dying here.


Posts: 69 | Registered: Oct 2008 | From: New England
wheat
♀ Member
Member # 18918
Default  Posted: 11:46 PM, November 23rd (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Careerlady-

Hopefully someone will come along and hit him with a huge 2x4 and tell him to get over the being-sick-of-answering-questions part. He sounds like he's still got a huge sense of misplaced entitlement. Unfortunately it also sounds like he doesn't get what his end of this is supposed to be now. Which means he's still foggy. I'm so sorry. I'm sure the ring is pretty.


"Every new day is another chance to change your life."

FSOW - late 30's, married now.


Posts: 209 | Registered: Mar 2008 | From: midwest
wheat
♀ Member
Member # 18918
Default  Posted: 11:51 PM, November 23rd (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

TracyFace-
So, my question is this. Is this really over?

This post made me so sad for your situation. And FURIOUS with him. No, to me it sounds like he has zero idea who or what he wants. He's basically flipped the situation around to where now she's the one wondering where his head is, while he's trying to get back with you. Meanwhile, that's the behavior that started this mess in the first place: getting with her to see what it's like without you. So to me, it's not "over", per se, in his mind, but it should be in yours. It's not healthy.

He can't go shopping for another relationship while he's IN one. That's just too bad for him if it doesn't fit into his plans. I wouldn't wait around to see what he wants: protect yourself emotionally and financially.

And ask yourself "do I really want someone who isn't sure he wants me?"

(((( Tracy )))))

[This message edited by wheat at 11:52 PM, November 23rd (Sunday)]


"Every new day is another chance to change your life."

FSOW - late 30's, married now.


Posts: 209 | Registered: Mar 2008 | From: midwest
Devestatedx5
♀ Member
Member # 16557
Default  Posted: 7:16 AM, November 24th (Monday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Kwills & Wheat - thank you both.
He's more "tender" with me than at any point in our past, and he tells me every day that he loves me and doesn't want to lose me, and gives me a kiss before he leaves for work in the morning. He calls me every day from work in the morning (did that even BEFORE his ONS) and has answered nearly every question I've presented him.

Those are the only "changes" I've seen since Dday - and that was almost 15 months ago. And although they're changes, they're things he should've been doing for the last 22 years - even WITHOUT the devistation caused by his ONS.

I guess I just expected more. A LOT more - and yes, it's been written out what I expect numerous times. Therefore, I just don't feel that he's doing "the hard work", just the easy stuff.

[This message edited by Devestatedx5 at 8:05 AM, November 24th (Monday)]


FBS-me (49)
FWH(57) ONS 8.19.07
Dday: 9.19.07
Married +26 years
RE-MARRIED 4.28.11
----------
Proverbs 31:10-31
Sometimes people are SO open-minded that that their brains fall out.

Posts: 2598 | Registered: Oct 2007
TracyFace
♀ Member
Member # 21104
Default  Posted: 11:09 AM, November 24th (Monday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

wheat -

Thank you for responding. I am definitely committed to making sure that I do what is right for me now. I know what is truly right is to be with my husband, but I can't allow this anymore. I told him on Saturday that I was going to see the divorce attorney and got no response at all. I assumed he was glad to hear that I am finally making the decision that he can't seem to make.

But then he emailed me today to ask "has something changed for you" and wants to know why I was emotionally distant over the weekend. It was like we didn't have that conversation at all. This is why I think there's just something chemically wrong with him. I don't want to believe that he's this manipulative.

You're right. I love him but I need to love myself more. I have asked myself this question, "why do you want a man who doesn't know for sure that he wants you above anyone else?" and I can't come up with an answer.


Posts: 69 | Registered: Oct 2008 | From: New England
careerlady
♀ Member
Member # 16958
Default  Posted: 6:43 PM, November 24th (Monday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hopefully someone will come along and hit him with a huge 2x4 and tell him to get over the being-sick-of-answering-questions part. He sounds like he's still got a huge sense of misplaced entitlement. Unfortunately it also sounds like he doesn't get what his end of this is supposed to be now. Which means he's still foggy. I'm so sorry. I'm sure the ring is pretty.

I don't know, we fought about it, but the next day he was ok again. He says he is afraid if I focus on it everyday I will decide not the R. This is true but unsure what balance to strike.

I got my questions answered, but have been re-asking. I think our big issue is he is consistently telling one story, I am consistently looking for more. Probably won't settle this without a polygraph.

What is the fog like with NC established?


Me (BS, 35); The Snake (WS, 36) 13yrs together; 1 baby boy (DOB 7/12)
Serial cheater-Multiple OWs, Multiple D-Days
Divorcing! Stupid in house separation though

Posts: 864 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: Northern California
wannabenormal
♀ Member
Member # 19772
Default  Posted: 5:51 PM, November 25th (Tuesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Another question from me: why is WH so afraid to tell his family the truth? Of course, I see the obvious - having an affair and still being with OW is shameful while you're technically still married BUT he had a chance to intro OW to family and didn't. He said the timing was bad (um, b/c we're still tech. married) but reading some posts on the wayward side, I wonder if there's more to it than him not wanting his family to have this predisposed idea that his 'soulmate' was the OW I guess when he actually does bring her around. I mean, is it that HE'S ashamed or he honestly doesn't want his family to have that black mark about her in their minds?

I don't know - he's told me she doesn't want to meet them anymore than he wants to intro her...but if you're soulmates, don't you not care what others think? If you're MEANT to be together, why all the cloak & dagger?

Why doesn't he admit that he left me for her and that we're not 'just having problems'?

I was reading on the wayward side today and I've wondered this a million times; many people say to tell them (his family), but I don't. Thanks, if anyone can help me. I'm glad you all take the time to help if yo can! TIA!

ETA: we've been S for about 2.5 mos, I'm sure that makes a diff.

[This message edited by wannabenormal at 6:22 PM, November 25th (Tuesday)]


BW, divorced: 03/09


Posts: 14252 | Registered: Jun 2008
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 6:44 PM, November 25th (Tuesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

careerlady -

What is the fog like with NC established?

For me, it was about as close to walking around in a trance without being placed in a trance as I can imagine. The rational side of the brain tells you all the right things to do. Maintain NC. Be honest and transparent. Focus on what your BS needs to heal.

It also tells you that you aren't quite fully in reality yet. You know how someone who needs glasses can make out objects, but it's unclear who they are until the glasses are on? In the fog, you can make out bits and pieces of your feelings, emotions and needs, but can't quite tell how deep they run and in which direction.

I can tell you that when my fog lifted, it was as instant a change as putting on glasses. The second I "snapped to", I saw vividly my love for my BW and our kids. I knew exactly who I was in love with, and how passionately I wanted to spend the rest of my life showing my family how wonderful they are!


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 6:48 PM, November 25th (Tuesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

wannabenormal -

If you're MEANT to be together, why all the cloak & dagger?

IMHO, he hasn't faced his real demon. Not the A, but a part of it's cause - a burning need for external validation. Any action that runs the risk of someone giving him negative feedback is to be avoided at all costs, because he defines himself through the eyes of others who tell him what they think.

Of course, there will be no perfect time for him. My bet is he continues to stall, hoping for D, a little time and then OW gets introduced as if she just entered the picture. Poof - he keeps both himself and her in a positive light and gets more pats on the back and smacks in the face.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
Deeply Scared
♀ Administrator
Member # 2
Red  Posted: 7:00 PM, November 25th (Tuesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

BS's...

Before posting your question, please read the thread posted below.

http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=242597

It is loaded with valuable information from WS's.

The WS's are opening themselves up to help you better understand the mind of a WS. Please read the thread so you (general term) don't repeat the same questions over and over to them.

We don't want them to abandon this thread out of frustration for being asked the same questions.

[This message edited by Deeply Scared at 6:49 AM, November 26th (Wednesday)]


"Don't give up, the beginning is always the hardest." My Mom:)

My tolerance for stupid shit is getting less and less.


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