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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: Spouses/Partners of Sex Addicts II
JustWow
♀ Member
Member # 19636
Default  Posted: 6:43 AM, February 26th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

momofthree2007:

Sory I'm late getting back. I really didn't mean to leave you w/the impression that if your H didn't do X, Y or Z, your M was doomed.

I guess I was really stressing the CSAT part because my H wasted about 9 months with someone who claimed to be experienced w/SA, well maybe he was experienced, but that didn't mean he was qualified. It was wasted time, and in some ways made things worse, not better. I guess I would interview any therapist pretty thoroughly, before wasting money, time and effort. We did not, we simply went w/ who our insurance covered in our area, and the word of that group that this guy was experienced. Well, maybe he was experienced, but he was not effective.

Use every single tool available. Ultimately, the success of his recovery is based on his commitment to it, but the right tools will certainly make that commitment easier to live-out.

There was one thing you said earlier that I wanted to point out:

I wish I could try the "no sex card" as a consequence. I really don't want to have sex with him after he acts out but as I said, that has the exact opposite of it's intended effect. It just drives him further into it.

If you don't want to have sex after he's acted out, then DON'T. Don't because that is something YOU do not want to do. If you're w/holding sex, however, as a "punishment" to him or to get some "desired effect", it may be that you are trying to control him. Honey, right now HE can't even control him.

For years, before we knew abot his SA, my H never initiated. And often when I did, he declined. Well, after a while, as you might imagine, this became really hurtful and discouraging. I finally said, for my own self-respect, I was not going to chase him sexually anymore, I decided to quit initiating.

Well, guess what? When I didn't initiate, no one initiated. I didn't stop to punish him, I stopped to preserve my self-respect. That the sex stopped too, was almost a "so what" to me at the time. It only ever happened once in a blue moon anyway, so all I felt I was losing, in order to maintain my boundaries, was some veeeerrrrry infrequent lackluster sex that never felt very intimate anyway.

Well, for him, this did in fact enable him to continue to deceive himself that he needed to compulsively m-bate because we were barely having sex, so of course that's why he needed to do what he was doing. But guess what, this is the story he told hiself whether we had sex 4 times a week or 4 time a year. My behavior did not cause or create any change in his behavior.

Because we can't control another's actions.

We control our words and actions. With work, IC, and perspective, we can work on controlling our own thoughts. We can't control our own emotions.

We have a big enough job controlling ourselves. The idea that we can control our addict, or that they can control us, IS A MYTH.

You need to decide to relate with him based on boundaries you set up for you. You decide what those boundaries are, the consequences you will hold yourself to if they are crossed, you commit to yourself to enforcing them, and then let go of the outcome.

I wouldn't call our M reconciled, and my SAH is only in the infancy of recovery. I am still hopeful for us, but by no stretch am I certain we are going to make it. What I am becoming more certain of is that I will make it. I so hope he, and we do, as well, but I'm not willing to compromise my boundaries for that to happen. If I do, I can be certain that I won't make it.

Sorry to ramble so long.

I think it is quite reasonable that you formulate a plan that allows you to move to where your H is. Set up some parameters for yourself. Do you stay in the same bed/room with him, if so, under what conditions. What do you require from him with regard to treatment, sobriety, etc. for the relationship to be safe for you.

There's a good link to a boundaries post below (courtesy of 7yrs)

http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=256949&HL=10198

Boundaries are for you, hun, not to control him.

You don't need a plan for the rest of your life today, take one step at a time, figure things out one step at a time.

This is hard, but it certainly isn't hopeless.


BW - Reconciling

edited for typos (I always have to!)


Posts: 3556 | Registered: May 2008 | From: Midwest
lovedontlivehere
♀ Member
Member # 20055
Default  Posted: 6:58 AM, February 26th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I wish I could try the "no sex card" as a consequence. I really don't want to have sex with him after he acts out but as I said, that has the exact opposite of it's intended effect. It just drives him further into it.

You are not responsible for his behavior! I can't talk to yours, but I know mine acts out regardless.


Partner still wanking off into fantasy land.
*update* No longer together, but he was STABBED and now wants R. Whatever.

Posts: 1256 | Registered: Jun 2008 | From: Deep South
lovedontlivehere
♀ Member
Member # 20055
Default  Posted: 7:02 AM, February 26th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Well, guess what? When I didn't initiate, no one initiated. I didn't stop to punish him, I stopped to preserve my self-respect. That the sex stopped too, was almost a "so what" to me at the time. It only ever happened once in a blue moon anyway, so all I felt I was losing, in order to maintain my boundaries, was some veeeerrrrry infrequent lackluster sex that never felt very intimate anyway.

Same here.

The "no sex card" is more about protecting myself emotionally and physically rather than punishing him. I've pretty much phased out trying to initiate sex with him. Why do I need to ask if I already know the answer? But if he wants it I'm expected to drop everything and please him.


Partner still wanking off into fantasy land.
*update* No longer together, but he was STABBED and now wants R. Whatever.

Posts: 1256 | Registered: Jun 2008 | From: Deep South
momofthree2007
♀ Member
Member # 14766
Default  Posted: 7:46 AM, February 26th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

You're right, I shouldn't use the no sex card as a punishment but the truth is, after he acts out, sex with him disgusts me.

I guess that's why we need to go to MC.

Coming to this thread is an eye opener.

I'm beginning to realize that my H cannot afford NOT to seek professional counseling in addition to SA.

Last night I told him to ask his SA coordinator and contacts to refer him to a good therapist.

After I got off the phone I was doing a lot of prayer and thinking and I don't feel peace about moving with him if he's not willing to undergo therapy.

Money is a big issue with him. Even if we have enough money, he's a "compulsive saver". He's one of the few people who's trying to save for retirement at a young age. Him seeking therapy means putting away less money.

Today I'm going to ask him "What's more important, his retirement money, or our relationship?"

He's been struggling with this addiction for 2 years, and now that we can afford it, there's no reason not to seek it. However, the only issue might be time because his job is not the kind where he can "call in sick" whenever he wants to.


H - XWH (32) RSA
D-Day 1, OW1: 3/20/07
D-Day 2. OW2: 6/24/07
Divorced, 08/23/2012
Married 7 years, together 9
One day fling each; online As turned physical physical

Posts: 491 | Registered: May 2007 | From: Florida
JustWow
♀ Member
Member # 19636
Default  Posted: 8:05 AM, February 26th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I've got a compulsive saver, too.

I put it to him this way:

It will take a whole lot of therapy before therapy becomes more expensive than divorce.

And its true.

[This message edited by JustWow at 8:05 AM, February 26th (Thursday)]


BW - Reconciling

edited for typos (I always have to!)


Posts: 3556 | Registered: May 2008 | From: Midwest
lovedontlivehere
♀ Member
Member # 20055
Default  Posted: 8:07 AM, February 26th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

You're right, I shouldn't use the no sex card as a punishment but the truth is, after he acts out, sex with him disgusts me.

I understand. I feel the same way. I would definitely consider that self-protection.(((((hugs)))))


Okay, partner is coming back today. I'm still a little upset that I found these DVDs in his bag the last time I saw him. I was snooping, he asked me to look in that bag, but I guess he forgot he had them in there. The videos are porn in the usual sense, but they are sexually suggestive. Should I be upset or am I overreacting???

I know he'd just say they are just dvds so stop being so overbearing. I feel like he's setting me up to be the overbearing bad guy.


Partner still wanking off into fantasy land.
*update* No longer together, but he was STABBED and now wants R. Whatever.

Posts: 1256 | Registered: Jun 2008 | From: Deep South
momofthree2007
♀ Member
Member # 14766
Default  Posted: 8:22 AM, February 26th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

lovedontlivehere that is so true.

Though the Army will pay for a divorce, we'll still have to divide the assets so in a sense, divorce is still more expensive.


H - XWH (32) RSA
D-Day 1, OW1: 3/20/07
D-Day 2. OW2: 6/24/07
Divorced, 08/23/2012
Married 7 years, together 9
One day fling each; online As turned physical physical

Posts: 491 | Registered: May 2007 | From: Florida
momofthree2007
♀ Member
Member # 14766
Default  Posted: 9:59 AM, February 26th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My H said he was willing to seek professional therapy for himself as long the cost wouldn't break us. He said he'd ask his SA coordinator and contacts to refer him to one. We'll just have to write out a budget for this.

I told him that he has no excuse to get a therapist, because we an afford it now.

This might mean cutting out entertainment but I told him that's a sacrifice I was willing to make.


H - XWH (32) RSA
D-Day 1, OW1: 3/20/07
D-Day 2. OW2: 6/24/07
Divorced, 08/23/2012
Married 7 years, together 9
One day fling each; online As turned physical physical

Posts: 491 | Registered: May 2007 | From: Florida
7yrsbetrayed
♀ Member
Member # 10198
Content  Posted: 11:22 AM, February 26th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

hope4tomorrow
You need to express your feelings to him. Don't get angry (that will only make him more defensive) but you need to express how it hurts you and how it scares you.

He may not be able to "hear" you very well yet but you need to get into the habit of sharing those feelings so that when he is better he will hear you.

I'm sorry you're triggered and feeling anxious and sad. :(

momofthree2007
JustWow and lovedontlivehere said pretty much what I would have said. :)


Me(44)
Him(46) arthurdent (rSA)
Married 12 yrs, together 15
Renewed Vows 12/19/08
One DD(8)
You can avoid reality but you cannot avoid the consequences of avoiding reality.~Ayn Rand

Posts: 2167 | Registered: Mar 2006 | From: Colorado
momofthree2007
♀ Member
Member # 14766
Default  Posted: 11:54 AM, February 26th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

OK, every time I think this issue is settled there's always another issue.

I keep thinking about the relapses. I hate it when he acts out. Just like all of you, it disgusts to have sex with him after he acts out. I feel raped.

I know he'll most likely act out more if I deny him.

I know I can't control his addiction but there's no point in him seeking help if I'm going to drive him further is there?

I don't have much time to decide what to do. At this point I feel moving with him will be signing my death sentence.

He had minor relapses the last time he was going to SA,

I'm sorry for flip flopping but every time I think I have the answers, there's always more questions.

[This message edited by momofthree2007 at 11:55 AM, February 26th (Thursday)]


H - XWH (32) RSA
D-Day 1, OW1: 3/20/07
D-Day 2. OW2: 6/24/07
Divorced, 08/23/2012
Married 7 years, together 9
One day fling each; online As turned physical physical

Posts: 491 | Registered: May 2007 | From: Florida
JustWow
♀ Member
Member # 19636
Default  Posted: 12:01 PM, February 26th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

mom,
here's the thing, he acts out whether you sleep with him or not. Say to yourself, 5 times, 20 times, however many times it takes you to BELIEVE it,

"I am not in control of, or responsible for, his acting out"

It seems he's not ever really reached a point of sobriety yet, rather he cycles between "acting-out" and "acting-in". Acting-in IS NOT sobriety.

So if after some period of acting-in, he reverts to acting out, YOU are not what causes this. His addiction is.

If you were so powerful to control his behvior, sleeping with him at his every whim should cure him of this addiction, huh?

That's not very realistic, is it?

YOU ARE NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR HIS BEHAVIOR.


BW - Reconciling

edited for typos (I always have to!)


Posts: 3556 | Registered: May 2008 | From: Midwest
JustWow
♀ Member
Member # 19636
Default  Posted: 12:07 PM, February 26th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

This does not mean you can't or shouldn't move where he is. That is almost a separate issue.

For example, go ahead, move to the base he's at. Set boundaries such as:

We won't share a bed, or have sex, or have unprotected sex (or whatever you feel you need to protect you) until H has been sober and in active recovery for X amount of time. And communicate the boundary to him.

See, you can go there under YOUR terms. You can say you're willing to move there, and work toward R'ing the M and getting him sober, but you are not sending the message that by moving that mom is committed to R no matter what.

Go, but go with clear boundaries in place.

See what I mean?



BW - Reconciling

edited for typos (I always have to!)


Posts: 3556 | Registered: May 2008 | From: Midwest
hope4tomorrow
♀ Member
Member # 21673
Default  Posted: 12:14 PM, February 26th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

hope4tomorrow
You need to express your feelings to him. Don't get angry (that will only make him more defensive) but you need to express how it hurts you and how it scares you.
He may not be able to "hear" you very well yet but you need to get into the habit of sharing those feelings so that when he is better he will hear you.

I'm sorry you're triggered and feeling anxious and sad. :(

Thanks, 7yrs! I actually did tell him. I was crying so it was quite obvious. He had left his cell phone in his car on accident while eating dinner with his parents. As soon as he saw the missed call, he knew.

Of course now he feels really bad and is going to get down on himself. He said he was going to call his IC after talking to me. I sure hope that he does.

I'm getting to see my IC today!! Yay!! It's been over a month and I really just need to get some of this stuff out.

This all just stinks. I'm just very glad that he does recognize that he messed up. He just didn't understand how upset I would be but I think he does get it now.

Thanks for listening, guys. It's really hard sometimes in real life to even tell people when I'm sad.


Me BW
Him WH-SA
Married 12 years
3 Beautiful girls 8 and under

Posts: 346 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
hope4tomorrow
♀ Member
Member # 21673
Default  Posted: 12:26 PM, February 26th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

That's very good advice, Just Wow. Just wanted to say. I needed to hear some of that myself.


Me BW
Him WH-SA
Married 12 years
3 Beautiful girls 8 and under

Posts: 346 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
JustWow
♀ Member
Member # 19636
Default  Posted: 12:29 PM, February 26th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

hope-
thanks, its funny how my head can "know" all this stuff, my heart is a little learning impaired, and has trouble catching up a lot of times.

JW


BW - Reconciling

edited for typos (I always have to!)


Posts: 3556 | Registered: May 2008 | From: Midwest
momofthree2007
♀ Member
Member # 14766
Default  Posted: 12:31 PM, February 26th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I know I don't have control of him acting out.

Like I said, I want to set that boundary for myself because he'll slip up regardless.

Does that mean I should put up with him acting out?

I guess my H is not serious about getting well. . .

[This message edited by momofthree2007 at 12:32 PM, February 26th (Thursday)]


H - XWH (32) RSA
D-Day 1, OW1: 3/20/07
D-Day 2. OW2: 6/24/07
Divorced, 08/23/2012
Married 7 years, together 9
One day fling each; online As turned physical physical

Posts: 491 | Registered: May 2007 | From: Florida
JustWow
♀ Member
Member # 19636
Default  Posted: 12:36 PM, February 26th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Does that mean I should put up with him acting out?

NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO!

If he's acting out/not sober/not in recovery, you enforce the boundary you put in place for that. For example, until H maintains sobriety (meaning NOT acting out) and is in recovery for X amount of time, we won't have sex. Just an example.

So he acts out, YOU DON'T HAVE SEX. Period. You don't bargain with him, you don't scold, you just enforce your boundary.

I'm afraid I must not be explaining this well enough......


BW - Reconciling

edited for typos (I always have to!)


Posts: 3556 | Registered: May 2008 | From: Midwest
momofthree2007
♀ Member
Member # 14766
Default  Posted: 12:49 PM, February 26th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'm willing to have sex with him every day that he goes without acting out.

I just don't want to on the days he acts out.

I guess that's just one more thing I'll have to discuss with him today.


H - XWH (32) RSA
D-Day 1, OW1: 3/20/07
D-Day 2. OW2: 6/24/07
Divorced, 08/23/2012
Married 7 years, together 9
One day fling each; online As turned physical physical

Posts: 491 | Registered: May 2007 | From: Florida
too trusting BW
♀ Member
Member # 15459
Default  Posted: 1:30 PM, February 26th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

By stating that you will reward or take away sex for his sexual conduct, you are still trying to control HIS choices.

You feel very icky having sex with him when he has acted out? So don't have sex, because it make you feel bad inside.

It is amazing how I have felt for myself once I told my SAH that I would not be haing sex with him until I felt ok with it. He tried several times to translate this to 90 days, but it is about ME taking care of my self respect.

I deserve intimacy.

I deserve to not sell my body to my husband to keep him on track.

I was actually not aware of the many different aspects of our sex life and how I felt about it, until I took it out.

My SAH has not tried to convince me to change my personal stand on this, but it has really taught him to respect me and my body. It also helped come faster to the realization that even though I am his wife YES he was using me to act out and rationalizing it.

You are getting there Momofthree.
Just stop each time you make a decision and focus on YOU.
Ask yourself if this decision is good for you, regardless of the status of the marriage.

If the answer is yes, it is probably a good choice for you.


Me 39
SA-FWH 44
11yrs M
In R-maybe
3 DC from Marriage #1
1 DS together
at least 4 d-days

Posts: 1300 | Registered: Jul 2007 | From: Kansas
momofthree2007
♀ Member
Member # 14766
Default  Posted: 3:37 PM, February 26th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I guess I'll have to address this to a MC.

So far, I'm commmited to the move.

Yesterday my H just singed a lease to house.

Soldiers need to be married and have families to house and he showed them proof.

All that's left is for me to arrange to have my household goods and the car transported and I'm commited.


H - XWH (32) RSA
D-Day 1, OW1: 3/20/07
D-Day 2. OW2: 6/24/07
Divorced, 08/23/2012
Married 7 years, together 9
One day fling each; online As turned physical physical

Posts: 491 | Registered: May 2007 | From: Florida
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