Gosh I love it when someone else sees through him without any information from me!!
So why is he crying all the god damn time? Why does he say he misses me?
Because he knows you are faltering in your resolve. He can sense that he's making headway with you. Are you really considering reconciling? I'm out a year and a 1/2. I can't believe now what I put up with for 17 years. I am happier than I've been since I was 20 years old!!! Please give yourself a chance to shake him off.
Can't remember who said to you that you can always get remarried. LOL, as if! But honestly, that's a good way to look at it. If you two really belonged together, don't you think you'd find a way back to each other? But ask yourself about each of the things he's done through out your marriage and look back at the way you've been treated and how you've learned to tip-toe around him and take care of his needs. Is that really the kind of relationship you wanted or thought you'd have?
How do I find out if therapy is really helping? Do I just look at his actions/behavior? I really want to speak with his therapist, just to explain the NPD and such, should I just tell him I need to do this?
I am happy for once in a very long time. I know it is because he is basically out of my life. I do not miss him, really I don't. I was never "allowed" to be right, to have my own passions, to live freely and I am feeling so much better now that I am. But the kids, that is what makes me feel guilty when he shows any effort.
But I also know they do not want crazy mommy back, I think they are loving finally having me all to themselves, me thinking about them when I when with them. Not "we better hurry and get back so daddy doesn't get mad", etc.
I think its time to remind myself of the quote that speaks to me "it is what it is, not what it should be"
It would be great for my NPD to completely change and me not have to worry every second of every day about him going crazy again. It would be great for the kids to have a "family" as they say. But that is just a fairytale, I know that. If the man was that way for 10 years of marriage, and most importantly SO horrible for the past 2 years, why would I even consider giving him another chance.
I think I need to go back to NC, but getting the money from him, him going to therapy are things that are desireable for me. I guess I just have to remind myself if once agai, if I am losing myself for these things they are not worth it. Because I can see the NPD pattern starting emerge again
It's not that I have trust issues, it's that you shouldn't trust some people!
so i know he is chatting while i am out...or even when i am at home...
i just can not say anything...i will have to reveal my source...then he will just format the laptop...and put passswords on it..so i have to be quiet...and just live with it..
it just hurts...and unsettling...u know it...but u just pretend to be normal..happy...like nothing happened...
Yes, he's sucking you back in with the promise of what it could be, what you thought it was. But you know that it was only as good as it was because of all the work you put in to make it that way.
I did the same thing. He begged me to take him back (while living with the slut but "not sleeping with her" LOL!) and I made a list of all the things I'd need to feel secure again. And it was a big long list. He agreed to it, we planned a day to discuss him moving back in. Then on that day, he called and said he needed one more day. I was blown away. I told him no, today we meet to plan your move back in. He said "you can't dictate the terms of my return." HA!!! Yes I can douchebag, but how's this instead, come get the rest of your shit. "When?" I recommend right now becuase it'll be on the lawn in about 5 minutes.
And it was...adrenaline makes you really strong. The games only stop or appear to stop when he wants something. You start getting wishy washy and he's getting his supply. Its temporary. Test it. Do something that you know will set him off. You'll see the true colors again. Don't be fooled.
The biggest thing that has changed is that there is peace in this house. I don't walk on eggshells anymore. And that's a palpable change for the girls to see.
They have also seen me with a boyfriend now. And they've seen some real affection. That's a wonderful thing as well since I know they didn't see any true affection basically their entire lives between him and I. How sad is that. I'm glad they won't grow up thinking THAT'S what a marriage is.
Earlier this month I took my two little ones on a long weekend trip. We flew and had a connecting flight both times so it was a little crazy toting two kids and all their gear through security, on the plane, etc.. It was hard work but I just had the best time and they did too. It was so empowering doing all that by myself.
I told my Mom it was the first vacation I had really enjoyed in a long time. How crazy is that? I had more fun on a trip where I had to work hard than I did on the kid-free trip I took with STBX a year before D-Day. It made me realize how unhappy I really was with STBX, even pre-A. I think I was just swimming in denial at the time.
MR, that is great that you have a good boyfriend. I am hoping to find that someday, but in the meantime I am ok just being alone and figuring out who I am.
Is there any circumstances for those of you here that you would considered taking the NPD back? Don't worry, I'm not there, not even close, but I do think about the what if's.
No way. Not under any circumstances. Try to remember that he is in frantic mode right now and will SAY anything he thinks you want to hear in order to get you (and his supply) back. Watch carefully and pay more attention to his ACTIONS more than his words. NPD's are notorious for throwing out all the words they KNOW we want to hear, but always fall short in the action department.
I also think that after you get away from him for a period of time you might find that some of these people who you think see your WS is "normal" might come to you with a different opinion. Sometimes people just don't say so while you're married.
Keep telling yourself "it is what it is, not what it should be"
I know there were times WH may have seem to me unreasonable, but I always took it to be a mood, or just him. Over the years, there was more and more "unreasonableness", but he seemed to balance it enough with his charm, etc.
Can they act "semi-normal" for so long? It seems that those who knew WH superficially thought he was wonderful. Some people who were not taken in by his charm thought he treated me badly.
Yes, they can seem normal for long periods of time. And people who don't know them well can think they are "wonderful." But also give yourself a break because you have been with this man for a long time and have been conditioned to his behavior. I'm sure when you first met him that he didn't act like this on a regular basis or you won't have married him. This has been gradually introduced into your life and you have been conditioned to accept it to some degree.
They are forever and always managing their image. Once my NPD realized he couldn't manipulate how I viewed him, he decided "game over".
Totally spot on.
just wondering...it said if you block off the NPD...then they find thier N supply elsewhere...
Don't take it personal. I don't think NPD's are capable of being faithful in any relationship. Even during the "good" years in my marriage, I found out that he was cheating. He ALWAYS had someone on the side. They need constant stroking. (in one form or another)
The most I ever got was "I am sorry that you got hurt while I was searching for my happiness"
Sounds about right.
In the future, try not to engage in lenghty conversations with him. When he drops off the kids and trys to start talking, just say something like, "I've got a cake in the oven, I really have to get in the house. See you later." And walk away. You'll save yourself a lot of heartache in the long run.
When another woman takes your husband,
sometimes the best thing you can do for
yourself is to LET HER HAVE the worthless
OC born 2001
Remarried 2008 (New Guy)
Sorry that I've been MIA.
I'll try to catch up.
Thought that you might like this:
Assholes! Why do they fucking exist?
[This message edited by bobelina at 2:53 PM, July 1st (Thursday)]
Everybody, soon or late, sits down to a banquet of consequences.
~Robert Louis Stevenson
I agree! I had a thousand conversations with my NPD & each one left me more confused and depleted than ever.
There are many reason why I kept persisting, but in hindsight I believe I was trying to get him to say what I needed to hear (i.e., something remotely remorseful or a declarative of undying love)
Once I mastered the 180 I had no need for anything but the most superficial conversations (and he is very good at that! )
And HI to BoB! We haven't met, but I have enjoyed reading your posts here. WB
[This message edited by Nicole5 at 7:58 PM, July 1st (Thursday)]
Nicole: Your whole post I was saying "yes, yes, that's my WH!!" OMG, is it the same man? Thank you for sharing that. I feel depleted too. We cannot talk about US. He twists and turns everything so it's ny fault, etc, etc. BUT as you said, if it's a superficial subject or about HIM (LOL, actually that IS a superficial subject!!) we can have a quite interesting conversation.....you know if we are talking about current events, or politics etc. But I guess I could get more interesting conversations by auditing a class.
Thank you everyone for giving specific examples because it really helps give me reality checks and see how NPD WH really is.
I understand the need for reality checks and real life examples.
In certain NPD circles they call these conversations we have with NPDs: "word salad". They toss words around in the hopes that something they say will eventually make sense (and, more importantly, imho, shut us up!)
[This message edited by Nicole5 at 8:40 PM, July 1st (Thursday)]
he complains to everyone..my wife doesnt talk to me...and my parents are on my case...oh talk to him...
only if it was this simple....
Guys I am worried. I see alot of NPD traits on my oldest son. He is demanding has a huge sense of entitlement, is a master at manipulating others to do his work for him or getting out of things. He can be so nice and then so nasty like someone flipped a switch. He is gifted so he considers pretty much everyone else is a lower human form
He is 17 1/2 and I know it is difficult being a teen but....
I am worried he is going to continue down this road and it is going to bad for him. I have no idea what to do to help him see his behaviours. He is in IC. I am so at a loss as to how to deal with it. He is making life in my home a really bumpy ride.
He reminds me of the ex so much it is scary.
The essence of love is not what we think or do or provide for others, but how much we give of ourselves.
A clean house is the sign of a broken computer.
I cannot stand my NPD. I now realize the only reason he is being nice is because he lost his job. Once again he had me second guessing myself when he was sticking to his usual npd lies.
Unfortunatly his texts, contact, calls have really increased with him not working. He also looks like shit and I bet he is drinking A LOT. He was supposed to have IC this week for the first time and big suprise it didn't happen, he says the therapist canceled on him, right.
But I am back to knowing with all my being that D is the only answer. I need to have my kids know this is not right and if I stayed and tolerated it they would think that is a normal marriage. He is so messed up, I feel so bad for them that they have to deal with such a loser dad:(
The dh i'm stuck with is a somatic (not diagnosed as he refused to see IC or MC), but from everthing i've read it fits him to a tee.
15 years ago this month, I was packing to move to the East Coast from the West. The reason is he didn't want me to catch him with his xw (who lived about an hr away) and he wanted to continue the A (which he did). I told him then it would kill the M, but he didn't listen, again, it was all about him.
I couldn't find a job in my field so I stayed at home with my children and gave up my career and became totally financially dependent on him. I have no cars in my name, nor the title to the house. I own nothing except the clothes in my drawers.
That is changing on Wednesday. He has promised me for 6 years we will leave this state he drug me to and move. Since we have a grandson, I don't want to be more than 5 hrs by plane to get to him, so we are staying on the east coast, but moving to a warmer climate.
Well, he hasn't done one thing to get us to the point of moving, so I decided to move WITHOUT him. Last year at this time, I told him i'm taking a small pittance once a month $500 and putting it away for myself. I now have almost 10k and I'm purchasing a small mobile home in Florida on Wednesday.
I expect to move in on a full time basis by the end of July. I never dreamed it would take me 15 years to get out of here. I'm not willing to wait another month or year!
He's not to happy, but he can't do much about it. Our children are grown and gone, both girls are now married, oldest son is in Japan with the Army Rangers and youngest son is working and taking care of his business.
XH is NPD. One of his favorite tactics is to blame everyone else for his problems. Our children have suffered greatly do to his decisions and treatment of them. At the start of the separation he was verbally abusive and physically rought with them. Social services was called twice (and not by me) and the police once because he seemed threatening to the person that called. All of this was not his fault or problem, it was mine because apparently I had said or done something to cause those people to report him.
I had the kids and myself in counseling for a year, and at one point 3 different therapists were involved. All 3 therapists said he could be diagnosed with cluster B personality disorder(s), but since he would not agree to therapy we had to work on me and the kids. They advised him he needed instruction on how to parent kids through divorce and he called them quacks. So, all the kids' misbehavior is my fault because I get him in trouble when he disciplines them...so he can't...so goes his logic. But he won't accept anyone's advice or even acknowledge that he is having problems witht he kids.
Recently my kids were very disrespectful to him which was wrong...and they did it in public and loudly. Problem is he will not listen to them or anyone because he knows it all. He was trying to get them to do a very dangerous thing and they told him no and he forced them to do it. Which caused the disrespect. They were scared to do what he wanted and felt backed into a corner.
My friend witnessed this and blamed me. Appartently he told her he is powerless to discipline the kids because they tell me and then I get him in trouble. He, of course did not tell her any back story.
My friend is a second wife (don't know if there was infidelity but she cannot understand my point of view as the betrayed and abandoned first wife with damaged kids, and projects her frustration of her situation with her first wife onto me) She also doesn't have biological kids but is a step parent.
She really went after me and gave me all sorts of advice about how I need therapy, it's my fault, I allow the kids to manipulate me, I need to work with XH and be civil. I started crying at one point because she doesn't know all the gory details, she doesn't know I paid for all that counseling and fucktard wouldn't chip in a penny. She doesn't know he pathologically lies, he steals, etc.
I want to defend myself to her but then I think what is the point. He has charmed her and conned her too. I am the evil doer.
I am very upset about this as I thought she was my friend and on the kids and my side. I thought wrong.
I don't know what to do and I am angry and hurt that she would accuse me and say those things to me.
What would you do?