"So, So what, I'm still a rock star, I've got my rock moves and I don't need you" ~ Pink
Life is great!
Complicated mad hatter situation
Status: With all the Ddays, lets just say the clock was set back to Jan 2012.
Thanks for your reply. While I'm the BS in my situation I am very much in an asexual marriage right now and we are going on 4 years out from D-Day. I know that I said some very VERY hurtful things to my FWW. I said some things that I would be embarassed if my mother ever heard them come out of my mouth. I said some things that if there were no A, would be worthy of a nasty divorce.
However, from the BS perspective, I earned the right to say some of those things due to the level of hurt I was going through at the time. I never got physical with my FWW and although some would say that it would have been justified, I believe I did more or at least as much damage with my words as I could have ever done with my hand.
I'm not saying what I did was right. I am saying that given what she did to me....my words were forgivable. I did not go out and have the revenge affair, I never laid a hand on her. Now, we are a few years out from D-Day, and I'm being told that she's just not into sex. She refused to initiate anything EVER and I've been told no so many times that I've stopped asking. I have now spelled it out for her. She's got one more year to figure this out or we're done. Everything else about our marriage is great. Communication has not always been her strong suit but she's getting better. I stuck by her through depression 7 years ago when she was crying all the time and asexual. I stuck by her after her A. I've repeatedly tried to initiate a sexual relationship with my Wife who I love and am tired of being rejected.
For those Waywards out there who are experiencing this, please take into consideration that by abstaining from the biggest reason people get hurt in A's, you are only keeping the rift open and in my case may be the end of a marriage if not solved.
I love my Wife but I also have to be physical with her and if that's not a possibility, then I need to move on. Selfish??? Maybe but it's not like I haven't tried and I'm not the one who fucked up...
WOW this kind of turned into a rant rather than a response. For that I apologize.
He was just pissed at me all the time. Who wants to be intimate with someone who shows such anger. Intimacy lost all the way around.
It would have been a better choice to have worked with me to see if as a team we could work on libido. Communication has always been sexy to me. If he had put the effort into helping me instead of seeing me as a foe, I may not be here now.
(this is pre A. Post Confirmation day, it's been rabbit city)
[This message edited by IntuitionKnows at 4:17 PM, January 7th (Friday)]
You and I seem to be on the same page. I'm the BS and he's had multiple affairs due to my not having a strong a sex drive as him.
My desire for him is basically non-existent. That being said, I have always been a "good wife/mom" in all other ways and he says I'm the best friend he has.
But yeah, mostly repulsed by him at this point.
I am working on my 180.
I love my Wife but I also have to be physical with her and if that's not a possibility, then I need to move on. Selfish??? Maybe but it's not like I haven't tried and I'm not the one who fucked up..
we have a few things in common. we're both in a sexless M and we both got cheated on by people who seemingly have low libido.
it's not selfish at all to want and try to reclaim your sex life. in my case, the A happened 10 years into our M which had been effectively sexless for 8 yrs except for when we were trying to get pg.
we have been in R for at least the last 2 1/2 years and i just told WH last night - this has got to improve. you can't hold my sexuality hostage like this anymore. please don't make me think that leaving is the only option to address the lack of sex in my life.
sex has never been a strong point in our M, but i was able to live with that bc i thought it resulted from physical issues for WH (he had one testicle removed in his teens and has had low testosterone levels as an adult). you can imagine how betrayed i felt when WH confessed his ONS - it felt like a double betrayal - once for the act itself, and also for the many years i tried to bury my need for sex that i wasn't getting in the M, but didn't cheat to obtain. WTF?
i'm not sure what else to tell you other than the approach i'm taking now. last night (i triggered big time after holding my tongue for a few months), i told him 'i want you to write down 5 ways you're going to address our lack of sex life, and i want to see you assign dates to the timeframe you expect to achieve these things.' i expect that list to include things like 'i'll read once per week from those books you gave me' and 'i'll check in with you once a week to see what you need from me in our M.'
fairytale, you're not selfish for wanting sex and feeling that if you can't establish that part of your M, you need to move on. remember that *WS* is the one that forever changed the dynamic of your M because of *her* ultimate selfish act. the only benefit available here is to improve your M from where it was pre-A, and it sounds like sex is a critical part of that for you. it's part of what you need to feel R. don't be ashamed of that.
good luck, and keep us posted on how things are going!
[This message edited by Dark Mark at 10:23 PM, January 9th (Sunday)]
I can't figure him out and I'm about to give up trying to.
He realized I've been really depressed lately. I told him that I just cannot tell if he loves me anymore, and that it's killing me.
Dark Mark- we have a few things in common. we're both in a sexless M and we both got cheated on by people who seemingly have low libido.
I'm the "low libido" wayward in a sexless LTR, so maybe my perspective can help out either the BS or WS in this kind of f'd up situation.
Disclaimer: I'm still very much trying to figure this out, so this is by no means conclusive, but maybe it will still be useful to someone? I'm hoping I'll be able to figure out more in the weeks/months to come.
A big question that has been on my mind about the A is about sex. At least for me, I wonder, how could I believe I had low-libido for most of my life and then suddenly have the libido to have sex with the absolute wrong person, by cheating?
Itís an ugly and uncomfortable question, which is probably why Iíve avoided thinking about it until recently. But I think it is a big part of my betrayal, and Iím pretty sure has been like having salt rubbed in my BSOís wound. Here he was being a very patient, understanding SO, accepting and not pushing me about my low-libido for nearly 10 years! Then I go and screw some other guy. I canít even imagine the pain- and itís been hard to face that.
What I think it really has to do with is my dysfunctional relationship with sex. I think I carry a lot of shame about sex, and the only way I could express my sexuality was if it was secret and illicit. I let my libido get suppressed to the point that it busted out and expressed itself in an ugly, screwed up way.
When I think about it more, even masturbating, I was so uncomfortable with it that I always did it in secret and never shared it with anyone, even my BSO. I was afraid to be found out, so I always did it in secret.
It seems the only time I could be free sexually ďwithĒ my BSO, so to speak, was in my sleep, because my deep seated embarrassment and shame could not get in the way. He said that sometimes I would masturbate in my dreams and that was a turn-on for him. But once I was awake, there I was, ashamed again and Ms. Low Libido again.
I think that has been a big barrier to having any sex life to speak of, because I couldnít even talk about how I felt about sex and what I wanted about it directly. It was easier to just create and believe a story about me that I was just ďlow libidoĒ and there was nothing to be done about it, that I was some sort of freak. I have believed this for a very long time (since childhood I think- though I wasnít abused or anything like that.) So, I considered myself very lucky when it appeared my BSO was able to live with my so-called problem, love me, stick by me and agree to marry me.
To further that story I created, I think I even held myself back from thinking too much about sex because I was embarrassed about thinking about it even, and so therefore did not let myself go down the mental pathways that would lead to arousal. I did that for enough years (again since some point in my childhood) that my mind got trained just not to go there anymore. But really, it was still there. Itís like breathing and hunger; I could only suppress and deny it to myself for so long before it came out with a vengeance.
I used to think, right after the A sort of shocked me out of believing I had a ďlow libidoĒ, that the fact that our whole relationship was pretty darn sexless (once every 2-4 months?) perhaps meant that me and my BSOís relationship was doomed. I was also still in the fog, too, so I tend to discredit that thought, though.
But now I feel like thereís more hope, because our lack of passion is not something fundamental about us as a couple, but something for me to work on through IC, reading and working on it more proactively. You know, a dysfunction, like any, that can be worked on. Not a fundamental, unchangeable fact. Just realizing that is very empowering for making change.
I canít guarantee it will succeed, but I think trying to work through it is worthwhile for me (and perhaps for him too) to gain better skills around communicating about and creating sexual intimacy, which will help us, whether we stay together or move on.
It will remain to be seen whether my BSO will want to wait for me to get my act together in terms of sexuality, but Iím going to start doing the work anyway, because itís something I have to face at some point, or I canít ever hope to be a good partner to anyone, ever.
My IC suggested a book called _Real Sex for Real Women_, to get me started on thinking about how to get over my shame of talking about and thinking about sex. Iíll let you guys know if it is helpful, and what, if any, progress I make on this front.
But seriously, it is so amazing that for me, something as seemingly innocuous as *shame* kept me from talking and even thinking about sex for so long, and may have ruined a potentially wonderful relationship with a wonderful man. But no more of this crap!
Good luck to everyone. I hope we all find some resolution to our sexless relationships and marriages.
Edited to fix typos and wording.
[This message edited by Compost Heap at 12:45 AM, February 24th (Thursday)]
Don't know if anyone will read this but I just needed to put these words down.
However, around Dec. the sex started being less frequent. And now, I think we've had sex twice in the last four months. Not nearly enough!
Possibly the Zoloft she's taking, although we're afraid to get off that because she may become the monster she was back in Oct. She is going to try to substitute St. John's Wort for the Zoloft, to see if that helps.
She just has no desire at all right now, and my desire keeps increasing. I can't hardly think of anything else but sex anymore. I get hard just watching shampoo commercials.
Our MC suggested that we put it on the calendar, just like it was a date for some appointment. He claims that once you start having sex, you start wanting it more. I think this is true, but I'm having trouble getting WW to even try this. I'm getting to the point where I'm ready to just demand that she lie down and spread 'em, although that seems a little rape-ish.
I can't let it go on too much longer, though. I refuse to have an affair, or visit a brothel, but I refuse to live in a sexless marriage, too. Masturbation is nice, but it's no substitute for a good, healthy sexual relationship with a partner.