<<dancing around living room waving arms in the air>>
ETA: My horoscope for today: Use today to get into a project or finish up a long-overdue must-do. The speed at which you get this done could shock you. Take a deep breath. Do you feel different? Most likely so. Consider taking an action you have been putting off. Tonight: Make it easy
Guess I really need to get this rear in gear! LOL!
I wish we could search the site for keywords... esp. in profiles so I might find others with the same interests...
[This message edited by lostsuol at 12:21 PM, May 16th (Saturday)]
Didn't do the link, we can't always see what you get, but did this one!
>>>dancing and waving too <<<
And then I thought of this one:
I LOVE that movie. And I had a wonderful black lab too, so had to choose this one. Makes me smile.
Now I gotta get that disco compilations tape on and dance around the kitchen.
For BT or any of our veterans, do you have anything other than Not Just Friends that you recommend my WS read? And anything for me to read?
Love you all
the book dept has been a difficult one for me...all the affair book tell you to go back to "before" the affair...and since i do not have a before, that kind null and voids the advice, hell it null and voids the book......so i have been reading alot about "me" stuff, books to help me through and help me get back to being "me"....so i have alot of books going.....
my wh actually booked us on a weekend workshop with debbie ford, i have mixed feeling about going away with him....looking forward to the workshop, but not being with him.....
anyways i digress....after the good people, bad things book let me know if it helped she has another book that might be helpful.....
You have to discover that there is only one person you can rely on, one person to be true to, one person who can be your judge and (you know what Iím going to say) that person is you. One book might be Men Like Women Who Like Themselves, I canít find my copy at the moment, but it was quite a good dip in, dip out one. Please step right back and view him with steely eyes. Ask yourself, when you have stripped him down to his bare bones, is he worth it?
I've bought the Debbie Ford book too, but not read it yet.
I am trying to fathom out just what I was to H when I first met him. I wonder if I was a replacement for her. I know he regretted the way they broke up as studnets, even though, when I asked, he shrugged his shoulders and said it was her decision to split when she chose the man who was to become her H over him. He says he was in total agreement that they were finished and had a sense of relief. And then there was the business of being unable to finish with her a second time, until I made the decision for him. People keep telling me he is still here, that if he truly loved her or if he no longer loved me, he would have gone, but I think he is just a coward and let me and MOW sort it out. And he wanted to be seen to do the right thing. And he knew his family never thought much to her and thought the world of me.
And then trying to deal with how he was looking for her, actively looking for her, in the two years after the first school reunion. Meanwhile, engaging with other old gfís (he says not and I have no way of proving that now, so that will remain a quiet suspicion) and looking back over his life with regret at all those might have beens. Was he ever happy or content? Rambling on, on this rainy Sunday afternoon.
I am struggling with several things today. To find something H and I have that I can say is ours.
Was he ever happy or content?
Will you consider going back into IC? If your old one wasn't a good fit, how about looking for a new one. YEs it is harsh and tiring going on about issues, but I think thats the only way we can get out of the place we are in. Leaving H and the M aside, we have to save ourselves first. And I suspect that you, like me, have a tendency towards selfpunishment (in whatever form) instead of "punishing" the real culprits (parents, spouses, etc).
Fnf, that was fun.
But HOW can we possibly do disco without the BeeGees???
[This message edited by Lost Heart2 at 12:46 PM, May 17th (Sunday)]
Mind what you love. Mind how you are loved.
i am trying to think differently lately and it helps somewhat....the hardest part is when something comes up, and he tries to defend himself...how dare he defend the indefensible...he just proves to me over andover that he doesn't get it and he doesnot know the first thing about owning his shit...lately his new thing is that i should be understanding because he had a lousy foundation with his parents, and he was th edutiful son....well i know for a fact that they didnot teach him to fuck other women, much less a married women, and i for sure that they not only would not condone the loansharking but i am sure that my fil would probably take a whack at him...they were shitty parents, but he made his own poor choices out of selfishness pure selfishness.....
we had a little to do last night with kids and he so damn stupid, he pushed my dd buttons, she told him that his word doesn't mean crap and he tell her that she has to respect him that is no way to speak to him.....meanwhile she knows what he did, how could she respect him....and to boot she is keeping his secret form ther borthers...who were in the car with us, and then he kept pushing...tell me how you defendied your mother...was one of the stupid lines of the nite....he so damned lucky that she kept her mouth shut, and he kept pressing, i kept telling him that he needed to shut up, but what do i know....everything i warn him about has come to pass.....but then again what do i know...earlier yesterday before this i had warned him that she is very very angry and he needs to watch his step....and sure enough last nite was a bit of scene....thankfully she didn't let the cat out of the proverbial bag...but it is coming.....
my mom was here this week, and she doesn't know either...they finally have a realtionship...i can't tell her, it would hurt her beyond belief....once i know we are doen, without any doubts whatso ever i will tell her....maybe....but right now she doesn't know....and she is starting to defend him....stick up for him and she want to know if my c know how much anger i have.....
all i want to do is scream HELLO< FUCKING HELLO...OF COURSE I HAVE A LOT OF ANGER....THAT ASSHOLE FUCKED OTHER WOMAN, LOVED ONE OF THEM, AND SHE WAS ALWAYS THERE...AO YES SHE KNOWS HOW ANGRY I AM...AND THE FACT THAT HE STILL DOESN'T GET IT, NOR DOES HE OWN IT MAKE ME EVEN ANGRIER...
ok, i feel slightly better....it helps to yell even if it is only in caps..
and lately i am starting to feel really lonely...a truly dangerous emotion.....i have big time longings.....i long for a man to put his arms around me, hold me and kiss me......and know, really know in my soul that I AM IT!!!!.......i want to know that there is no one in the background...but i know that will never be....at my age everyone has baggage and there will always be someon else in the background...I HATE HIM FOR TAKING THAT AWAY FROM ME........he took so much and i willingly gave it freely.....because i really believed he loved me.....only me!!!!
i need to go now....too upset...need to read on in si, get lost in others sich's...
What would I have him read? For one, I would have him go back to basics. Since he's already got Not Just Friends, the two infidelity books I would suggest he read are the online downloadable one (I can find the link if you need it.) and Private Lies by Frank Pittman.
But I would also suggest he read some books on how to live a life of integrity. One of the easiest ones is The Four Agreements. I would also suggest Beverly Engel's Blessings from the Fall. And I can't remember the name of it, but the book that FNF suggested to us about a year ago might be helpful, too. FNF?
How are you doing, HB?
Anyway, always appreciating your extra thoughts and prayers. I'm adopting a wait-and-see attitude to see how H's actions show that he is either progressing or just going through the motions.
Just curious- of our LTA tribe who here has children under the age of 10? For me, anything I am doing affects so much more than myself. I have an 8 year old who has emotional problems (counselor thinks it may be chemical like Bipolar) and a 5 year old.
Hugs to all,
[This message edited by forgivenotforget at 1:44 PM, May 18th (Monday)]
How sad that your H has to deliberately hurt your DD like that.
And even though your DS doesnt know the story, he would definetly know by now that something is going on.
Miracle, I know this is a tough time for you, but next time your H gets onto the kids like that, tell him to leave. You have to take control in that situation and protect the kids. I will always have regrets and shame for the times that I allowed H to be emotionally abusive to the children after dday.
He would not have dared before then.
Re the loneliness, can you spend some time with your gfs? I know its not the same, but you need to find healthy ways to nurture yourself and get you away from the slope.
Take care, Miracle, and like Fnf said, it DOES get better.
My DDs are 9 and 7. My DS is 13.
They have all reacted in their own ways after dday...each one so different from the other. Youngest DD became more clingy and regressed. Older DD became quieter, more protective and yet angry with H. DS became more agressive and he also withdrew. We 4 were so close before this.
I presume you asked the question as your kiddos are reacting to the current sitch. Would you consider taking them a homeopath? To help with anxiety/sleep etc.
A family therapist might also help in the near future.
Stay strong, HB. You are doing great.
Call me delusional but I don't believe that those who are capable of living double lives for extended periods of time have the emotional capacity or maturity to be capable of genuine love
Oh most definetly!
I KNOW that whilst he didnt love me, he also did not love either of the OW. He loved the way we all made him feel. He loved that he could pick or discard as he felt. He loves that he could have either world anytime he wanted. And he did.
To Love? I think my H is still finding out the meaning of that word. And I can see without a doubt that he has shown us more real love in the last year then any of the previous 15 years.
I would love to hear other stories about the mother/son relationship and how it has had long-term, devastating effects for them and for your M.
Well where should I start? Conception?
I am going to get back to you on this soon but have to put the kiddos to bed.
Receiving Love: Transform Your Relationship by Letting Yourself Be Loved by H Hendix?
Tribe, I am feeling so much better after my recent stumble. God when I think of how low I fall, its really scary. But I am on my way back. Thank you all for holding my hand.
It was Steering Clear. I thought you had recommended that one to us, but obviously it was someone else.
And I completely agree that anyone involved in a LTA hasn't the faintest conception of what love is.
I donít think the ages of my boys would have made much difference. It was such a shock, frankly, that I could barely breathe, let alone think straight. Iím just so angry that he abandoned us for his lost love when the boys were 6, 12, 14 and 15, with all their different issues at that time. I was left with it all for five yrs and I still get pissed at the thought even now. Dday, they were 11, 18, 20 & 21. DS1&3 would have had nothing but contempt and despise for their father, he had been particularly hard on them. DS2 would have been extremely hurt and worried about me and DS4 would have had all the vibes from the rest of us, doing him no good at all. No age is the right age for S&D. When theyíre older, you worry about the detrimental effect it will have on their school/college work and exams. At least it was the summer holidays, which was something. But it also meant the house was always full of people coming and going. It was awful. I didnít want them to know. I reckon MOW had picked her time. WH had implied that he would leave when DS4 was ďold enoughĒ and she knew he was leaving primary for high school that summer, so she upped the ante. DS4 had left primary just one week before.
www.loveandrespect.com Ė I remember those videos and thought they were excellent.
emotional capacity or maturity to be capable of genuine love
H always had a very close relationship with his mother. It was very much mother/DS2 and father/DS1. His mumís into art and drama, she did amateur dramatics and encouraged H to do the same. Which is where his relationship with MOW started when they were at school. They were in The Crucible and he was John Proctor (church leader having adulterous affairÖ..) his wife was played by his then GF () and long comes bitchface as Mary Warren to lure him away. Strange. Anyway, he always wanted to please his mother, but only because he loves and cares about both of them. His dad frustrates him. His mum is very outgoing and popular, his dad Is a bit of a hermit, quite happy just being in the garden.
Both sets of parents get on really well and we've had loads of Christmases and celebrations when they've all come up to stay with us. They chat on the phone and meet up once a week or so for lunch. Check up on each other when one has been in hospital or whatever.
His mother was devastated and at her drama best when I told them about the A. Everyone has foo issues, but I canít blame them for the A. He has put the women in his life on a bit of a pedestal. His lovely Nan who took his mum in when she got pregnant. And then his mum took on the matriarch role when Nan died. He was perhaps overly expected to excel academically. He feels he has failed by not being the CEO of some conglomerate. And the fact that I wasnít bothered kind of niggled him, I think and made him feel even more inadequate. If that makes sense.
ETA: cross posting, I'm a slow typer!
[This message edited by UKgirl at 2:40 PM, May 18th (Monday)]
A life chasing butterflies. They look very pretty, but catching them is hard. ďHold it too tight, it'll crush, hold it too loose, it'll fly.Ē He was never content with being content. Now he says this is what he wants, that it is me he loves, but I doubt it. Iím not sure if Iíve been crushed or if Iím waiting to fly.
Now I sound as bad as him
Just wanted to share a (too-telling) story. As I've gotten older, I've had to deal with very course hair on the underside of my chin - too course to wax. The light must be just right for me to see well enough to pluck - best is outdoors. So...Sunday morning we're parked in the grocery store parking lot and the light is perfect, so I pull out my tweezers, but my eyesight is really failing and I was having a great deal of difficulty. FWH simply reached over and took the tweezers out of my hand and finished the job for me. It made me cry because about a year and a half ago I asked him to help me once and he refused - said it was just too gross.
WS-59: LTA (22+ years)
MOW-54: H's old girlfriend
D-day 08/11/08 (3 days before 25th anniversary)
Working hard on R
Maybe this is too telling as well. I donít want my H to see me in those casual situations of shaving my underarms in the shower, epilating my legs, putting on my makeup. I let him see to my stitches and scars after surgery, but only because he wanted to and it was quite hard for me to see much those first few days. I donít want him around when Iím ironing, mopping floors, mending etc. I donít want him around when Iím sick. I never again want him to see me in the free fall devastated condition I was in after dday. I guess I will never feel completely comfortable with him in the way I did before. And MOW would not have had wet washing hanging around, the pile of ironing waiting to be done, been seen in her gardening sweater, he would not have seen her ill or with hairy armpits. I suppose Iím saying while I think I love him, I donít think I want to live with him. I seem to be getting more than just a step away, now maybe I'm actually turning.
My friend asked me the other day if I had stayed with FWH to stop MOW from having him. I think there was an element in that, but I recognise it was wrapped up in all sorts of other tumultuous emotions at the time.
Hope you made it through the anniversary day yesterday without too much trauma, although my gut tells me that is unlikely. I am thinking of you and sending you good thoughts and prayers.
My sons were 8 and 11 when H confessed. It was much tougher on the older one than the younger one. I was so out of control in hurt and anger that they lived in a stew of negative emotion for a very long time, a fact which I regret mightily but had no power to alter.
The research on the effects of divorce and marital discord is really mixed on children of different ages. Among the few areas of agreement is that discord between parents and divorce seems to affect kids differently depending on their age. It's kind of hard to generalize, but if I remember right, the older kids tend to be affected in a more conscious way in their own romantic relationships. (More wary, more cynical, more commitment-phobic, etc.) The younger kids seem to be more affected by marital discord rather than the divorce itself. I don't think it's ever easy to go through, no matter what.
One of the lessons I have learned the hard way both in life and academically is how easily and deeply children are affected by what we do as parents. One of the Sufi masters that I have studied is fond of saying he has never met anyone enlightened enough to raise a child. I totally understand what he means.