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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: BS Questions for WS"s III
UnexpectedSong
♀ Member
Member # 21761
Default  Posted: 12:44 PM, August 21st (Friday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

stuck808 -

For the WS's, did your spouses do anything that helped to get you back or did you just want to be left alone?

He said he would divorce me, and then he did the 180. Both the threat and leaving me alone (180) worked.

[This message edited by UnexpectedSong at 12:46 PM, August 21st (Friday)]


WW(SA)
"Feedback is the breakfast of champions." - Boris Becker

Posts: 6046 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
MissesJai
♀ Member
Member # 24849
Default  Posted: 1:11 PM, August 21st (Friday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

For the WS's, did your spouses do anything that helped to get you back or did you just want to be left alone?

nope....he didn't feel he needed to and neither did i....because i had no intention of leaving him, there was no need to try and get me "back". i never wanted to be left alone and i still don't...


FWW - 40
Nobody can make you feel inferior without your consent...

Posts: 5525 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: So Cal.....
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 2:20 PM, August 21st (Friday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

ChasingPavements -

Anyway, do either of you have suggestions on how I can create a safer environment for him NOW to discuss his feelings, etc., with me?

Sort of a tough question, because until I did the work in IC to address my conflict avoidance the barrier to communication was me, not my BW.

Out of the gate, though, there are a few things in hindsight that I think helped. We leveraged tools to spark communication without it being a targeted "so, what did LC learn about himself today" approach. We read "After the Affair" together, and talked about the content after we had both finished each chapter. I read at a slower pace than my BW, but she did not push me to get it done faster. She just asked when I finished a chapter that we talk about the book.

We also used the Emotional Needs Questionnaire on marriagebuilders.com. It helped use an objective set of answers to isolate differences in view between us.

In all cases, it's critical to allow for thoughts and opinions to be expressed without attacking the other person. Facts can be disputed, but feelings are what they are. You may not agree with them, and that's ok. Just don't dismiss them as being absurd either. If you can reach a point where you can agree to disagree, you'll know you are on the right path.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
forget2007
♂ New Member
Member # 16662
Default  Posted: 3:10 PM, August 24th (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

It has been already three years since the D-day. I still could not understand why my wife hated me so much during the time that she had an affair. I considered myself a good husband and father. However I was a workaholic.
I asked my wife several times but never got an ansewer except for getting blamed.

I would love to know why from WS spouse

Thank you


WW: College Sweetheart.
BH: Me
Together: 21 years
Married: 16 years
Two wonderful son: 8/12

Posts: 8 | Registered: Oct 2007
64fleet
♂ Member
Member # 18710
Default  Posted: 3:29 PM, August 24th (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I still could not understand why my wife hated me so much during the time that she had an affair.


I wonder this as well-WW actually texted her friend "I hate my husband" WTF did I do?


time wounds all heels

Posts: 5359 | Registered: Mar 2008 | From: deliverance land
MissesJai
♀ Member
Member # 24849
Default  Posted: 3:57 PM, August 24th (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I still could not understand why my wife hated me so much during the time that she had an affair.

i wish i could help out here but i never hated my BH during the course of the affair..hell, i've never hated him and never will, even if we don't work out. but, i'll throw my 2 cents in the hat...

maybe she feels resentful because you were a workaholic. maybe she felt like she always had to compete with your job and maybe she felt like that was a competition she'd never win, regardless of the reasons why. maybe she felt because you were a workaholic, you were emotionally unavailable, to her when she needed you. not trying to justify, just throwing stuff out there....

you said it's been 3 years since d-day. are you guys still M?


FWW - 40
Nobody can make you feel inferior without your consent...

Posts: 5525 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: So Cal.....
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 4:58 PM, August 24th (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Forget2007 and Fleet64 -
I still could not understand why my wife hated me so much during the time that she had an affair.

It's hard to understand unless you have lived as a WS. At the heart of the origination of an A is an unmet need in the WS. In many cases, mine included, that need is misguided. Often, the need is described as a desire for more attention, to feel more physically attractive to someone, for another person to pay attention to the WS, etc.

This "need" is usually rooted in a greater flaw within the WS and really has little to do with the BS (or the OP for that matter). In my case, it was that I could not see value in myself and relied upon others to express it for me. There were certainly gaps in our M at the time. We had placed our M on hold for the kids (her), work (me), etc. And we've spent quite a bit of time since D-Day addressing these issues as a couple.

But there is a snowball effect. The OP shows positive attention to the WS. The WS knows inside that this is wrong, but is too weak to resist the positive feedback. So history needs to be rewritten to justify the A. So the WS starts what is a small kernel of dissatisfaction with the M and builds it up. The more they tell the AP that their BS is not giving them the attention they need, the more the AP strokes the WS's ego back and tells them how their BS just doesn't understand what a great person the WS is. So the WS moves from dissatisfaction to frustration to anger to hatred. It's called a slippery slope for a reason. At first it doesn't seem all that big a deal, but before long the WS looks back and wonders how they dug such a huge hole for themselves.

So while there may have been bumps in the way you treated your WS, they are NOT the reason their anger appears so strong. They are infact reflections of how weak your WS is, unable to see their own value and be less reliant on others to define themselves.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
figureitout
♀ Member
Member # 23997
Default  Posted: 4:59 PM, August 24th (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

"I still could not understand why my wife hated me so much during the time that she had an affair."

I am the WS of a workaholic. It is easy to confuse 'these are all the reasons that it is his fault....' with not taking responsibility for my actions. For me also there is resentment, if only my H spent half the time with me as his work, if only I wasn't always a priority behind his work, why do I have to 'compete' with his job for his attention. Also I have had intermittent reinforcement by H of M, but kick myself because I do not want to accept the crumb offerings and berate myself for ever thinking 'it's just too little, too late'.
Just so much conflicting stuff swimming around in my head could make me so resentful and 'hate' the H because I hate the situation.
Of course, now I know better and own my shit


M-30+ yr
Dday 8/09

Posts: 308 | Registered: May 2009
forget2007
♂ New Member
Member # 16662
Default  Posted: 6:37 PM, August 24th (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I do really appreciated all for sharing and ideas. This open my eyes a lot.

To be honest, the affair does not much me as much as the hattress that my wife gave me during the A and shortly after.

Nothing more hurtful than the person you care for and love just hate you.

I still feel sad but atleast I understand why now.

Thank you


WW: College Sweetheart.
BH: Me
Together: 21 years
Married: 16 years
Two wonderful son: 8/12

Posts: 8 | Registered: Oct 2007
forget2007
♂ New Member
Member # 16662
Default  Posted: 10:40 PM, August 24th (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have another question.

Although our relationship is doing much better now. Sometime the old memory came back so I just do not talk much. My WW seems to be very anoyed by this and started a fight. I never fought back and just said yes to whatever she wanted.

SO my question is why she has to get upset whenever this happen. Can she just left me alone so I can recollect myself

Thanks for reading


WW: College Sweetheart.
BH: Me
Together: 21 years
Married: 16 years
Two wonderful son: 8/12

Posts: 8 | Registered: Oct 2007
UnexpectedSong
♀ Member
Member # 21761
Default  Posted: 12:04 AM, August 25th (Tuesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

forget2007 -

I still could not understand why my wife hated me so much during the time that she had an affair

I never hated my husband, but I do understand what your wife meant. You need to read the book "The Five Love Languages" by Gary Chapman. It says there are five "love languages", which are how people feel loved.

For example, you may feel loved when someone cooks for you (acts of service). Your wife may feel loved when you spend time with her (quality time). The converse of this means that if you are using a love language that is NOT hers, she will not feel loved.

So, if your wife's love langage is quality time and you have been showing her with acts of service (you fix appliances, mow the lawn, work hard at your job, replace the shower tiles), she may actually feel that you hate her, that you never spend any time with her, that you avoid her.

My guess is that you and she have never learned each others' love languages, so all the acts of love you were showing each other were misunderstood and never appreciated.

Sometime the old memory came back so I just do not talk much. My WW seems to be very anoyed by this and started a fight

Do you tend to withdraw in general whenever you feel stressed or something bad is happening? Is it only when you get triggered with bad memories and withdraw that she gets mad? Or does she get mad whenever you withdraw?

Are you in marriage counseling? I think you and your wife could really benefit from learning how to communicate better.


WW(SA)
"Feedback is the breakfast of champions." - Boris Becker

Posts: 6046 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 7:07 AM, August 25th (Tuesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

forget2007 -

SO my question is why she has to get upset whenever this happen. Can she just left me alone so I can recollect myself

UnexpectedSong is on the track I would be thinking. If displays of affection and quality time are how your WS receives love, she will feel rejected and hurt any time you withdraw and go silent on her.

You may also want to examine this trait as it is not a healthy way to address things long term. It sounds like you may have some conflict avoidance areas you should touch on in IC. consider reading the book "The Assertiveness Workbook" by Randy Paterson. It's an excellent resource in finding better ways to cope with this type of conflict.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
forget2007
♂ New Member
Member # 16662
Default  Posted: 3:19 PM, August 25th (Tuesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I would like to thanks everyone from the bottom of my heart for ideas and sharing. It really open up my mind and I feel I understand my wife alot better now. I hope by changing the way I approach things will help us having a better relattionship

Thanks again


WW: College Sweetheart.
BH: Me
Together: 21 years
Married: 16 years
Two wonderful son: 8/12

Posts: 8 | Registered: Oct 2007
jewel123
♀ Member
Member # 22863
Default  Posted: 10:10 AM, August 26th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Bump


BS me 44
H 46 (paulie)
married 25 years (hs sweethearts)
dday 8-08
DS19
DS23
New love is the brightest, and long love is the greatest, but revived love is the tenderest thing known on earth. -Thomas Hardy
Reconciled! :)

Posts: 5524 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: MO
woundedspouse
♀ Member
Member # 16657
Default  Posted: 11:30 AM, August 26th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

THE WHY

Wh and I are 2 years out from D Day #1. I have endured trickle truth this whole time.

We are far from healed and struggling as intensely as ever.

He is NC.... was immediately. He is in IC, but I believe that this particular therapist is doing more harm than good. SHe was also our MC, but I quit going to her. I would be open to another therapist, but at this point, the ball is in his court to make that happen.

So my question for all of you wise and giving WSs:

Can you ever be healed as a WS, can a marriage be healed if you never get to the "WHY"?

His answers are all very surface answers. His most honest is "because I wanted to".

WHile I believe that is true.... it is not WHY he chose to betray me / his vows / HIMSELF.

He thinks he needs to go no deeper.

NEedless to say this scares the crap out of me.

I am interested in your very wise opinions.

THank you in advance!!

WOunded

(also posting in general for BS / WS opinions)


Wounded Spouse
ME - 41 BS
HIM 51 WS
Married 2/93 3 beautiful children
DDay #1 8-26-07 DDay #2 11-8-07 DDAy #3 12-23-07 DDay #?! 7-2-07
"If you ask me what I came into this world to do, I will tell you: "I came to live out loud."

Posts: 1381 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: midwest,
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 11:36 AM, August 26th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

woundedspouse -

Can you ever be healed as a WS, can a marriage be healed if you never get to the "WHY"?

For me, the answer is no. A WS needs to get to the core foundation of why they cheated. This isn't just to ensure they heal as a person, although that's an important outcome. But the bigger reason is until you get to the why, you cannot answer the most important question in R:

"How can either of us be sure you will never cheat again?"

The only way to answer that question is by digging deep enough to uncover the flaws in a WS and to learn ways to address them.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
beach
♀ Member
Member # 7533
Default  Posted: 2:57 PM, August 26th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

wondedspouse,

I also posted in General...


From FWS's POV.

Need to know "why" is very important.

If you don't know why, what happens if he/she slip back into the same coping pattern..?

I could justify my PA as because of our lifestyle enabled my behavior, but that's not enough.

When I was about to end with xOM 5 years ago, I was thinking to find a replacement to get over the xOM.

After I joined here and other forum and learned about codependency, love addicts, external varidation, abandonment, and low self-esteem helped me deeper.

Looked at my FOO helped me.

I no longer have desire to go back where I was.

Good luck. Hang in there woundedspouse.


If you don't find peace with yourself, you cannot find anywhere else.
Appreciate and cherish what I have.

Posts: 8680 | Registered: Jul 2005 | From: midwest
UnexpectedSong
♀ Member
Member # 21761
Default  Posted: 3:13 PM, August 26th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

woundedspouse -

can a marriage be healed if you never get to the "WHY"?

I will go against SI philosophy and say that there is no final answer to "why". No matter what the answer, there will always be another "why" after that. Of course, some answers are more superficial than others, and one can certainly do a lot of introspection and learn a lot about oneself. And certainly, "why?" must be asked.

But, if the answers are everything below and more: family of origin, child abuse, being selfish or narcissistic, having opportunity, thinking BS will never find out, external validation, parents cheated, immature, whatever... there will always be a LOT of people with the exact same issues who NEVER cheat.

Being "selfish" or "because I wanted to" are valid answers, in my opinion.

Now, how does the WS prevent this in the future? Here there is a lot that one can do. Build better boundaries, communicate more, the whole walls and windows thing that Shirley Glass talks about, everything.

And then maintain a healthy distrust, by both parties. This way, you don't take each other for granted, you work on the marriage, and your marriage has a much better chance of being what you want it to be.

[This message edited by UnexpectedSong at 3:16 PM, August 26th (Wednesday)]


WW(SA)
"Feedback is the breakfast of champions." - Boris Becker

Posts: 6046 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
MissesJai
♀ Member
Member # 24849
Default  Posted: 5:49 PM, August 26th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

And then maintain a healthy distrust, by both parties. This way, you don't take each other for granted, you work on the marriage, and your marriage has a much better chance of being what you want it to be

song ~
you are so wise.....no sarcasm, just truth....


FWW - 40
Nobody can make you feel inferior without your consent...

Posts: 5525 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: So Cal.....
imtrying
♀ Member
Member # 22031
Default  Posted: 6:00 PM, August 26th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

A question - my Wayward Partner and I have broken up, after a False R lasting 9 months, during which, I now know, he slept with another woman in the 2nd month... and who knows what else..

We are unable to have separate residences right now, but we get along fairly well. Yesterday I got very frustrated though, because he has been very lovey-dovey and seductive, and saying that it feels like we are back together and got through the rough times - even though he has done NOTHING that he promised to do in order to show me some concrete change.

He is trickle truthing, and always has. He still blames me for his actions, or says, "It just happened," or etc. Sometimes he sees it, "gets it" but not for long.

My question is this: I got a new confession out of him last night, a small one. Afterwards, he was enraged at me. He yelled at me, stomped off, sent me angry texts for hours, and is cold and distant today.

My first thought is - he didn't tell the whole truth. It involves another woman, one he admitted to sleeping with once. It was just an incidental detail I happened across yesterday, and which he initially tried to side step.

I think he maybe slept with her more than once or it was yet another woman.

But is there another reason he could be so angry about this? He has confessed much bigger things, recently, and I had no angry or negative reaction to the confession last night.


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