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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: BS Questions for WS"s III
beach
♀ Member
Member # 7533
Default  Posted: 12:52 AM, September 2nd (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Queenof,

. She sent me a NC text(you can not believe how that hurt) at the AP's behest a couple of months ago but wouldn't write or send the letter I asked for during R attempt.

She sounds like she still have her feelings attached.....


I'm not sure she loved me at all anymore and the OP may meet her needs just fine.
I thought I was in love with the idea of being in love with the xOM.

If I don't mean enough to her for her to do this, then it is time for me to give up and just accept that her feelings weren't real all those years, I was just meeting her needs.
You cannot control her behavior or reaction but yourself.

The person I thought she was and the person she is are very different and I am having trouble reconciling this in my mind(something to work on in IC).
During A, my persona was totaly different. I behaved as dispised H. I put xOM on the pedestal and my priority was messed up. I hated the person whom I became, and I was acting like a self-absorbed biach.


She may have loved me the only way she knew how but the minute I failed to meet those needs she turned to someone else and I can not live my life looking over my shoulder.
That's where her FOO issue is coming from, which is unhealhy coping mechanism and running away from the problem and not dealing with it properly.

Most importantly, I want to be loved for me not what I provide. I deserve that and to have her whole heart.
Keep putting your boundary for your self-respect and self-love.

[This message edited by beach at 12:57 AM, September 2nd (Wednesday)]


If you don't find peace with yourself, you cannot find anywhere else.
Appreciate and cherish what I have.

Posts: 8680 | Registered: Jul 2005 | From: midwest
tryin2smile
♀ Member
Member # 25131
Default  Posted: 5:03 AM, September 2nd (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thank you to all the FWS's that have contributed to this wonderful thread. A special thanks to listeningclosely for responding to my question thoughtfully. I know it is a difficult situation.
ensure stern consequences for incorrect choices are in place. Make NC, IC and full transparency mandatory. Add reading key books if you think it will help. Probably the best one for him to read would be "Not Just Friends".

I wish I could do those things but he's basically out of the house and completely denying the A - despite very obvious signs. Any time I mention an A, he becomes very angry and offended that I would think the marriage ended over something as small as an affair. He then starts to rewrite history, blameshift, gaslight. We were able to communicate for the first few weeks following separation. During that time he admitted to apossible EA and having a crush on her. Since then, I believe he's completely gone into fantasy land and has tossed me aside. I feel the marriage is over, despite wishing it were not, but it's hard for me to watch him self-destruct. At this point though, I have absolutely no say and am progressing with the legal separation, which he is pushing for. He has always acted quickly on his decisions without thinking through the long-term effects.
I also think he may be one of those people who gets his identity from the SO. He was a country boy from the midwest when I met him and he had dreams of having a house, lots of property, and pets. Now he says he's a city-person who only needs an apartment?!?
I have detached myself with a strong 180, and that has been a tremendous help to me.

[This message edited by tryin2smile at 6:51 AM, September 2nd (Wednesday)]


“The soul would have no rainbow had the eyes no tears.”-John Vance Cheney

"The harder the conflict, the more glorious the triumph." -Thomas Paine


Posts: 189 | Registered: Aug 2009 | From: East Coast
futureseemsbleak
♀ Member
Member # 16642
Default  Posted: 8:57 AM, September 2nd (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thank you for this post. It surely makes sense of my situation too.

WS has completely discarded his entire family. He is basking in the world of fantasy with his own money of which we get dribbles controlled by him. He shows up when he needs to have some documents signed..I can't even allow this anymore.

On seven months s'd now, he has never mentioned D or even R. He is so self absorbed it is pathetic.

I will be okay, but I really worry about my kids, although adults they are getting the same treatment from their father as his father gave him. The foo issues and many other BPDs.

The words are few, but the behaviors show what future there won't be. This, I have to accept and move on.

I truly admire and appreciate all WS's responses in helping us BS's understand and get through this. My 180 is concrete now.

Should I start dating now? I think I'm ready!!!


Posts: 227 | Registered: Oct 2007
Razor
♂ Member
Member # 16345
Default  Posted: 9:02 AM, September 2nd (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I am thinking about the idealizing the A threads. And I have a question.

Many WS posted that there M was better and stronger because of the recovery process the A forced on them. And that the M was in bad shape before.

This begs the question. If you could go back in time and choose to NOT have the A and loose everything you gained from it in personal growth and a better M. Would you choose NOT to have the A?

If you choose to not have it then you loose all memory of it and all personal growth and you M would have kept going the way it was.

Would you choose to have the A and gain what you have from it? Or would you choose to not have it and spare you BS the pain but have a bad marriage?

ETA. You cant have it both ways. One path or the other only.

[This message edited by Razor at 9:04 AM, September 2nd (Wednesday)]


Forgive and forget = Relive and regret.


Posts: 3068 | Registered: Sep 2007
beach
♀ Member
Member # 7533
Default  Posted: 9:10 AM, September 2nd (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

futureseemsbleak,

The words are few, but the behaviors show what future there won't be. This, I have to accept and move on.

My 180 is concrete now.

Should I start dating now? I think I'm ready!!!

IMO, if you are no longer considering R, and proceeded with D, then yes, I think it is reasonable to start dating, or maybe start making friends.

All I can say is that you have to know how to love yourself before you love someone else.


If you don't find peace with yourself, you cannot find anywhere else.
Appreciate and cherish what I have.

Posts: 8680 | Registered: Jul 2005 | From: midwest
beach
♀ Member
Member # 7533
Default  Posted: 9:18 AM, September 2nd (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Razor,

If you could go back in time and choose to NOT have the A and loose everything you gained from it in personal growth and a better M. Would you choose NOT to have the A?

If you choose to not have it then you loose all memory of it and all personal growth and you M would have kept going the way it was.

Would you choose to have the A and gain what you have from it? Or would you choose to not have it and spare you BS the pain but have a bad marriage?

ETA. You cant have it both ways. One path or the other only.

You brought up a good question. If I was going back to pre A, and if I am not happy in M, instead of having A, I may have been addicted to TV or something and not addressing unhappiness and just face away from reality, because that's how my coping mechanism was wired.... and dysfunctional M.

Unfortunately, in the sense, after mass of A gave me the opportunity to look inside of me and where I am at.

[This message edited by beach at 9:32 AM, September 2nd (Wednesday)]


If you don't find peace with yourself, you cannot find anywhere else.
Appreciate and cherish what I have.

Posts: 8680 | Registered: Jul 2005 | From: midwest
debbied
♀ Member
Member # 25354
Default  Posted: 1:17 PM, September 2nd (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

If you could go back in time and choose to NOT have the A and loose everything you gained from it in personal growth and a better M. Would you choose NOT to have the A?
If you choose to not have it then you loose all memory of it and all personal growth and you M would have kept going the way it was.

Would you choose to have the A and gain what you have from it? Or would you choose to not have it and spare you BS the pain but have a bad marriage?

ETA. You cant have it both ways. One path or the other only.

I would have chosen never to have the A no matter what personal growth it meant for me.I have learnt so much from the A but I hurt someone I loved so deeply.It would have been better for me to have recognise the problems in my M and when he refused MC I should have sought IC myself.There I would have gained the knowledge I needed for personal growth.On top of that he wouldn't have been able to use my guilt for the A against me and abused me so badly.There is no justification for abusing someone the same as there is no justification for having an A.


Posts: 620 | Registered: Aug 2009
EmptyCup
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Member # 22909
Default  Posted: 2:11 PM, September 2nd (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

If you could go back in time and choose to NOT have the A and loose everything you gained from it in personal growth and a better M. Would you choose NOT to have the A?

I choose to be where I am now, and so I choose to not change the path that got me here. The marriage I have now is worth the pain it took to get here and my husband agrees. We had a very dysfunctional marriage for a very long time. We're finally where we need to be and looking forward to the rest of our lives together.


FWW, reconciled with my best friend <3

Nothing much but love to give you, even less have I to hide - Tim O'Brien


Posts: 1140 | Registered: Feb 2009
UnexpectedSong
♀ Member
Member # 21761
Default  Posted: 2:13 PM, September 2nd (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Razor -

Would you choose to have the A and gain what you have from it? Or would you choose to not have it and spare you BS the pain but have a bad marriage?

What a fantastic question!

Before last Thursday, I would have said unequivocally that I would have preferred not to have the A and stayed in a bad marriage. I would rather have remained in a bad marriage for 40 years than put my husband through this horrible event and have him lose his "innocence".

However... now I cannot say that. There is no other way that I would have learned what I've learned. So, I am sorry... If I could go back in time and someone showed me the two paths - one which was to remain in a bad, ignorant marriage and the other was to learn what I needed to learn, I have to now choose the affair path. My guess is that my husband will say the same - because he loves me that much.

(ETA: This sounds very selfish. Put my husband through pain just so that I can learn. What I learned affects him, too. That's why I said what I said.)

[This message edited by UnexpectedSong at 2:16 PM, September 2nd (Wednesday)]


WW(SA)
"Feedback is the breakfast of champions." - Boris Becker

Posts: 6043 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
tryin2smile
♀ Member
Member # 25131
Default  Posted: 2:23 PM, September 2nd (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Oh how I appreciate your answers to the affair/no affair question.
Our marriage definitely had some big problems but it also had soooo many strong points. I didn't realize how much we needed to work on until this crisis. Oh how I wish he decided to stay and work things out. It could have been wonderful!
kudos to all of you who did R, you and your marriages are so much stronger for it!

[This message edited by tryin2smile at 2:24 PM, September 2nd (Wednesday)]


“The soul would have no rainbow had the eyes no tears.”-John Vance Cheney

"The harder the conflict, the more glorious the triumph." -Thomas Paine


Posts: 189 | Registered: Aug 2009 | From: East Coast
NeverWillAgain
♂ Member
Member # 25007
Default  Posted: 2:34 PM, September 2nd (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

This begs the question. If you could go back in time and choose to NOT have the A and loose everything you gained from it in personal growth and a better M. Would you choose NOT to have the A?

If you choose to not have it then you loose all memory of it and all personal growth and you M would have kept going the way it was.

Great question! I actually talked about this with UV. I would have to say that I would not choose the A path. This brought us to the brink of a D. It also put us on a path for a relationship we would not have had (maybe).

I probably would have continued on the way I was and she was. We didn't talk, we didn't sleep together (sleep, not sex), we didn't do much together. Sex was just that, sex. And the relationship was stale.

Our MC had made the point that the A was a crisis in waiting. Some crisis may have come at some point down the road and we would have found ourselves in the same place. (He said "death of a child" God forbid). But, the point is that some crisis probably would have made us look hard at ourselves and the M. I can't say I would have looked as closely at myself as I had to due to the A, so I don't know how successful we would have been.


Trust is something you take for granted until you lose it...

Posts: 491 | Registered: Jul 2009
Razor
♂ Member
Member # 16345
Default  Posted: 4:30 PM, September 2nd (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I really truly appreciate all your honest answers.


Forgive and forget = Relive and regret.


Posts: 3068 | Registered: Sep 2007
quirkina
♀ Member
Member # 22119
Default  Posted: 4:52 PM, September 2nd (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

This is my question for WS's and thanks so much in advance for any help.

After your D-Day did you express the desire to remain in the M because you were scared or because you really wanted to--and after the hoopla died down and the BS emotions cooled off did you in the ensuing months begin to feel "hey this isn't going to work no matter what because it is too painful to get to the root of the issue" so I'll just check out emotionally and hope that my BS gets fed up and ends it.


Posts: 402 | Registered: Dec 2008
imscared_k
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Member # 14061
Default  Posted: 5:49 PM, September 2nd (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

quirkina
I wanted to R with my spouse. I never entered into my A, thinking that I was killing my marriage. I never had an intentions of leaving my spouse for my OM.
I did think that there was too much to overcome around a year and half out. Usually when I get that line of thinking, it's becuase I want to rush the process. For that the root of my problem is I want him to just get over it. Which isn't going to happen to I try my best to switch my focus.
It helps sometimes when my spouse comes up to me say I'm not showing him that I love him. Usually, my attempts go unnoticed because, its not something that he wants or needs.

Posts: 1059 | Registered: Mar 2007
quirkina
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Member # 22119
Default  Posted: 8:03 PM, September 2nd (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

imscared-k
Thanks for your honesty--I know this can't be easy no matter which side of the aisle you are on.

It just seems like the same way there is a sort of play book for having an A or in my case an EA--there should be a play book for the R.--and there isn't. So any advice from the other side is doubly appreciated.


Posts: 402 | Registered: Dec 2008
UnexpectedSong
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Member # 21761
Default  Posted: 8:36 PM, September 2nd (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

quirkina -

After your D-Day did you express the desire to remain in the M because you were scared or because you really wanted to

This is not easy to answer. I never intended to leave the M - the xOM was nothing, if I were single, we would not have lasted beyond two months (how pathetic is that?). But, after dday, I desperately wanted to leave because I could not face my husband. I wanted to stay married to him, but I could not face him.

So, it's difficult to answer this... I stayed in the M because I wanted to, but I also wanted to run away. (As waywards do...)


WW(SA)
"Feedback is the breakfast of champions." - Boris Becker

Posts: 6043 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
quirkina
♀ Member
Member # 22119
Default  Posted: 8:51 PM, September 2nd (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Unexpectedsong
I stayed in the M because I wanted to, but I also wanted to run away. (As waywards do...

You mean you wanted run away after the A or before?

This is what is driving me crazy--should I stay and deal with this uncertainty while he definitely works through some issues--or are these "issues" a smokescreen to make it impossible to continue the M?


Posts: 402 | Registered: Dec 2008
UnexpectedSong
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Member # 21761
Default  Posted: 10:52 PM, September 2nd (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

q -

You mean you wanted run away after the A or before?

I wanted to run away afterwards.

This is my story. (I am all screwed up!)

I wanted to run. H would not let me. He kept saying he wanted us to celebrate our 40th anniversary (in 31 years). I kept wanting to run.

We went to MC. I kept going to IC. I stopped telling him I wanted to run, but I kept wanting to. Finally, in MC one day, I could not hold it back any longer and told him that I was trying to decide if I wanted to stay in the marriage.

That devastated him, I know. But it freed me. A huge pressure lifted off me, a ray of sunshine peeked through, and a small part of me inside said, "yeah, I do want to stay."

Kept going to IC, finally figured things out. I still don't want to admit that I want to stay, but I have no desire to leave anymore.

Somewhere in my screwed up brain, I am thinking: since I already messed up my vows, more vows (i.e., promising to stay) mean nothing, and maybe if I just put one foot in front of the other, day by day, suddenly the 40th anniversary will appear one day! (Happily!)

This is probably of no help to you.


WW(SA)
"Feedback is the breakfast of champions." - Boris Becker

Posts: 6043 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
quirkina
♀ Member
Member # 22119
Default  Posted: 9:08 AM, September 3rd (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Actually that is very helpful unexpected song--thank you.

I think sometimes there is a sort of over thinking--and if we could just "be" some things would naturally come together.

I really appreciate your honesty. Good luck with everything


Posts: 402 | Registered: Dec 2008
beach
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Member # 7533
Default  Posted: 9:36 AM, September 3rd (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

[This message edited by beach at 9:37 AM, September 3rd (Thursday)]


If you don't find peace with yourself, you cannot find anywhere else.
Appreciate and cherish what I have.

Posts: 8680 | Registered: Jul 2005 | From: midwest
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