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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: BS Questions for WS"s III
imagoodwitch
♀ Member
Member # 23375
Default  Posted: 2:45 PM, September 24th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have a BS to WS question......

If it has been asked and answered here before please forgive me

"Once a cheater, always a cheater"..........

answer honestly please, I'm serious.

Is this saying true?


I am just your ordinary average everyday sane psycho supergoddess - Liz Phair

It's all shits and giggles until someone giggles and shits.


Posts: 5137 | Registered: Mar 2009 | From: Munchkinland
imscared_k
♀ Member
Member # 14061
Default  Posted: 3:19 PM, September 24th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

imagoodwitch,
I would certainly hope not. If that were true what would be the point of this site, we could never hope to better ourselves.

Posts: 1059 | Registered: Mar 2007
beach
♀ Member
Member # 7533
Default  Posted: 3:22 PM, September 24th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

If WS didn't learn from poor choice and won't fix their problems, wayward behavior will never change.


If you don't find peace with yourself, you cannot find anywhere else.
Appreciate and cherish what I have.

Posts: 8680 | Registered: Jul 2005 | From: midwest
betrayed 35
♀ Member
Member # 22169
Default  Posted: 10:39 AM, September 25th (Friday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Do you believe it is possible to R when the spouse still thinks highly of the OP?


me-BW 31 WH-36
dday 1 9-8-08 and they keep coming-last one 8-20-09
married 8 years together 10
2 great boys 5 and 7
Working towards R

We need the cloudy days so we appreciate the sunny ones :)


Posts: 187 | Registered: Dec 2008
itspersonal
♀ Member
Member # 24887
Default  Posted: 11:48 AM, September 25th (Friday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have asked this before and apologize but I just cannot get it! Please FWS if you can relate in any way,,,help me understand as this its destroying me inside.

FWH shows so much love to me,,tons of remorse and has helped me in so many ways in my healing. Had affair 13 months with out of state co worker.

Had sex once a month at best with her. I had two D-days. He is def. out of the fog yet he tells me he just has no interest in sex. No interest at all for anyone.

It hasn't been that long but for me,,I have suffered on and off with his rejection for 13 months. He says he loves me and wants to heal in other areas but just isn't interested in any sex with me.

I don't understand. He says that sex is not a way to show love,,,and that I seem to think it is too important yet he was running to another state to have sex with her? I feel so pained that he wanted her and not me and he says it is an act and it isn't an indication of his love.

I don't get it,,,it is breaking my marriage and my heart. He is sexually non responsive. She told me every detail and he is extremely angry and hateful towards her disclosure as he said it was very cruel. It was! But we have always had a great sex life so I am perplexed.

This is destroying my feelings and causing me more pain then the affair and he doesn't get it no matter how much I tell him.

What is the problem? What should I do? I am so lonely in this area!

Thanks in advance

[This message edited by itspersonal at 11:56 AM, September 25th (Friday)]


me:bs
him: ws
:Got caught in Affair with same Coworker x 2 in 08 and 09: True R and it started with my healing.
3 kids: 16,23,30
PEOPLE WHO HAVE NOTHING TO HIDE, HIDE NOTHING!!!!!! "When someone SHOWS YOU who they are, believe them"

Posts: 172 | Registered: Jul 2009
anotherpea
♀ Member
Member # 25212
Default  Posted: 2:27 PM, September 25th (Friday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Do you really not think of the OP unless we talk about them?

My WS insists that if I didn't bring up the OW then he wouldn't think about her. We are only 7.5 weeks out and the OW is a hot young chick. I find it hard to believe that he doesn't think of her, especially since he tells me the reason he did her was to see what it would be like to have sex with a hot young chick.

I think he just doesn't like answering the questions I have because they make him "feel bad about himself" (his words) and it ruins his image of the OW.


Posts: 120 | Registered: Aug 2009
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 2:51 PM, September 25th (Friday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

imagoodwitch -

"Once a cheater, always a cheater"..........

answer honestly please, I'm serious.

Is this saying true?

I can only speak from my own experience. The answer is no. I will never go back to the person I was before.

It's more like "A cheater who finds the flaws within them that led to their actions and who change their behavior can become faithful again. A cheater who blames others for their actions and who refuses to work on their own weaknesses is doomed to repeat their behavior.".


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 2:57 PM, September 25th (Friday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

betrayed35 -

Do you believe it is possible to R when the spouse still thinks highly of the OP?

Not in my opinion. In order to R, a WS has to turn their focus squarely on their BS and the needs of their BS. If the OP is occupying space in the WS mind, it will be a distraction to their ability to focus on their BS and their M.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 3:03 PM, September 25th (Friday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

itspersonal -

I can't relate directly because it's not an issue that I have experienced. Any chance that internalized guilt over the harm he has done is holding him back? Like thoughts that he doesn't deserve to be intimate with you after doing what he did?


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 3:11 PM, September 25th (Friday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

anotherpea -

Do you really not think of the OP unless we talk about them?

That hasn't been my experience, but it has nothing to do with whether she was hot or not. It's more when something happens that reminds me of an event during my A, it would be very hard to ignore a memory.

The important part from my perspective is what the WS does with that memory. If they romanticize it, that's a bad thing. If they accept it happening and just set it aside, then it really isn't going to be an issue.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
itspersonal
♀ Member
Member # 24887
Default  Posted: 3:19 PM, September 25th (Friday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

listeingclosely,

You are a blessing to so many of us here. I always know you will make an effort to help whomever you can. Thank you for taking a terrible situation and offering help to others because God knows we need answers to heal! Yes I think he feels guilt but what he says is that he has NO desire whatsoever for sex...it is like he is dead in that area. I will have to talk to him more as he just says he is exhausted and doens't crave it at all. I know guilt may be a part of it and the exhaustion of living a double life. He also says my questions and comments shut him down as they wear him out which hurts me terribly but he is there to answer them either way! Any other advice or answers that may cross yours or someone elses mind would be of great help.


me:bs
him: ws
:Got caught in Affair with same Coworker x 2 in 08 and 09: True R and it started with my healing.
3 kids: 16,23,30
PEOPLE WHO HAVE NOTHING TO HIDE, HIDE NOTHING!!!!!! "When someone SHOWS YOU who they are, believe them"

Posts: 172 | Registered: Jul 2009
hopefulwife
♀ Member
Member # 20942
Default  Posted: 2:18 PM, September 26th (Saturday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Just want to say to all WS's posting here, YOU ROCK!! You take so much time with us BS's and it is so appreciated. I have been away from SI for a while and have really enjoyed catching up today. I continue to get answers from you (hubby not so much, but he tries in other ways to make up.) so I wanted to take the time to thank you!


BW - me 42
FWH - 48
DDay 4/17/08 True R 6/11/08
No children together except our Bull Mastiff Maximus...my baby.

Posts: 99 | Registered: Sep 2008 | From: California
floridaredman
♂ Member
Member # 15122
Default  Posted: 3:37 PM, September 26th (Saturday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

itspersonal,

My wife asked me a bunch of questions also. The answers to those question made me feel sick to my stomach and wondered how she could even look at me.

"Did you love her?"
Me: At the time I believe I did. I believed I loved her.

"Did you ever think of me"

Me: Yes, but I made you out to be a villain to justify what I was doing.

to which she replied..." I know I had my faults..we both did.

If there is anything lower than feces..I felt like it at that moment.

I never had problems with what your husband has with the sex drive. But the guilt alone after those questions made me feel like a weasel and no one should touch me or be around me.


The simplest thing can be the hardest thing to do....FRM

Posts: 2412 | Registered: Jun 2007 | From: Florida
itspersonal
♀ Member
Member # 24887
Default  Posted: 4:04 PM, September 26th (Saturday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Florida,

Thank you for replying. That makes me very sad that you WS have to go thru a "I am crap" stage to heal. I cannot imagine hating me for something that hurt another. I am certain he has self hate and guilt. I wonder if he shuts down because i am not what he wants but he tells me it is his problem and that he finds me beautiful and attractive and loveable. Very confusing but I think you both have hit on something about his guilt and self esteem. I often wonder if sex brings her to mind and that is too much for him to handle but he says no...furthest from his mind. I know he is VERY angry and disqusted with her for call me with ALL the details and he feels a lot of shame over that hurting me. He says he sees that trash that she is/was now that it is over and it can't figure out why she was able to make him think different. He is the third man she has gone after and had sex with that was married...he is grossed out right now and I get that but self hate must be a big part of it. He keeps saying to me :just admit you hate me and get it over with? I don't hate him,,,,,so sad! Thanks for responding


me:bs
him: ws
:Got caught in Affair with same Coworker x 2 in 08 and 09: True R and it started with my healing.
3 kids: 16,23,30
PEOPLE WHO HAVE NOTHING TO HIDE, HIDE NOTHING!!!!!! "When someone SHOWS YOU who they are, believe them"

Posts: 172 | Registered: Jul 2009
floridaredman
♂ Member
Member # 15122
Default  Posted: 7:36 PM, September 26th (Saturday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I often wonder if sex brings her to mind and that is too much for him to handle but he says no...furthest from his mind

itspersonal,your welcome.

I question the above quote about her not coming to mind. Your husband may be quite different from me, but I had to get use to the feel of my wife all over again. Different body structures and all that. That may be TMI and I am sorry if it is, but my sexual mindset had to change. This along with guilt and self hate can play a huge role in him refraining. He is also in withdrawal from her too. That plays a major role. it's a form of mourning a loss, even though you may hate that person, you have to spiritually ween yourself from them too.

[This message edited by floridaredman at 12:04 PM, September 27th (Sunday)]


The simplest thing can be the hardest thing to do....FRM

Posts: 2412 | Registered: Jun 2007 | From: Florida
jollum
♂ Member
Member # 25152
Default  Posted: 3:49 PM, September 28th (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Did you LOVE your spouse? WW's encouraged to post.

I'm moving this over from the Reconciliation forum per suggestions.

In talking with my WW the other night she told me in reference to her LTA "but I always loved you". This just totally pissed me off. My contention is that the "love" she said she had is no more than general caring and concern for someone you've known a long time ie., your grandmother or other family member. The "love" she had for the OM was the love that was missing from our marriage. Love is an action not a feeling. For me to show someone I love them is to do what makes them happy or is best for them. Did her cheating and lying fit either one of those? How do you love someone who you refuse to have sex with and lie to every day??? This has me so perplexed. Is she still in the FOG? Are we in false R because of this? She seems to be trying hard but this just floored me and makes me wonder if she is even close to getting it.


Posts: 269 | Registered: Aug 2009
BorrowTrouble
♀ Member
Member # 2435
Default  Posted: 5:35 PM, September 28th (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Did anyone here start therapy while still actively involved in the affair? What did your therapist do that was particularly helpful/hurtful to you?

I have my first client who is an active WS and considering leaving her marriage for the OP, who is also married. I'd love to hear advice from folks who have been there.

Thanks in advance.


D-day 7/29/04.

Posts: 5711 | Registered: Oct 2003
beach
♀ Member
Member # 7533
Default  Posted: 11:08 PM, September 28th (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

jollum,

My contention is that the "love" she said she had is no more than general caring and concern for someone you've known a long time ie., your grandmother or other family member. The "love" she had for the OM was the love that was missing from our marriage.
My A was LTA (6 years and it was open to H). During A, I felt the same way what you described. The love I felt towards H was like motherly love and the love I felt towards xOM was obsessive/toxic lust.

Are we in false R because of this?
I would not call it false R, because it is not like she is carrying on her A. Sounds like she is in the withdrawal stage. She maybe pinning for xOM, trying to grieve the loss.

It took me 6 months to get out of the withdrawal stage and then..... if you are interested, please read "SWIRL process" thread in Wayward.

My goal was to feel indifferent about xOM, but in order to get there, I had to go through the SWIRL (Shattering - withdrwal - internalizing - rage - lift)....

Hope this helps.


If you don't find peace with yourself, you cannot find anywhere else.
Appreciate and cherish what I have.

Posts: 8680 | Registered: Jul 2005 | From: midwest
beach
♀ Member
Member # 7533
Default  Posted: 11:14 PM, September 28th (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

BT,

Did anyone here start therapy while still actively involved in the affair? What did your therapist do that was particularly helpful/hurtful to you?
I have my first client who is an active WS and considering leaving her marriage for the OP, who is also married. I'd love to hear advice from folks who have been there.

I initially went to see an IC when I was trying to end A back in 2005. I didn't tell IC everything. I was afraid of being judged.

Does this client have d-day or not? The things that helped me sort things was one of members from other boards asked me to write down the list of pros and cons of D or R. Jacket exercise. With each senario, what is more comfortable.....

I knew that due to double life, identity crisis was one of reasons I had to end A.

I hope this helps.


If you don't find peace with yourself, you cannot find anywhere else.
Appreciate and cherish what I have.

Posts: 8680 | Registered: Jul 2005 | From: midwest
BorrowTrouble
♀ Member
Member # 2435
Default  Posted: 11:07 PM, September 29th (Tuesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Beach, she has told her husband that she had started talking to the OM and was considering leaving the marriage. Husband does not know that the affair is sexual.


D-day 7/29/04.

Posts: 5711 | Registered: Oct 2003
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