Cheating Hurt by Infidelity
Betrayal Wayward Donations lying
Welcome

Forums

Guidelines

Find a Local Counselor

The Healing Library

Media

Contact Us
lies
cover
In Association with Amazon.com
Support
Infidelity -
-
Find a Local Couselor
You are not logged in. Login here or register.
[Register]
Newest Member: northeasternarea (43214)

I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: BS Questions for WS"s III
UnexpectedSong
♀ Member
Member # 21761
Default  Posted: 8:47 AM, November 2nd (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

lovedance -

I was really trying to figure out is if my WH has an addiction or is deep down a selfish jerk

What does this matter if the end result is serial cheating?

And if he really does not want to change and has not worked on changing, then there are no "boundaries" but divorce. You decide what you can live with.


WW(SA)
"Feedback is the breakfast of champions." - Boris Becker

Posts: 6046 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
UnexpectedSong
♀ Member
Member # 21761
Default  Posted: 8:54 AM, November 2nd (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Finesse026 -

He did this, he can see why I would want to check his messages.

I guess my question is how can he not have patience with me when I have done everything in my power to try to R and work on our M? Is this normal? Is he still in the fog?

I don't know if it's fog or not... There is a strange dynamic that goes on with "transparency" after the A. The WS understands that it is required, that the BS will check up. The WS understands this intellectually. However, it still rankles.

I think he used "patience" as a stand-in word. He probably meant that he felt violated when you checked his messages, especially since you were together the whole time and he didn't even have his cell with him.

But, you know, it's not his call. He gave up that right with the affair. He needs to suck it up.

This will pass.


WW(SA)
"Feedback is the breakfast of champions." - Boris Becker

Posts: 6046 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
leftoolate
♀ Member
Member # 22658
Default  Posted: 9:21 AM, November 2nd (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi Itspersonal,

It is not okay to sneak the other person back into the marriage through sexual techniques. Now, I'm not sure that the new kind of kissing is something he used to do with the other woman. However, I'm just saying that because I felt really strange about trying new techniques after d-day, even though they didn't have anything to do with the other man. Basically, I'm hyper sensitive to anything and everything sexual. It can be a bit too much, but sex and sexual relations really are personal. It was at the core of the original betrayal, predating all the lies and deception - so I should be sensitive to my husband's perception of anything new. I'm having a lot of trouble conceiving of such a callous reply as your husband gave you. Is he really aware of the breadth and depth of the pain he caused and the taint of the affair on uhm... everything? And if this is annoying me, thousands of impersonal miles away, it must be really hard for you. Can you sit him down again and spell it out for him? You know, short, simple sentences, having him repeat them back to you, that kind of level?

On the bright side, even the slightly embarassing, cheek reddening kind of sex talk can be not just a turn on, but liberating as well . Go on, Itspersonal, get your kiss back!

~L.


If you came this far, you're looking for something. - Jrazz

Posts: 811 | Registered: Jan 2009 | From: Europe
itspersonal
♀ Member
Member # 24887
Default  Posted: 10:38 AM, November 2nd (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Lefttolate,

Thank you for your response. Yes he can be a bit callous if he thinks he has done something to make things worse or can't please me when he tries.
I see it as a defense mechanism. I will talk to him.
As far as the kissing,,,ok so I know exactly how they kissed and to be honest everything else even down to their positions etc as the FOW called and told me hours of details in the name of her own healing ,,,,I just could not hang up.
SO the sliding of the tongue on the front teeth and the tip of the tongue kissing instead of deep kissing like I am use to was theirs.
I wonder if he kissed her so long (12 months) and not me that it became habit??? He seems to not think he kisses diferently.
Also, he avoids my chest which hurts terribly. I think he hates my chest now. I had to have tissue removed and an implant in one side (sickness) and he told her about it and she said well he liked mine were real.
He says he doesn't remember saying anything about it but how did she know I had that happen?
I really feel his rejection of my chest??? He says thats not true but a woman knows. I am broken here.
I hate my body now and I am suffering. I hate that I listened to ALL the details from her. Even where his tongue was and she stated "what you think he is gonna tell you I was the best he has had since marrying you".
Now mind you,,,we had a great sex life. I am lost! So, his tongue flicking is not our kissing,,,I mean occassionally a little but no this is not how he kissed me and it is how he kissed her...it makes me sick.

Should I let it go? Why are we so awkward in bed? That is the other thing...it is like we are soooooo awkward or I know I am and he just does the deed but says that is not how he feels. He also hasnt wanted to have intercourse,,,no effort really but he says i am wrong there too but I know us and how we had sex. He (pops) very quick to avoid it or maybe thinking of her gets him too excited...
he isn't with me is what I want to say and I feel like I am kissing etc my brother and that he feels that way too? What the heck,,,did this have to ruin everything for goodness sakes?,,,
I can't stop thinking about the fact that he is thinking or might be thinking about her.
Can I do this? is recovery POSSIBLE?
Thanks for responding,,,I am freaked by all this.

[This message edited by itspersonal at 10:43 AM, November 2nd (Monday)]


me:bs
him: ws
:Got caught in Affair with same Coworker x 2 in 08 and 09: True R and it started with my healing.
3 kids: 16,23,30
PEOPLE WHO HAVE NOTHING TO HIDE, HIDE NOTHING!!!!!! "When someone SHOWS YOU who they are, believe them"

Posts: 172 | Registered: Jul 2009
leftoolate
♀ Member
Member # 22658
Default  Posted: 11:23 AM, November 2nd (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi Lovedance,

Thanks for your response. Reading back my post to your first question, it's rather condescending. I'm sorry for that (and as soon as I figure out what exactly I do wrong there, I'll fix it).

Good luck getting your perspective clear!

~L.


If you came this far, you're looking for something. - Jrazz

Posts: 811 | Registered: Jan 2009 | From: Europe
leftoolate
♀ Member
Member # 22658
Default  Posted: 11:46 AM, November 2nd (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Oh, Itspersonal, I'm so sorry for you. That sounds horrible.

Should I let it go?

If you must, by all means do so. I don't think you should. It's been a good part of your relationship for years, I'd say you both need the sex as a form of reconnecting. To me, it feels like he's not so much repulsed by your chest as he's rejecting you. I'd be hurt something awful .

Why are we so awkward in bed?

Trust, openness, spontaneity, intimacy, relaxation... Have you had much of those between you lately? If these things are absent, sex would feel awkward. My husband and I cliqued together right after the first d-day. Good thing too, I seriously think the hysterical bonding helped keep us together - but I've often felt really weird about it. Disconnected, even. Of course, I still hadn't told him the whole ugly truth at that point. That probably had something to do with it... I'm really glad we've moved on to less territorial, less awkward sex. It's been an adventure, really.


I can't stop thinking about the fact that he is thinking or might be thinking about her.

That, combined with the lack of desire, is enough to kill any kind of mood. I have no idea how to respond to his "You're wrong about that"-answers. If he says he loves you, but he doesn't want to be physically intimate, that's something to address. My approach would most likely be to get some semi professional info and try to get very clinical and graphic. It would be a sham and it would probably not have any good effect. Pleas try something else, like professional help.

Can I do this? is recovery POSSIBLE?
Thanks for responding,,,I am freaked by all this.

You may be freaked, but you sound strong. I couldn't do it.

I wish you very well, and I hope you'll work through this. Keep asking questions, if it helps. Vent, if it helps. You'll make it yet.

~L.


If you came this far, you're looking for something. - Jrazz

Posts: 811 | Registered: Jan 2009 | From: Europe
bestrongforyou
♀ Member
Member # 25818
Default  Posted: 1:04 PM, November 2nd (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I also have a question: my husband works abroad for 4 years and he tells me in April 09 that he is unhappy -he doesn't ask for a separation straight away but says our marriage is only hanging by a thread - no mentioning of another woman or anything when he first tells me - then 2 days later he tells me that he got close to a co-worker and that he had told her about his feelings a few weeks earlier (I had no clue at that stage about his feelings and I also never heard her name before eventhough she was in his company 8 mnonths at that stage)- now I am suspecting that he had an affair with her but why would he then even bring her up? Why not just stay quiet? He says, if he would have had an affair with, do I really believe he is that stupid to bring her up?I don't really have an answer but I am just so convinced...


Me(39)BS Him(35)

Posts: 659 | Registered: Oct 2009
srb1608
♀ Member
Member # 19477
Default  Posted: 2:18 PM, November 2nd (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I am the BS. I was recently persued a bit by a man who walked at the same place i exercised at. He started with little chit chat and then compliments litle at a time. I have NO interest in this man as he is not my type anyway and not physically attracted to him at all, however i found myself looking forward to the flattery i guess. So i made changes and exercise somewhere else. I see how it starts and see how my H got wrapped back up with his exgf since the attraction was already there. He has been going above and beyond to R for the last 17 months. Says when he thinks of the affair he thinks of the pain in my eyes as he rejected my pleas for us to work it out on dday. Says he hears my daughter cry "what about our vacations, what about christmas? what did i do?" Says these thoughts keep him from hurting us ever again.

My question is once you have taken this leap and had an affair to enjoy these feelings of flattery from someone else , how do you go back to normal and be content without the outside energy from someone else?? How are you sure you wont hurt your spouse again?


BS- me 37
WS -him 37
Married 13 years

Posts: 2220 | Registered: May 2008
EmptyCup
♀ Member
Member # 22909
Default  Posted: 2:31 PM, November 2nd (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My question is once you have taken this leap and had an affair to enjoy these feelings of flattery from someone else , how do you go back to normal and be content without the outside energy from someone else??

My answer is that I didn't go back to normal. My normal wasn't healthy. I've worked hard to learn to not rely on external validation for my own feelings of self-worth.

Seeing the pain I caused is more than enough to keep me in check. I know what the slippery slope means and how to keep appropriate boundaries now. I wasn't entirely conscious of my approval seeking behaviors before. I am now, and I could never get that far into an affair without stopping myself.


FWW, reconciled with my best friend <3

Nothing much but love to give you, even less have I to hide - Tim O'Brien


Posts: 1140 | Registered: Feb 2009
srb1608
♀ Member
Member # 19477
Default  Posted: 2:48 PM, November 2nd (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks empty. That is what my H says. He says he knows he wont hurt us again and understands how to prevent it in the future and i guess it is common for us BS to be paranoid forever even when WH is 150% recommitted.
I guess the scary part is feeling myself the enjoyment of flattery from someone who isnt "suppose" to admire you . I have never been a cheater, so i wouldnt do it, but see how someone who is can.

Thanks for giving me some faith that another ws says they just know they wont hurt BS again. I expect that to be what my H says to me so it falls on deaf ears.


BS- me 37
WS -him 37
Married 13 years

Posts: 2220 | Registered: May 2008
beach
♀ Member
Member # 7533
Default  Posted: 2:50 PM, November 2nd (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

srb1608
once you have taken this leap and had an affair to enjoy these feelings of flattery from someone else , how do you go back to normal and be content without the outside energy from someone else?? How are you sure you wont hurt your spouse again?

During A, when I got the taste of getting the ego boosts from random men, I was more hunger for attention. I appear quiet, and introvert in real life, and I have a social anxiety, being annonymous enable me to become different persona - someone who is not myself in real life. I made sounds like outgoing on chat or email.

I am so glad those days are over and that I worked on myself, and family of orgin, so I don't need any external validation anymore. In other words, I worked on self-esteem (do what I like, and believed adn valued my worth) and love and respect myself, so I feel fullfilled and don't feel emptiness inside anymore, therefore I don't need external validation to fill the void.

I have no desire to go back to where I was.

Hope this helps.

ETA: and yes, I don't want to be that selfish and self-absobed person whom I had become.

[This message edited by beach at 2:53 PM, November 2nd (Monday)]


If you don't find peace with yourself, you cannot find anywhere else.
Appreciate and cherish what I have.

Posts: 8680 | Registered: Jul 2005 | From: midwest
srb1608
♀ Member
Member # 19477
Default  Posted: 3:10 PM, November 2nd (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Beach, thanks it does help. I guess i liken it to an addict that once has a hit cant turn another down. I find comfort that yall say what he basically says is that he doesnt like who he was and wont go back.
I am 17months out and 16 in R where he has really worked his butt off for your marriage. I found out my mom had cancer and dealt with her sickness and eventual death the entire first year after dday. Since her death i sometimes feel i am starting over or really just dealing with this A mess since my mom took presedence over everything at the time. I feel so juvenille still worrying after 16 months of great R.
Thanks for the help! Just extremely vulnerable nowadays!!!


BS- me 37
WS -him 37
Married 13 years

Posts: 2220 | Registered: May 2008
beach
♀ Member
Member # 7533
Default  Posted: 3:10 PM, November 2nd (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

bestrongforyou,
I am suspecting that he had an affair with her but why would he then even bring her up? Why not just stay quiet? He says, if he would have had an affair with, do I really believe he is that stupid to bring her up?I don't really have an answer but I am just so convinced...

None of us can answer for your H. Your H can only hold the truth. Unless you have the solid evidence or proof, you cannot vouch that and cannot be sure.

Is he still works abroad? When can he move back for good? Maybe you plan for surprise visit and see for yourself, too?


If you don't find peace with yourself, you cannot find anywhere else.
Appreciate and cherish what I have.

Posts: 8680 | Registered: Jul 2005 | From: midwest
beach
♀ Member
Member # 7533
Default  Posted: 3:19 PM, November 2nd (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

srb1608,
I found out my mom had cancer and dealt with her sickness and eventual death the entire first year after dday. Since her death i sometimes feel i am starting over or really just dealing with this A mess since my mom took presedence over everything at the time. I feel so juvenille still worrying after 16 months of great R.
I am sorry to hear about your mom. It must have been tough on you on top of the regular R journey. I hope your H keeps up on his being transparent and openbook with you. Sending you more positive thoughts.

Hugs!

[This message edited by beach at 3:20 PM, November 2nd (Monday)]


If you don't find peace with yourself, you cannot find anywhere else.
Appreciate and cherish what I have.

Posts: 8680 | Registered: Jul 2005 | From: midwest
figureitout
♀ Member
Member # 23997
Default  Posted: 4:13 PM, November 2nd (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

BeStrongForYou

I was reading this the other day, posted by SerJr, it has a section that relates to the WS in a strange way seeking approval of their unacceptable choice. It may give you some insight...


www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=261192

I wish you the best.
FIO


M-30+ yr
Dday 8/09

Posts: 308 | Registered: May 2009
srb1608
♀ Member
Member # 19477
Default  Posted: 8:52 PM, November 2nd (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Beach - Thanks, it has been hell. Dealing with both has been a nightmare. My mom was always my best friend and she helped me through the A mess. We got back together before she found out and she was very happy as she too knows WS was a wonderful H and father and was glad to see us try. However, as she got sicker i couldnt talk to her about my pain as she shared it and stress was bad for her. So i held a lot of this in. I am just starting to have a clear mind to think about our R. I feel so sad. Although all has been so well, just feel lost and empty and scared.
Thanks for all the kind words.


BS- me 37
WS -him 37
Married 13 years

Posts: 2220 | Registered: May 2008
bdotoole
♀ New Member
Member # 25213
Default  Posted: 10:57 AM, November 3rd (Tuesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

18 months into R and I have earned some recent insight into my continued frustration......WS has really worked on getting me to see that he "now" wants only me and truly loves me. He states all the time...I do love you and want to be with you. I get this already but what I think it really is on my side of the ledger is what makes me able to look past the red flags and doubts when what I really think I am thinking is "how is this WS now WORTHY of MY love. A person who would so freely take part in behaviors that without a doubt would hurt me so badly (there has to be no doubt that he knew an affair would wound me deeply) is now daily trying to make me confident of his love for me while I just don't see where he is has worthy of my love as before the A. Any insight from WSs would be appreciated. I feel angry that he probably just thinks how do I make her see and feel my love and that I made a really bad mistake but am with her now when I feel most of the time....how is he worthy of my love now that he has shown how capable he is in hurting me ??? Hope this makes some sense....I think it's resentment on some level possibly......

Posts: 25 | Registered: Aug 2009
MissesJai
♀ Member
Member # 24849
Default  Posted: 11:23 AM, November 3rd (Tuesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

bdotoole ~
I feel angry that he probably just thinks how do I make her see and feel my love and that I made a really bad mistake but am with her now when I feel most of the time....

You said "he probably just thinks" - do you know for a fact this is what he's thinking? Why don't you ask him what he's thinking? You are 18 months into R - hopefully communication flows freely. I don't think that's an unreasonable question to pose. Instead of jumping to conclusions about what he MIGHT think, find out what he's REALLY thinking. It's much less self-punishing..

how is he worthy of my love now that he has shown how capable he is in hurting me ???

Only you can answer that. Yes, he's capable of hurting you but the truth of the matter is we are all capable of hurting the ones we love. IMO, if the litmus test to determine whether someone is worthy of your love is based on whether or not they are capable of hurting you, then we would all fail. You have to decide if he's worthy. Based on what you've stated, he's doing things daily to try and rebuild with you but your resentment won't allow you to see that. All you see and feel is the damage he caused and I get that. But, I can tell you that if this is truly the case, nothing he ever does will be good enough for you. He can work his ass off and do every single solitary thing you ask of him but it won't be enough. Wayward or not, that's frustrating.

I think it's resentment on some level possibly......

IMO, I can tell based on your post that resentment is driving this and not possibly - it is and it's probably been building. Again, have you talked to him about this? Have you communicated your feelings to him? I understand the resentment; however, if R is going to be successful, you have to address this with him immediately. Do not let it build and/or fester any longer - it's not healthy for you, your WH, the R process, and your M.


FWW - 40
Nobody can make you feel inferior without your consent...

Posts: 5527 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: So Cal.....
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 12:46 PM, November 3rd (Tuesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

bdotoole -

how is he worthy of my love now that he has shown how capable he is in hurting me ??

I agree with MissesJai that you are the only one who can ultimately answer your question, and a WS cannot answer it for you. I do think there are things you can do to help the process along though.

He states all the time...I do love you and want to be with you.

Does he just say "I love you"? If so, how about asking him why he loves you? Get him to be specific about it. What is it about you that makes him care so deeply. The more he can articulate this, the easier it will become for you to accept that he truly does love you that much.

but am with her now

Being there and sharing words is no longer enough. How does he express love toward you, and is it in a way you can accept? For me, I had to step up my contribution as a member of our family. Do more around the house and with the kids to take the load off of my BW's shoulders. Those types of efforts were worth more than 1,000 "I love you's", because they were actions that represented what I had learned about what my BW needed me to be for her.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
HurtButHopeful?
♀ Member
Member # 25144
Default  Posted: 1:11 PM, November 3rd (Tuesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

FWH has always been slim, yet he has always worried about 10-20 extra lbs. which doesn't look bad IMO since he is a tall man. (I've always thougth he looked great.)

He started lifting weights b/c of his job and putting on a little muscle.

All of the sudden, he became super lean and buff.

Later find out about the EA with 15 yr. younger OW.

Now we are in R, living together again (his job had him living 6 hours from home, and after A our family moved to town where his job is.)

He now has access to plentiful good food again at home and his membership to the gym expired. Since his company no longer pays part of it (bad economic times) he doesn't want to renew it at full price.

He is putting on weight (10 or 15 lbs) and he feels bad. He says that he doesn't feel as good about himself, and he recently said the extra weight affects his sex drive. (I think he looks great still.)

How come he was motivated to be lean and working out when he had an OW, but for me he lets himself go? And even though he wasn't in a PA it made him feel very manly and sexual. How do I help him be motivated to do what he needs to do so he will feel good about himself when he is with me?

Anyone else deal with a spouse who is more motivated with OP than in marraige?

I'm afraid he will look for another OP so he can feel good about his body again.

WS welcome.


Reconciliation means that we both are authentic and vulnerable. I still have my H, and he's a better man than ever!

Posts: 1716 | Registered: Aug 2009
Topic Posts: 1000
Pages: 1 · 2 · 3 · 4 · 5 · 6 · 7 · 8 · 9 · 10 · 11 · 12 · 13 · 14 · 15 · 16 · 17 · 18 · 19 · 20 · 21 · 22 · 23 · 24 · 25 · 26 · 27 · 28 · 29 · 30 · 31 · 32 · 33 · 34 · 35 · 36 · 37 · 38 · 39 · 40 · 41 · 42 · 43 · 44 · 45 · 46 · 47 · 48 · 49 · 50

Return to Forum: I Can Relate This Topic is Full
adultry
Go to :
madness  
© 2002 - 2014 SurvivingInfidelity.com. All Rights Reserved.