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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: BS Questions for WS"s III
Allgoodnamesgone
♀ Member
Member # 26157
Default  Posted: 6:32 AM, November 30th (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks again Card.


Me- BS
DDay- 8/26/09
Separated after failed R effort.

Posts: 2165 | Registered: Nov 2009
Cloudy and Clear
♀ Member
Member # 25665
Default  Posted: 11:26 AM, November 30th (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

"I am not a dog" says my WH after I asked him about placing a GPS tracking system on his BlackBerry.

I can see his point, to a point, but this reaction is not a trust-builder to me. He says that his BB is from work therefore work wouldn't approve it/wonder what's up etc. (( His track record is 12 overseas ONSs and hookers for the last 8 years while on business trips... and recently an EA. He still travels.))

I am really upset about this, i can't get it out of my mind that he is not even considering discussing the issue -- he just cut me off at the knees and is vehemently opposed when I try and talk about it. I have suggested some alternatives, like a camera, but nope, "I'm not a dog" he keeps saying. It just makes me wonder what the heck he's hiding, or maybe he's not hiding anything -- i just don't know!!!

Do you think I am being unreasonable here in my request for a GPS tracking system? He does seem to be doing all the other right things.

C and C

[This message edited by Cloudy and Clear at 11:37 AM, November 30th (Monday)]




Posts: 76 | Registered: Sep 2009
Phoenix519
♀ Member
Member # 26186
Default  Posted: 11:38 AM, November 30th (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My question is this, and it's been discussed in the General forum...

Why does my FWS keep telling me to quit living in the past?

What does that mean to the "waywards" exactly?


Posts: 581 | Registered: Nov 2009
imscared_k
♀ Member
Member # 14061
Default  Posted: 12:17 PM, November 30th (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Cloudy and Clear-
Initially after Dday I found out my BH but a keylogger on our computer. I wanted to R, but I was livid that I was being spied on. How dare he spy on me! Of course, now that I'm further out from d-day, I want to smack myself upside the head. The I can't do this attitude doesn't work in R. Ok his BB is for work and is a company BB so maybe modifications aren't ok. Why can't he carry a 2nd personal BB?
You've given him options and he won't submit to any of them. I can't tell you what to do but I can tell you that what you need to feel safe is not unreasonable. You could give him the original options again when he says "I am not a dog" you could reply with "No but you could be a divorcee." Just remember whatever line you decide to draw follow thru with the consequences, don't make empty threats.

Posts: 1059 | Registered: Mar 2007
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 12:31 PM, November 30th (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Cloudy and Clear -

Do you think I am being unreasonable here in my request for a GPS tracking system?

I don't think the request is unreasonable, and I can understand the stress point.

I think the best way to work out whether your WH really can't accomodate your request is to focus less on one solution and more on the issue you are trying to resolve. If you dig in your heels on a GPS, he'll just keep digging in his on being monitored.

But if you tell him your difficulty in trusting him while he travels and ask him to suggest ways he can help ease that fear, it will likely reveal whether or not he is invested in R. If he tries to come up with ideas, then he's invested. If he sticks to his line about not being a dog and rejects any effort to be more transparent, you'll need to decide whether or not that's a dealbreaker for you.

If it helps you out at all, I voluntarily offered to have a webcam on from my hotel all night. My BW told me she found it a bit "creepy" and so it didn't last long, but I offered it and would still do it now if it was what she needed to feel safe with where we are.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 12:39 PM, November 30th (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Phoenix519 -

Why does my FWS keep telling me to quit living in the past?

In my experience, the answer depends on whether the WS is remorseful or not.

For the remorseful WS, it's because the pain of facing your own actions is deeply painful. It's bad enough having to deal with the damaged M. But knowing that you are the cause of it and you really can't turn to anyone else for support makes it that much worse. The desire is to find a way to focus on "new you" that is no longer capable of being the monster we used to be is overwhelming. Moving on means hope. Revisiting the past means keeping us mired in pain and despair.

For the unremorseful WS, it means trying to bury the actions and make them less significant than they are. It means trying to avoid repercussions for the harm the WS did. It is an effort to sweep it all under the rug and pretend that nothing happened. It is also a recipe for a repeat offense since the WS isn't held accountable and forced to find their own weaknesses.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
just breathe.
♀ Member
Member # 25604
Default  Posted: 12:42 PM, November 30th (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Just wondering how many waywards have assured their BS that an affair/ONS would never happen again -- and actually stuck to it?

I am 3 months and a day since my WH confessed to his ONS (I had NO idea, and would never have known had he not told me), and he tells me nearly every day that he will never do it again. He is remorseful & transparent, but I'm just having such a hard believing that he isn't *more* susceptible to infidelity now that he's crossed the line once.

I guess I just keep hearing the "once a cheater, always a cheater" repeating in my head.

Is it really possible to learn your lesson?


Me: Faithful Wife, Him: WH (stupid ONS)
DDay/Confession day: 8/29/09

Fear less, hope more; Whine less, breathe more; Talk less, say more; Hate less, love more; And all good things are yours.


Posts: 368 | Registered: Sep 2009
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 12:52 PM, November 30th (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

just breathe - I've stuck to it. But the foundation of not having another A has changed over time.

Immediately following D-Day, it was the fear of losing my family. I didn't know why I was committed to not blowing it again, I just was.

Over time with IC, I managed to learn about my flaws. My need for others to praise me to feel good about myself. My fear of conflict with others. All the things that the A fed into. I learned ways to counter those gaps to be a stronger person.

So in the first 6 months to a year, I could say it wouldn't happen again but the reality was I hadn't done the work needed to guarantee that. After learning through IC what I needed to change about myself, I gained the foundation I need to say that it will never happen again because I no longer need others to define whether I am good or bad. I now do that for myself.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
cyclewife
♀ Member
Member # 17922
Default  Posted: 2:05 PM, November 30th (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

If you lied after D-day what was the reason for doing so?
Was it to protect the affair?
The memories of the affair? To protect the other person?

I am unable to find any valuable reason why my husband would have lied to me for two years if he wanted to stay married to me.
We went to marriage counseling...all lies.
So many opportunites to tell the truth within those two years of "R" and he never did until I caught him doing something...then he would 'fess up a little bit.
At what point did you decide to stop lying?
What was the turning point?


BS(me)-37,WS-40
3 kids-s-13, d-7, d-5
married 13 years
Affair started Aug 2007
He moved out 9/15/2007-Said he was moving in with his sister, he moved in with the OW.
OW-51,no one special, just a serial whore
R-hope he's not trying to trick me

Posts: 1314 | Registered: Jan 2008 | From: Texas
Devestatedx5
♀ Member
Member # 16557
Default  Posted: 2:28 PM, November 30th (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I don't like being accused of doing shit I didn't do.

"Stole" this quoted statement from another thread.

Although my FWH/DH has NEVER stated or acted like he was resentful or angry when I question him about something about situations or persons in our past (and PRIOR to his ONS), I get all "turned inside out" when I feel the need to bring up a person or situation for clarification that that is EXACTLY what he feels - NOT that I can blame him.

How do other FORMERLY WS's "feel" when asked about questionable (in their BS's eyes) situations and/or persons from your past?

Do you resent being asked for clarification?
Do you become angry at your BS for asking?
Do you feel that your BS will NEVER get past what you did?
Do you wonder if your BS is "actively scouting your life" (past and present) for situations/people that have "crossed their - the BS's - line"?
Does being asked about situations/people in your past (prior to your infidelity; or even POST!) make you feel like giving up "R" and "being" what you feel you are being asked (acused) of?

The last question, I guess, is really the "meat" of the matter. Does my rational/irrational thoughts about situations/people in my FWH's past/present - do these questions (say they average one or two every couple months) - will the questions - and implied lack of trust - lead to a REASON for me to not trust?


FBS-me (49)
FWH(57) ONS 8.19.07
Dday: 9.19.07
Married +26 years
RE-MARRIED 4.28.11
----------
Proverbs 31:10-31
Sometimes people are SO open-minded that that their brains fall out.

Posts: 2598 | Registered: Oct 2007
Sandcrab
♀ Member
Member # 10067
Default  Posted: 3:12 PM, November 30th (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

cyclewife

If you lied after D-day what was the reason for doing so?
Was it to protect the affair?
The memories of the affair? To protect the other person?

My reason for lying is because I was afraid I would loose my husband. If I told him everything at once he would have left (he did confirm this). I didn't want to loose my husband so I trickle truthed.

At what point did you decide to stop lying?
What was the turning point?

When I couldn't take it anymore and there wasn't much truth left. After that there was no reason to lie anymore.


I ♥ LostJim

Adopt a chihuahua in your area
http://adopt-a-chihuahua.adoptapet.com/


Posts: 5618 | Registered: Mar 2006 | From: wishing I was on an ocean beach somewhere...
Sandcrab
♀ Member
Member # 10067
Default  Posted: 3:20 PM, November 30th (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Devestatedx5

Do you resent being asked for clarification?

No, not at all.

Do you become angry at your BS for asking?

No.

Do you feel that your BS will NEVER get past what you did?

At times, yes. Then other times no.

Do you wonder if your BS is "actively scouting your life" (past and present) for situations/people that have "crossed their - the BS's - line"?

Not anymore. There was a time that I wondered and I was correct, he was actively looking.

Does being asked about situations/people in your past (prior to your infidelity; or even POST!) make you feel like giving up "R" and "being" what you feel you are being asked (acused) of?

No, I don't want to be that person anymore and I won't be that person, even if accused of that. I know who I am now and I am staying me, not that other person.

The last question, I guess, is really the "meat" of the matter. Does my rational/irrational thoughts about situations/people in my FWH's past/present - do these questions (say they average one or two every couple months) - will the questions - and implied lack of trust - lead to a REASON for me to not trust?

I don't think it will lead you to not trust. I believe in time you will learn to trust again. They say 2 to 5 years but sometimes it may take longer. I think you will be able to turst again in time.


I ♥ LostJim

Adopt a chihuahua in your area
http://adopt-a-chihuahua.adoptapet.com/


Posts: 5618 | Registered: Mar 2006 | From: wishing I was on an ocean beach somewhere...
Card
♂ Member
Member # 23667
Default  Posted: 5:05 PM, November 30th (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'm not a dog" he keeps saying.

Cloudy and Clear,

Your WH is still feeling entitled to live a secret seperate lifestyle. Your solutions are perfectly reasonable.

I find it offensive that he say's, "he is not a dog".

WH has treated you as the dog, throwing crumbs to you for years, and he has the gull to say, you're trying to treat me like a dog. Your just asking for accountabilty, not a leash. Geesh!


WH (me)
BS (her)

D-Days April - Oct. 2007 Recovery started Nov. 2007

"Found Myself", I was right there in my shoes all along!
Search for self called off!

Why Repentance Is Necessary? Because Undeserved Mercy Empowers Entitlement/Sin


Posts: 570 | Registered: Apr 2009
tooanalytical
♂ Member
Member # 22306
Default  Posted: 8:01 PM, November 30th (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Leftoolate & Card,

Thanks for your responses about the meaning of your wedding rings. I was wondering what my fww thought about her rings now but was afraid to ask and didn't want to upset her. Especially since I focused specifically on them representing a sacred vow or covenant. In many ways, my definition needs to change because I agree they do represent all the love and good we have which has kept us together.

Thanks again for the insight.


Me BH 44
FWW 44
Married 21 years
D-Day Apr 29, 2008
Children: 19,17,14
EA/PA - 1 year
Status: R

Posts: 270 | Registered: Jan 2009
UnexpectedSong
♀ Member
Member # 21761
Default  Posted: 3:21 PM, December 2nd (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Devestatedx5 -

Do you wonder if your BS is "actively scouting your life" (past and present) for situations/people that have "crossed their - the BS's - line"?
Does being asked about situations/people in your past (prior to your infidelity; or even POST!) make you feel like giving up "R" and "being" what you feel you are being asked (acused) of?

These questions are what helped me the most. Have I behaved like this in the past? Why or why not? Those are questions that help answer "why".

So, no, I did not mind these questions. In fact, the therapist spent a lot of time on these kinds of things.


WW(SA)
"Feedback is the breakfast of champions." - Boris Becker

Posts: 6046 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 3:29 PM, December 2nd (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Devestatedx5 -

do these questions (say they average one or two every couple months) - will the questions - and implied lack of trust - lead to a REASON for me to not trust?

Not for me. For one thing, the cause of the reason not to trust had nothing to do with my BW's trust or lack thereof. It was about things I had to fix within myself. Those are the things that have "affair proofed" me, not any change in my BW's actions.

As far as questions, she can ask anything she likes. When there's nothing to hide or fear, the questions are easy to answer. And when I do something that makes her uneasy, she simply needs to make me aware of it and it stops.

But I see that openness and willingness to discuss things that make a spouse uncomfortable as being part of any healthy relationship whether infidelity played a role or not.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 3:40 PM, December 2nd (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

tooanalytical -

Especially since I focused specifically on them representing a sacred vow or covenant.

I understand the difficulty in sorting this out. For me, it boils down to this. My A was about weaknesses within me. It did not replace or discard the love I have for my BW. In fact, I honestly believe that if I did not love my BW so deeply, I would not have recovered and would have lost everything in the process.

It was the strength of my love for my BW that served as my guide to recovery. Under that view, the ring makes a lot of sense. In our ceremony (like many others), the wording of the points made during the exchange of rings refers to them as a symbol of infinite love. It frequently goes something like this:

"The wedding ring is a symbol of eternity. It is an outward sign of an inward and spiritual bond which unites two hearts in endless love."

For me, my love for my BW never ended. In fact, the words "Endless Love" are etched on the inside of our rings. It is that endless and powerful love that has carried us through the deepest darkness imaginable, and allowed us to emerge even more connected than ever before.

I still wear my ring proudly. Because it's strength and beauty is a testament to the strength and beauty of our M. And as long as she'll have me as her husband, I will be bound to my BW with the power of a love that never ends.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
Nicki519
♀ Member
Member # 26311
Default  Posted: 8:17 PM, December 2nd (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'm sure this question has been asked already. I apologize if I'm repeating someone.

Why is it that WH tells the OW terrible lies about me. Also why would WH say very mean and hurtful things about me? I think that he must believe these hurtful things he said to some sort of extent, otherwise he never would of had those thoughts.

WH tells me that by him saying mean things about me it was to justify the A. Than makes no sense to me.


BS, Me, 41
WH, 41
Married 12yrs, Together 17yrs
D-day #1 May 25, 2009
D-day #2 June 21, 2009
8 yr old Son
19 yr old Step Daughter
In Recovery

Posts: 226 | Registered: Nov 2009 | From: The South
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 7:36 AM, December 3rd (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Nicki - if you're looking for any of this to make sense, you're going to find yourself very frustrated. It all has to be seen through the foggy view of a WS.

The justification reason is pretty accurate. Despite our actions, there is still an internal compass inside that tells us what we are doing is wrong. But the lure of whatever the A is providing that we feel we can't live with out (for me it was positive external affirmation) overpowers the rational self saying to no go there.

So to offset the stress of going against your own internal compass, you have to fool yourself into thinking that things in the M are worse than they really are. Let's face it, if your spouse is a wonderful person then having an A makes you scum. But if your spouse is constantly demeaning you, nagging you, unappreciative of what you do for them, then it's only natural that you would fall into an A to gain the appreciation you weren't receiving right?

So it starts with convincing yourself that the M is on the rocks or even is headed for D. Then you start sharing that with the OP, because they feed off of that and pile on the positive attention. The more you talk about how awful your spouse is to you, the more the OP will tell you what a great person you are and how they can't understand why your BS doesn't see that. That feeds the beast inside you that is craving the ego stroking, so you add more issues. It becomes a horrible, spiraling cycle.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
cyclewife
♀ Member
Member # 17922
Default  Posted: 9:38 AM, December 3rd (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thank you Sandcrab for your insight.


BS(me)-37,WS-40
3 kids-s-13, d-7, d-5
married 13 years
Affair started Aug 2007
He moved out 9/15/2007-Said he was moving in with his sister, he moved in with the OW.
OW-51,no one special, just a serial whore
R-hope he's not trying to trick me

Posts: 1314 | Registered: Jan 2008 | From: Texas
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