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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: Betrayed Men - Part 4
Razor
♂ Member
Member # 16345
Default  Posted: 10:19 AM, January 6th (Wednesday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Blaming the M is just a excuse. More justification. More bull shit lies.

IMHO WW have A because they feel entitled.


Forgive and forget = Relive and regret.


Posts: 3086 | Registered: Sep 2007
64fleet
♂ Member
Member # 18710
Default  Posted: 10:46 AM, January 6th (Wednesday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

IMHO WW have A because they feel entitled.

amen-now WW feels entitled to a great M-but it ain't happening.

damn she is fucking mean-started on me when I came home again last nite. Screaming at me & the kids, got mad at me for washing my own clothes? Its my fucking washer...
I either need another job to keep me away at night or I need to leave-but I got nowhere ta go & its my damn house.


this AM she's all syrupy & sweet to me & the kids.

If I have to work alla time to get away from her I might as well D & be a weekend dad.


time wounds all heels

Posts: 5359 | Registered: Mar 2008 | From: deliverance land
Jimi40
♂ Member
Member # 10909
Default  Posted: 10:54 AM, January 6th (Wednesday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hey 64, get her a night shift job.

If you can't turn the light off, break the bulb.


You've got nowhere to fall, when your back's to the wall.

Posts: 5524 | Registered: Jun 2006 | From: Niagara
64fleet
♂ Member
Member # 18710
Default  Posted: 11:28 AM, January 6th (Wednesday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

good idea Jimi, but that just ain't gonna happen.

I sure wish I hadn't been so damn dumb & got married-I'm usually fairly bright on things, but I sure blew it out my ass on the M bullshit.

I avoided it for 30 yrs, shoulda avoided it for 40+.


time wounds all heels

Posts: 5359 | Registered: Mar 2008 | From: deliverance land
jjct
♂ Member
Member # 17484
Default  Posted: 8:11 PM, January 6th (Wednesday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

yep. doin all the work huh?
I think about TIME spent, proving in ACTIONS how faithful, competent and all that jazz I was.
Way to piss on the dream I was investing all that time and energy in, yeah thanks...

Now I have to look back to understand me, see why I chose such a one who so lightly would do

such things.

Because of you, guess what,
I get to learn I got no one except myself to blame for my choices. I feel the stripes of it, but here's another promise, even before an altar doesn't make it true,
witnesses attending? And to still be the reason we find ourselves tapping keys on here?
Man that's alaugh!


Posts: 6021 | Registered: Dec 2007 | From: texas
SourCherryDrops
♂ Member
Member # 25883
Default  Posted: 2:39 AM, January 7th (Thursday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks for the encouragement. I will definately not be letting the subject slip from the table.

Given that we managed to get through Xmas without any significant incidents, sure I was a bit down at times, but on the whole i had as good a time as could be expected. I think putting the topic on hold was ok.

I know that my WW doesnt want to go there, she thinks shes told me everything, In fact im ok with the level of What details that ive got ....you you the 'what did she do...did you do this' questions...I dont really want to know any more. In the begining i had no mind movies, lately the odd one pops up every now and again...Im usually able to banish it fairly quickly... perhapes more what details would make them worse...perhapes make them better...but just for the moment its not really waht interests me.

The things im really wanting to know are the how, and the why questions. I also figure that these are probably the harder ones to answer as a WS...Im sure that off the top of her head she doesnt even know some of them...and its this introspection about why she did it, that i can understand wanting to avoid. It means taking a cold hard look at yourself. But i do trust that she will answer my questions.

Im sure in some cases that
Blaming the M is unjustified, but for the majority i think there must have been something missing in the first place. But our W should have raised their concerns and made sure that we were aware of the significance of them before they looked outside the M. In my case my W did tell me a few times that she was unhappy...but it was usually also wrapped up in a dozen other points about financial stress, or me not pulling enough weight around the house...or that i didnt go out with her enough...all points that clouded the real issue that she was feeling depressed, unsupported and not taken seriously. I focused on the phsical elements of what she raised... the not going for coffe with her once a week.... my argument, you already went for coffee twice this week and we are already behind on the telephone bill... I just didnt hear her emotional distress...

Part in parcel of why i am so interested in the how, and why questions is so that i can pay more attention to those warning signs in future.... but i hope that by then we will have both learned to communicate with each other in a way that ensures the actual point gets across.

Having said all of that, thats where i think our fault (if you can call it that) ends... it was our WW that decided to stop trying to let us know what was wrong...that didnt try and figure out other ways to let us know and that in the end started looking outside the marriage to try and fullfill those needs. From what My Wife tells me I figure that in the end none of the A's she had gave her what she needed anyway, in fact they just made things even worse...a positive feedback loop if you like. Hopefully now that i know and we are trying to R and we are talking openly and honestly about what we need and how we feel we will both start to get better.


Me BS 37, Her STBX 34, 1*ONS, 1*EA 1*PA/EA, 2*PA
Heading for D after 9 mths of R

Posts: 1468 | Registered: Oct 2009 | From: Europe
Stop
♂ Member
Member # 23564
Default  Posted: 7:28 AM, January 7th (Thursday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

SourCherryDrops

In my opinion, there is no way your participation in household chores or the number of times you go out with her or don't etc can cause her to cheat. She decided to cheat. She now would very much like to make it your fault.

Her emotional "distress" as you put it is not your responsibility.

I don't know where you are on the learning curve of sexual addiction and codependency but if you haven't read any books on those subjects you might look into:

"Mending a Shattered Heart" by Stephanie Kernes...and...Codependent No More by Melody Beattie

Basically, if there is addiction present (and I certainly don't know if there is) you have to know that you didn't cause it, you can't change it or fix it. Only she can.

Do you know of or suspect any sexual or emotional abuse in her early years? That is something that is very frequently associated with this type of acting out. It is also something she may not have shared with you so don't discount the idea on the face of it.

If addiction is present you haven't seen the last of it but whether addiction is present or not, you didn't cause her infidelity. She did and she, not you, needs to own it.


Me: Recovering codependent BH
Her: Long term gambling addict, unadmitted,unrepentant,practicing sex addict.
I didn't cause it, I can't control it, I can't fix it.
"Healing starts when you start taking care of yourself and let go of

Posts: 90 | Registered: Apr 2009 | From: Midwest
shyguy
♂ Member
Member # 18281
Default  Posted: 8:09 AM, January 7th (Thursday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Mine had that "entitlement" attitude. She is a SAB survivor. Bottom line some people are just broken


Love stinks yeah yeah(J. Geils)

Posts: 5866 | Registered: Feb 2008 | From: tulsa
64fleet
♂ Member
Member # 18710
Default  Posted: 8:55 AM, January 7th (Thursday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

mine claims some sort of sex abuse, but she never told her folks, anyone else, etc etc-makes me wonder if it really happened or if she is simply trying to keep her only family left(her folks are gone now)

why would she wait until I'm ready to divorce to finally say something abt it?
30 yrs or so later?
now when I no longer care?


time wounds all heels

Posts: 5359 | Registered: Mar 2008 | From: deliverance land
Razor
♂ Member
Member # 16345
Default  Posted: 9:40 AM, January 7th (Thursday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Watching Jay Leno some time back and he was talking about Tiger Woods. The monologue touched on the *sex addict* issue. Jay Leno joked that this is some thing rich people proclaim when they are caught. *Rich men claim they are sex addicts and then they go to rehab. The rest of us find our clothes on fire out on the curb.*

I laughed.

I have never known a woman who did NOT think that every man out there was a sex addict.

About SAB issues I have no knowledge.

BUT. I think allot of WS. Not just WW but WH also. Are looking for ANY excuse to soften the consequences of what they choose to do. Call it jaded if you will. But I suspect every thing that a WS says allong this line.

We have all heard the bad M being the cause of the A. Well. We are ALL now suffering in a bad M because of WW A. Is this not true? And yet the number of BS that have RA are very few. So if ANYONE has a *valid reason* for having A then we do. Also there were 2 people in this bad M. Were there not? So why did only 1 have the A?

Excuses. All of it is just excuses. I am surprised we do not hear more of A being *caused* by unfortunate planetary alignments.

But I also think that we BS are quick to seize these excuses and do our best to believe them.

Why? IMHO.

We are still in love with our WW. At least at first but further lies blame shifting and gas lighting destroy this. But at first we are still in love with them. And we do not want to believe the person we love is actually this heartless narcissist bitch. Because what does that say about us? And what does it say about us if we stay with a heartless narcissist bitch after she betrays us?

Also. We are quick to believe these excuses because it gives us some kind of control. Let us say we are told we are not doing enuf around the house and that is why the A happened. (Yes stupid, but we have all heard things more stupid than this) So if we believe this excuse then we feel that if we just do more around the house then by that act we can *control* whether a A happens again. So believeing this excuse makes us feel safe.


Forgive and forget = Relive and regret.


Posts: 3086 | Registered: Sep 2007
64fleet
♂ Member
Member # 18710
Default  Posted: 10:05 AM, January 7th (Thursday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I agree, Razor.

Are looking for ANY excuse to soften the consequences of what they choose to do.

I think that is why WW brought up SAb.

Look, I'll admit I have no sympathy for her-she betrayed me with at least two men I know of for sure, & there are 2-3 more I wonder about now. She initiated all contact w/them. This was no "mistake"-she lied for months right to my face. I still feel there is much more, but all I get is IDK IDR etc etc.
If she is not willing to tell the whole truth, I am not willing to care/invest/reconcile.

she cried the other nite about how perfect her family would be if she hadn't "done what she did"-I guess referring to the fact she killed my love for her & now I am cold. Too damn bad.

now that her folks are gone, she has nowhere to turn, & wants her husband back.

[This message edited by 64fleet at 10:05 AM, January 7th (Thursday)]


time wounds all heels

Posts: 5359 | Registered: Mar 2008 | From: deliverance land
Razor
♂ Member
Member # 16345
Default  Posted: 10:26 AM, January 7th (Thursday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

64. Yeh consequences can be a bitch.

Often I hear whining on how bad WW feels. They do not even really know what bad feels like. The pain they feel is the consequence of they actions. I tell her that I would trade places with her in a hot second. Yeh I would like a nice romance. With fun. Adventure. Dates. Excitement. And hot sex. To me the consequence of some minor loss of privacy and having to endure the BS crying seem a pretty minor cost for this to me.

They KNEW this was the possible price they would pay for the A. They actually KNEW the cost could be much higher. And now they complain about it?

And we hear how they do not want to hurt they BS by telling them? What a pile of crap. They ALLREADY hurt they BS by what they DID. If they truly did not want to hurt us they should not have DONE THAT. And now they whine about having to tell. Well cry me a flaming river.

I am a pretty jaded guy. I do not believe any of they excuses. They had A because they feel entitled and they thought they could get away with it. Plain and simple.

And I have no sympathy for how *bad* they feel. Just whining about the consequences is all I hear. If you do not want to get wet stay out of the water. If you go in do not complain to me about you being cold and wet.

Whining about consequences and not telling to *protect* they BS is just more abuse. And ABUSE is what having A is. Physical abuse. Our lives were put at risk. Emotional abuse. Our sanity is barely sustained.

I think more D happen because of what WS does AFTER telling than because of the actual A.


Forgive and forget = Relive and regret.


Posts: 3086 | Registered: Sep 2007
64fleet
♂ Member
Member # 18710
Default  Posted: 10:36 AM, January 7th (Thursday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

you are exactly right-immediately I wanted to stay M, I could forgive the As-I loved her with all my heart- it was the out & out lying to my face while looking me straight in the eye, long after dday-at that very moment something inside just quit-& I no longer feel anything for her. I knew then there were still things I'd never know, & I will never ever trust her again.
I simply can't.

I am comfortable, I love my kids, don't want to sell my house to settle w/her & move to somewhere i gotta pay rent & see my kids every other weekend.


time wounds all heels

Posts: 5359 | Registered: Mar 2008 | From: deliverance land
Razor
♂ Member
Member # 16345
Default  Posted: 10:47 AM, January 7th (Thursday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

This is the situ many of us BH find our selfs in. With the legal system as it is BH are in a loose-loose situ.

BW fare much better in the legal system than we do. May be that is why they are more willing to draw that hard line in the sand.


Forgive and forget = Relive and regret.


Posts: 3086 | Registered: Sep 2007
64fleet
♂ Member
Member # 18710
Default  Posted: 11:25 AM, January 7th (Thursday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

it sure pisses me off-she didn't have squat when we M'd, not even a car-it was even in my name.
now after fucking me around she is entitled to half my shit & both my kids. WTF?


time wounds all heels

Posts: 5359 | Registered: Mar 2008 | From: deliverance land
Razor
♂ Member
Member # 16345
Default  Posted: 11:33 AM, January 7th (Thursday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

In some sense it is a *smart financial move* by a WW to have the A and D. She does not do any of the work (or very little of the work) to build up financial security. She gets to go have all the fun of the A. Then she D and gets half plus of every thing. And full custody of the kids. And alimony. And child support.

And much of the alimony and child support the OM gets to enjoy.

Justice is lost.


Forgive and forget = Relive and regret.


Posts: 3086 | Registered: Sep 2007
64fleet
♂ Member
Member # 18710
Default  Posted: 12:00 PM, January 7th (Thursday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I wonder if she planned this "smart financial move" all along.

did I mention OMM is a fucking lawyer?

[This message edited by 64fleet at 12:00 PM, January 7th (Thursday)]


time wounds all heels

Posts: 5359 | Registered: Mar 2008 | From: deliverance land
Razor
♂ Member
Member # 16345
Default  Posted: 3:13 PM, January 7th (Thursday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I did not know that.

Makes sense when you consider the *smart financial move* thing. Cover your ass buddy.


Forgive and forget = Relive and regret.


Posts: 3086 | Registered: Sep 2007
Jimi40
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Member # 10909
Default  Posted: 5:34 AM, January 10th (Sunday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

A poor girl wants to marry, and a rich girl wants to flirt. A rich man goes to college, and a poor man goes to work. A drunkard wants another drink of wine, and a politician wants your vote, and me I don't nothing at all, but I will take another toke.- Charlie Daniels

Interesting how that sentence pins it down, huh?


You've got nowhere to fall, when your back's to the wall.

Posts: 5524 | Registered: Jun 2006 | From: Niagara
TwiceTorn
♂ Member
Member # 13895
Default  Posted: 1:13 AM, January 11th (Monday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I think your right on Razor with it is sometimes a financially smart move for the WW to D. Look at the simple number of who files first in D.

I think my biggest problem isn't the money thats actually used for the kids. Its the fact that it is given to the person that has shown bad decision making in the past for their own benefit. I don't like the feeling of giving someone money, and hoping it goes toward my kid. Its also the whole fact that I'm working my ass of, for my son, yet what is he actually going to see from it. Since when do parents who decide to ruin a marriage, break up a family, still get all the financial backing they had during M? I guess too me I find it hardly fair...


You've got to trust your instinct
And let go of regret
You've got to bet on yourself now star
'Cause that's your best bet~311 All mixed up


Posts: 3597 | Registered: Mar 2007 | From: Minnesota
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