I agree that it is difficult to think of my WS as a step down. But, the MOW's BH must think so, if he thinks about my WH at all.
My interpretation of DBB's point (written about OWs more than OMs, I think) is that it is the very compliance and complicity in deceit (and all else) that means it is a step down for all parties. A needy person chooses a needy AP, because that's all they can get (or all they perceive they can get), because their own opinion of themselves is not good. All round its a deceit and self-delusion of its opposite. Wonderful people do not have affairs (and to any FWS who thinks I am judging them, you may be wonderful now, but you weren't during the affair), but APs have to pretend to each other and themselves that they are wonderful in an ever-escalating process of self-justification, aggrandisment and delusion.
(But I know what you mean about your WS, )
[This message edited by Edie at 4:03 AM, June 6th (Sunday)]
A needy person chooses a needy AP, because that's all they can get (or all they perceive they can get)
This is true, but in my xWW's case, she affaired up, socio-economically. The guy is everything she ever wanted in a man -- a good provider.
She has told me that it's OK for a guy to have affairs if he's a good provider. Really? Something tells me she wouldn't have told me that back when my career was on track and I was making close to six figs.
I know she "affaired down," though. A man who would betray his family for a piece of ass is a shitbag any way you cut it.
I can only confirm this applied to my WW too. OM has never had a job in his life, does drugs, a real looser in every sense of the word. My wife said several times while in the fog she was making progress with 'fixing' him. BARF!!
For a bit it really hurts your self esteem. Thinking how can this POS be a better choice then me. So this post is a must read for everyone in that situation.
Once the fog lifted though, they are sooo shamed of how low they went with their choice.
"Forgiveness is letting go of the hope that the past can be different"
That bitch was so fucking illiterate. She couldn't even spell adultery. Didn't know the difference between suit and suite. She referred to herself as his secret fuck. No respect for herself. While she was not ugly, she definitely was not gorgeous.
I have done her the disservice of working full time while allowing her the luxury of working only 10 hours a week at a woman's health club for minimum wage so she can work out and tan for free. I provided a comfortable suburban residence with pool in the back yard that I kept up alone while she laid out and got more tan. I come home and fix a dinner every night for a family of 5 and clean up the mess afterward. She will then go out and run for hours because she is training for a marathon. He has nothing and she has been handed everything by me; the doormat. She still tells me that the affair came about because of my deficiencies.
These two deserve each other. Good fucking luck, bitch!
[This message edited by tulipcitymadman at 11:15 PM, June 11th (Friday)]
My husband consistently chose women I cannot begin to approach, in terms of physical appearance. At the same time--and for a prolonged time--I was sexually abandoned.
The overriding message was (and is), "You're not as good as they are."
No, they don't always affair down. Sometimes, they just rather blithely discard the wrong person---not really caring about the consequences.
I know this thread helps many. But I have to believe there are more, out there, who feel the way I do: that there was always an eye out for the next "something better," and we never quite factored into the equation at all.
In whose eyes?
I'm not disagreeing you with you for the sake of argument, and only countering with my own perspective (i.e, not invalidating yours) to say that 'all that glitters is not gold', and your husband may have liked shiny things (mirrors) perhaps was not the coinoisseur you are somehow giving him the credit to be, and that iin forever seeking himself in the mirror, he will never be satisfied because the image is forever distorting. He may not either have learnt to bite the coin to check if it's real gold let alone what carat it is.
I do not feel that this is but a 'feelgood' thread. It has a vent function and also IMO serves to
illuminate questions of standards: double standards, lowering of standards, perceptions of standards, and helps a BS orientate towards The Gold Standard, and feel that their sense of rejection is completely and utterly justified and understandable, and appreciate this is only because their WH is a golden ass. Otherwise, should we take the blame for their affairs?
But at this point, still fresh from the latest D-day, I can't shake the feelings associated with it.
I mean, I know that I'm better than a diseased stripper, or the women who were willing to meet him after a few words exchanged online, or even the bored housewife who was his latest conquest.
Intellectually, that is.
I don't quite yet feel that way.
My therapist assures me I will :) (PTSD sucks.)
[This message edited by BetsyBG at 8:18 PM, June 12th (Saturday)]
Sorry you are feeling so rough. Understand what you are saying. Guess this the point, as you are saying, where your intellect has to fight really hard on your behalf, to keep questioning those doubts of self-worth, test their credibility again and again the face of your husband's narcissism or whatever.
Your 'feelings' of rejection are true and valid, and I know how rejected I felt after Dday. This is why the analogy of the cake-eating is useful here. In most cases, it is not the main cake that is being rejected, far from it, it is being taken for granted as daily standard fare and only 'rejected' in that sense because children really like bread and butter,
but are always clamouring for cake instead. Ws's appetite for 'cake' is an unhealthy greed in themselves, filling themselves with sweet, sugary stuff, that provides a temporary' blood-sugar' high, always followed by a sharp and corresponding dip in blood sugar.
As you are saying, you do know really that your H's inability to appreciate fully the full and beatiful afternnon tea of cucumber sandwiches, tea-cakes and strawberries and cream that you represent, is simply that he spends too much time looking anxiously in thr mirror and not liking what he sees there. He is just not seeing anything much else at all. Do not give any credit for discernment that is not due, and especially not at your own expense. Because how does that help you, or him, for that matter?
Betsy, you are lovely, and lively and full of life, I always really enjoy and respect your posts. Don't let this man drain any of that lovely life out of you through his bloodsucking and sweet-tooth, kid in a candy store, eyes bigger than his stomach.
In my case, OW makes more $$ than I do and that was his driving force. She is younger, probably prettier and may have a better body too, but I still feel like she has nothing on me ... My morals, my attitude, my whole being has to be much better than hers -- that skank-homewrecker!!
In my situation the OM is a handsome man, apparently professionally successful, and has always been a charming ladies man. I realize that he is horribly broken inside, and I feel pity for his BS.
But this makes me feel like from his perspective he affair'd down, so that makes my WS somehow worse. It hurts to read many of the attributes in these posts and apply them to her. Makes me wonder WTF I am doing continuing to be in this relationship.
I'm not saying this for any other reason than to share my feelings...
Please do not be depressed by the dual 'vent' function of this thread, and try to realise that vents are an outlet for 'judgements' that we may not permit ourselves IRL; your wife may be an OW, and therefore 'condemned' collectively here, but as BSs we also realise our WS was trying to fix 'needs' (usually ego ones) by having an A, and can try to care for that 'hurting' bit on our WS and work with them to identify it and find more appropriate and healthy ways for them to address it than the self-destructive, self-medicating pathways to hell in an A.
I read all these posts about AP being ugly, fat, uneducated, unsuccessful.
MOW in my case is a successful owner of a veterinarian practice that employees 4-7 vets. WH loved that DR. in front of her name. Loved to hear about her great vacations, new boat, jet skis, fast car. He admitted to day dreaming about how their combined incomes would be so comfortable and her large house was so much more impressive than our modest ranch style home.
Looks wise we were very similar in height and build. Both long hair, mine red, her blond. Both pale freckled skin. Both even straight teeth. She is 10 years younger than me but too much sun has prematurely wrinkled her face and her hair grayed early so she bleaches it.
But she is broken. Has been in therapy for years and years. Suffers from SAD. Has a new best friend every year.
Has a husband that has never held a job for more than a few months every couple of years. Drinks 4 or 5 beers every night after work.
Knowing they affair down helps me sometimes. But sometimes it works the other way. Why would he want to be with a cheating, lying, drinking, mentally ill, morally bankrupt person instead of with me? Am I lower or less desirable than that?
WH and I discussed the looking for weakest in herd theory and he just didn't get it. I tried to tell him that if one of his friends propositioned me, I would be offended that they thought I was the kind of woman who would cheat. It would show complete disrespect of me and my values.
WH said that I should be flattered that another man found me attractive enough to hit on. This was his take on the posting in November. I've made a point to tell him of every possible complement I have received since then. Guess he didn't think I got any since I didn't brag about them or act on them.
He seems much more clear thinking these days. Think that I will print this out again and see if he has the same response.
Sorry for the long post but this is the one year anniversary of the night when I first suspected affair and I'm having a horrible night. WH is out of state for orientation for a new job after being unemployed/part time employed since d day.
Really letting the memories hit hard tonight.
MOW - mother of Daughter's best friend. 15 years younger than WH
Discovery Day - July 1, 2009
I still feel like she has nothing on me ... My morals, my attitude, my whole being has to be much better than hers -- that skank-homewrecker!!
In my case, OW was 26, on H #3, all of whom she has cheated on. And WS was her 3rd A in 6 months. Officially OW and BH had only been married a MONTH when A w/ my WH began. What a skank. She barely has an associate degree (not to say that's bad - but compared to me - below average), stupid, lazy, hates the job that WH loves and tried to recruit me into Avon (have to pause their commercials, otherwise I'll throw things @ the TV). I know I'm far more intelligent than she is, worked my butt off to get my undergrad (2 jobs and scholarships), and am now earning my MBA in a field I am passionate about. I am better looking, but also heavier. But what's that saying? I'm fat but you're ugly, and I can always lose weight.
Oh and as a side note, WH is my ONLY partner . . . ever. And as apparantly the only adult between the 4 of us (WH, OW, her WS/BH) who would get STD testing, I at least discovered an infection they gave me which luckily was treatable w/ anti-biotics. So, that was awesome.
[This message edited by Thera77 at 1:44 AM, June 19th (Saturday)]
You don't sound used up to me. You sound energised and 'usefully' up.
Sorry about the antiversary feelings. Hope your H gives you a thoughtful response to the thread.