It will be difficult to move forward w/R, once OC arrives. Not having a full commmitment (like M) from wBF would even make you question whether you even would want involvement w/OC. My brother dated & lived w/a girl w/young child & it really KILLED him, when they broke up after 2 years. He'd grown so attached to the toddler, that it killed him more to see the child gone...than in losing the GF.
Stay strong. Yes, R is impacted by OC, but you need to explore reasons to R & not to R (that don't involve OC).
Good luck on CS hearing. In-home childcare shouldn't be considered like you're paying someone. Even on taxes, you cannot get a credit for in-home childcare by older siblings or anything. I can see if she had a live-in Nanny....I guess, maybe he'd have to prove he was claiming the income from childcare on his taxes also. If he did, then that would be proof enough that she was paying him (who'd want to pay IRS on income you DIDN'T actually receive).
I know exactly how you feel. I don't want to spend my life waiting for a knock on the door either. But dealing with OC is not something I want to deal with either. Good luck.
(((((OnMYOwn & WaNT2hELP)))))))))))
CS is difficult. On one hand, every child has the right of support of both parents, but also I think of all the good we could do for COM with the CS money. Also, FWH is paying part of child care. I am going to talk to him about getting this court ordered. He is at least paying by check so there is a paper trail.
OW spending her weekends here with BIL is stressful on me right now, I am just trying to act human and get by.
Repeat, glad you made it through another season. Glad OC will not be playing next year, you do not need the stress. IMHO, if parents sign their children up for stuff, they should be there, not depend on others to get children there like OW.
BIL has diabetes and high blood pressure now. OW took him to the ER Sun and Dr Monday. What was incredibly stupid and selfish is BIL drove OW home (1 hr away) in her car and wanted FWH to pick him up. OW was too tired to drive home (Dr appt was at 2, she stayed until 6) and she might wreck with OC in car and die. So FWH, under pressure from BIL and FIL says yes and goes after working 9 hrs to pick up BIL. BIL only went to OW's house last night to get a piece and had plenty of time for that before FWH got there. Then BIL had the nerve to text FWH on his way to bed and said "we have to go back, I have OW's keys" FWH texted back and said have a safe trip, see you in the morning. FWH was mad, said there was no way he was going back to OW's to drop off keys! BIL had to take them to her this morning. This is the biggest pair of horney, selfish bastards to walk the planet!
Yes? Well, I am fucking stupider than I look.
She lied her ass off at the child support hearing (over the phone).
My H's CS has been doubled (well, is pending being doubled) due to her getting all this assistance, but mostly because she is getting $200 a month for childcare. I know she doesn't pay child care (from reading her emails- which I can't really submit to court- as her "fiance" who she is pregnant by has the OC while she works nights and sleeps during the day as he lives with OW) so H called for a hearing.
She was supposed to submit evidence that she was paying child care to BOTH PARTIES (H and the judge) by a deadline BEFORE THE HEARING. She submitted nothing.
During the hearing she stammered, and "Yes, I pay child care" but didn't say to whom. The judge asked her "Are any other adults living in the home?" and of course she says "No! No one lives with me!". LYING BITCH.
So the judge says "You will know my decision in the next few weeks... OW, can you get me proof of child care in the next 2 days?"
You can't submit "evidence" AFTER THE TRIAL!!!
Of course OW got all smug and "Yes I can". So, the judge will be deciding the case with evidence my H never sees. I am outraged!
He intends to file an appeal, in the mean time I intend to have him file a formal complaint about this "judge". This is not fair!
In our state, the "self support reserve" (the least amount someone paying child support must have to support themselves, when they have no non-joint children in the home) in almost $1000. My is is bringing home around $800 a month, and we have our own daughter to support. The CS papers state a "credit" is given for our daughter, but they are wanting to raise his CS to 50% to the very dime... where is the credit then?
So, I felt my only choice is to turn her in for welfare fraud. She was required to list all the assistance she gets (on CS papers) and she gets a ton, despite making as much as my H. She lists her and OC as the only people in the household, so I immediately got on the phone and turned her in. It will be hard to prove, but once the child she is currently knocked up with now is born, if she is still claiming her "fiance" as not living there, they will go after him for CS.
Great idea, REPEAT, about the IRS thing. I have a feeling she is going to claim her mom watches OC (her mom, who works TWO full time jobs already trying to keep her house). I know her mothers email, I feel like writing her a letter letting her know she will be turned into the IRS for unclaimed income if she claims to be the one OW is paying to watch OC.
God, I really thought "She looks like she must be moving on with her life... I am SURE she's not going to lie to CS just to be spiteful and get more $$$". Duh.
The good thing is my H is seething. I guess OW had the gall to interrupt and say "My paperwork says you already get a credit for [our d's name]!!" He said he wanted to reach through the phone and choke her for having the nerve to say our daughter's name. He said he could barely stop himself from yelling at her never to say her name again, she didn't deserve to use it!
Even though she resprained her ankle Thurs night & was on crutches so she couldn't go to OC's game, OC said yesterday that her mom was off crutches & feeling better. Wow, she must be a quick healer. I don't know anyone else who's has a severe sprain & isn't on crutches for @least 4-6 weeks. OW wants to get OC back on Saturday to take her to circus w/toddler sister. She must really be feeling well, to attempt such an outing. She asked if fWH wanted OC back after circus & fWH told OC to tell her momma NOPE. Let her deal w/the misbehaving this weekend (she's really difficult to deal w/for about the last 3-6 months) - backtalk, not doing what told, refusing to answer when asked a question, refusing to get up for school/church. I told you guys, I made her go w/out breakfast to game one Saturday...told her "get up or U won't have time 4 breakfast." She whined of being hungry all b4 game....but, now when I say "get up or no breakfast," she actually gets up. OC doesn't like going w/out food. She is 9 & weighs 108 lbs.....we're working on that.
OC also said OW's BH#2 quit his 2nd job @fitness center. He's been driving OW to pickup OC each day this week. Don't know what's up w/that, none of my business as-long-as OW is there, per custody papers.
New guys, don't forget to get CS credit for COM & any health care premiums you pay (if fWH carries health, dental, vision). Our state lets you divide the Family premium by #parties in family, so that was good on fWH's calculation.
W2H, how could they ask for $$$ that is greater than his income?
Wonder if you could tip-off judge that BF is living there & they are expecting child together. Wonder if he's changed his legal residence on IRS forms or anything, when he files. That'd be proof that he was living there. Don't you just hate to get dirty about this? I think the judge is looking out for you & maybe OW cannot come up w/proof of CS payments. Not really any way of making her required to use certified/licensed daycare, since she works nights. I did like when OW sent OC to daycare & afterschool, as I knew that OC's CS $$$ was really going toward her care & that she was @least being cared for better than hopping from relative-2-relative or pot-smoking granny who didn't change her diapers. In our state, my income in caring for COM doesn't come into play, so if fWH's income dropped drastically, his COM still give him a credit (not exactly sure about the $$$ amount though). Time spent w/OC played into our calculation also, since we had her close to 50% of time (only where she spent night counts as day).
Custody papers say whoever signed OC up for extracurriculars, is responsible for her transport & the cost, but since fWH was going to each game...he did not push that part of papers.
My H has been saying all along that the system is biased against the men in these situations. They have NO SAY in anything and the lawyers and judges have akready made up their minds about them before things even start.
As I am living through this on his side I tend to agree.
I hope the appeal and the complaint are taken seriously.
Hugs to you.
I totally agree, that the courts are biased towards the men. When FWH went to CS hearing, OW claimed he had been giving her support all along, at aproxiamitly $2000 a month. LMFAO. But he had a female judge, and she ended up leaving the court room, and leaving FWH on the stand, because she was appauld that OC were on government assistance based on the income he has, but we had only gotten the DNA results back 2 weeks prior to hearing. She felt that he should have the children on his insurance all along. We did not dispute the OW lies, as this would have come across that he might have had to pay back the government, or back CS. I was just furious over this judge leaving the courtroom, and making my FWH feel like a piece of shit, this is OW bad behavior as well.
I did submitt a complaint to the judge and spoke my mind, that if he was paying the privous amount OW suggested, then I do ask why she was on assistance, and about her leaving the courtroom, this was a very unethical position to place a person in. I did get a response from the judge, pretty much stating that it was not my place to contest, as FWh could if he so choose too. But that my complaint would be filed into the paperwork. That was all I really wanted, and did not want an outcome to change at that time, just wanted to state my opinion of her behavior. Glad it did become part of the file though.. So if you file something, be sure that it is all addressed by your FWH. Your FWH can request that the daycare provider be licensed provider. That is a federal regulation now, I believe.. Not a state by state law.. But I do think you have to specify that they are licensed. And if they are if she gets the tax credit for it, it reduces the CS and gives your FWH a percentage break for OW getting credit on taxes for it. It is not much of a credit, but every bit does count..
You could mail a certified letter to OW house in care of BF name signable only by him, and that would be proof enough to show he resides there. This is what I was told by my attorney, when I was going to file for divorce and wanted to prove abandonment on my FWH, that he was living with OW.
Im wishing you luck, and praying things turn out best for you two...
Amazing how these OW use our FWH for career choices, when a man with no marriage would have been a better choice. I suppose this is KARMA for our FWH, to bad we go along for that ride as well. Another choice we make by staying and R-ing.
Great idea, about the certified letter. Even if we don't end up winning, and CS does get raised, I at least want her busted for welfare fraud (one of the reasons CS is so high).
That is really good to know about the tax deduction.
Now, we of course want to make it so that she has to use a licensed provider, how do we do that? Do we need to go to court and get a modification?
In our state, you never get to go to actual court over CS, just over the phone hearing (as I understand it). Do we need to go to ACTUAL court, like we would if we were going for visitation?
God, I wish we had $$$ for a damned lawyer, but as it is we are not even making ends meet!
I really thought OW had moved on with her life enough not to have the "I'm going to make him pay!" attitude (which H says she totally had during the hearing). God, I am so stupid.
Don't beat yourself up. OW's are so manipulative, you want to believe them. And you, as a good, grown up person want to believe that other people will act grownup and responsible also. You want to believe that OC will change their priorities, be as life altering as our own children were to us. But, it seems most OW's don't lose their selfishness, make OC a priority or essentially "grow up". But, people who sleep with married men don't do decent things or make good decisions.
Every last word she wrote is the livin' truth.
Even now, so many years later I still have a hard time when the assmom doesn't mom up.
It still kills me that "person" has these two wonderful kids and continues to make ass-excuses NOT to see them.
I find myself getting angry that she brought these two wonderful beings into the world and she doesn't even call them, then I have to remind myself that they were just a means to an end for her.
It's supposed to be her weekend Friday. She hasn't seen them since the beginning of January. The last time it was her weekend, *I* had to hold two kids while they sobbed their ever-lovin' hearts out for that POS.
Geesh. My head hurts now.
I would suggest maybe petioning the court, which in most courts there is a web site available to find the proper documents to do this. Or maybe even invest in a paralegal to work up the documents. I so understand wanting to get an attorney, we are in the same situation, but now that we pay such a high amount in CS, we can not do this. I see that OW goes and has massages done, takes trips out of state, goes on weekend trips for girls night in Vegas, and goes out at least once a week partying. It burns me up inside to see that she is out enjoying life, when half the time I cant even afford to go to the grocery store for decent meals for the month. But yet OW has no problem calling FWH and telling him she cant afford diapers. WTF!!! But he refuses and tells her she should have budgeted for them, it is just her ploy to try and get FWH to come by. Whatever....
You may also be able to call the courts and see what actions you must take, to try to have this order modified, maybe they can suggest something that will go into effect with the judges decision now..
Good luck to you all, this struggle is so difficult at times, but at least we all have eachother to lean on. Thank you all
he is all of a sudden demanding visitation after months of absence, and I told him he has to do this before I let him back into our lives.
I live on the Peninsula, in btw SF and SJ. thanks in advance!
OW since Dec? 04
D-day May 07
OC borm July 07
I triggered badly last night. Something started us talking about me nursing DS10 & then about 30 minutes later, I started thinking & thinking....I was nursing my DS, while fWH was planning & conceiving OC with HER. Makes me weep sometimes. This time-of-year is around time when he was trying to impregnate her & I really think that it probably happened the day DS13 & DS10 and I went to a friends all day for an Easter party & egg hunt. Kids had so much fun (DS10 was infant & everyone had to hug, hold, & kiss my chubby blonde/blue-eyed baby). I remember that fWH was supposed to be mowing yard that day & I couldn't reach him by cell, so thought he was mowing when we headed home. Funny, yard wasn't mowed @all & it stuck me as odd. I really think that he spent the entire day in OW's arms. I cannot even remember if he was home or @his parents' next door, when I got home. Of course, a coverup/alibi.
Anyway....do any of you guys just get this way, even after OC is much older. The 3rd A really screwed w/my brain & all the trickle truths & lies he finally told the truth about. He still won't come clean about WHAT in the HELL he and OW had planned, when they were TRYING to knock her up. They were trying during A#1 (3-6 months ending in Jan1999) & started trying somewhere early-2-mid 2000 (right after DS10 was born in Dec1999) with her conceiving probably mid-late April2000. He probably found out around late May or early June (around either my or his birthdays). He told about OC & (alleged ONS w/OW) in early July2000. Of course, ONS was really A#2 (now that I know some of the truth)...or, A#1 never ended & I was oblivious because I was trying to R & carry our child all that year & then later being mommy to 2 young kids & work full time.
Really sucks, when I'm scared to tell him what's going on in my mind, or I feel guilty, like I'm trying to keep punishing him.
Why do you guys think I cannot forgive & move forward? Last night, I started thinking about D again. The "what ifs" kinda thing, like maybe I should've D him in 1999(dday1), 2000(dday2), 2001(DNA+), 2008(dday3). I sometimes feel, like I'm the most naive & gullible BW in-the-world & quite stupid on top. Ugh! I hate this!!!
[This message edited by repeatBS326 at 7:14 AM, March 5th (Friday)]
I am not comfortable with that at all. I feel like he is pushing me. I told him how I felt and he got upset!!! WTF!!!
He told me that that child is part of him and he doesn't understand why I don't want to be involved.
He thinks I need to face her (OW)instead of hide from her. He thinks I am hiding because I have changed the stores I shop at to avoid running into her. It is not about hiding it is about just not wanting to see her. I told him that. He says that I am acting like I did something wrong because I let her get to me. I need to face her and tell her that what she did is wrong.
He only wants me to go out of spite, because OW does not want me around OC, which I think is wrong too. That is the only reason he is making OW follow through on the visitation. He says she needs to be inconvienced and uncomfortable like we (I) am.
I just want to put this behind us and move on. Which before court last week he wanted too. Now he is being spiteful to OW and OC. Then he proceeds to tell me that IF he gets attached then she will be a part of our family. IE she will spend summers with us (we are planning on moving out of state next year)
I DID NOT AGREE/SIGN ON FOR THAT!!!!
Oh and let's not forget that he is telling me that I am wrong and I should do this blah, blah, blah, however when this all started and I asked him how things would be if the situation were reversed, he said that we would no longer be married.
But I need to "deal with it"
[This message edited by Chandler at 7:32 AM, March 5th (Friday)]
Talk to him again. Maybe he just isn't understanding how this impacts you. Maybe he's thinking "this is my kid & to hell w/what anyone else thinks."
I kept my mouth shut too much, afraid fWH would leave me for OW (while I had a toddler & newborn). I regret not stepping in & demanding boundaries. I did have the choice of whether OC came home or he went to OW's mother's house for visitation (since nothing done legal @that point). It would have been better, if supervised visit could've been @neutral location (park, mall, indoor function?). On one hand, it would be nice to see how fWH reacted toward OW, OC, & you...on the other hand, I couldn't have done it myself. I never really met OW until I started doing some dropoffs (mainly after fWH's accident). I usually did pickups @daycare b4 & dropoffs @daycare Monday if fWH didn't take her back on Sundays.
If you want to R, I suggest a united front. Protect your M, by going to watch her like a hawk. Make her hand baby 2 you, sit away from fWH, even maybe leave the room if possible. Some women on this thread bond quite well w/OC....for me, she's more like a little sister that I'm responsible for. I never felt about her, like I feel about my own DSs. I think, that I resent the fact that she was born so much, that I kept OC @a distance. If we'd had full custody of OC, it would've been different (I think). But, OW needed OC to keep that bond w/fWH. Even though she didn't want to be the mom, she was using OC. In hindsight, I should have set boundaries & insisted NC between them. My gut was telling me changing fWH to dropoff/pickup person was wrong, but my logic was saying "he'd never cheat again, not after what we've gone through w/OC & fWH's disability/accident." NEVER TRUST OW....period.
Do not beat yourself up. Your H and OW did not have a "plan" they were living in a fantasy, they were king and queen of denial land. They scheme but do not plan, planning involves thinking things through. This had nothing to do with you! We just endure the fall-out because we value our M. Forgiving is hard, it is a choice to not let his failure come between you.
I am not very far out, but March 21st will be OC's conception date, the 1st time of PA. This on top of BIL moving OW onto our property is very triggery. IL's bought them a trailer and everyone is so excited and they can't wait to move in! She is even getting a transfer on her job and will be making as much as FWH! More if you include child support from 3 baby daddies.
Chandler, you and FWH have to be a united front for this to work, it cannot just be his way and you suck it up and deal with it or leave. Those are not the only choices. You have to be able to talk about it, both sides and come to a consensus. He has to do what you need to heal period for this R to work, if you need time, tell him. Please keep trying to talk to him, when he gets defensive, call him on it. This is just MHO, it and a quarter will buy you a cup of coffee. But please take care of you.
[This message edited by altered at 9:42 AM, March 5th (Friday)]
The donor has not seen the kids since some time in January. We're keeping track of it on a calendar, but that's at home right now...anywho, it's been long enough that my 42 year old mush for brains can't really remember WHEN in January it was.
Lessee...she called sometime last month around one of her weekends, but she was calling from PRIVATE, and we don't answer private calls. SHE KNOWS THIS. We have never answered private calls. Ever. Shit, SHE has said she doesn't answer private calls. But anyway, she calls a couple of days in a row before one of her scheduled weekends, AND NEVER ONCE LEAVES A MESSAGE. Now, even if she was calling from Private, she could've left a message, "hey, I'm trying to call here, can you pick up?" and that would've been that. But no. NOTHING. When she finally does call from HER number it's a day past pickup day. She then lays in that it is OUR fault that she didn't come. Oh, no, no, no...not a judge in the land is going to buy that line of horseshit...I mean, it's not like she'd lost her voice and couldn't leave a message. So she asks to talk to the kids...I can hear everything she's saying cos the kids are standing by my computer and she has no "inside voice". I heard her tell them it was "daddy's fault" she didn't come.
We dropped it...but still. Since then she's missed every other pickup. Wanna know the reason? Cos she can pick them up but she can't drop them back off.
But get this. Yesterday she texts my husband and asks if this was the 1st weekend of the month.
How many people out there think a 32 year old mother of SIX would be able to figure out a visitation schedule? How many think a 3rd grader can figure out the 1st, 3rd and 5th weekends of every month?
He didn't answer her. Shit. It's been YEARS since we got custody. You'd think she'd get the picture that we won't baby her old saggy ass and she'll have to mom up for herself.
Yet here she is, still tryin' and tryin' and tryin' to make it out like she needs that kind of help...like she's some kind of victim and we are SOOOOOOOO mean cos we expect her to be a fucking grown up for goodness sake!
Yet here years later and no job and no car and she doesn't pay CS, yet the kids go with her when she deigns to arrange to pick them up...
She's never going to mom up.
And it's gut-wrenching when the kids realize it's her weekend and break down crying when she doesn't show.
Dunno what I wanted to say. The pathetic attempt to get some coddling last night set me off. SHE doesn't deserve coddling...but those kids...they WANT her and she won't do it if it involves very much effort on her part.
I am going to talk to him again after work. Some days he understands and some days he thinks I ahould be over it already. I do want R to work and it was until this last court date. Then everything went to hell.
The visitation is going to be in a neutral place and H says that I can go off with our son he just wants OW to see me.
OW sounds like a real piece of work. Sorry the kids are feeling the brunt of it.