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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: Betrayed Men - Part 5
lostcause111
♂ Member
Member # 19109
Default  Posted: 11:45 AM, June 18th (Friday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I think if you get pissed and cant take it it is MORE of a reason to leave.

The biggest struggle for a WS to me is confronting themselves and not being who they were.

This change requires brutal honesty about who the really are .... and it is not pretty.

Had you not challenged her to fix the damage and become an adult in a loving monagomous relationship whe would cheat again or treat you like crap.

My WW must change her core or she is the same self esteem depressed whatever woman who cheated and NOTHING will get better.

I was open and swallowed a shit sandwhich alone staying.

Once you regain yourself, get a life again it really is up to my wife to prove she is not who she was. I want NOTHING to do with her if she stays the same.

I am so sorry SCD. You wife is scared of change. I just hope she thinks of the consequnces. post D life is not pretty at all.

And I know you would have given your right hand to make this work.

Stay strong brother.


Posts: 934 | Registered: Apr 2008
Mighty
♂ Member
Member # 26909
Default  Posted: 6:32 PM, June 21st (Monday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Got quiet here over Father's Day weekend.
Mine went good even though my WW found a really angry markup of her timeline. She was able to put of laying into me all through the weekend when I would have expected a fairly big arguement. I hate it when she finds things like that...just gives her ammo. I was angry and had every right to be so, but the words weren't meant for her like that. Probably not a bad thing she knows how it really effects me, but I'm worried it will make her rabbit and dive for her hole again when I'm still just trying for open communication.


BS (me) 44 WS (her)43
Married 17yrs, Together 20 yrs
Three children (9-13)
D-Day #1 - 4/11/09 (me).. DD's stopped, she quit talking. Body count: 6 OM, 1 OW. (2 EA's, 1 LTPA, 1 PA, 3 "kisses").

Posts: 629 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Denver
deeppurple
♂ Member
Member # 28757
Default  Posted: 7:22 PM, June 21st (Monday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I havent felt anger or hatred only sadness that the relationship became so bad. I acknowledged my part in that. She is really struggling as she terminated a pregancy to OM. The reality has hit home - she wants space & Im trying to give that but the other part of me just wants to hug her & tell her that we will survive & that we will heal together. I never not thought about forgiving her. Im trusting her more. As my IC says says only deal with what you know otherwise the what ifs will tear you apart. Time is a pain in the ass but I know it is our friend. I live in hope that she wants to reconcile & create a new & better future with me.


Me - BS 49
Her - WS 43
Married 16 yrs (together 17 yrs)
DD13 DS10 DS8 DS6
DDay 1 6.4.2010 dday 2 7.25.2010
Heading for divorce.
"Never look down on someone unless you are helping them up"

Posts: 522 | Registered: Jun 2010 | From: Where the sun is shining & the surf is pumping
awakening1
♂ Member
Member # 27360
Default  Posted: 9:04 AM, June 22nd (Tuesday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

"make her rabbit and dive for her hole again when I'm still just trying for open communication"

On the same page here. The kids leave for England with their Grandma and Step-Grandpa tomorrow for 2 1/2 weeks. For the first 1/2 of the trip, I will leave her in the house while I go to the beach. During the second half, she will join them there while I return to the house. Then when she returns, she will housesit at her father's, and the kids will shuttle between the two places.

She was rattled and anxious last night, and all throughout the day. She took the day off from work. She had difficulty making decisions, and focusing on anything. We talked briefly, but not really of anything substantive. Tonight when the kids fly out, we'll discuss the details of our separation.

"only deal with what you know otherwise the what ifs will tear you apart"

Very true, and very important right now. One day at a time.


Me: BH, 43
Her: WW, 41
Kids: 2 (9 and 6)
D-Day: 11/21/09. WW tried to bust up another marriage, but got dumped. OM/St. MF apparently wasn't so saintly after all.
Drafted S papers in 1/10. Filed in 1/12. Court date set for 1/13.

Posts: 79 | Registered: Jan 2010 | From: Northern VA
Mighty
♂ Member
Member # 26909
Default  Posted: 10:23 AM, June 22nd (Tuesday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

She went rabbit last night. She brought up one commit about how before I knew about her affairs, I was already saving and planning my D. I kept it short and told her there was no secret money account; I was going to liquidate my retirement fund, had started repairing the second home and started researching good divorce lawyers; lots of thinking, not much action. I asked if she was doing the same, and she claims she wasn’t... I wanted to scream at her that by that point, she’d been with the OM for 2 years so what is her definition of marriage when she’s already left it?.. I held my tongue expecting a talk later once the kids were in bed. Then she ended the conversation and disappeared. No more talking and she disappeared to bed before the sun went down or the kids went to sleep. Run rabbit, run!

btw; I was on the verge of leaving, then found out about the affairs. DD#1: Suddenly everything clicked as to why I was treated like crap, why she was so distant, and why the marriage was failing. Once I could put a finger on the problem, rebuilding the marriage was possible. She absolutely still doesn’t get that a strong marriage is about communication and sharing thoughts (good or bad ones) so each of you can support each other. Instead, she doesn’t want to “upset” me, so she doesn’t open up and tries to bury or avoid. It’s beyond frustrating and slowly becoming a deal-breaker. If she’d only tell me what’s going on inside her head, not only about the A, but about herself and looking for advice, we could get closer. But she’s silent and carrying her own burdens. For instance, yesterday she quit her job and took a position at another company... I had no idea she was still toying with the idea and still trying to make up her mind. She decided to reject that offer two weeks ago and seemed committed to her current job. Then... flop. Obviously she doesn’t have to share, but I’d think big decisions like that she’d want to share with me. Not a good sign of recovery when she’s still omitting big things. I’m starting to think she’s mental and I should run.


BS (me) 44 WS (her)43
Married 17yrs, Together 20 yrs
Three children (9-13)
D-Day #1 - 4/11/09 (me).. DD's stopped, she quit talking. Body count: 6 OM, 1 OW. (2 EA's, 1 LTPA, 1 PA, 3 "kisses").

Posts: 629 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Denver
64fleet
♂ Member
Member # 18710
Default  Posted: 11:57 AM, June 22nd (Tuesday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Sometimes the M just can't be fixed, mighty.


time wounds all heels

Posts: 5359 | Registered: Mar 2008 | From: deliverance land
awakening1
♂ Member
Member # 27360
Default  Posted: 1:55 PM, June 22nd (Tuesday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

She absolutely still doesn’t get that a strong marriage is about communication and sharing thoughts (good or bad ones) so each of you can support each other. Instead, she doesn’t want to “upset” me, so she doesn’t open up and tries to bury or avoid. It’s beyond frustrating and slowly becoming a deal-breaker.

And you would be justified doing so.

If she’d only tell me what’s going on inside her head, not only about the A, but about herself and looking for advice, we could get closer. But she’s silent and carrying her own burdens.

YMMV, but my guess is that she doesn't know herself well enough to start. My WW is finally in that process, but I'm not very hopeful how she will make it through.

For instance, yesterday she quit her job and took a position at another company... I had no idea she was still toying with the idea and still trying to make up her mind. She decided to reject that offer two weeks ago and seemed committed to her current job. Then... flop. Obviously she doesn’t have to share, but I’d think big decisions like that she’d want to share with me. Not a good sign of recovery when she’s still omitting big things. I’m starting to think she’s mental and I should run.

Stay strong. You can lead the horse to water, but you can't make it drink.

As a lawyer (not a family one though), it has been tough for me to separate the side that is developing my case from the emotional side. To make the best case, you often have to endure things your emotional side loathes, like waiting to develop evidence before confronting.


Me: BH, 43
Her: WW, 41
Kids: 2 (9 and 6)
D-Day: 11/21/09. WW tried to bust up another marriage, but got dumped. OM/St. MF apparently wasn't so saintly after all.
Drafted S papers in 1/10. Filed in 1/12. Court date set for 1/13.

Posts: 79 | Registered: Jan 2010 | From: Northern VA
lostcause111
♂ Member
Member # 19109
Default  Posted: 3:25 PM, June 23rd (Wednesday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

1) STop walking on eggshells. You should not feel bad even one bit about your timeline markup. She should be mad at herself that you even have said timeline.

This cartoon comes to mind when I read what you wrote:

http://www.thedoghousediaries.com/?p=1764

I am intent on NEVER being that last frame of that cartoon again as I was that guy for way too long.


Posts: 934 | Registered: Apr 2008
Mighty
♂ Member
Member # 26909
Default  Posted: 7:51 PM, June 23rd (Wednesday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

lol awakening.. been slow to respond since I was giving depositions today (expert). I have a tendancy to apply standard of care for married women to my WW.. (reasonable and prudent... not!)

Lostcause.. You are right in that I'm not quite saying sorry, but implying it and fearing it about that markup. I really shouldn't care... still working on me. But, I did stop myself from making excuses to invalidate what I wrote.

Some good news though. She has her first IC on Saturday. I'm hoping it will continue.


BS (me) 44 WS (her)43
Married 17yrs, Together 20 yrs
Three children (9-13)
D-Day #1 - 4/11/09 (me).. DD's stopped, she quit talking. Body count: 6 OM, 1 OW. (2 EA's, 1 LTPA, 1 PA, 3 "kisses").

Posts: 629 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Denver
lostcause111
♂ Member
Member # 19109
Default  Posted: 7:19 AM, June 24th (Thursday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Good luck on the IC.

My fear has always been that my W affair revealed who she really was and I would be a fool to think otherwise.

At some levels my wife is agood person. Takes good care of kids and me logistically and can be pleasant.

Another part of her is a very bad person. Thinks only of herself, can lie as easy as telling the truth, hold in her feelings and uses them as weapons to drive poor decisions.

She is the same person that cheated on me sans current cheating (that I know of).

The real hope for me has always been her in IC. She has very poor self esteem and their is nothing I can say or do to fix that.

My wife went to 4 IC appointments and I noticed every single time she went she changed. Sometimes just for a day or two sometimes for two weeks.

Then she stopped going and all progress was lost.

Their is a fundamental part of my wife defined by her LTA and her present actions that scream this is who she is.

I do not like who she is at all and any partner unless a fool would feel the same.

My point is I sincerly hope your wife stays in IC. It is likely the only way she will get the head out of her ass.

I wish you luck and strength because R is VERY hard because if she is like my wife she is such a mess over her own issues she has been unable to give you the support you need to be in a really solid R.


Posts: 934 | Registered: Apr 2008
awakening1
♂ Member
Member # 27360
Default  Posted: 3:16 PM, June 24th (Thursday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My WW is in IC too. Haven't seen much in the way of immediate results from her, but she is saying she is trying to figure herself out now instead of blaming her unhappiness on the marriage, and she says she is trying to decide whether to be married or not now, instead of between me and St. MF. I hear less in the way of the immature entitled talk from her than I used to hear. Still, we are unlikely to spend any time together of note for the next month, so no progress in improved communication is expected either.

I share the concern that I have now seen the real person within my wife. It was the one I had feared was there before, but chose to ignore. Or hope I could change. It's one thing to see the warts clearly and accept them. It's another thing entirely to have been hurt so badly by them, and to expose yourself to the potential for further harm should be reconcile.


Me: BH, 43
Her: WW, 41
Kids: 2 (9 and 6)
D-Day: 11/21/09. WW tried to bust up another marriage, but got dumped. OM/St. MF apparently wasn't so saintly after all.
Drafted S papers in 1/10. Filed in 1/12. Court date set for 1/13.

Posts: 79 | Registered: Jan 2010 | From: Northern VA
lostcause111
♂ Member
Member # 19109
Default  Posted: 10:24 AM, June 25th (Friday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

In a way awakening I do not like how your wife is framing IC to me.

It is NOT about the M or staying together.

She was is a immoral person capable of great lies and deceit.

That is what IC should be really about. Addressing the flaws within yourself. The good or bad effects they can have on a marriage is nt the point at all.

When somebody really confronts themselves that is where progress begins.

IMHO I would let go and not even talk about anything unless she brings it up and spend more tie with friends until she earns more of your time.

She has you in holding saying I am deciding to stay married or not.

That is a HORRIBLE thing to say if you are trying to repair the marriage at all.

She know right now you are not going anywhere and she has total control.

This NEVER works. My wife responds much better when I am in control in all situations.

As you cannot control her control yourself and value yourself more.

If you are continuing giving to her when she says statement like that you are betraying yourself and what you know is right. It is wrong to invest in somebody who only thinks of you as an option.


Posts: 934 | Registered: Apr 2008
awakening1
♂ Member
Member # 27360
Default  Posted: 2:32 PM, June 25th (Friday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Lost cause,

Good points. She knows she needs to work on herself. For her to pull herself out of this, she needs to show strength I have yet to see from her. I am only responding to her calls, not seeking her out, and only corresponding about kid matters and nothing else through this limbo period.


Me: BH, 43
Her: WW, 41
Kids: 2 (9 and 6)
D-Day: 11/21/09. WW tried to bust up another marriage, but got dumped. OM/St. MF apparently wasn't so saintly after all.
Drafted S papers in 1/10. Filed in 1/12. Court date set for 1/13.

Posts: 79 | Registered: Jan 2010 | From: Northern VA
SadStorey
♂ New Member
Member # 26701
Default  Posted: 1:16 PM, June 26th (Saturday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hey guys,

I posted this in NB too, but was wondering how often this happens and if so soon...

xWW is getting married in July (almost a year to the date of our wedding )


Honestly when I found out I laughed. I'm actually ok with it. I'm just so happy I got out before kids, invested years, financial tie ups, etc.

I can only imagine what her life will be like now. He has no education, is a drug dealer, already has another child (or 2), her family hates him, and no job.


Me-BS 28
Her-WS 24
Dated 3 years, then engaged a year.
Married 7/18/09
Dday(my bday also) 8/27/09
Divorced 12/14/09
Began affair prior too and during the marriage.
No kids...just my Doghter

Posts: 26 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Michigan
SerJR
♂ Member
Member # 14993
Default  Posted: 10:38 AM, June 27th (Sunday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I can only imagine what her life will be like now. He has no education, is a drug dealer, already has another child (or 2), her family hates him, and no job.

Oh, don't worry... getting married will fix everything

It's a pretty common theme here - WS's will often tend to get involved with... well... to be blunt, trash. The reasoning has to due with a WS's lack of solid self esteem. When they have difficulty dealing with reality and are unable to cope as a healthy individual would, attractions are formed with those worse off than them - as a way to temporarily relieve their feelings of insecurity (by being able to feel superior). It's all about creating a fantasy about yourself and falling in love with that.

Of course, reality has the nasty habit of creeping in anyway and souring the fauxmance. Naturally, it would be too difficult to acknowledge her fault in this, so the "happiness" is often forced through marriage, luxury expenses, etc. Of course, it doesn't really help longterm and the cycle eventually becomes self fueling. Some can take the necessary steps to self improvement to escape the cycle. Others are unwilling.

But what really matters is the choices that you make towards building your future.


Me: BH - Happily remarried.
Hope is never lost. It exists within you - it is real. It is not a force in and of itself - it is something that you create with every thought, action, and choice you make. It is a gift that you create for yourself.

Posts: 17093 | Registered: Jun 2007 | From: Further North than South
SadStorey
♂ New Member
Member # 26701
Default  Posted: 9:19 PM, June 27th (Sunday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

SerJr.....
I agree completely. I just know that she will never acknowledge the destruction she caused, why she did it, what she needs to "fix", lack of selfconfidence, etc.

She will go on the rest of her life being OK with her actions and choices. She will never connect the dots as to the "problems" she experience in her life. It's always someone/something elses fault.

AAAGGGGHHHHHH I just get so fucking pissed at that. It's not the lost of her/marriage/potential life, it's simple the fact that she will never "get hit by the karma bus" because she is to broken to put it all together.

Of course, reality has the nasty habit of creeping in anyway and souring the fauxmance. Naturally, it would be too difficult to acknowledge her fault in this, so the "happiness" is often forced through marriage, luxury expenses, etc. Of course, it doesn't really help longterm and the cycle eventually becomes self fueling. Some can take the necessary steps to self improvement to escape the cycle. Others are unwilling.

TRUTH


Me-BS 28
Her-WS 24
Dated 3 years, then engaged a year.
Married 7/18/09
Dday(my bday also) 8/27/09
Divorced 12/14/09
Began affair prior too and during the marriage.
No kids...just my Doghter

Posts: 26 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Michigan
SourCherryDrops
♂ Member
Member # 25883
Default  Posted: 3:57 AM, June 28th (Monday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

What has me worried, or perhapes i think i am starting to realise is that MY relationship with my STBXW was also a fauxromance.

The whole time i had my rose coloured googles on, and i had her up there on the pedistal. but i look back over our history, and i cannot help but wonder about all the things that we did, driven by what she wanted....

Was i the one she saw as insuperior? Realistically when we meet i was a bum, no job, no money....


Me BS 37, Her STBX 34, 1*ONS, 1*EA 1*PA/EA, 2*PA
Heading for D after 9 mths of R

Posts: 1468 | Registered: Oct 2009 | From: Europe
lostcause111
♂ Member
Member # 19109
Default  Posted: 3:19 PM, June 28th (Monday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

1) Borderline types like my wife have very low self esteem

2) When affair is broke my wife felt worse self esteem wise

3) In a way a jerk type persons who the OM was who used her (oh she did allow this BTW no transferring that) actually confirms how they feel about themselves.

At times I feel being nice makes it WORSE. She does not feel worthy of good care because she herself believes she is a &*&^%*()_).

I can never change that and until she replaces the affair with something worthwhile like investing in marriage, getting IC, a good hobby, going back to college etc things will never change.

It is sab but I am with a very deep down broken woman who hides behind the masks of fear an anger and it has nothing to do with me.


Posts: 934 | Registered: Apr 2008
jasper
♂ Member
Member # 28168
Default  Posted: 9:20 PM, June 28th (Monday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Feeling weird and less angry lately. I hate WW for the infidelity and betrayal, but I'm starting to see our marriage as a relationship that just ran its course. We were in love, and I don't ever doubt that it was real, but we didn't have what it takes to ride out the challenges.

We both knew the challenges were there. I ignored them, and focused on all the awesome things we had: our DD, our friends, the great life we have in our community. She dwelled on he crappy stuff: the built-up resentment, the fact that we wanted different things, the fact that our sex life had (seriously) waned.

We both dealt with it by focusing on DD. I focused on the fun stuff, and spent time with her on the weekends, with friends at the pool, park, zoo, sledding hill. WW focused on keeping DD in clothes, doing arts & crafts, making sure she was clean. Neither of us focused on food. Poor DD has been eating in restaurants since she was 3 months old.

We both ignored the fact that we have been totally ignoring each other.

I continued to ignore, but WW chose to go outside our marriage. I see what happened very clearly, but I know that I never considered going outside of the M. We both had a responsibility to address the problems we were having, but neither of us did it.

It sucks, and it hurts. But it also feels like an opportunity. And that feels a little wrong to me. I feel like I shouldn't be thinking this way. But I feel a little relieved. I feel like I have an opportunity to find a better match for me. A woman who wants the same things I want.

My relationship with WW worked when we didn't have kids because it was about the sex and the fun we had together, but it wasn't the kind of relationship that can support a family.

I don't know what that says about me, but I do know that I want something different from what I had. WW and I were a couple who had a child. But we were never really a family, despite the fact that we both love DD more than anything.

I want a family, and, as much as I hate what happened, I feel kind of positive about my future, and what might happen in years to come.

Am I wearing rose-colored glasses?


Posts: 696 | Registered: Apr 2010 | From: New York
trynhard
♂ Member
Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 9:54 PM, June 28th (Monday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Jasper...
Am I wearing rose-colored glasses?

No... I think you see it exactly the way it is. I think every M goes in stages... Romance, Disillusionment, Misery ending in the awakening. Your W is guilty of thinking love is to go back to the romance stage. Maybe she'll discover what a M is really about, but likely not... unless she goes to Marriage Encounters or something like that.

Jasper, after reading most of your post since your dday... I can tell you this. Your W is making a huge mistake. You are a good man. Good luck...

Peace to all here..

[This message edited by trynhard at 9:55 PM, June 28th (Monday)]


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