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User Topic: Npd Thread Part 8
jjct
♂ Member
Member # 17484
Default  Posted: 5:50 PM, June 23rd (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I learned never ever ever to tell them what you know.
I became pretty adept at practicing blank-faced incompehension.
It was to save me the time involved in drama and circuitous explanation, because of course, any "deep thing" or deep truth revealed would be examined like a bug under a microscope with; "How might this advantage me?"

and I'd find myself tangled in uncertainty once again.

Any goodness, insight, understanding, or revelation that you might share is fodder for their compulsion to make it "about them", to make themselves look good to the outside, to answer their sadly sick demands.

The thought that you are no more than a bug under a microscope, analyzed intently for ways to obtain supply is arresting...unbelievable to us.
We don't do that. We never really even thought of that. We were just sharing our hearts...

Problem is, this bug is alive, capable of changing, adapting. I'd prefer they didn't know that.

At one point she looked, and found I wasn't there...


Posts: 6032 | Registered: Dec 2007 | From: texas
bent44
♀ Member
Member # 31386
Default  Posted: 11:06 AM, June 24th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

whyohwhyohwhy

Thank you for your words of wisdom in your recent post- you nailed it!

PS- how's the car smelling these days?


"If you marry a chicken, don't expect an eagle."


I don't know if my chicken will ever become an eagle. But rest assured, I'm going to be a phoenix. Nevermind that I am still in the ashes stage of the process.


Posts: 626 | Registered: Mar 2011 | From: California
honesttoafault
♀ Member
Member # 27105
Default  Posted: 11:24 AM, June 24th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Whyohwhy, I want to second bent44's praise. Your post really hit home. I copied and pasted it in my journal to reread. It really helped.

Posts: 1903 | Registered: Jan 2010
toughgirl8
♀ Member
Member # 29812
Default  Posted: 3:47 PM, June 24th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Haven't checked in in a while. FWH began threatening to go to the bar on a Sat night if he didn't get his way a few months ago and it has escalated mostly because I won't bite on the "trying to get a rise out of me" bait.

I've been clear that I will not tolerate blatant bullying and he can go anywhere he wants, he's a big boy. I just endured a long week away on a business trip to Europe during which I received threat after threat: "I'm filing for D, I'm moving out, told my parents we're getting a D, if you miss the kids - get used to it since I'll have 50% custody, I'm not going to family wedding this summer so come up with a good excuse for me, cancel with the MC- I'm not going anymore" and so on and so on...

But I didn't bite. Can I tell you it's driving him CRAZY!!! He has no control anymore and he's losing his mind. I don't care anymore. And the A is just the icing on the cake I can't swallow. The rest of it is made up of selfish act after selfish act. 13 years of them. And now I'm emotionally done and he has no leverage and therfore, no leg to stand on.

He is amazingly angry and grasping at straws. (ie backed into a corner- like many of you describe and lashing out 1 minute and the next trying to get a hug or more - is he nuts??? Yes.) I can't take this emotionally bullying man seriously anymore. No more trust, no more respect and it's getting worse. Always been about him, always will be. I wish we could R. But I have no more hope.

He wasn't officially diagnosed as NPD, but seems to me he fits the bill. I'm very sad, but thinking this is it, time to call it and call my lawyer. I'm scared.


Me-37
WH-41
M-12 yrs
D Day-3/2010
4 kiddoes
Some may say I have a short temper, I say I have a swift and assertive reaction to bull sh't. ;)

Posts: 327 | Registered: Oct 2010
bent44
♀ Member
Member # 31386
Default  Posted: 10:49 AM, June 25th (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

ie backed into a corner- like many of you describe and lashing out 1 minute and the next trying to get a hug or more - is he nuts??? Yes.

Argh...this exactly.

I have been away for awhile, and just feel the need to vent this morning.

Daughter and I were on vacation for 18 days, and I forgot how difficult it is to deal with these folks! WS and I are divorced, but he still sees our daughter during supervised visits (I supervise). So, here's the latest:

- He is "offended" that I sent an e-mail about the drug tests he will need to do to see her. During the last visit, he said he did not have the money for it, so I replied that he could let me know when he had the money so visits could resume. Did he seriously think he could just skip it? I told him I was "offended" he chose to be high on meth around our 4 year old daughter. He has since come up with the money.

- It is "unacceptable" to him that I have not invited him to her birthday party. Well, the party is at my house (where he is not allowed) and I am paying for it. Who the hell does he think he is to invite himself?

I told him all of this was the result of his choices, and his response was...get this..."No, it is the result of the choices you are making". Silly me.

Argh, you guys. I will have to deal with this man for the rest of my life and it is such an energy drain. The constant armour I have to put on, the flipping rules of engagement, the fallout of their BS...don't you get tired?

I know self care and having as little contact as possible is the way to go, but this is a marathon and I don't even feel trained for a sprint.

Any advice or 2*4's greatly appreciated. How do you find the energy to deal with these people?



"If you marry a chicken, don't expect an eagle."


I don't know if my chicken will ever become an eagle. But rest assured, I'm going to be a phoenix. Nevermind that I am still in the ashes stage of the process.


Posts: 626 | Registered: Mar 2011 | From: California
suckstobeme
♀ Member
Member # 30853
Default  Posted: 3:37 PM, June 26th (Sunday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I love that this thread is here for a resource. It's my first post here and the whole idea of my stbxh being a narcissist is still very confusing for me.

My IC met with him once and pegged him as a narcissist right out of the gate. She said he's not the obvious narcissist, i.e., a doctor or pilot who is just clearly in love with himself, but he's a much more subtle narcissist. A "do gooder" narcissist is what she called him. She said that everyone must always say what a nice, laid back guy he is. That's the one thing that everyone always said about him, me included. But, the way this whole thing went down is so far from nice it's ridiculous.

My IC believes that he was not always this way to the outside world, but that it was bubbling under the surface and something triggered the narcissist to come out. He's had a lot of issues over the last couple of years - things that would go hand in hand with a major MLC - death of a parent, his age (45), dissatisfaction with job, more stress at home with two small kids, etc. Before he moved out, he masked his issues and ramped up a lot of drinking and, as it turns out, spending. I had no idea until I filed for D that he has about $28,000 in credit card debt now, on top of his $70,000 in school loans.

He's a mess, but he tries to come off as perfect. He turned his back on me and the kids like no one I've ever seen. His words to mutual friends were that "it just wasn't working out." It's actually more like the stuff of legends how he just seems to have forgotten about the 16 years that we had together. It's as if he just wants me and, to some extent, the kids to disappear. He never really stood up and said why he wanted to leave. He just came up with bullshit excuses and, to this day, has never told me how/when it started with OW.

This is all very confusing for me. The one thing that I asked my IC is whether she thought he really wanted to leave. I practically had to throw him out even after he said he wanted to go. He didn't take any real fast steps to get out.

My IC says that most don't want to leave. In my case, I was obviously starting to really believe that there was someone else and I think he knew it was a matter of time before his charade blew up. I also started to question why there wasn't more money in the one account. He did all the bills for years; I trusted him blindly and never had reason before to question. I was questioning everything during those awful months.

Does he sound like a classic narcissist and does this sound like the mark of a person who just wanted to run because he couldn't handle the world as he knew it to blow up? In other words, does the narcissist want to maintain control of how it goes and was his decision to leave the only way for him to do that???

Any insight from you all would be so helpful.


BW - me
ExWH - "that one"
D - 2011
You get what you put in, and people get what they deserve.
Hard as it may be, try to never give the OP any of your power or head space.

Posts: 2508 | Registered: Jan 2011
Chrysalis123
♀ Member
Member # 27148
Default  Posted: 9:44 AM, June 27th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I am posting this here and on the NPD thread.

I have read that children of divorce do better if the parents can co-parent effectively.

Well, I am divorced from a NPD FT. Nothing is easy with him as he lies, distorts, stomps on boundaries, abandons his kids for his current GF, blames his children or me for their problems with him etc. etc.

I have a huge issue with how he is harming my kids. It breaks my heart that I chose this person to be the father of my kids. They do not deserve the consequence of my horrible decision. I can be triggered easily into feeling intense anger at him when he harms the kids. (perhaps this is what he wants to happen and why he repeatedly emotionally harms the kids??)

I try to keep NC, but at times have to speak..but it never turns out well. The therapist says I need to get to a point where I can co-parent amicably with him.

He isn't amicable and I end up getting stomped to pieces, taken advantage of, disrespected etc. etc.

How do I make this situation the best for my kids? Do I need to speak with him in front of the kids, sit with him etc? When he pulls some emotionally abusive stunt do I talk about it? I just don't know what to do.

I am worn out...divorced 3 years, daughters 14 and 16.

Yes, Bent44 how do we find the energy for this marathon and keep our own joy?


Donít get to the end of your life and find that you lived only the length of it; live the width of it as well.†

Posts: 2379 | Registered: Jan 2010
suckstobeme
♀ Member
Member # 30853
Default  Posted: 10:03 AM, June 27th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Sarcastically, that was really helpful of the therapist to put everything on you and say that you need to get to the point of being able to co-parent effectively. Geez. How about some concrete suggestions for you?

I would ask if there is another therapist who specializes in co-parenting issues and see if there is a way that you both can see him/her to discuss how to go about parenting the kids. Or, ask the therapist about parallel parenting - I don't know much about it, but I know that it involves less communication between the parents and is still an option that is better than fighting.

I'm sorry I don't have any other suggestions. I HATE the fact that these idiots ignore the kids and have such a sense of entitlement when it comes to them at the same time.

Since he's being so difficult, I would try to look for some outside resources to help. Now is the time that he needs to step up and help - you have two teenage kids and that's not easy by any stretch of the imagination.


BW - me
ExWH - "that one"
D - 2011
You get what you put in, and people get what they deserve.
Hard as it may be, try to never give the OP any of your power or head space.

Posts: 2508 | Registered: Jan 2011
bent44
♀ Member
Member # 31386
Default  Posted: 10:12 AM, June 27th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Chrysalis123,

I could have written your post. It seems there is an NPD manual, our XWS seem so similiar.

I wish I had some advice for you, but I am in the same boat. Perhaps some of the wise folks here will chime in and offer the key to this disaster.

I have thought often of moving across the country to live with my family so I can get away from him, but this is just not plausible at the moment.

Sticking to the boundaries I have set, trying to stay in my head not my heart when dealing with him, and making decisions based on what is best for my 4 year old daughter seem to be the best I can do for now. I ask myself often if I am behaving as the woman I hope she one day becomes- that seems to get me on track.

The emotions that are triggered are unbelievable! I never knew I was capable of such intensity.

As to your therapist saying to co-parent amicably, how the heck do you do that? My counselor has reminded me that I don't co-parent as I have sole custody, but dealing with him sure feels like it!

One of the hardest things about all of this is that my silly little self keeps hoping he would "get it", and come to his senses. I keep forgetting what he is and expecting some reasonable interactions with him. Everytime he does something decent, I get thrown off track and then slammed when his reality returns.

And we are both raising daughter(s)...I never want her to end up in this situation. I have gotten my girl into counseling. Are yours going?

Single parenting with an NPD XWS is wearing me out. I really don't know where to turn.


"If you marry a chicken, don't expect an eagle."


I don't know if my chicken will ever become an eagle. But rest assured, I'm going to be a phoenix. Nevermind that I am still in the ashes stage of the process.


Posts: 626 | Registered: Mar 2011 | From: California
Chrysalis123
♀ Member
Member # 27148
Default  Posted: 10:57 AM, June 27th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

One of the hardest things about all of this is that my silly little self keeps hoping he would "get it", and come to his senses. I keep forgetting what he is and expecting some reasonable interactions with him
.

I do this too. I remind myself that any email or attempt at contact will not change him. He is what he is and that is my reality.

And we are both raising daughter(s)...I never want her to end up in this situation. I have gotten my girl into counseling. Are yours going?

When we separated the girls were 9 and 11. He was behaving horribly at that time and was physically abusive to the younger kid. The older has always been his golden child. Both kids were in therapy.

Now, the youngest is 14 and he put her in therapy because she threatened self harm...which scared him as it would make him look bad. The first positive step he has taken in 4 years.

The therapist recently invited me in for a session alone with her and was shocked when I filled her in on the background. Can you believe he made himself appear angelic???

My fear is the therapist does not know what she is dealing with yet and may think I am just the bitter wife and also that once she brings up any issue he will quit.

Anyway, the therapist told me my daughter is sharing a lot which is good.

My biggest fear is the girls will choose an abusive jerk as a husband to repeat the dad experience they now have.


Donít get to the end of your life and find that you lived only the length of it; live the width of it as well.†

Posts: 2379 | Registered: Jan 2010
whyohwhyohwhy
♀ Member
Member # 17890
Default  Posted: 7:54 PM, June 28th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

hi guys! I was away for a few days...took the kids to the beach before they are to embark on an 11 day visit with superdad.....we'll see how it goes. usually he brings them back midweek, which is ok with me.

kids tell me his car still smells, but apparently he discovered what was causing it and removed it..........

as far as co-parenting with a narcissist....it is impossible. at this point, I'm grateful he is so lazy and doesn't force the issue if the kids don't want to go.if anything comes up, I email him to cover my ass, and that's that.......

older daughter has asthma, which started to act up the last time she was with him. he told her she sounded terrible, and "tell your mother to get that fixed." he then told her asthma was just a conspiracy by big pharmaceutical companies to sell drugs to people who don't really need them...yikes! (there is an extensive history of severe asthma on my side of the family and it's nothing to f-around with, and we were in the doctor's office a few hours later getting some new meds/inhalers.)

older daughter is now going out of her way to piss him off. she requested purple hair dye and fake body piercings for her birthday just because she knows it will set him off. it's almost like a game of chicken at this point. when she's with me, she looks completely normal, typical kid outfits..pretty tomboyish, but girly. before she goes with him, she rads herself out......just because she knows it will piss him off.....


what did I ever do to deserve this?

Me:47 BS
Him: X, 51 PA SA NPD?
2 kids; DD14, DD8 divorced


Posts: 1030 | Registered: Jan 2008 | From: east coast
hopefulmom
♀ Member
Member # 23556
Default  Posted: 6:32 PM, June 29th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Now is the time that he needs to step up and help - you have two teenage kids and that's not easy by any stretch of the imagination.

Oh so true...but don't count on it.


me-44
WH-45
married 22 years
Dday 10/08
Divorced!

Posts: 257 | Registered: Apr 2009
MaleableReality
♀ Member
Member # 22451
Default  Posted: 2:57 PM, June 30th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Ok. It has been forever since I've been here. My divorce is final because my NPD finally calmed down and we were able to sit down and work out our agreement. Things have been VERY calm lately. That always sets me off and actually makes me feel like it must be the calm before the storm. But so far, good equilibrium.

However, there is one odd thing. I am getting texts from him, whenever he's got the kids, and ostensibly had a really nice time with them, wherein he tells me we have GREAT kids and is a little over the top in explaining why they are so great. And then, I get "and I thank you for that!"

Um. Ok. You're welcome? I just sort of acknowledge in a less over the top way that yes they are great kids. But it keeps happening. It is anything but the way he used to freak out on me all the time so it's not really a problem. It just feels very unsettling. I suppose I shouldn't question it.


Posts: 64 | Registered: Jan 2009
rainagain
♀ Member
Member # 14917
Default  Posted: 5:17 PM, June 30th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

This used to happen to me

However, there is one odd thing. I am getting texts from him, whenever he's got the kids, and ostensibly had a really nice time with them, wherein he tells me we have GREAT kids and is a little over the top in explaining why they are so great. And then, I get "and I thank you for that!"

But I was so angry and hurt when it was happening that I ignored it totally, no contact. Then I'd start to feel like maybe I was missing a chance to build a co-parenting relationship, well read back a few posts.

Then it would happen, texts and pics of fun things with kids, in response to polite factual kids/finance type emails. Except he wouldn't respond at all to the pertinent questions or issues.

Then these were in response to the "where's the child support" emails. Then, I got the parenting coordinator to tell him to knock it off (after he sent "happy" pics of kids out on a wedding event date with his girlfriend and they were miserable).

When I got the restraining order, he told the judge, "but she never answers emails or texts". As if this is a reason for becoming an animal.

Be careful.


Now, faith is being sure of what you hope for and certain of what you cannot see. Heb 11:1
I done been through the pain and the sorrow the struggle is nothing but love. Maino
Me: Divorced BS 49
DS22, DD19, DS17

Posts: 1277 | Registered: Jun 2007 | From: Massachusetts
ItsRocky
♀ Member
Member # 30327
Default  Posted: 9:46 AM, July 6th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

suckstobeme said:
My IC met with him once and pegged him as a narcissist right out of the gate. She said he's not the obvious narcissist, i.e., a doctor or pilot who is just clearly in love with himself

It got me to thinking - since my STBX is a pilot and the one MC session we had, she referred to him as being a narcissist in the first 15 minutes. Of course he didn't like that at all. And refused to go back.

Now I am in IC and she also believes he is NPD.

What have you all heard about pilots and NPD. I am really struggling trying to get my mind around what was going thru his head!

And now, very early in the process of a contested divorce where I am countersuing for adultry, he hasn't made a settlement offer. But as of last week he is demanding a jury trial - where he is likely to get killed! I thought my attorney was going to use the threat of jury trial to push progress in the settlement offer stage.

He just jumped right into it with both feet instead! Is this part of the NPD?


Thanks for all the support in my healing, outlived my usefulness on SI, time to move on.

Posts: 1460 | Registered: Dec 2010 | From: SouthEast
suckstobeme
♀ Member
Member # 30853
Default  Posted: 6:51 PM, July 6th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'm still trying to wrap my head around this too. Apparently, there is a whole spectrum of narcissists, some much worse than others.

Pilots and doctors are sort pegged as the classic narcissits only because they engage in occupations that you need to be intelligent, strong and confident to perform. People in these professions generally have very high opinions of themselves because of what they can accomplish in the professional world and others' perception of their abilities.

In terms of how a narcissist deals with himself, conflict and his entire world blowing up, that's a whole different story. My STBXH is completely non confrontational and conflict avoidant so he's not fighting me on much of anything in the D. He's more of the type where he cannot stand to have anyone, and I mean anyone, think he's a bad guy. He's all about what other people think of him. On some level, my NC kills him because it means that I've turned my back because I think he's a shit heel.

Your STBXH seems to be the much arrogant type of narcissist who never wants anyone to think he's weak or that he'll be beaten. He'll throw it right back in your face and make you out to be the bad guy. I suspect he will try to vilify you and will tell anyone who will listen lies upon lies about you, your M and how YOU caused him to cheat.

Again, I'm trying to wrap my head around this stuff too so don't take me for any type of authority on a narcissist. My STBXH, I think, is the more elusive type. Yours seems to be the more flagrant type.


BW - me
ExWH - "that one"
D - 2011
You get what you put in, and people get what they deserve.
Hard as it may be, try to never give the OP any of your power or head space.

Posts: 2508 | Registered: Jan 2011
ItsRocky
♀ Member
Member # 30327
Default  Posted: 7:07 AM, July 7th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Flagrant yeah that is probably the operative word here. But why did I not see it for 32 years, why did I put up with it, why did I let it tear me up and put me in a tiny box? That is why I have my weekly IC appt.

He told the MC in that one appointment that he hates confrontation and avoids it. She told him while that may be true it is because he doesn't want anyone to question him or his authority. In his mind there should be no confrontation because it should always be understood that his way is the right way - no questions asked!

I was dumbfounded - she nailed it in 30 minutes. I used to gently try to say to him: It is not insubordination for me to have a different opinion. He would look shocked, but it had no lasting, positive effects.

The older he got, the worse he was. And I just kept making excuses for him, extra stress this week etc. I have to figure out enough about him and those issues to fix me. So I can avoid repeating this garbage.



Thanks for all the support in my healing, outlived my usefulness on SI, time to move on.

Posts: 1460 | Registered: Dec 2010 | From: SouthEast
toughgirl8
♀ Member
Member # 29812
Default  Posted: 11:24 AM, July 11th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My FWH is in Sales. His appearance is everything to him. And his $$$. He has gone as far as pretending his teenager from previous relationship didn't exist and I was supposed to play along and make sure I didn't mention her while in his professional circles. This was years ago, before we had our own kids, and when i asked why (I was sooo pissed and hurt on StepD's behalf) he said he didn't want people to think differently of him, as in about how he got someone prego out of wedlock.

I've been trying to R but the more control he loses over our situation, the nastier he gets to me. A few months of 180 resulted in threats of D, going to the bar, stopping MC, anything he could think of to try to get me to be intimate with him. He doesn't get its had the opposite effect.

He's convincing me more and more he's a total NPD, Not the worst kind I'm sure, but he's on the scale. Beyond selfish and can't empathize at all, he can't get what he wants by manipulating me, so now he's nasty and threatening with anything he can get his hands on. I'm seeing D is my only option, even tho I've been fighting it in my own head. I asked for space, he wouldn't give it, truth, time, got none of it and now I'm finished compromising with someone incapable of meeting me halfway. He can't stand it.


Me-37
WH-41
M-12 yrs
D Day-3/2010
4 kiddoes
Some may say I have a short temper, I say I have a swift and assertive reaction to bull sh't. ;)

Posts: 327 | Registered: Oct 2010
fallenangel02
♀ Member
Member # 15044
Default  Posted: 9:58 AM, July 17th (Sunday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

can any one please recommend some books to read in dealing with npd...or leaving them

i know one book that was mentioned co dependant no more

any others that helped you moved on ..
thanks.


BS: 26 - me
WH: 31
Dday 1: dec. 27, 2006
dday 2:june 14th 2007

Posts: 268 | Registered: Jun 2007
fallenangel02
♀ Member
Member # 15044
Default  Posted: 9:58 AM, July 17th (Sunday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

can any one please recommend some books to read in dealing with npd...or leaving them

i know one book that was mentioned co dependant no more

any others that helped you moved on ..
thanks.


BS: 26 - me
WH: 31
Dday 1: dec. 27, 2006
dday 2:june 14th 2007

Posts: 268 | Registered: Jun 2007
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