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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: Npd Thread Part 8
Brentwood
♀ Member
Member # 27465
Default  Posted: 10:30 PM, July 31st (Sunday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi all. I'm recently new to this thread so excuse me if someone has mentioned this book before but "Malignant Self Love Narcissism Revisited" by Sam Vaknin has really helped give me much needed clarity. I recommend it.

Posts: 70 | Registered: Feb 2010 | From: New Mexico
caregiver9000
♀ Member
Member # 28622
Default  Posted: 10:39 PM, July 31st (Sunday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

welcome Brentwood. Thanks for the recommendation. All information is helpful in reinforcing boundaries and decisions.

Walking is good. Running too. But if you are prone to falling down or tripping on your own feet walking might be better....

Hi jj!! I hope the zebraduck isn't in your neck of the woods.

(((tribe)))

court for me in the am... sigh. AGAIN. mojo left over from last time, stored away and carrying me through. I will of course update after.


Me: 43, independent, happy, despite co-parenting with a lower muppet
FT "Stretch" (and Skew!) ;)
DS 12 DS 9
S 5/2010
D 12/2012

Posts: 5290 | Registered: May 2010 | From: a better place
Brentwood
♀ Member
Member # 27465
Default  Posted: 10:43 PM, July 31st (Sunday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

CG it's soooo funny you said that. I actually broke my foot....walking! It was so embarassing having to 'fess up to that.

Posts: 70 | Registered: Feb 2010 | From: New Mexico
woundedby2
♀ Member
Member # 18522
Default  Posted: 10:56 PM, July 31st (Sunday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Welcome, Brentwood. The thing about Vaknin is you have to take him with a grain of salt being as a he's NPD himself. But anything you read about the disorder helps to understand what you've been dealing with.

cg -- Sending mucho mojo for court tomorrow. Hopefully he'll put on some theatrics for the judge and show his true colors.


Me: BS
2 kids: DD15 and DS18
Him: The Assclown NPD
OW: "friend" of 15 years
Divorced! Feb. 2010

Everybody, soon or late, sits down to a banquet of consequences.
~Robert Louis Stevenson


Posts: 7625 | Registered: Mar 2008 | From: SoCal
fenrustf
♂ New Member
Member # 32683
Default  Posted: 12:23 PM, August 1st (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

So late to thread and all...

Question:

I think my WW may have NPD on at least some level. I of course can't be sure because I'm not a shrink. But reading through various resources she does seem to fit the mold on many levels. Maybe not to the most extremem level but its there.

I'm a bit confused though - it seems she may also be Histrionic and they appear similar in many respects. Self centered, ego centric look like commonalities between the two.

Any tips on differentiating between the two? Looks like lack of empathy is more obvious for NPD.

My goal in this is to decide if I should even attempt to R with my WW or if I should cut my losses earlier. I am definitely a codependant type so if she really does have NPD that would be about the worst combo i can think of.


BS: Me (33)
WS: Her (25)
1 kid - 3 1/2 year old boy
DDay - June 22 2011
DDay #2 - July 22 2011 (trippy huh?)
Married 2007
OP: 23, former "friend" and neighbor
Deciding whether to R or D

Posts: 46 | Registered: Jul 2011 | From: Denver, Colorado
neverbelieve
♀ Member
Member # 32711
Default  Posted: 8:12 AM, August 2nd (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Ugh. So last night I had to listen to a long winded speech about how I should have dealt with his EA so differently and that it's easy to do. All I had to do was look at the situation, decide if I wanted to stay or not, and do it. If I wanted to stay I should have just moved on, and if I didn't it would all be over. No problem.

You see, it's logic and rationalization. I'm weak and let my emotions play into it. He doesn't like the way my mind processes things and that I can't handle anything.

Yeah, that's right assface, it's been 7 months and I'm still upset and don't trust you. I didn't just decide I was going to accept it and move on. I'm pathetic. Nevermind that a relationship is formed out of emotions. They shouldn't come into play. Assface.

Jesus, move out already you stupid ass. I don't give a shit.

I really hate that I'm becoming like him. I watch him like he's the object. I say things because I want to see his reaction. It's like a game. Only I'm winning this time because I know just what to say and do to get to him. My new name for him, in my head, is simpleton. When he starts one of these boring lectures, and trust me, they're BORING because he won't shut up and he won't get to the point because he really thinks he has something to say, I just say to myself "Ok simpleton", "Of course, simpleton", "yes, you're right simpleton" yawn.

Oh, yesterday I was also told that I should never again question his ability to read people and determine how what they're doing is right or wrong. Really? Really, you cheating piece of shit? Funny, you couldn't determine I'd hate your guts for cheating. Never saw that coming, did you?

what's a zebraduck?


When the infrastructure of a building is gone the collapse is inevitable.

Posts: 934 | Registered: Jul 2011
toughgirl8
♀ Member
Member # 29812
Default  Posted: 11:52 AM, August 2nd (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

neverbelieve...I second that motion in general.

I'm 18 mos out from the A, dealt with at least 6 mos of lies and after that went into hard 180 and that sent my FWH into such ANGER. It was like he lost control over me and the M, things were on my terms and he couldn't stand it. He started threatening (on an emotional level), bullying, telling little lies to get a rise out of me, and the more I lacked in the response he wanted, the worse it got.

It was at this point I decided he is NPD, the evidence has always been there, I just always doubted myself and was so confused I just sat around hoping for change.

He finally has accepted that it wasn't working and has been in a "killing me with kindness" mode lately with being generous, telling me how much he loves me, wants me to wear my wedding ring again. But I've already been so manipulated that it means nothing. I don't know why I'm still here, for the kids I guess, but he doesn't get why I won't tell him I want to stay with him at this point. 3 weeks of nice is supposed to heal 2 yrs of shit or something. I was supposed to be over it as soon as he ended it, oh but did I mention MOW is coworker...they had to go away for a sales meeting together less than a year from DDay, still a coworker, so no NC.

I'm sure the A is over but each time I agree to try a little longer, he screws it up with another manipulative lie, or really bad selfish behavior. And he certainly can't deal with the consequences of that.

So I'm where you are at "I don't give a shit" and feel like I just have to D him already. I believe nothing... the nice, the mean, because it's all proven to be designed to manipulate me into doing what he wants. Games games and more games... from the person who betrayed ME.

And I am still here cause I'm human and I care and it would be nice if we could keep our fam together. I don't want to rock our kids' world...but I don't think I have a choice in the interest of self-preservation and I want my kids to have a happy Mom.

I really don't believe there's any coming back from this.


Me-37
WH-41
M-12 yrs
D Day-3/2010
4 kiddoes
Some may say I have a short temper, I say I have a swift and assertive reaction to bull sh't. ;)

Posts: 327 | Registered: Oct 2010
caregiver9000
♀ Member
Member # 28622
Default  Posted: 2:54 PM, August 2nd (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

fenrustf- to answer your question, how to tell the difference? Read the older posts here and see if there is a pattern. The lack of empathy is a huge part of it. The NPD is not wired the same as emotional people.

Selfish is a characteristic of any cheater. Thus, the choice to serve their needs without thought or regard for those who are hurt. But the lack of remorse after, the choice to continue to punish, the lies. And then when you look back at non cheating behaviors,
the poor gift giving, no thought for what someone else would like or want
the rage
the inappropriate laughing, always a beat behind or laughing at something not funny
the lack of genuine emotional response to everything
the manipulation
lying about everything
the belief that they can or could do anything better than everyone else... if they wanted to
charming
focus on status and symbols of status

Read here. Those who have been in the trenches share so much and the "got it" moment will come or it won't. You may be a "lucky" one who goes- UGH, that is awful, but I have no idea what that is like. My WS is bad but never done anything like that....

neverbelieve- One of the main prompts for me to leave and sever all ties (except kids) is that I knew I could not be a person I wanted to be in his presence. It would not be allowed. It was impossible. I didn't like who he was or who I was in response to him: either a victim or someone who attacked out of self defense and crazy making.

A zebraduck, see page 23 of this thread.


Me: 43, independent, happy, despite co-parenting with a lower muppet
FT "Stretch" (and Skew!) ;)
DS 12 DS 9
S 5/2010
D 12/2012

Posts: 5290 | Registered: May 2010 | From: a better place
neverbelieve
♀ Member
Member # 32711
Default  Posted: 3:16 PM, August 2nd (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

A zebraduck, see page 23 of this thread

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!! My H is a zebraduck then.

I need a zebraduck hunting license!


When the infrastructure of a building is gone the collapse is inevitable.

Posts: 934 | Registered: Jul 2011
neverbelieve
♀ Member
Member # 32711
Default  Posted: 3:19 PM, August 2nd (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

So, I'm new to the NPD thing. Anyone else have issues with their NPD H watching porn? Is this an NPD thing or is this another disorder on top of the NPD? He spends about an hour or so a day on the stuff on days where I'm at work. Not in one sitting - in two or three.

Seems excessive to me. I don't view porn as cheating so that isn't the issue. I'm just wondering if I'm dealing with something bigger. For the first 6 months after being caught cheating, he stopped. He started up again 2 weeks ago.

Thoughts?


When the infrastructure of a building is gone the collapse is inevitable.

Posts: 934 | Registered: Jul 2011
Brentwood
♀ Member
Member # 27465
Default  Posted: 3:49 PM, August 2nd (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Welcome Hurt. Sorry you're here witht he rest of us.

I know EXACTLY how you feel about the gaslighting, the lies, feeling crazy. Like you, my STBHX is mostly PA with a bit of NPD. The world revolves around him...always has, always will. That's why I have to get out.

Here's the sick, but funny thing. My H told me not to contact him at all this week. So I haven't. Been less that 48 hours. He's sent me 3 texts and now says he wants to come by today to give me a gift. I've ignored. And will NOT be here when he arrives. Leave my gift at the door A$$HOLE!

I know you're scared, confused, blaming yourself. It's what THEY did to us. They make us feel worthless and we believe them. After 3 years, I am finally starting to believe I am NOT worthless. You'll believe it too. But it takes time and lots of emotional setbacks.

It all sucks. Stay here and read. Don't be like me and take so much time before you let the positive words of these wise SIers sink in.

We're all in this together!


Posts: 70 | Registered: Feb 2010 | From: New Mexico
sadtoo
♀ Member
Member # 2027
Default  Posted: 3:52 PM, August 2nd (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi everyone!
Wow...some many newbies.

fallenangel02
Try not to engage with him. It's a no win situation. He will twist and turn everything around every time to make you the bad person. Stay NC as much as possible and don't engage with him. Don't allow yourself to be baited. When he says stupid shit like, why didn't you pick up the phone? (like that even riquires an answer) Ignore him. If he's talking to the child, instead of getting involved arm the child with ways to deal with his father. The more distance and silence you can create between you and your NPD the better off you will all be.

iwanttokillher
OMG. You have to get away from him. Write down in DETAIL (dates, times, places and events) all of these horrible things he has done. Then take the baby, go to the courthouse (yesterday) and file for a protection order against this MONSTER. Change and ADD dead bolts to your doors. Buy a big dog for the back yard. Tell all of your neighbors that he is NOT suppose to be anywhere near your home. Ask your local police department to watch your home. Install a security system with cameras. Change your telephone numbers. Have a friend move in with you until you get through this. File for DIVORCE. Do not ever contact him again. Have your attorney do the talking. I know you'r scared, but unless you get rid of him he will kill you. Big hugs from someone who has BTDT.

The bad gift giving
This goes along with their inablility to empathize. They cannot "put themselves in someone else's place" or feel for another person, so how can possibly choose an appropriate gift for anyone but themselves?
Selfish pigs.

neverbelieve
I like how they tell YOU how YOU should be thinking. Instead of trying to understand how you think....it's NO, you need to think like THIS!!
I used to get those lectures too. The ones that would go on and on and on and ON and never say anything. *sigh*

Don't miss that. Not one bit.

And the PORN?? OMG. Mine was addicted to porn and to masterbation. He would rather jack-off than have sex. I guess it was better for him to have sex with himself than with me. Sex with him was weird too. It was like I wasn't really there. He was just masterbating using my body as a sex aide. He was a freak.


It is what it is, not what we hope it can be.

When another woman takes your husband,
sometimes the best thing you can do for
yourself is to LET HER HAVE the worthless
bum.
OC born 2001
Divorced 2003
Remarried 2008 (New Guy)


Posts: 7926 | Registered: Aug 2003 | From: Iowa
neverbelieve
♀ Member
Member # 32711
Default  Posted: 4:00 PM, August 2nd (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Sadtoo, the lectures are unbearable! And God forbid I try to engage like it's a conversation! He just gets louder as if to say "how dare you interrupt ME when I'm speaking! I'm telling you how to live dammit! SHUT UP AND LET ME TALK!" I don't get an opinion, and if I try to give it, I hear "You see, that's where you're wrong. What I said was..." blah blah blah.

And I keep seeing everyone talking about how NPDs are terrible gift givers. I have to ask: what exactly is this gift thing you're referring to? I've never received one of those from mh H. One year on my Bday, he bought me a pair of leather pants. They weren't my style at all and they weren't my size but he gave them to me. But nothing else.

So, what's a gift?


When the infrastructure of a building is gone the collapse is inevitable.

Posts: 934 | Registered: Jul 2011
sadtoo
♀ Member
Member # 2027
Default  Posted: 4:07 PM, August 2nd (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

That's just it. Leather pants, not your style, and not your size. That would be considered a "bad" gift. He probably bought your leather pants for one of his porn queens.

Gifts that they obviously didn't put any thought into. If they even bothered in the first place.


It is what it is, not what we hope it can be.

When another woman takes your husband,
sometimes the best thing you can do for
yourself is to LET HER HAVE the worthless
bum.
OC born 2001
Divorced 2003
Remarried 2008 (New Guy)


Posts: 7926 | Registered: Aug 2003 | From: Iowa
caregiver9000
♀ Member
Member # 28622
Default  Posted: 4:12 PM, August 2nd (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

He probably used your reaction to the leather pants to justify never giving gifts again. How dare you not be grateful for his gift? Obviously he should not ever try to please you, and you are so awful and undeserving anyway...

Viola! No gift for you and it is all your fault!! Perfect example of NPD.


Me: 43, independent, happy, despite co-parenting with a lower muppet
FT "Stretch" (and Skew!) ;)
DS 12 DS 9
S 5/2010
D 12/2012

Posts: 5290 | Registered: May 2010 | From: a better place
neverbelieve
♀ Member
Member # 32711
Default  Posted: 4:25 PM, August 2nd (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

sadtoo, I was just joking. You know, like I have no idea what a gift is because the son of a bitch never buys me anything!!!

fucker!


When the infrastructure of a building is gone the collapse is inevitable.

Posts: 934 | Registered: Jul 2011
neverbelieve
♀ Member
Member # 32711
Default  Posted: 4:27 PM, August 2nd (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

He probably used your reaction to the leather pants to justify never giving gifts again. How dare you not be grateful for his gift? Obviously he should not ever try to please you, and you are so awful and undeserving anyway...
Viola! No gift for you and it is all your fault!! Perfect example of NPD.

Close. He used it to say he just never knows what to buy and besides, when I want something I just buy it myself.

This way, he isn't the bad guy, he just doesn't know what to get.

HOW ABOUT A FUCKING CARD??? IS A CARD THAT FUCKING DIFFICULT?

fuck him. This year on his birthday I'm buying him a mirror. It'll be the best gift he ever got.


When the infrastructure of a building is gone the collapse is inevitable.

Posts: 934 | Registered: Jul 2011
Frank2010
♂ Member
Member # 29438
Default  Posted: 9:07 PM, August 2nd (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

This year on his birthday I'm buying him a mirror. It'll be the best gift he ever got.

Fucking Brilliant......all All I can say is fucking brilliant!!!!!

Says more than any card or any other gift possible!!!!!


Me 56 BS
Her 59 WS NPD(She is Empty)
D-day#1 05-01-10
Dday#2 06-04-10 previous ONS 9-24-09 AFF hookups

Status: S & D'ing


Posts: 1195 | Registered: Aug 2010 | From: North Texas
Cogal
♀ Member
Member # 28314
Default  Posted: 9:28 PM, August 2nd (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I haven't been here in ages, you'd think that was a good thing but shit, it never ever ends with an NPD does it?! I know you guys have told me it gets better, and maybe that is true, but I'm struggling again.

This is mainly for those with or had young children when the shit hit the fan....
The kids are getting more affected by him as they age, they just turned 5 and are now starting to question and also believe things he says. My son in particular has major stress from the whole situation causing bladder issues:( Their dad refuses to buy them anything and when I can't supply these things he tells them it's my fault. For instance, he tells me he won't take them to soccer because he has a race they "want" to watch (sure), then when he decides at the last min to take them and they don't have shin guards it's because mommy forgot to give them to him! Or today he asks to "borrow" my sons baseball glove. I had already ignored the request for 2 days and finally decided to bite the bullet. My therapist said I NEED to start saying no and let him figure it out, even though then I feel bad for the kids, it will never end. So I tell him no, go buy one for his place. This starts a shit storm of how horrible I am, that he told our son I wouldn't let him borrow it so our son feels bad for his POS dad and tells his dad he'll just sneak into the house and get it. A fucking 5 year old!

Ugh. Then there's the drama with everyone in my life, especially my SO, because of the stress he causes. I do not know how SO deals with it, he has a heart of gold.

It's back to being so bad that I feel stuck, in a bad way, feeling helpless. I just don't get how someone can do this to me and the kids, there has to be something that can be done for us to live a healthier life away from him.


Me (bw): 30 something
exH NPD: 30 something
kids: preschool twins
d-day 4/09 (7 month EA/PA)
married 10 years
divorced and ready for 2011

It's not that I have trust issues, it's that you shouldn't trust some people!


Posts: 279 | Registered: Apr 2010
Frank2010
♂ Member
Member # 29438
Default  Posted: 9:41 PM, August 2nd (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Cogal,

Talk to attorney about parental alienation. He is not allowed to bash you....period!!!! Judge will be very harsh on him. Document and record as much of the exchange as possible. Attorney can give you specific instructions.

Make all contact email only. This will create a paper trail. I am sure there is more but your best bet is an attorney.


Me 56 BS
Her 59 WS NPD(She is Empty)
D-day#1 05-01-10
Dday#2 06-04-10 previous ONS 9-24-09 AFF hookups

Status: S & D'ing


Posts: 1195 | Registered: Aug 2010 | From: North Texas
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