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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: BS Questions for WS- Part 5
Hope24
♀ Member
Member # 9344
Default  Posted: 6:04 AM, May 8th (Sunday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

suckstobeme

So if the typical and illogical behavior, lies, blame shifting, gaslighting, etc., occurs because the WS usually has poor coping mechanisms and avoids confrontation, what is it that would make him/her turn it around. If this is how they've dealt with bad situations all their lives, what would make this situation different? I guess what I'm asking is what switch occurs in the mind to make them realize that they've screwed up, lost their family and hurt the BS beyond belief???? It's clearly nothing that we would ever say or do to turn things around - so how does the WS get there?

It's not a switch. These are long-ingrained coping mechanisms that take time to change.

I took a number of approaches.

1. Reading SI really helped me. I didn't post much in the beginning, but I read voraciously. The bravery of others was inspiring to me, as was the acceptance of the WS that is found in the Wayward Forum.

2. Reading infidelity books. Opened my eyes to the patterns that occur and I that I could relate to.

3. IC, IC, IC. HOnestly, I think this is a MUST for any wayward. If you cheat and don't get therapy, I believe the likelihood to repeat the behavior is very high.

4. Making amends. It was very important that the affair not define me and the only way to do that was for it not to be in vain. As a result, I give back on SI. It is tangible proof that I am a better person than I was then. It makes me feel good about myself. It was a huge part of my healing.

Hope that helps.


She packed up her potential and all she had learned and headed out to change a few things.

Posts: 7603 | Registered: Jan 2006 | From: Poolside
velveteer
♂ Member
Member # 30997
Default  Posted: 5:15 AM, May 9th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi - wanting to hear from any WS that struggled with withdrawal from the A/OP.

WW has wavered in and out for almost four months - breaking NC all the time (although i did not always know, or at least have proof).

I took things up a level and starting the whole process of legal S - this had a huge impact and her whole demeanor changed - she has now ditched OM, gone NC and wants to work on the M - wants to go to MC and has offered up full transparency.

BUT - she is now in withdrawal and I know she will struggle. What helped if this was your situation? (I have read the threads here e.g.g Maia's but am looking for something else maybe?) What is my role - supportive yes, but I cannot be the shoulder to cry on for OM. But should I be working to make the M a good place - be nice, kind and supportive in more general terms?

I am tempted to introduce her to SI, but need to do so when she is ready and am nervous about losing MY safe place.

Any thoughts very very appreciated.

V


Divorced

Posts: 854 | Registered: Jan 2011
roccodom
♀ Member
Member # 19714
Default  Posted: 10:13 AM, May 9th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My FWH works in the medical field with a lot of women. Talk tends to get inappropriate in that particular work place (surgery). I have this confirmed from another friend who is Director of Surgery (says it is so in almost ALL of these settings in the various hospitals she has been in).

I have had this discussion with my FWH. AND thought he understood THE PROGRAM. Being that he should tell me about any inappropriate comments directed toward him. He knows to show me any inappropriate texts, e-mails, etc.

WELL... Here's the problem. And I will preface it with the fact that we are 2 1/2 years out. Although there was stumbling at first...once he went NC...we've have been doing fairly well at R with some dips but peaks too. And also that his A took place with a co-worker in the hospital. DDay he was required to change his job location (still works for same anesthesia group) which he did - now at surgery center and has NO contact with AP.

In December, we went to his work party. It quickly became uncomfortable as I realized how close he was to his co-workers. He had repeately said that he goes to work, comes home and that's it. Well, at the party...one of his female coworkers tells me that his nickname is "Wild Thing". I immediately became stressed and stiffened up the whole night feeling like my FWH was "protecting" me and not informing me of his real work setting. After a fight ensued after the party as i asked him what it was really like....I asked him if anyone had hit on him at work...He said "Yes, XYZ had said that if he wasn't married, he would be the kind of guy she would date." WEll, I had already expressed concern about XYZ'a excessive posting on his facebook page. He claims to not have given her comment a thought and that's why he didn't tell me.

I think he didn't tell me cause I had already expressed concern at XYZ being too familiar. And I was right given the comment she made.

Well....last Thursday....after probably months of not checking his phone. I decided to check it before I went to bed. There was a text from a number I didn not know that said..."Maria has 200 0nes again and XYZ is stealing glasses"

His response "Sounds like fun"

She responded back "Maria can't find the money. Drunk...Sitting at home in bed."

I went to bed. But was hugely anxious.

The next day... I look at his phone and see that he changed the number to a name (a woman he works with - we'll call her Jane) and deleted the last text.

I asked him who the woman was. He said that it was someone he worked with. I asked him why he deleted the text. He said because it was inappropriate and admitted that he did not want me to see it.

He stated that he was pissed that this person had gotten his number as he had not given it to her.

When we discussed it later that day. He got angry saying that all he does is come to work and go home. And said he was defensive because I was accusing him of something he wasn't doing. Finally he said. I am not mad at you. I have a hard time showing any other feeling than anger (i know this about him) and that really he is frustrated that he received this texts which put him in this situation. Of course I pointed out that it wasn't receiving the texts...it was deleting them and not sharing them with me that caused me alarm.

After this...I looked at his facebook where he received a private message a week ago from XYZ that said...."We're having fun. Drunk already. Wish you were here...XYZ and Jane"

Then I saw a comment posted on an old photo from XYZ "Grrr baby!" Since it was an old photo that had been posted a long time ago, but a new comment...I knew she had been trolling through his photos.

His comment...."I can't control her looking at my photos".

Help me out here. When I try to discuss this with him I tell him that he is not understanding me. There is a lot of anger and what i call "shock and awe" which is everything to not focus on what I am saying. Why he feel the need to hide these things from me makes me think he does not GET IT in regards to how these A's start. He doesn't GET IT that showing me diffuses the situation. And his lack of willingess to tell me is more alarming the the things themselves.

Please give me a comment that I can give him to GET IT.

Thank you in advance for your help.


BS - me (45) WS - him (45)
married 16 yrs (DS 11yrs, DD 9yrs)
#1 PA - DDay 12/97
#2 PA DDay 5/08
#3 PA DDay 2/12
Trying R
Buddhism teaches that a craving for things outside ourselves causes an unhappy and pointless search for security.


Posts: 789 | Registered: May 2008 | From: MO
momtobdestroyed
♀ Member
Member # 32004
Default  Posted: 12:25 PM, May 9th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I just wanted to pick the brains of WS i do not have such emotional stuff with. I ask my WH q's but i feel like i cant really hear him right now, i am too hurt. He says he had the affairs to fill a hole in himself, something left there from childhood. He tried to fill it with drugs in early 20's, booze in teens and later 20's and then women. He says he never did it thinking he would leave me, loose me or not wanting me. He says it was like he split into two people, like these OW filled a void, he says it wasnt about the sex and calls the sex "essentailly assisted masturbation"- i so dont buy that. He says in his "asleep state" hje didnt feel joy, or saddness, just nothing. He says he has always loved me, always will and is now awake. He feels everything now and is in IC to work on issues.
If i was so great, why did he do this? if the sex wasnt so great with OW, why did he turn me down- he said honestly he was getting it elsewhere and was tired...ouch. He says he will do whatever it takes but if he didnt think i was terrible thinks i am beauitful, kind, good hearted etc, then how did he do this without a care about me. He says he just didnt ever put together the consequences and it was like he was trying to destroy himself. He says he is so sorry for all the pain but also thinks he would never have gotten to this point without having gotten caught. He was apparently cleaning his act up weeks before he got caught, but says he honestly thinks it would have started again without the help he is getting now to deal with left over childhood pain.
Did any other WS really not think any less of their BS while they did the A? Can it not have been about sex? Does he love me, could he have loved me and done this?


me BS 33yrs old, one 3.5yr old
him WS 33yrs old
affair of 4 years
married 5.5yrs
DD March19/2011

Posts: 304 | Registered: Apr 2011 | From: canada
mistakesweremade
♀ Member
Member # 31442
Default  Posted: 3:17 PM, May 9th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

momtobe:

I really didn't think anything less of my BS. What attracted me to my AP was an inner ugliness we shared. My A was very much about trying to fill a void inside myself and cope with feelings of self hate and shame from my childhood experiences. It had nothing to do with my BS, he is amazing. I put him up on a pedestal...I felt I couldn't possibly show him the darkness inside of me so I chose someone else to go slumming with. I didn't like my AP as a person he just had a lot of the same issues and that made me feel validated.


FWW-ME

Posts: 106 | Registered: Mar 2011
Feb 8, 2011
♂ Member
Member # 31137
Default  Posted: 9:54 AM, May 10th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Conditions for R

I can't ask this in General or JFO, because of the # of 2 x 4s I'll receive...

Transparency...

My WW (FWW for now) will not give me her passwords. She feels very strongly about it being an invasion of her privacy. Pre-A, we both knew each other's passwords, but admittedly never really bothered being on each other's emails unless we were asked to.

She left her email logged in yesterday, so I looked. NC with AP, but e-mails with a mutual friend about the AP, our relationship, effect on mutual friends etc. I read the email exchange..it had some pretty hurtful things on there about us.

She claims that it was just a snapshot in time (which I get - I have almost left the house three times - it's a wild rollercoaster ride, and what I say one day/hour/minute will not be necessarily how I feel later), and that it's "inadmissable" because I shouldn't have violated her privacy.

So, since this is supposed to be a question...

Are there an WSs out there that feel the same way as my WW, not because they are having/contemplating an A, but because they feel they should be able to have private conversations?

Am i wrong to feel that it is a dealbreaker?


D-Day see username
and maybe March 11, 11
ME: 45 yr old BH
Her: 40 yr old WW
3 kids
married 11 years
Who is this woman in my house?!

Posts: 717 | Registered: Feb 2011 | From: canada
TammyLynn70
♀ Member
Member # 28470
Default  Posted: 10:11 AM, May 10th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Feb 8, 2011

I thank you are perfectly justified to have this as a deal breaker. IMHO as a WS the only place where private conversations should be allowed is in IC. Your WW needs to build back trust and that doesn't happen by keeping secrets with friends in email about your M.


Posts: 166 | Registered: May 2010
MissesJai
♀ Member
Member # 24849
Default  Posted: 10:23 AM, May 10th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Are there an WSs out there that feel the same way as my WW, not because they are having/contemplating an A, but because they feel they should be able to have private conversations?
Okay, here's my take on this....my BH has all my passwords except the one to my SI journal. I gave them to him because I realize how critical transparency is to R and rebuilding trust. However, I also need to have private conversations, even if it's just dialogue with myself, in an effort to sort through my thoughts and feelings at any given moment without having to answer questions about what I was feeling, thinking, etc. at that time. No different than any other human being. I used to use the SI journal as my safe place. Since it was password protected I felt I could be open about my struggles with my addiction, and with everything else. Well, my BH broke into my journal, read the entries, and then interrogated me. I lost my safe place. He violated my privacy. I was angry and hurt. Now, I only have IC as my safe place. I no longer have a journal, on SI or anywhere else. It's a really touchy subject and everyone's going to have their perspective...this is JMHO (just my humble opinion)...
Am i wrong to feel that it is a dealbreaker?
Only you can answer this. You are in control of your deal breakers and if complete and total transparency is a requirement for you and anything less, like those convos, are a deal breaker, then that's what it is. I for one will not fault you for whatever choice you make. Even if you don't stick to your guns, that's fine too. Only you know what's going to work for you and your situation...


FWW - 40
Nobody can make you feel inferior without your consent...

Posts: 5520 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: So Cal.....
MissesJai
♀ Member
Member # 24849
Default  Posted: 10:32 AM, May 10th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

mom ~ first off, I am so sorry for your pain...
Did any other WS really not think any less of their BS while they did the A?
I didn't think less of my BH during my A. My A wasn't about him. It was about me and my broken self. Same as your WH. Clearly, he's immensely broken.
Can it not have been about sex?
It wasn't about the sex for me at all.
Does he love me, could he have loved me and done this?
I don't know your WH personally, but chances are yes, he does love you and yes, he can love you and still do this. Loving you often can't and won't fix someone who's that broken. He doesn't love himself and that's a problem.

[This message edited by MissesJai at 10:33 AM, May 10th (Tuesday)]


FWW - 40
Nobody can make you feel inferior without your consent...

Posts: 5520 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: So Cal.....
Feb 8, 2011
♂ Member
Member # 31137
Default  Posted: 11:22 AM, May 10th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I thank you are perfectly justified to have this as a deal breaker. IMHO as a WS the only place where private conversations should be allowed is in IC. Your WW needs to build back trust and that doesn't happen by keeping secrets with friends in email about your M.

Thanks TammyLynn...she used the IC example herself, which I of course agreed with..but then she also mentioned private conversations (no written record of course) with friends and family. It's not as black and white as some of my fellow BSs would say. We are both dealing with some big issues, and sometimes need someone else to confide in.

I wish were both totally open and transparent with each other...I am not sure if this is a dealbreaker..some people have very strong feelings about invasion of privacy...she did say that if I was suspicious of her having an affair in the future, I could ask and she would show me her e-mail/phone, but that would be an awkward confrontation.

Okay, here's my take on this....my BH has all my passwords except the one to my SI journal. I gave them to him because I realize how critical transparency is to R and rebuilding trust. However, I also need to have private conversations, even if it's just dialogue with myself, in an effort to sort through my thoughts and feelings at any given moment without having to answer questions about what I was feeling, thinking, etc. at that time. No different than any other human being. I used to use the SI journal as my safe place. Since it was password protected I felt I could be open about my struggles with my addiction, and with everything else. Well, my BH broke into my journal, read the entries, and then interrogated me. I lost my safe place. He violated my privacy. I was angry and hurt

I get that too, MissesJai. She is mad at me, because she was confiding in a friend, trying to work out how she really feels, and I violated that privacy. I am hesitant about telling her about SI because it has been my safe place.

I guess I'm wondering if there are WSs who have fought for their privacy for philosophical reasons, but were still committed to R...or am I grasping at straws here? It feels right now as though she is unlikely to have another A, but needs people to "talk to" in confidence in addition to me and her IC as part of the healing process.
I feel as though transparency should be offered by her (I know it's what I would do if I was the WS), but I don't want to (mixed metaphor alert) draw my line in the sand over a red herring.


D-Day see username
and maybe March 11, 11
ME: 45 yr old BH
Her: 40 yr old WW
3 kids
married 11 years
Who is this woman in my house?!

Posts: 717 | Registered: Feb 2011 | From: canada
atsenaotie
♂ Member
Member # 27650
Default  Posted: 11:36 AM, May 10th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I read a lot that it was not about the sex. FWW insists that too. If that is the case, then why all the sex?

She met with them on average once a month for 2 - 4 hours. Arranged a couple of complicated out of town meetings. Contracted herpes. Why is sex, and the PA so prevalent when so many insist that it was not about the sex?


LTA BS 53
FWW 60
M 1990, dday 10-5-09
Reconciled

Posts: 3964 | Registered: Feb 2010 | From: FL
MissesJai
♀ Member
Member # 24849
Default  Posted: 11:41 AM, May 10th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I am a WS who has fought for my privacy and am still committed to R. I don't think you're grasping at straws here. This is where communication is critical. The both of you have to come to an understanding & acceptance of each others position. I think my BH gets what he did was a violation to me and he regrets doing it. I don't know the logic or motivation behind those regrets. I could speculate on that all day. I too need people to talk to; however, I keep it to a minimum and do most of my soul searching in IC and during introspection.


FWW - 40
Nobody can make you feel inferior without your consent...

Posts: 5520 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: So Cal.....
Phoenix Rising
♂ Member
Member # 28696
Default  Posted: 12:40 PM, May 10th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Betrayedmomof3,

Your post was my post - how can a WS deny what is so blatantly obvious when you walk in on them naked together? WW initially says all they did was kiss - if so why the need to get naked. Later she says OM performed OS on her but she did not reciprocate. WW refuses to discuss it anymore at all but I was able to get confirmation from OM that yes they had drunk sex a year before DD and while they lived in different cities they did get together a few times. WW says OM is a liar but in the next breath says he wouldn't lie because he had feelings for her. Go figure! BaxtersBFF highlighted exactly what I have been through for going on 2.5 years - blameshifting, gas lighting, enormous trickle truth,etc. And for Mrs. Panda, Hope24 or anyone else, is there anything a BS can say or do to get the WS to snap of the fog that they have been in for so long? Are their any WS that engaged in this behavior for many years after DD and then finally one day "Got It" and tried to work on things. I have no clue what my WW thinks these days about the A because she did such of a good job of getting so angry everytime I brought things up or showed her how her stories never made any sense or matched what witnesses said they saw that I just talking about it and we quit going to MC. (And why is it that just when WS gets ready to open up that the MC says we are out of time and can revisit next week which never comes.) But it really is eating me up inside knowing that the person I love and care about simply loves themself more than their BS. Some days I hold out hope that enough time has gone by that she will not be so defensive and the guilt, shame and embarrassment of being caught are not as bad and she will be abe to engage in active remorse and not rugsweep any more but other days I have also resigned myself that I am dealing with NPD and it is never going to happen. Any WS wait for 2.5+ years before coming clean and then begin working on true remorse?

PR


Posts: 86 | Registered: Jun 2010 | From: North Carolina
LookingforLove
♀ Member
Member # 12002
Default  Posted: 12:56 PM, May 10th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I so need help processing this..

My story in a nutshell--
STBXWH having had LTA for 5+ yrs with co-worker..

After booking a cruise with OW on CC in March, I found out and threatened to dispute it--he hit me--and in defending myself fell and broke my leg.

Filed for D 3 weeks later with NC order April 6th--haven't heard from him since.
He hasn't even contacted my L to get his clothes.

OW who has had breast cancer 3 times discovered growth on her back but decided to get it looked at after cruise--2 days later it got so big she had to have emergency surgery to have it removed (1 week before cruise). Don't know if it's cancerous or not.

They are on said cruise now..

He has not responded to D (had 20 days) and he has not retained a lawyer to represent for NC hearing and temp orders--this is next week.

Fist ?--why would he not respond to D filing? He spent his money on cruise so I am not sure if he has money for a L but at this point don't know if he will even show up for temp order hearing.

Told his sister that he is upset with me. If he wanted the D so bad like he says--why not respond?
Why not fight to see his kids?(1 minor son is part of NC order)

Second ?--With what has happened with him hitting me, me filing and getting NC order and now OW medical emergency 1 week before cruise-- don't you think they would recognize the KARMA bus coming down the street? Choices equal consequences--

Sorry this is long but I just don't understand this way of thinking or why he hasn't woken up from his fantasy world...or it is really a fantasy?


Me: BS
Him: WS LTA 6+ yrs
OW: Skank Company HO
Status:
Divorce filed 4-5-11
WH served on 4-6-11 with D papers and NC order.
Divorced: 4/20/12

Posts: 1114 | Registered: Sep 2006 | From: Washington State
LOSTinaBook
♀ Member
Member # 30309
Default  Posted: 2:39 PM, May 10th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

atsenaotie:

I read a lot that it was not about the sex. FWW insists that too. If that is the case, then why all the sex?... Why is sex, and the PA so prevalent when so many insist that it was not about the sex?

I was thinking the same thing. If it's really not about sex at all, why have sex? In my mind I can understand why WH sought the OP. He once told me he "felt her pain" when I asked him what would go through his mind when he was with her.

Okay, I get that, but that seems to me a cognitive and emotional connection, hence the start of the EA.

So is it that the EA creates such a foggy mess that making the EA a PA makes sense?

I'm really trying to understand her; I hope my questions don't take an accusatory tone.


fBW-me, 26 (now 29)
xWH-he

Divorced.
S (H e) B E (L i e) V E (d).


Posts: 318 | Registered: Dec 2010 | From: East Coast
caspers1wish
♀ Member
Member # 28720
Default  Posted: 3:22 PM, May 10th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

To Feb 8, 2011

I wish were both totally open and transparent with each other...

Have you tried to lead by example? Be open and transparent with her. Show her what you need, tell her this is what transparency looks like. Maybe something will click for her if she knows transparency is going both ways. Just a suggestion.


Me - FWW (35)
Him - BH (34)
Kids - Ages 6, 8, 10
Married 13 years, together 18 years.
Last D-Day - November 2008

Posts: 700 | Registered: Jun 2010
caspers1wish
♀ Member
Member # 28720
Default  Posted: 3:40 PM, May 10th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

LOSTinaBook

If it's really not about sex at all, why have sex?

For myself, it wasn't about the sex, but as a woman, used sexually from an early age, having sex is the currency to gain anything else (non-sexual) in the relationship; affection, attention, protection, love, talking, spending time with me, etc. You can have none of those things unless you give yourself sexually. Unfortunately, that is the messed up message that some of us learn.


Me - FWW (35)
Him - BH (34)
Kids - Ages 6, 8, 10
Married 13 years, together 18 years.
Last D-Day - November 2008

Posts: 700 | Registered: Jun 2010
stilllovinghim
♀ Member
Member # 29971
Default  Posted: 8:58 PM, May 10th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

velveteer:
For many WS, going NC is like going cold turkey for an addict. Unless you are 100% committed, & willing to give everything you have from the bottom of your soul, it won't work.

A person addicted to cigarettes, alcohol, drugs, sex, other people, etc. must be committed. They cannot change until they are ready to change. They can see the hurt their family suffers, but they won't stop until they are truly ready, KWIM?

It sounds as though your W may have finally hit that spot. Sometimes hitting rock-bottom and realizing that your H or W is really ready to S or D is the wake-up call, for others it may not require as much, for others, it may require more.

Introduce your W to SI only when your ready. In the meantime, can you print out some things for her to read or maybe not tell her your user name till your more comfortable, she's made more changes, etc?

roccodom:
So because your H is playing with Kerosene and matches in a dry forest is different from #1 PA - DDay 12/97 lasted 5 months) in which he used gasoline and bbq lighter?
Or when he used an oil soaked cloth & a lighter for #2 PA - DDay 5/14/08 (lasted 3 weeks) Or what about when he got really creative with two sticks and some dry kindling and had #2nd DDay for PA (6/3/08) (really lasted 3 months and went on and on til 10/08)?????


“You have a choice. Live or die.Every breath is a choice. Every minute is a choice. Every time you don't throw yourself down the stairs, that's a choice. Every time you don't crash your car, you re-enlist.”
― Chuck Palahniuk, Survivor

Posts: 1933 | Registered: Oct 2010
SisterMilkshake
♀ Member
Member # 30024
Default  Posted: 8:39 AM, May 11th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Translation, WS, please.

MisterSister says sex with OW wasn't better, just different.

I am still confused. What was different? The receptacle? And, really how different can sex be?

Does different = better?


BW (me) 50ish FWH 50ish
Married 34 years, 3 children
d-day 3/10 LTA (4 yrs./fucking & flirting)

"Oh, why do my actions have consequences?" ~ Homer Simpson
"She knew my one weakness: That I'm weak!" ~ Homer Simpson


Posts: 8950 | Registered: Nov 2010 | From: The Great White North USA
jdt1973
♂ Member
Member # 31750
Default  Posted: 8:45 AM, May 11th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I had the same feelings. I think the thing that made it different was the fact that it was wrong. The illiciteness of it was creating such a high that it was making everything with the A, including sex, seem so much better. In reality, it was all the same, in fact with my W better, but I could not see it at the time. I know that when you are in the high, you are more willing to explore and do things you might not normally do, but how long can that really last or one day those new experiences will just be the same old thing too.


After all is said and done, just shut the hell up.
WH(me) 38
BS 38
Togethher 21 years, married 19
5 kids - 17,15,12,10,2
DD#1 4/2001 - EA/PA
DD#2 10/2009 - EA/PA
DD#3 1/4/2011 - EA/PA same AP as DD#2
R - trying hard

Posts: 175 | Registered: Apr 2011 | From: Texas
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