Cheating Hurt by Infidelity
Betrayal Wayward Donations lying
Welcome

Forums

Guidelines

Find a Local Counselor

The Healing Library

Media

Contact Us
lies
cover
In Association with Amazon.com
Support
Infidelity -
-
Find a Local Couselor
You are not logged in. Login here or register.
[Register]
Newest Member: SoCalBoy (43217)

I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: BS Questions for WS- Part 5
momoffive
♀ Member
Member # 27352
Default  Posted: 10:20 PM, August 17th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I asked this in the General forum, but would like other WS/FWS opinions please.

I wrote down 16 things that I need for me from SAWH. Things such as SAWH go to IC (I am also), SAWH continue with his SA group, no contact, transparency, apologies, compassion, sensitivity, respect, attempts at communication, etc... 16 may sound like alot, but the basics were broken down into several. I wasn't looking for all of them done immediately except the IC, no contact, but that the others (compassion, respect, etc...) be slowly worked on over time.

SAWH told me his IC (had 1st visit with new one) says that the list of my needs is emotionally abusing SAWH because my demanding these things is forcing/abusing SAWH.

I'm confused. Isn't most of them, especially the compassion, respect, etc... apart of a healthy relationship?

So my question is am I, as the BS, abusing SAWH by needing those things I mentioned?

Just a side note... there is hardly any communication, when I felt hopeless the other week, I told him that he can give it back (It was clearly evident that SAWH was incapable or unwilling to try, not sure which). He wouldn't give it back and then took it to this new IC.

[This message edited by momoffive at 5:35 AM, August 18th (Thursday)]


BW 44, SAWH 45(sorry1)
M24 yrs
DD 23,16,13 DS 21, 18
Dday1-7/3/09 EA OW4
Dday2-9/1/09 PA OW4
Dday3 3/14/10 Farmville sexting, OW3
Dday4 3/13/11 Secret texting, would be OW5-she said no
Dday5 8/2/11 PA 10 years ago OW1, kissing 4 years ago OW2

Posts: 1123 | Registered: Jan 2010 | From: Pennsylvania
neverbelieve
♀ Member
Member # 32711
Default  Posted: 7:56 AM, August 18th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hope24:

Sadly it was a cold, violent act in my personal R. It was not an enjoyable memory in the least.

Thank you for your answer, but why was it cold? Did you not care about your BS, or were you still having the A? Did you think less of your BS for even having sex with you at all?

I guess I'm still a little confused.

Thank you again.


When the infrastructure of a building is gone the collapse is inevitable.

Posts: 934 | Registered: Jul 2011
helpemegetoverit
♀ Member
Member # 30242
Default  Posted: 8:01 AM, August 18th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Neverbelieve:

What do WSs think of hysterical bonding, other than "Hey, I'm getting some!"? lol

Sadly it was a cold, violent act in my personal R. It was not an enjoyable memory in the least.

I felt exactly the same way. I equated it at the time to a dog peeing on something to claim it. I know not everyone feels this way, but most that I've talked intimately with admit that it's not the best form of sex to get.

Second DDay we didn't go through HB and I've been very grateful.

[This message edited by helpemegetoverit at 12:12 PM, August 18th (Thursday)]


Me: WW
Him: BH
Intuition is not a gift, but a skill based in self esteem.

Posts: 872 | Registered: Nov 2010
BaxtersBFF
♂ Member
Member # 26859
Default  Posted: 3:27 PM, August 18th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

momoffive,

The IC is wrong. Either that or he/she doesn't realize the whole story, only the side told by your WH.

Compassion, sensitivity, respect, communication are all something which should be a part of M. The lack of those things are part of what led all of us here to SI.

I would suggest that sorry1 stop asking IC what he needs to do, and tell IC what he wants to do then work on what he needs to do to get there. He seems to be happy being led around by others instead of doing any work on his own. I get the impression that he is waiting for you to decide to end things or accept them as they are. He hasn't committed to you again. At least that's what it seems like from your recent posts.


WH - 44
BW - gerrygirl

Posts: 6048 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise
momoffive
♀ Member
Member # 27352
Default  Posted: 5:04 PM, August 18th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thank you BaxtersBFF for your insight. The things Sorry1 says to me really makes me feel like I'm going crazy.


BW 44, SAWH 45(sorry1)
M24 yrs
DD 23,16,13 DS 21, 18
Dday1-7/3/09 EA OW4
Dday2-9/1/09 PA OW4
Dday3 3/14/10 Farmville sexting, OW3
Dday4 3/13/11 Secret texting, would be OW5-she said no
Dday5 8/2/11 PA 10 years ago OW1, kissing 4 years ago OW2

Posts: 1123 | Registered: Jan 2010 | From: Pennsylvania
Miss Saigon
♀ Member
Member # 31965
Default  Posted: 2:33 AM, August 19th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Do you want me to commit suicide?

That's what my WS asked me last night. What do you want me to do? why dont you believed any word I said (actually he never said so much but truly remorseful in his deeds) why cant you trust me again?
and I just said "nothing just let me go" ( will be back to school by feb next year, but its seems six months is too long to wait for me)
WS have two sister who committed suicide, and also this is nth time i heard it from him.
now i feel trapped, as WS do you really think about ending your life?
I have been in so much pain by his betrayal but it never entered my mind.


BS - me 43
WH - 39
2 kids - ages 7 & 4
together 10 yrs, married 7 yrs

rather than love, than money, than faith, than fame, than fairness... give me truth.
-H Thoreau


Posts: 73 | Registered: Apr 2011
Hope24
♀ Member
Member # 9344
Default  Posted: 6:36 AM, August 19th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Neverbelieve:

Thank you for your answer, but why was it cold? Did you not care about your BS, or were you still having the A? Did you think less of your BS for even having sex with you at all?

Quite the opposite. I broke off the A six months prior to d-day. I cared very much about my BH and threw myself into R.

For my BH, hysterical bonding was a way of marking his territory. His anger and emotions surfaced during sex which made it rough to the point of taking what was his. I hesitate to call it rape, but it was something very close to that line.

HB was a very sad, difficult time for me (and him, too, I suspect).

At the same time, I craved intimacy with him. I wanted to believe that sex would help us re-build what we had years before. That did not end up being the case for us.

Do I think less of him for this? I have processed it. I have forgiven him, as he has forgiven me. We are divorced now and have a very amicable relationship. Surprising, considering what occurred on both sides.

[This message edited by Hope24 at 6:37 AM, August 19th (Friday)]


She packed up her potential and all she had learned and headed out to change a few things.

Posts: 7603 | Registered: Jan 2006 | From: Poolside
Hope24
♀ Member
Member # 9344
Default  Posted: 6:39 AM, August 19th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Miss Saigon:

as WS do you really think about ending your life?

Yes, I was suicidal after d-day.

I thought I was a bad seed beyond redemption. I felt evil. The shame was unbearable.

However, it was an internal struggle. It wasn't something I threw in my BH's face as a manipulation tactic as I suspect your WH is doing.

Is he in IC? You should insist upon it. It literally saved my life.

[This message edited by Hope24 at 6:40 AM, August 19th (Friday)]


She packed up her potential and all she had learned and headed out to change a few things.

Posts: 7603 | Registered: Jan 2006 | From: Poolside
UnexpectedSong
♀ Member
Member # 21761
Default  Posted: 12:54 PM, August 19th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

MOF -

SAWH told me his IC (had 1st visit with new one) says that the list of my needs is emotionally abusing SAWH because my demanding these things is forcing/abusing SAWH.

No, you are not abusing him. That is ridiculous of the IC.

However, you are doing this entirely the wrong way. He should be writing a list of what he will do to heal himself and make you feel safe. Your doing so makes you the parent image. He should be making himself an equal, marriage partner.


WW(SA)
"Feedback is the breakfast of champions." - Boris Becker

Posts: 6046 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
UnexpectedSong
♀ Member
Member # 21761
Default  Posted: 1:01 PM, August 19th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Miss Saigon -

Wow, your WH has a ton of issues. I hope he is getting counseling to help him. Having two sisters commit suicide speaks to something in the FOO (family of origin) environment, which would likely have affected him, too.

Do you want me to commit suicide?

this is nth time i heard it from him

He is deflecting. If he brings it up, it stops you from questioning him. So, help him. If he threatens to commit suicide, call 911. With his family history, you have every reason to worry that he would carry it out.

I just said "nothing just let me go"

Now, this is you being disingenuous. If you want to go, go. He is not stopping you.

as WS do you really think about ending your life?

That's not the issue here. The issue is what do you do when he threatens and how do you move through that to get to honest communication. Either take him at his word and get him psychiatric help or tell him you don't believe him and he needs to talk to you. Or leave, if that is what you want to do.


WW(SA)
"Feedback is the breakfast of champions." - Boris Becker

Posts: 6046 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
UnexpectedSong
♀ Member
Member # 21761
Default  Posted: 1:06 PM, August 19th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

neverbelieve -

How is the possible loss so blocked from one's mind?

Compartmentalization. Everything is in little boxes inside the brain and they don't touch each other.


WW(SA)
"Feedback is the breakfast of champions." - Boris Becker

Posts: 6046 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
UnexpectedSong
♀ Member
Member # 21761
Default  Posted: 1:08 PM, August 19th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

LadyQ -

Is it common for a WS to NOT feel disgust for th AP when the affair is over?

I do not feel disgust for the AP. I do not feel anything for the AP.


WW(SA)
"Feedback is the breakfast of champions." - Boris Becker

Posts: 6046 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
painpaingoaway
♀ Member
Member # 27196
Default  Posted: 2:29 PM, August 19th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I, two, am very puzzled with the wayward's lack of disgust with the OP. When I finally realized H would probably never on his own say anything negative about the OP, I asked him to tell me something negative about her, something that disgusted or irritated him about her.

Nothing. He's got nothing. I can not tell you how hurtful that was to me. To think of how many times over the years he has found fault with me, yet he could not muster one negative comment about her?!?!? Hell, I would have been happy if he had made something up!

I just don't get it. How could there be NOTHING negative? Waywards help me out here! Is he just completely blocking?

I just can't tell you how important is is to me to hear him say something negative about her... Cuz right now, even though we are in R, if he says ANYTHING negative to me about me, I will throw that shit back in his face so fast I would make your head spin...and I know that is not right, but I can't help it...


Oh, let me add, he will say that the STD disgusted him....well, duh, do ya think? But that's all he's got!

[This message edited by painpaingoaway at 2:32 PM, August 19th (Friday)]


me BS female 55/him WS 58
Married 33 years
D-day July 09/he gave me his slut's STD
Watch my movie: "My wayward husband's adventures in STD land":
Episode 1: youtu.be/9Jv0-d_CdYc
Episode 2: http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8Tz822H82Gk

Posts: 6763 | Registered: Jan 2010 | From: Coastal South
UnexpectedSong
♀ Member
Member # 21761
Default  Posted: 4:57 PM, August 19th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

painpaingoaway -

Hell, I would have been happy if he had made something up!

Really? Or until you found out he lied again?

I just don't get it. How could there be NOTHING negative? Waywards help me out here! Is he just completely blocking?

Do you think that any Wayward who says he or she has nothing negative is blocking?

For me, it's kind of like a neighbor that you never talk to. I don't really care what goes on in his life, I am sure he has good points and bad points, I am sure if I talked to him that I would like some things and dislike other things... but why would I expend any energy in that direction? That person has no impact on my life.

The affair, yes. But the affair partner is just a speck of sand.


WW(SA)
"Feedback is the breakfast of champions." - Boris Becker

Posts: 6046 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
GroundZero
♀ Member
Member # 27853
Default  Posted: 5:12 PM, August 19th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Re: disgust for the OP

I also do not have disgust for the OP. I have disgust for my choices during the A and that got me to the point of the A, but I don't feel any disgust for him. Personally, for myself at least, I feel that massive feelings of disgust for the OP are evidence of blameshifting and an inability to own my shit. The things I see on SI when fWSs DO feel disgust all have to do with taking a little of the blame from them and placing it squarely on the OP. "He manipulated me." "She was a liar!" "She convinced me that it was okay and then threatened to tell so I had to keep doing it."

No. *I* made the choice to cheat. *I* betrayed the vows that *I* made. He was the mechanism by which I chose to destroy my life, but the operative words there are *I chose* - me. He had nothing to do with it.

The other reason I can think that your fWS would not find something even slightly irritating about the OP (because come on, even when I am in the throes of consuming love, I can find something irritating) is that the OP is a reflection of himself. If the OP is disgusting, he is disgusting in equal measure. If the OP has a flaw, the logical response might be "Why would you risk your marriage on someone who was rude to waitstaff, or smelled like BO all the time, or [pick your flaw]." I don't think that's healthy, but I don't think it's evidence that your fWS really thinks the OP is perfect in every way, just that your fWS is unwilling to look in the mirror and see how broken he is. JMHO


Out of clutter, find simplicity; out of discord, find harmony; in the middle of difficulty lies opportunity. Einstein

Posts: 1777 | Registered: Mar 2010 | From: Land of the Sweet Lovely Kiddos
helpemegetoverit
♀ Member
Member # 30242
Default  Posted: 6:06 PM, August 19th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Re: disgust for the OP

I also do not have disgust for the OP. I have disgust for my choices during the A and that got me to the point of the A, but I don't feel any disgust for him. Personally, for myself at least, I feel that massive feelings of disgust for the OP are evidence of blameshifting and an inability to own my shit. The things I see on SI when fWSs DO feel disgust all have to do with taking a little of the blame from them and placing it squarely on the OP. "He manipulated me." "She was a liar!" "She convinced me that it was okay and then threatened to tell so I had to keep doing it."

No. *I* made the choice to cheat. *I* betrayed the vows that *I* made. He was the mechanism by which I chose to destroy my life, but the operative words there are *I chose* - me. He had nothing to do with it.

The other reason I can think that your fWS would not find something even slightly irritating about the OP (because come on, even when I am in the throes of consuming love, I can find something irritating) is that the OP is a reflection of himself. If the OP is disgusting, he is disgusting in equal measure. If the OP has a flaw, the logical response might be "Why would you risk your marriage on someone who was rude to waitstaff, or smelled like BO all the time, or [pick your flaw]." I don't think that's healthy, but I don't think it's evidence that your fWS really thinks the OP is perfect in every way, just that your fWS is unwilling to look in the mirror and see how broken he is. JMHO

I could not ditto this more. It took me quite a while to get to this realization though. I think for a while it made me feel better to review the timeline and see the 'manipulation' and it made me feel better when my husband pointed it out (although he also could see from my timeline where I played that role). It made me feel better to think 'well, this was my first affair after 8 years of marriage and he's had more than one already and has only been married a few months'. But, you know what? First, spending any time thinking about it this way is just another way to rationalize the affair. Second, I think those that spend too much time (or any I guess) ripping the AP apart are both fooling themselves and completely blameshifting. I also agree that it can be scary just how alike the AP and the WS are in certain ways that the WS doesn't want to admit.

I too would not take it as a sign that your WS has ANY sort of feelings for the AP any longer, I would actually say that it is much more healthy. Some couples on here form a 'bond' over their disgust of the AP but I don't think it's the right way to rebuild a marriage.

[This message edited by helpemegetoverit at 8:06 AM, August 20th (Saturday)]


Me: WW
Him: BH
Intuition is not a gift, but a skill based in self esteem.

Posts: 872 | Registered: Nov 2010
painpaingoaway
♀ Member
Member # 27196
Default  Posted: 11:43 PM, August 19th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I appreciate your answers, but I still don't 'get it'. If the wayward spouse is 'disgusted' with the affair, and 'disgusted' with themselves for engaging in the behavior, how is it possible not to be at least equally disgusted with the OP? The OP was engaging in the exact same behavior?

My H keeps saying that HE was responsible, and he doesn't want to blame shift to the OP. Well, I appreciate his willingness to own his behavior, but NOT holding the OP accountable for their part in the mess reeks of 'protection' of the OP to me.

I find it very hurtful.


me BS female 55/him WS 58
Married 33 years
D-day July 09/he gave me his slut's STD
Watch my movie: "My wayward husband's adventures in STD land":
Episode 1: youtu.be/9Jv0-d_CdYc
Episode 2: http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8Tz822H82Gk

Posts: 6763 | Registered: Jan 2010 | From: Coastal South
Fallen
♀ Member
Member # 4313
Default  Posted: 11:53 PM, August 19th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I think it's about emotional real estate for me. OP just isn't entitled to that kind of energy. It's bad enough that I obsessed about him during the A, so I don't want to waste one minute stoking my negative feelings about him now.

That's not to say that I can't come up with things about him that are negative. I can. It's just not worth it at this point because it takes my focus off my H and puts it on the OP.

I have told my H things about the OP that were ick... but not because he asked me to... just because it came up in our talks. You talk about "equal" disgust. Do you REALLY want your WS to spend that equal time being disgusted with the OP? Think about that for a minute. All the introspection and work we do on ourselves to really change. All the thinking and worrying and crying over the pain we caused our BS and ourselves. Does the OP deserve equal time in that? Of course not. That's why it really is better to focus on what really matters: ourselves and our BS.


You can't heal what you won't feel.

"There would be no grand absolution, only forgiveness meted out in these precious sips. It would well up from his heart in spoonfuls, and he would feed it to me. And it would be enough."


Posts: 23475 | Registered: May 2004
Miss Saigon
♀ Member
Member # 31965
Default  Posted: 2:40 AM, August 20th (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

When it was only EA I confronted him,(he met the other W thru FB) I knew he was lying but I keep pressing to tell me the truth, and instead of talking to me he hit his head on the table many times and left me. So from then on I stop asking him so he will stop hurting himself physically. But after I found out that it was a full blown A, I just lost it, I am so over him.

For the moment I cannot leave him just like that, I need some papers for him to sign before I leave the house( we are currently in a very restricted country, he can report me to police and go to jail as I am under his visa)

I am requesting him to read self help books & sending him thru email about PA behavior. If i want him to know how/what i am feeling i will send it by e-mail to avoid the shouting as he is always angry, never got any reply from him but he will reach out to me thru good deeds.

Is it about time that I introduce him to SI? I just copy paste those articles that applicable to him.


BS - me 43
WH - 39
2 kids - ages 7 & 4
together 10 yrs, married 7 yrs

rather than love, than money, than faith, than fame, than fairness... give me truth.
-H Thoreau


Posts: 73 | Registered: Apr 2011
UnexpectedSong
♀ Member
Member # 21761
Default  Posted: 9:08 AM, August 20th (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Miss Saigon -

I would NOT recommend that you show your H this website. If he were remorseful and did not know what to do... If he admitted that he needed help getting over the OW... then, sure. But if he won't read books, hits his head instead of talking... Why give up your safe place??

It is his job to seek out books, to find counselors, etc. You don't want to become a mother figure - telling him what books to read, what to do.

You need to look carefully at his behavior and decide if he is willing to change and help you feel safe in your marriage. If he is not, you need to decide how long you will live with him this way.


WW(SA)
"Feedback is the breakfast of champions." - Boris Becker

Posts: 6046 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
Topic Posts: 1000
Pages: 1 · 2 · 3 · 4 · 5 · 6 · 7 · 8 · 9 · 10 · 11 · 12 · 13 · 14 · 15 · 16 · 17 · 18 · 19 · 20 · 21 · 22 · 23 · 24 · 25 · 26 · 27 · 28 · 29 · 30 · 31 · 32 · 33 · 34 · 35 · 36 · 37 · 38 · 39 · 40 · 41 · 42 · 43 · 44 · 45 · 46 · 47 · 48 · 49 · 50

Return to Forum: I Can Relate This Topic is Full
adultry
Go to :
madness  
© 2002 - 2014 SurvivingInfidelity.com. All Rights Reserved.