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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: Long Term Affair Part 22
iwantamiracle
♀ Member
Member # 22812
Default  Posted: 12:08 PM, January 15th (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

promise: i missed your post last nite...took so damn long with my own.. ...

as for the picture...i would probably go through the rest of all his belongings to see if i could find it...and if i find it, then i would probably confront since i don't do well with keeping shit like that under wraps...although i have found lots of stuff i have yet to confront on....but i had gotten to the point of...i needed it all to come from him...told him i knew other stuff, found stuff and i wouldn't tell him what i found....well he never fessed up and i never told him what i found...and i didn't even find just one thing but several.....and then i knew we were done since he never gave up lying.....

so i say search, confront if you find it, let it go if you don't....bank your info...


allgood: still feeling like i want to slap your husband....the fact that he has not cried since he was like 20 is a huge sign of someone so not dealing with their emotions.....perhaps he is more afraid to let it rip for fear that he will lose control and appear less manly....methinks pride and macho shit is huge for him...


fun: i loved your post...it shows that change is ever happenin for the funs...and god knows it was sorely needed....i love that he is crying, going to ic...and i love that he is getting in touch with himself and showing and and telling you all that was so needed showing and telling....

i love that you are taking kickboxing....yup very happy....

this whole thing is a process....and its a journey, not a journey that short either.. ...but you are getting there fun, you both are.....

if i remember correctly weren't you also talking about doing retrovaille....i say go for it...the more proaative you are together the faster your journey not to mention solidifying your relationship....working together is awesome....go for it...


nell:

I guess I don't get the whole "I don't want to look at myself" thing.

of course you don't....thats because you are enlightened to the power of knowledge...something your ws clearly hasn't got....not to mention that he is probably scared shitless to delve to deep....most people who live their lives making their choices based in fear and selfishness have lots and lots fear based issues....

and then to top it off, he would not be able to blame anything, take refuge in his ignorance and face who had become, what he did and how it made you feel....


gotta go....sounds like lots of fighting between my boys....and pfm sounds useless.....


i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
njgal480
♀ Member
Member # 24938
Default  Posted: 1:36 PM, January 15th (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Honest-
BPD mothers are VERY high maintenance. Mine also demanded a ton of my time and I am NOT the only child!
She would call or arrive on my doorstep and expect me to ignore my children (she wasn't particularly interested in seeing her cute little grandkids) and definitely my husband. She was supposed to be the focus.
And, like you... I do think that my husband ended up being 3rd or 4th on my list after the needs of children,my mother and my siblings, etc.
And..of course.. I thought he didn't really care because he was drinking a lot also..
So, I understand the guilt etc. but... you have to put yourself first for a change... and of course your kids...
Like I said before..BPD mothers are impossible to please anyway... if she lived with you there would be NOTHING that you did right.
A neutral living arrangement will be so much better for all concerned...including her.
She'll have to be on her best behavior with strangers!LOL

Broken-
about the pic. He probably threw it away when he realized it was there. He was most likely fearful about triggering you.
If you can let it go... then do that. But, if it's eating away at you I would ask in about it in a non accusatory tone.
By the way...did you go to that retirement party?
I was never invited to my husband's retirement party.
I knew they were having a luncheon for him (after a very long career at the same place) and I did know quite a few co-workers but, I assumed it was not typical for the spouse to attend...so, didn't even ask about it.
Turns out..that spouses do typically attend...and in fact, a number of co-workers had been asking about me.
But, it also turned out that the MOW co-worker had organized the retirement party and was going to be there front and center and my husband did not want to see his two worlds collide-so, I was not invited.
It is still very painful for me to think abou that lack of respect and loyalty.
sigh....just more painful memories about the LTA.

[This message edited by njgal480 at 4:01 PM, January 15th (Saturday)]


Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA
Reconciled.


Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
strongish
♀ Member
Member # 29259
Default  Posted: 4:18 PM, January 15th (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

It's still amazing to me how all our WS's are so much alike. My FWH takes such pride in being "different" and so I get a little thrill in telling him that how he handled the A and it's aftermath are a cliche.

Never did get shopping today. My BFF started the day out strong but then dissolved into tears when we met for coffee to start the day. She was apologizing all over the place, surprised that she was feeling so bad when just earlier this morning she was feeling strong. Uh, yeah...had to tell her that that's pretty normal and that of anyone I could completely understand. So we called off the shopping expedition and she went home. I took myself to a movie, ate popcorn for lunch. And I enjoyed every minute of being by myself.

I also again told my BFF about how much support I get from SI. It's such a relief to know that day or night any of you will be here just to listen. And hearing what everyone else is going through helps me feel not so alone. Isn't it funny though how we are all so much stronger for each other, than we are for ourselves? (Except for Miracle of course who is the strongest woman on the planet!!) why is it that I have the "right" answers for everyone else, but I can't follow my own advice about how to be strong. It must be human nature.


Posts: 490 | Registered: Aug 2010 | From: Texas
honesttoafault
♀ Member
Member # 27105
Default  Posted: 7:13 PM, January 15th (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

why is it that I have the "right" answers for everyone else, but I can't follow my own advice about how to be strong. It must be human nature.

Strong, I feel exactly the same way. I know a lot of people here have advised me to imagine I was advising a friend and what I would say...but it still didn't help me! I hope your friend feels better and good for you to go to the movies anyway!

Nell: I hope your WH takes a good look at the list and doesn't fold it in his pocket. These people don't seem to realize the work that is involved, or perhaps they do, and don't feel they can do it. Let us know how MC goes.

NJgal, I prayed to God this time for guidance with Mom, and I did get it from you, Dip, my neighbor. You guys have been my angels!!
I broached the subject with Mom today about going into a long term care facility, and she seemed to be able to think about it and not get mad. (for now)
I've done a lot of soul searching on this. When my grandmother broke her hip and was starting to get forgetful and cranky, I did everything I could to take her home. I WANTED to take care of this woman who gave me the greatest gift of all: unconditional love. BUT, my mother has had emotional problems ALL my life. I cannot deal with her. I have great difficulty saying no to her. When she visits with me for a week, I'm waiting on her hand and foot. (She's ALWAYS been this way, even when she was young and healthy) She refuses to do anything for herself. It would not be good for HER to live with me, never mind the kids.

Sorry, this doesn't really belong here, but I guess in off topic, but in some ways it does.

My relationship with Mom has had a big impact on all my relationships and I know that is the main reason I've put up with all the crap from WH.

I wish I was financially able, and I would have kicked WH to the curb immediately. He wouldn't have changed, but it needed to be done. But I was also too emotionally damaged.

Sorry for the pity party.

Love to all my angels

{{{tribe}}}


Posts: 1901 | Registered: Jan 2010
ImNellNow
♀ Member
Member # 28753
Default  Posted: 8:09 PM, January 15th (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Oh, honest. We all have our "issues." The thing you've got going for you is the ability now to face them and do what's best for yourself.

Allgood, thinking of you today.

I had a weepy MC session (and rest of the day). WH stated at one point that we had to move forward, but we had to repair the marriage first. Yes! Good! MC followed up to see what WH was thinking about when he talked about "repair." I did not expect this: WH explained that I had hurt his feelings after he revealed his A by saying things like he was selfish. uh... WOW. Wow. Woooooooowwwwww. Giant wow sandwich with a side of wow on a bed of wow with extra wow sauce and a big glass of wow to wash it all down. I didn't even know what to do with that (still don't), so I sort of blanked out for a few minutes. MC and WH talked, and all I could hear was blood rushing around my head.

Folks, there's not getting it and then there's Mr. Nell. Definitely make room in the slapping line. He might need to go around a few times. Because... WOW. I don't even know how to work with that. We went past it and ended the session with MC saying that we are in a really good place blah blah blah and frankly, I can't even begin to see how he gets to that conclusion. But then my mind is still circling the WOW.

The good news is I can't imagine what I could possibly do to damage this... whatever it is that I've gotten myself into... any further, so the whole should-I-shouldn't-I-and-if-I-should-HOW-should-I crap should be pretty well over from me.

Obviously Mr. Nell is six feet deep in marshmallow lollipop babytalk world and I've no idea how he's going to get himself outta there.

ETA: Oh, right. The list. WH asked questions about "understanding himself intimately" (what does that mean? oh. but i thought i did that in the three sessions i had with mc where i came up with the shallow "i liked the attention" crap.) and "build healthy relationships" thing (what do you mean? I told him that I meant that he makes friends with men who are in monogamous, long-term, healthy relationships and he spends time with those people... and he figures out what the words "toxic" and "dysfunctional" mean and he figures out how to stay away from those types of relationships. oh.) Apparently the rest, which deal with ME, is either self-explanatory or less important to understand.

[This message edited by ImNellNow at 8:14 PM, January 15th (Saturday)]


BS & D
Drinking wine and thinking bliss is on the other side of this.

Posts: 2370 | Registered: Jun 2010 | From: Baby steps on my new path
iwantamiracle
♀ Member
Member # 22812
Default  Posted: 8:15 PM, January 15th (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

strong: i am so happy that you found being with yourself enjoyable....its really good when you like yourself.... ...and i am so sorry for your friend...and i am so happy she has you....you are the "oldie" who knows the ropes and you will be her soft place to fall and it will help you as well on your journey you know...

as for :

Except for Miracle of course who is the strongest woman on the planet!!)

oh my...i wish...i know i am strong but i am so not that strong...thanks for the vote of confidence though...


honest: i am glad you are sticking up for yourself and not allowing your mom to move in with you...so yay honest...give yourself a pat on the back.....i know its not easy breaking old habits and wanting to jump in and do what you do which is to care for others...but i am glad you put yourself and your boys first....so yay again....


and never fear about where to post your stuff, we are all here for each other through pretty much everything....and i think we all agree that it helps that we all know each other's issues so well....kind of like treating a whole person instead on just one part of the whole....and if it helps us on this journey..why not...

njgal: i know it hurts to draw on those memories...but i hope you draw comfort as well knowing that your experiences help so many of us...you have been wonderful with your support and advice...


(((tribe)))


i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
njgal480
♀ Member
Member # 24938
Default  Posted: 8:35 PM, January 15th (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Nell....
Wow! Is all I can say.
A little narcissistic or what?
What did the MC say to him about his comments?


Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA
Reconciled.


Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
honesttoafault
♀ Member
Member # 27105
Default  Posted: 10:19 PM, January 15th (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Nell: It's a long, long road for R. Your WH is still just thinking about how HE feels and what HE wants. He does seem to want to R, but hasn't got that he has to work WITH you. I hope you are also going to IC to help you through this.

Old habits and ways of behaving are hard to change, for everyone. A WS doesn't want to look inside and see the mess that they are inside.

Thank you, Miracle. I wish we can help you more. {{{{Miracle}}}}


Posts: 1901 | Registered: Jan 2010
iwantamiracle
♀ Member
Member # 22812
Default  Posted: 10:47 PM, January 15th (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

nell: we must have cross posted..

anyways...mr nell seems to be deflecting and blameshifting....avoidance at its finest...

and as far as repairing the marriage...he first has to repair the damage HE caused by stepping out and putting his dick in someone elses hole for god sake....and it wasn't like it was a ons either....jeesh...

yup put him on the line, yet another one doing stupid really well....

and i am so sure his statements made you just want to hug him and love him....like a black widow spider im thinkin...


i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
Allgoodnamesgone
♀ Member
Member # 26157
Default  Posted: 6:59 AM, January 16th (Sunday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Morning all!
It's a wonderful day in the neighborhood, isn't it?

Honest: I'm glad you seem to be putting your foot down as far as your mother goes. I realize I'm an outsider looking in & I'm sure it's more complicated than what I realize, but it just seems very, very clear to me that you cannot take her in. It seems like you have spent your entire life caring for others and while a wonderful, wonderful trait to have (I couldn't do it), I think you need a great big giant break from it. (And, even then - there's no break given that you're a mom. Lol.)

Nell: You are HYSTERICAL!!!! And, yes, Wow. You really better work on yourself if you are going to reconcile. I'm thinking the reception line may not be adequate at this point. I think we need a circle of us with the dumb-asses in the middle and we all walk/run around them with more of a rapid fire repetitive silly slapping. And, even then, we may need to have something in the background, like an audio loop saying "Life is not all about you, etc." over and over again. Actually, I think I may create a tape and put it under my H's pillow. Lol.

I am doing ok. I successfully fought off the urge to ask Mr. Allgood why, 48 hours later he still can't make a decision whether he is in or out of this M. I really just have to remind myself that the assumption should be that he's not in. No expectations.

Problem is, it keeps nagging at me that I know he wants in, he just doesn't know what to do or he thinks he's been more trustworthy, etc. than not, which may be technically true, but the times he has been untrustworthy really cast doubt on his overall character, intentions, etc.

What I really want to impress upon him is that this is not about a list of things to do, but a shift in attitude. A shift from being primarily absorbed with things he wants to a full, 100% commitment to his marriage. If he had this shift, everything else would fall into place, I think.

And, it seems to me that he has to first recognize that his actions, attitude, etc. have not already shown this.

Anyway, overall, I'm fine. It's just a bit confusing that he doesn't say anything to me about his intentions, yet, he's back to kissing me goodbye everyday and is still telling me he loves me on a near daily basis.

Like I understand he's got the emotional maturity of a 15 year old, but is it really that hard to come up to me and say, I know I haven't got back to you with an answer, I just don't know what to say, do, etc. so he doesn't keep me hanging?

Whateva!

Peace all.


Me- BS
DDay- 8/26/09
Separated after failed R effort.

Posts: 2165 | Registered: Nov 2009
trynhard
♂ Member
Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 7:31 AM, January 16th (Sunday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Nell…
WH explained that I had hurt his feelings after he revealed his A by saying things like he was selfish. uh... WOW
I think this is common for most waywards. My wife went through the same thoughts.. She asked me to listen to this… http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TXsAtWbEoRU
my wife actually wanted me to sing that to her… yet parts of that her to me..

You should view this also in a different way. The other day, I made a decision that ultimately cost my company $6,500. I felt bad to say the least. Yes, I felt horrible. I wanted forgiveness but I’ll be damned if I got got it. They actually said to me I could pay for it if it would make me feel better… I said, no “I’m good” lol… anyways..

Can you remember at any time in your life where you did something that had a big impact on money, a life, etc?
Now, place yourself in the mind of someone who’s cheated. You need to be forgiven.. you hurt too… it’s a different type hurt but it is there… You stopped your behavior, you stopped the selfishness. Your inner soul is hurting because you know deep inside you are not a good person. Now take your #1 relationship you have and have that person call you that… It hurts. It’s painful. It’s something you don’t like.. Can you feel me?


Posts: 2636 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Indiana
ImNellNow
♀ Member
Member # 28753
Default  Posted: 7:47 AM, January 16th (Sunday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Allgood, sounds like he's doing what my WH (and half of the other WSs here) is doing... avoiding the hard work but acting like everything is hunky-dory in the hopes that you'll be tricked into thinking that you're in a happy marriage. Marshmallow lollipop babytalk thinking. I know this is what Mr. Nell is doing. Guess I shouldn't talk about anyone else, but Mr. Allgood's waffling and nonsense defeatism followed by the lah-dee-doo I don't see no stinking elephant actions seem to bear this out.

I did tell WH that I would like him to go back into IC specifically to understand himself better. That is the only way this whole "marriage" is going to work. I can't live in marshmallow lollipop babytalk world, and so far WH has been unable to join me here in reality land.

I generally feel better after MC. This time, still just weepy. Hm.

NJ, I honestly can't recall what the MC said after that statement. I was far too busy listening to the blood rush around my head. Literally. It's all I could hear for a few minutes. Oh, my gosh. I went into shock. Holy crap. Just figured that one out. Mr. Nell's narcissism sent me into shock. Like it was shocking. Jeez, Nell. Speaking of reality land...

ETA: tryn, we cross-posted. Yes, I get it. But I'll be damned if I'm going to follow WH into his fantasy world. I did apologize for saying hurtful things. I didn't do a very good job, though... too weepy and feeling too sorry for myself. I actually do plan to have a conversation with WH. I have done a very good job of owning my shit. WH has not. I will do my best to "repair" as he said, but holy swearword swearword. I'm glad you've experienced this, too. Perhaps there's hope for WH, but I'm not seeing it. I'm also not focusing on the fact that I was not even close to the #1 person in his life for a long time when those words were said. Not by a long freaking shot.

[This message edited by ImNellNow at 7:53 AM, January 16th (Sunday)]


BS & D
Drinking wine and thinking bliss is on the other side of this.

Posts: 2370 | Registered: Jun 2010 | From: Baby steps on my new path
trynhard
♂ Member
Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 8:56 AM, January 16th (Sunday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Nell. I am just pointing out those feeling of.. "I cannot repair" are within him... He told you.. to have you think loving of him.. is it possible again? I don't know..

Heck, most people cannot repair something after this... He can have those feelings but HE must "get it"... and now start doing things to change and be a better person...


Posts: 2636 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Indiana
ImNellNow
♀ Member
Member # 28753
Default  Posted: 9:38 AM, January 16th (Sunday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

tryn,
I know, I know... posting while angry (PWA). I should get a ticket. Yoga today, should help me find my center again.
Much love, Nell


BS & D
Drinking wine and thinking bliss is on the other side of this.

Posts: 2370 | Registered: Jun 2010 | From: Baby steps on my new path
Allgoodnamesgone
♀ Member
Member # 26157
Default  Posted: 10:52 AM, January 16th (Sunday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Gettin lonely as my H took the boys for the weekend. It's nice and quiet just me & my daughter, but it's so, so quiet & no fighting between the boys, no non-stop feeding them,e tc. I guess I just dont' know what to do. (Well, I could clean the house, I suppose...)
Lol.
Anyway just poppin in - hope everyone is well. I, personally am freezing my arse off and am thinking hibernation may be for me with the binge eating and sleeping through winter.


Me- BS
DDay- 8/26/09
Separated after failed R effort.

Posts: 2165 | Registered: Nov 2009
njgal480
♀ Member
Member # 24938
Default  Posted: 12:32 PM, January 16th (Sunday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Allgood-
Quiet is good. Enjoy yourself.Take a bath. Pamper yourself.

Miracle-
I just had this thought about PFM.
Did he ever go to IC?
Did he ever go to SA?
Seems to me that he is a classic SA. From what you described. All the yrs of affairs...different women..etc.
I just thought of this today because another BS that I know...her husband...finally after 4 yrs of R (also an LTA) went to a SA meeting.
And it was life altering for her FWH.
For him, to sit in a room with other (normal looking regular) guys and to hear their stories, their struggles etc. It has been a revelation for him and may be the key to save their marriage.

I know that in your case you feel that there is no hope for the marriage...but, PFM is still the father of your children so..any work he does on himself can only help in the long run.

Have you or anyone else ever suggested a SA meeting for him?


Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA
Reconciled.


Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
ImNellNow
♀ Member
Member # 28753
Default  Posted: 12:56 PM, January 16th (Sunday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Back from yoga and feeling peaceful-ish. Hugs to the tribe and apologies for the lashing out (tryn).


BS & D
Drinking wine and thinking bliss is on the other side of this.

Posts: 2370 | Registered: Jun 2010 | From: Baby steps on my new path
iwantamiracle
♀ Member
Member # 22812
Default  Posted: 1:48 PM, January 16th (Sunday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

njgal: pfm has been in ic since just shortly after d-day...its one of the conditions of him staying in the house....he quits ic, he can move out...

as for sa,...no, he is not sa at all....he tried to tell me once that he might be, but i knew it was him looking for another excuse....when he saw i was not buying it he quickly abandoned the thought, and his ic as far as i know has not diagnosed this either....

nell: glad you found your center... ...need to find my own...been a nutty day here...

allgood: just the girls...how cute, i wish she were a bit older, then you could go get a mani and pedi together...enjoy the peace...it never lasts...and isn't it amazing just how quiet things do get so quickly, and it makes you miss the noise...but when you got the noise you want the quiet.....just a small vicious circle of daily living when youre a mom....

nuff ramblin....manchild needs a ride..


i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
njgal480
♀ Member
Member # 24938
Default  Posted: 3:53 PM, January 16th (Sunday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Miracle-
here is a link to a questionnaire on sex addiction.
I think that a LTA like your husband's definitely qualifies.
I think all the WS are 'addicted' to the high of the LTA.
I just know that the 12 step program has been an eye opener for my husband. For him..its not just about the alcohol... he needs that reinforcement about morality, ethics, etc.
all addicts have toxic thinking.

http://www.addicted.com/addiction-resources/self-tests/sex-addiction-quiz


Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA
Reconciled.


Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
Allgoodnamesgone
♀ Member
Member # 26157
Default  Posted: 4:41 PM, January 16th (Sunday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I just had an "a-ha" moment:

It's just a bit confusing that he doesn't say anything to me about his intentions, yet, he's back to kissing me goodbye everyday and is still telling me he loves me on a near daily basis.

This was probably very obvious to most of you at first glance - but only when I re-read my response this evening did I see it:

He doesn't think anything has changed. He doesn't think I'm serious. Yes, he can see I've pulled back A LOT, but he thinks I can't do it (end the marriage). He's just waiting.

Am i right?


Me- BS
DDay- 8/26/09
Separated after failed R effort.

Posts: 2165 | Registered: Nov 2009
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