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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: Long Term Affair Part 22
old dipstick
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Default  Posted: 5:04 PM, January 26th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage


Not thinking about the repurcusions is what my W is all about. It is always present in small ways as well as bigger things. To me it is so childlike. She is just gonna do what she wants to do. There is a theory about BPD that says some of the BPD's emotional development is frozen at the time of a childhood trauma. Here a example of something she might do. I have told her several times to leave the phone answering machine alone. For good reason too. I had saved some messages that I wanted to transfer to a hard drive but had not done that yet. She accidently erased them all trying to erase a message she had left me. She thought she would just erase one not all. She then blameshifted by saying I had taken too long to transfer the messages. Does this not sound like a six year old? She was asked and told to leave the machine alone. Why was that so hard to do? Anyway I think that all our Ws have this in them. I'm gonna do what ever I want and not worry about how things will turn out That is their motto.

Since everyone likes a story here is one that I was reminded of when reading FNF's anniversary woes.

I am very good about remembering these events. Always get a card and a gift. About 8 years ago I got it in my head that our anniversary was on a Thursday. On Tuesday during the evening meal she got a call from a friend wishing her a happy anniversary. I consulted the calander and saw that I was off two days! Lucky for me I had already bought my card and gift. I explained to her that I had not been paying attention to dates but just day of the week. She was not too mad cause she does know that I am a bozo. I was damn glad that I had not done my shopping at the last minute. Still when I discovered my error the first thought that came to me was that my ass was grass and my W was the lawn mower.


I knew one co worker who had a LTA. I guess you could call it that. It is kind of weird
since they were only living in the same house till his girl got out of school. His W really did not care what he did as long as he kept making those big checks. We were gone from home a lot and so his LTA was not in the home town. I think there are probably more LTAs than we imagine, but I can see why the LTA is not so common.

Hugs to the tribe.

Her WW 60
Me BH 60
M 36 yr
D-day#1 fall of 76 OM#1 2NS
D-day#2 summer of 89 OM#2 LTA 8 yrs OM#3 Short Term A

Posts: 751 | Registered: Sep 2009
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Default  Posted: 5:24 PM, January 26th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Tryn - I am seriously going to print out your post, copy it and give it my H. Thank you. I'll let you know how it goes.

We are going away for 4 days way up north in ski country. Hot tubs, jacuzzi's and maybe if I play enough kissy face he'll cave in.

BS (me) 56
WH 61
M 36 yrs
OW - 55 - Howdy Doody Look Alike
3 Awesome Adult C
DD 6/7/09
LTA 12 years.
Confused: D or R???

Posts: 987 | Registered: Jun 2009
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Default  Posted: 6:24 PM, January 26th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

good day tribe! it's late p.m. central time here so I guess it's late evg in the UK and late morning in Oz. I've tried to keep up but we surely are a prolific group. Welcome to any new members of the group nobody wishes to belong to... hello lurkers (I am one a lot of the time) and dear tribe one and all.

FnF: sorry to read about your anniversary. I don't know how anybody 'forgets' their wedding date unless they suffer from amnesia! or would that be selective non-memory? Anyway, he deserves a 2x4 upside the head, imho.

Laura: keep your lovely butt jumping but be careful cuz nobody likes to be up their a** in alligators!

Honest: you are doing great. keep takinng care of you!

{{{LTA Tribe}}} I can't address everyone as FWH (I hope) will be home soon.

Lying and Confessing... My H lied to my face and by omission for over 3 yrs, first telling me that OW was an anonymous MSN gaming friend who lived in the U.S when I asked about the group he played with always including her nickname. He said it was because they were at the same gaming level, meanwhile she was one of his staff in our home city. I wondered about her familiar nickname when he seemed non-plussed by the obvious work-reference coincidence. I'd been online for several years in IRC crafting chatrooms and knew my own curiousity about 'nicks' and locations, etc. I found it strange that he wasn't interested as I was but was glad for him to find a stress relief after busy day. Stupid me, I encouraged the gaming while I stitched or read quilting books/mags in the same room... happy to be there with him. Since I chatted during the day I tried to give him time on the pc in the evg. this was before he had a laptop from work so we shared the pc. 30 yrs married, I trusted him implicitly... never worried when he was away on business for a week to 10 days at a time. We had been moved from our home city due to his job transfer and I was the supportive wife trying to 'bloom where I was planted'. Our youngest (dd) and oldest (ds) were left behind and only our middle son moved with us. I was home alone much of the time altho I worked part-time as a grocery cashier the last 3 yrs there and enjoyed the social nature of the job. He continued to lie when we moved back (at his request). When I confronted him with chat logs I found on our home pc, he looked totally dumbfounded-ready to deny until I waved the hard copy in his face. This was about 1 1/2 hours before he was leaving to go out of town for a week, returning on Feb. 14! Phone calls that week were brief... I'd be in tears afterwards, sometimes during, asking him if he was coming home - wondering if I should change the locks and not let him return to our home. He did not get what he had done to us, our family, our marriage; how he had turned our life upside-down. I met him at the airport & we went to dinner (him behaving as if nothing was changed and me with my stomach churning). It took weeks, months - maybe years before he got it. Sometimes I still think he doesn't get it and we are approaching 4th antiversary on Feb 7.

His busy season at work has started. As far as I know, OW is not there yet. I don't know if he's omitting telling me or if she's really not required yet. I don't have any way of knowing without going there and that would be a very unusual occurence to his staff. Some may know of his A but nobody has ever imtimated anything or acted differently to me. He tells me that they have no interaction when she is there and his office mgr deals with her. He also says he never treated her in a more familiar way than any other employee which I have trouble accepting as he is quite an outgoing, bordering of flirting, person in work-related, social situations. This is getting long - it happens when I unlurk - what did IWam or Dip call this? so I'd better move on and try to get something constructive done.

I'll be here in the background thinking and praying for all, trying not to get overly stressed as D-day antiversary gets nearer.

Posts: 808 | Registered: Feb 2007 | From: Canada
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Default  Posted: 7:08 PM, January 26th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

lostsoul: there was no need for you to stop...i have never heard your whole story before....and that is what we are here for....i am glad you did post tho, it can be so cathartic when you do a ramble...i do it all the time.. ......

repercussions: not a one of them gave this a thought...if they did none of us would be here....none of them...and worse if they did think of the what it i get caught and went ahead and did it anyway...i don't know which is worse...i would think the latter....making it a totally consious choice vs the go ahead without thinking....thinking about it afterwards if ever...i think the only thinking any of our ws's did was how to cover their tracks and how to do it again and again...

dip: ok, so what did she do for that know prior to a d-day its a mutual responsiblity....

fun: what tryn and njgal make the rules least until you are reconciled as opposed to reconciling...


I just can't understand living your life with no higher-level goals; only to feed your basest, lowest urges. But that seems to be one of his driving forces.

they all did this....i think the saddest part is for most people when you know better you do better...for our ws's, or most of them...when they knew better the still chose NOT TO...


When do you get to the point where you just assume he's going to make a crap choice?

the assumptions or expectations of seeing repeated crap choices being made time and time again....until they finally make good choices, right choices time and time again will you let go of the assumption or expectation of crap choices....yet another privilege to be earned...

I hadn't realized how low my standards had gotten.

was this pre d-day or after....i know pre-day, my standards were not low but expectations were....come to think of it they still are..


until I look at him and wonder about why he was just such a stupid ass. too!!!


I want the relaxed trust we had before, I guess. And that’s not going to happen.

no hon, its not going to happen....

not for alot of us...probably most of us...

manchild and pfm had a bit of a row this evening...a stupid one too....but i loved listening to manchild, there really is hope for this kid...try to make the back story short..

due to an emerg dr off visit with scrawny boy manchild had to walk to school for todays midterm...the school is about 20 -30 min walk from our house...the weather here today was horrible, snowing quite heavily at the time he needed to depart...manchild was told to call pfm when he was leaving...pfm also apparantly told manchild to leave by 11 to allow for extra time....the test was for 12, he needed to be there for 11:45....anyways, pfm thought manchild test was at biggie....manchild was a little miffed though because he got there in 20 minutes, leaving him a lot of time before the test...still no biggie, an annoyance at best..manchild also never called to say he was on his way....pfm had to call tonite manchild tells pfm that his idea for leaving so early was stupid and proceeds to ask him why...pfm takes this and starts to respond to his reasons for telling him to go so early then says, wait a minute, you also never called to say you were leaving...with this manchild, pretty calmly i may add, slightly elevated voice tells his father,, you are deflecting the issue, i am talking about you telling me to leave so early, my phone call does not belong are deflecting from the conversation....well this went back and forth for about 15 minutes...voices got continually louder..mostly manchild...but manchild actually stuck to topic and was mad because pfm didn't...and in between manchild said a few times," i know i should have called, i own that mistake, can you own yours"...

pfm as usual didn't handle it very well, so it got louder and louder...instead of giving the kid his answers and then going to his topic he just kept on him about the phone call, never acknowledging that he was "deflecting" as manchild put it...

anyways i was proud of manchild, he channeled me tonite instead of pfm for some of this discussion...ther is hope for this kid...YAY....

then later pfm comes and asks my opinion...i happen to agree with what he told manchild about leaving early, but i agree with manchild about how he didn't answer the question/accusation...and instead changed the conversation over to what manchild did wrong...we went back and forth for about 5 min and then i shut it down, i told him we will just disagree...well the idiot tells me why does the discussion have to be over... ....well because there is no point in continuing, i told him how i felt, i saw no need to continue to disagree so time to let it go and move on...he didn't like that at all... well too goes on....go scratch a yourself and make it bleed!!!

i am a proud mom tho!!


i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
Feeling so alone
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Default  Posted: 7:20 PM, January 26th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi everyone. Thought I'd stick my head in here and say hello to all who hangs out here. Almost forgot where to go to say anything. And that's very odd seeing as how for quite some time this was my home, my very breath that kept me going from day to day.
Guess it may be that D-day is coming up in March that has me thinking about SI. Not sure. Dday doesn't scare me anymore, just a date, nothing more, well maybe that last one was a little over the edge. But I'm not worried about it. I know that I will get through it just fine. Can you believe that I actually had to stop and think how many years it would be. I think that's GREAT. There was a time that I could tell you exactly how long it had been, at any given moment.
The fact that I do still count, and that I do still remember SI, and that I do still have thoughts or maybe they should be called memories, does go to show that I will probably never forget. 'Course I can hope for dementia or the likes. But the memories don't hurt. They don't make me lose my breath. They don't make me want to curl up on the couch and block the world out. They don't make me cry. They don't make me much of anything except a little mad at times. But anger is so much better than pain. And my anger is not extreme, just anger that my life was altered, and not for the better.

Enough about me. If you are on LTA, than I know your pain. I know that your world is reeling right now. And I know that LTA is a place to feel better. I don't check on much anymore but I may try and keep an eye on here for a while. Please say Hi to me and ask anything you may want. I noticed I saw some old famailar names, so I can assure you that you are getting some very sage advise already.
Hello to all the oldies on here. How's your world going? How's the hubbies? Hope they don't all have too many knots from all the 2X4's over the head.
Some dates
Are harder
(for you oldies, that's all I could come up with)

Together we're working through an LTA

If a man says something in the woods and there's not a woman there to hear it, is he still wrong?

Posts: 1357 | Registered: May 2007
Feeling so alone
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Member # 14492
Default  Posted: 7:47 PM, January 26th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Guess nobody's around tonight. Hope to meet some of you another time.
A little lonely

Together we're working through an LTA

If a man says something in the woods and there's not a woman there to hear it, is he still wrong?

Posts: 1357 | Registered: May 2007
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Default  Posted: 8:26 PM, January 26th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Feeling so alone... Welcome back! I kinda feel like you right now. I have memories... I think If I really want to think about what happened to me, I would hurt and cry but it's been a couple months since my last real hurt. I hope I have all that behind me.

Just working everyday on my M...


Posts: 2636 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Indiana
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Default  Posted: 8:48 PM, January 26th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Miracle: That's great news. Very good.

Dip: I have to say - the story about your WW - well, I'm embarrased to admit that's the kind of thing I've been known to do now and again. It's totally wrong, but damn, I hate being wrong or at fault, it embarrasses me and usually there's someone around who I can blame it on.... (occupational hazard I suppose). See, I am hardly EVER wrong or making mistakes unless I'm under extreme stress, so that's definitely got to be someone else's fault right there. Lol. Anyway, after the fact, I can see that I was wrong and I can recognize my mistakes and share that with whomever had the misfortune to be my target at the time. I have to say that this is one of the things that has been completely erased in the wake of DDay. Someone said something (maybe not here on LTA but on SI somewhere) about DDay being the catlyst for change within yourself. And, it was cause for overdue changes for me in a lot of ways.

Feeling so alone: Hi! Sorry you are.... feeling so alone. Lol. But, I'm glad to hear that you are well and that this stuff can fade. And what's with the FSA stuff? I'm confused. This must be an inside joke of which I am unaware, I'm sure.

Me- BS
DDay- 8/26/09
Separated after failed R effort.

Posts: 2165 | Registered: Nov 2009
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Default  Posted: 9:15 PM, January 26th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Feeling So alone-
Your d-day was right around the same time as mine- 1/07.
So we were both in a state of total shock in the winter/spring of 2007.
But, like you... I am finally seeing the light at the end of the tunnel.
I still trigger. I still think about the LTA but, the pain is not as severe and the sadness does not last as long-so, progress.
When I stay focused on today-I do have to admit that my marriage is much better than it has been. My husband is a changed man Allgood said d-day was a catalyst for change in my marriage,my husband, and myself.
It has been a tough journey but... things are looking up.

Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA

Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
Feeling so alone
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Default  Posted: 9:16 PM, January 26th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Allgood I was known as FSA and after a while I got tired of feeling so alone. So when I would post I would come up with a new meaning for FSA. It would usually go along with my post, sometimes just something silly off the top of my head. Sometimes it would be evil things about ow.
Just a game I played.
Trynhard, a couple of months is good. I can remember when a couple of minutes was a relief. I've been so long now since a real meltdown that I can't remember the last one. I'll soon be 5yrs out from Dday.

Together we're working through an LTA

If a man says something in the woods and there's not a woman there to hear it, is he still wrong?

Posts: 1357 | Registered: May 2007
Feeling so alone
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Default  Posted: 9:23 PM, January 26th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

njgal you said that you still trigger (i'm having trouble cutting and pasting, guess I can't remember how to do it). I hate that for you. Triggering is BAD. I still see things that would have triggered me at one time, but I just let them pass over me now. My Dday was about 10 months before yours. Look what you might accomplish in the next 10 months!!!
Someone might get
Annoyed if I don't stop this

Together we're working through an LTA

If a man says something in the woods and there's not a woman there to hear it, is he still wrong?

Posts: 1357 | Registered: May 2007
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Default  Posted: 10:44 PM, January 26th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I am not sure that any of us get out of this whole. I think some are just better (?) at delaying the inevitable or ignoring reality than others.

I wonder if I had known everything at dday that I know now if I would have walked away and not looked back. TT works; it makes the pain chronic so that there is not one acute episode to mark the transition.

OTOH, while out of town this week at a work roundtable, 2 women in my field at other locations, both attractive and YOUNGER than I made it clear how wonderful they think I am and asked if I could visit their institutions to offer consultation. The attention is very flattering and all that I thought about on the long drive home.

MC is cancelled for Friday because younger SD is coming to visit. She (SD) is sick with flue or something, should be a fun time.

Hi FSA, nice to meet you. lostsoul, it has been a while.

Dip, I hope you are doing OK. We are doing buffalo ‘jalapeno pizza Friday night. I am thinking it might be good grilled. How are those pancakes coming out?

FWW 60
M 1990, dday 10-5-09

Posts: 3968 | Registered: Feb 2010 | From: FL
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Default  Posted: 11:01 PM, January 26th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

hello feelings....

its always good to hear from the oldies, especially when they remind us that life goes on and that the pain does indeed ebb.....

i went back to your last postings in lta...and i found "me"....when i first got here...what a mess i was....every other post for me was a new revelation that i say i was devasated is an understatement...and the wonderful "oldies" here helped more then i can ever express....ukgirl, hurtshirley, fnf, lh2 and lost soul among others....all posted to me quite regularly...i practically lived was my place of solace, rational thought and truth...all of which went missing in my life....

here i am 2 years later, i am on a very long road to divorce, getting my life back on track and i actually love my life minus my ws.....

i am looking forward to a full happy future.....

so yes lurkers, newbies...there is life after may not seem like there is at the beginning of your pain...but not only is there life, but even when your circumstances are not ideal happiness can be found....


i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
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Default  Posted: 6:11 AM, January 27th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi all

The gators are really sapping my energy. Have read all posts hopefully catch up with you all on the weekend.


My h works with OW2 and OW3 often. I know how hard it is!


Nice to meet you both. Thanks for popping in. It always helps me so much to hear success stories. I'm still on the rollercoaster and it really does give me hope.


How's your gut?


Glad you checked in


Loved your anni story.


Manchild is clever like his mum.


Stay strong honey



Married 30yrs Me BW 57Yrs Him FWH 59yrs
OWzero 1988 EA?/PA? Gaslighted.
Dday May 28 2010.
OW1 1994(6mths PA, EA til dday).
OW2 2002(8yrs PA).
OW3 2009(1Yr PA).
Others???? Status: Not Divorcing..but.."You can't unfuck the goat"

Posts: 2729 | Registered: Jul 2010 | From: Australia
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Default  Posted: 6:13 AM, January 27th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

We are doing buffalo ‘jalapeno pizza Friday night.

Ok - other than desserts - that's like all of my favorite foods in one bite. Hmmmm. Delicious.

Me- BS
DDay- 8/26/09
Separated after failed R effort.

Posts: 2165 | Registered: Nov 2009
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Default  Posted: 6:57 AM, January 27th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

FSA, nice to meet you!

BS & D
Drinking wine and thinking bliss is on the other side of this.

Posts: 2370 | Registered: Jun 2010 | From: Baby steps on my new path
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Default  Posted: 8:04 AM, January 27th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Another "oldie but goodie"

Just wanted to give you a huge "welcome back" and say I'm glad to hear you are doing so well.
I do think us "oldies" have to share our progress because those first months and even years our belief in R is so shaky. So, thank you for coming back and giving the newbies an extra dose of hope.
Miracle - yes, I could hear your voice in your son's words. Wow, you must have really enjoyed listening in on their argument. See, we moms really do get through to our children.
LostSoul - we're here for you so please post or vent as often as you need to as your antiversary approaches. That's what's we're here for - to get and give support to each other. (((LS)))
NJG - sent you a PM.
Laura -
The gators are really sapping my energy

I'm sorry. Did I miss something?? What's going on? I know this R process can really sap our energy but I'm thinking life is a little hectic right now. Sometimes that can be a good thing. It gives us a breather from all the LTA crap that wears us down.
Hang in there and post if you get the chance. ((Laura))
The attention is very flattering and all that I thought about on the long drive home.

Hmmm - ATS, as in wow, that was really nice or did it help to see that if you were a different person you might have been vulnerable to that flattery?? Just curious!
I think it's so important to feel appreciated and yes, attractive to the opposite sex, especially when we've had our self-esteem attacked. The secret of course is to just enjoy the flattery and not get ourselves into trouble, but then you know that!
Hey, do I sound like a mother hen. Sorry for that.

[This message edited by forgivenotforget at 8:06 AM, January 27th (Thursday)]

D-day - 12/23/05 LTA - 8 years.
"Love's a matter of trust and I just want to believe in us." M McBride

Posts: 1901 | Registered: Jun 2006 | From: A tunnel where I'm beginning to see the light
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Default  Posted: 10:37 AM, January 27th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

It's super snowy and school is canceled and my nanny accidentally (deliberately( crapped out on us and I had to go to work SO WH is holding down the fort in the no power (i.e. non-heated) house with all 4 kiddos.

Go WH!

Very super.

BW 38, 5 kids
Dday Dec. 2009

Posts: 4034 | Registered: Dec 2009
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Default  Posted: 10:55 AM, January 27th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I wanted to share something that I recently realized.

One of my questions about the LTA has been how is it possible that my husband could not end the affair for 5 yrs (eventhough he claimed she meant nothing to him) and yet, he was able to go NC so completely right after d-day and never look back

One of the things that kept bothering me... and that I could not understand was how this LTA could be so........ important for so many years. And then,just like that...right after d-day it was done, over.

well, this is my analogy.....

imagine teenagers (who after smoking some pot together or drinking some beer or maybe even stone cold sober) have decided that it would be a real thrill to go out and shop lift! They think it will be really funny!

They dare each other to try it. They go ahead and they do it! They run out of the store laughing and feeling that 'high' of doing something wrong and forbidden...and yet they got away with it.

They may even be from well off families and do not need to steal but they do it for the thrill, the camaraderie, the peer pressure...etc.
(kind of like the WS who really has no real complaints about the BS or the marriage but gets caught up in the thrill of the forbidden)

They shoplifters also know going into it that there are a lot of real serious risks involved.

They know that stealing is morally wrong.

They also know it's illegal and they could get caught by a security guard or they could even get arrested etc.

They know all of this but they go ahead and do the shoplifting anyway.

they get caught up in the fun and thrill of it all and they repeat the behavior over and over again.

Its fun, they get away with it... they start to feel like its a way of life, like they can get away with anything, that they will never get caught....etc. etc.

until..they get caught....

and the minute that happens and they are sitting in a police station they immediately see things differently.

They immediately feel remorse, regret,fear, guilt,shame.

They see how their behavior has affected their families.

They realize that there will be big consequences.

They realize how stupid their behavior was...and the realization comes to them immediately.

They don't want to be friends with their fellow shoplifters anylonger, in fact they don't ever want to see them again.

They have no good memories about their shoplifting exploits anymore, they hate everything about it.

The behavior that used to give them such a big thrill and that they thought was so much fun is something that they want to forget now.

and the change in attitude is immediate.

The consequences woke them up immediately and made them look at their behavior in a totally different way.

I think it really does answer my question as to how my husband could get over it all so quickly and so completely.....

I would imagine that the shoplifters that got caught would get sick to their stomach whenever anyone mentions it...
the former shoplifters can't even walk into that store again....
when they see an ad in the newspaper for the store they can't read it because it just reminds them of the bad experience.

what used to be such a fun thing-has now become a horrible memory.

so, that's my analogy....

what do you think?

[This message edited by njgal480 at 10:58 AM, January 27th (Thursday)]

Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA

Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
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Member # 24938
Default  Posted: 10:59 AM, January 27th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Snow day here too....
but, I have power!
Yay for your FWH!
Hope he and the kiddies manage to stay you have a fireplace?

Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA

Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
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