Cheating Hurt by Infidelity
Betrayal Wayward Donations lying
Welcome

Forums

Guidelines

Find a Local Counselor

The Healing Library

Media

Contact Us
lies
cover
In Association with Amazon.com
Support
Infidelity -
-
Find a Local Couselor
You are not logged in. Login here or register.
[Register]
Newest Member: Bersey (43222)

I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: Long Term Affair Part 22
nofun
♀ Member
Member # 24546
Default  Posted: 6:18 PM, February 6th (Sunday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

P.S. My dog HATES evil twin.

Nell - I love your dog too!!


BS (me) 56
WH 61
M 36 yrs
OW - 55 - Howdy Doody Look Alike
3 Awesome Adult C
DD 6/7/09
LTA 12 years.
Confused: D or R???

Posts: 987 | Registered: Jun 2009
Allgoodnamesgone
♀ Member
Member # 26157
Default  Posted: 8:19 PM, February 6th (Sunday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Sweet dreams everyone.


Me- BS
DDay- 8/26/09
Separated after failed R effort.

Posts: 2165 | Registered: Nov 2009
trynhard
♂ Member
Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 6:41 AM, February 7th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

nell.. rock climbing?? lol I guess i could do it in one of those inside rock climbing walls places they have.. Oh well, another day...

Dogs are smart.. did you hear about the one sniffing cancer? Dogs know when something is wrong!

Here's mine telling us we need the "got milk" thing..

As far as how you dialogue, these are the questions. http://www.cs.bgsu.edu/maner/dialogue/
You’ll find one that fits when your relationship needs attention with something. Thing is, you both have to want to tell your feelings. I am breaking a promise to the folks a Retrou.. everything was supposed to be left at Retrou.. They ask us to make it our responsibility in life to help other suffering… guide them to Retrou.. So I do try. But I find around here is everyone is afraid to go. So, I give a few examples.


Allgood.. You’ll be fine… So, when are you going to tell him about the papers you drew up? Are you ready for the change? A new life?

As for me and my W and Superbowl…. we both wanted to spend this time together. We had fun last night…


So DeepP.. How are you doing? What does your week look like ahead? You going to something fun? Me, I guess I will keep chipping away at the ice around the house.. lol

[This message edited by trynhard at 6:45 AM, February 7th (Monday)]


Posts: 2636 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Indiana
Allgoodnamesgone
♀ Member
Member # 26157
Default  Posted: 7:18 AM, February 7th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Morning all!

Tryn: cute dog!

In response to your question, I told my H that the papers were ready on Friday and told him the terms. He had no comment. Then, yesterday, when he was unable to see my point about why I felt his decision about where to watch the Superbowl was not showing me I'm his priority, I told him that we will go forward with signing the papers this week. Not sure if had a comment to that as I hung up on him. Lol.

Later that day he texted me that he wasn't going to go where he had planned, he would go to bil instead. He must think all's good now, cuz he was trying to cuddle up to me this am.

Am I ready for a new life?

Yes and no.

I'm looking forward to less drama. I'm looking forward to having a rewarding relationship, feeling loved again, etc.

With each day I'm feeling more convinced that whether he broke NC or not, his thinking and priorities are just too screwed up for me.

I think it's going to be a looonnnng road before I find someone else tho and I'm already feeling lonely. So, that's scary.

O well.

And, Nell: my dog only liked white people - not sure what is up with that- and toll collectors of any ethnicity were completely unacceptable as well. He was a huge dog (died 2 years ago), but if you pet him, he was your best friend. (Course that meant he would want to sit on your lap, which was hazardous in and of itself. Lol.)

Got to go.
Peace to the tribe


Me- BS
DDay- 8/26/09
Separated after failed R effort.

Posts: 2165 | Registered: Nov 2009
forgivenotforget
♀ Member
Member # 11053
Default  Posted: 8:48 AM, February 7th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I know this post may seem a little lame to some but for me and my AHA! moment yesterday, I just felt I had to see if anyone else wanted to comment on my thoughts.
I was watching a movie last night with my DD's and there was a line in it where the wife said to her H, we have to be able to tell each other the truth.
Well we all talk about what consummate liars our S's are/have been for years and many of them, even after d-day still can't seem to break the habit of lying. What this line made me realize is that it is not just that they lie(d) to us and themselves but they also want us to lie to them. They can't deal with the truth about our feelings. They don't want to know how badly their actions hurt us. They want us to tell them we'll be ok, we love them, we will make it through this. They want us to "fake it till we make it."
For many of us, lying is just so difficult. Honesttoafault even uses this as her ID.
I was a twin (for those of you who don't know this, my sister died a little over a year ago ). We had a deal when we were growing up.
We swore to always tell each other the truth, even if we thought it might hurt the other temporarily, if in the end it would help the other to grow. I never knew any differently. It was wonderful to know that I had someone in my corner who had the courage to tell me the truth when I was wrong and to know it wasn't to make me feel bad but to help me to become a better person. After d-day, when our MC recommended it, I didn't know how to "pretend" - to "fake it till I make it." It was such a hard concept for me to grasp, kind of like telling the truth was for my H. He has lied his entire life, admittedly, since he was a very young child. Telling the truth and hearing the truth is as painful to him as me having to fake it and pretend I don't feel the things I am feeling.
Even now, after so many years of working to salvage our M, my H still can't hear the truth. If I have a bad day, if I'm still feeling a little unsure about where our M is going, any attempt to share this with him is met with defensiveness. I'm not telling him these things to hurt him or to make him feel bad, but to hopefully see what we need to do to improve our M. I also try to encourage him to be honest with me, especially when I see him getting irritable - "Tell me what's wrong" is met with, "Nothing, I don't know what you're talking about."
Think of how happy our H's would be if we just lied to them and let them believe all was well with our worlds.
If lying to them about how we really feel is so difficult for us, I guess it isn't so hard to imagine how difficult it is for them to start telling us the truth after years of being a liar.
As much as we hate the lies, I believe the liar hates truth.

[This message edited by forgivenotforget at 9:00 AM, February 7th (Monday)]


D-day - 12/23/05 LTA - 8 years.
"Love's a matter of trust and I just want to believe in us." M McBride

Posts: 1901 | Registered: Jun 2006 | From: A tunnel where I'm beginning to see the light
iwantamiracle
♀ Member
Member # 22812
Default  Posted: 9:13 AM, February 7th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

need to vent a bit:

pfm was in my business again...my personal business, calling my friend to find out whatever he could..i cannot and will not go into the particulars because they do not matter....he actually asked her tho if i was done.... ...i only tell him this umteen times a week, sometimes a day....yes i am done....he is a fucking liar and that has not changed...and at this point it doesnt matter anymore, i will never trust him....he is so not getting it, he is bordering on obsession with me...he fucking tells me he loves me and thats why he cannot let me go...he tells me he did a 180...well bucko you needed to do a 360 in the opposite direction...not to go back to who you were but to reinvent yourself and YOU FAILED miserably....asshole....loving me, but not respecting me or my wishes....and i am supposed to be happy because you love me enough to butt into my business, you love me enough to not respect me or my wishes....but you dont love me enough to tell the fucking truth.....he won't let me go...like he has a choice....he had the choice way back when, the choice is gone...i tell him if you love me, let me be...love me enough now to let me go in peace....but NOOOOOO....he loves me too much to let me go...WTF is that all about...its not love its fucking obsession.....

damn i wish i was a drinking person, i could use one....arrrggghhh....


fustration is at a new level.....calling my friend...who does he think he is....pfm you are a total fuckwit of an asshole in the first degree....get a new fucking life and get out of mine....

he is putting me in the position that will make me speed up the demise of this sich as it is now.....do you get that asshole...you are pushing me further and further away....pushing me closer and closer to ending this charade sooner rather then later....

aaarrrggghhh...


ok vent over....

i feel better now...will be back later to catch up...


i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
m334455
♀ Member
Member # 26893
Default  Posted: 9:35 AM, February 7th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Miracle -- sorry @ pfm. that sucks.

Sooooo... yesterday I spent 9 hours shopping and eating with my sister while WH held down the fort with all 4 kids. I came back @ halftime of the Super Bowl. He even skipped a BBQ part our friends were throwing and the ladies that were going to be there had said they'd watch the kids so WH could watch the game.


BW 38, 5 kids
Dday Dec. 2009

Posts: 4034 | Registered: Dec 2009
atsenaotie
♂ Member
Member # 27650
Default  Posted: 9:56 AM, February 7th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

G'morning Tribe,

With the LTA we talk of how hard healing and R is because there is just so much calculated betrayal over the life of the A. The other issue, and I think perhaps more significant, is what the ability to have a LTA (or serial A’s) says about the emotional health of our FWS. It is more than poor barriers and a desire for affirmation.

After dday for the LTA we face a FWS who, while NC with the OP and no longer looking for an A, is still a long ways from being a healthy partner in the relationship. We also seem to have a very common realization that it was not “just the LTA”, but much or most of our life M’d to this person is not what we thought that it was.

Now we try to go forward, to R. The FWS is no longer having A’s, is transparent, and wonders why that is not enough. It is not enough because in the aftermath of dday we have gained new sight. We see the aspects of our FWS’s personality that enabled the LTA. Even when the FWS is working to address these personal issues and to become healthier, we still face a waiting game while we see if they can become an emotionally healthy partner in a relationship still wobbling from the impacts of the LTA.

--Ats


LTA BS 53
FWW 60
M 1990, dday 10-5-09
Reconciled

Posts: 3967 | Registered: Feb 2010 | From: FL
Allgoodnamesgone
♀ Member
Member # 26157
Default  Posted: 10:11 AM, February 7th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Ats: Well said! Now, are you and Mrs. Ats ok or what?

M3: Glad he stepped up to the plate.

Miracle: That is the danger in coexisting. I see it in my sitch as well. As you know, with everything PFM has been saying to you, he still thinks there's a shot. That you still live in the same house pretending to be married to your kids is fueling that. I know your reasons for doing this and I'm not judging that by any means. You were supposed to get back to him with your terms. Maybe it's time to put that project on the front burner and get an agreement drawn up. The officiality of it may have him sink in. And, again, not defending PFM at all, but I kind of expected my H to fight me whenever I said it's over. While I get your issue re respect, I do think that fighting for your marriage, telling the person you love them, etc. pleading for a 2nd chance, even when someone tells you they don't want that, well - I think that is what you do when you love someone. You don't accept it and walk away. I would've liked to have seen more of this in my H.

But - calling your friend is ridiculous. It really is.


Me- BS
DDay- 8/26/09
Separated after failed R effort.

Posts: 2165 | Registered: Nov 2009
forgivenotforget
♀ Member
Member # 11053
Default  Posted: 10:22 AM, February 7th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

he is bordering on obsession with me...

First off, I'm so glad you came here to vent. You offer so much support all the time and rarely ask for any in return. So hugs to you, Miracle and hopefully you can feel all of the love and support coming your way from all of us who care for you.
Now, as to PFM, IMHO it sounds like desperation. He is desperate to find a way to win you back and even though you are telling him it's too late, he needs to believe there is still a chance. I know I've said this before but I just wish he would finally tell you the whole truth, trust you enough to give you that and maybe, just maybe, instead of you hating him for what he fears to tell you, he can win back some ounce of respect for having the courage to finally be truthful. I don't know. Maybe it's too late for that too. Is it???
Check back in and let us know how you are doing, please. (((Miracle)))
M3 - wow - he is really stepping up lately. That's great. I'll bet the kids are really enjoying this time with Dad too. Way to go Mr. M3!
ATS - another fantastic post and so true. I especially love the line about "a relationship still wobbling from the impacts of the LTA."
This is exactly it - all of the excuses we may have made over the years of a bad M because we believed in our S, trusted them, loved them only to find out the truth of their secret lives leaves us reeling and now we are no longer as capable of excusing inexcusable behavior.
I wanted to comment too on your post of the other day. I'm sorry you found those notes and agree with everyone's comments to you.
I wanted to add too that for us SI is a safe haven where we come to say things we may never want our S's to hear. Our most negative thoughts, fears, feelings about them, about the future of our M, about whether we really even love them after what we have learned. We come here to "let it all out" because we know we are safe here. That's what makes this such an amazing source of comfort and support.
It is unfortunate that as a BS we feel the need to continue to search for evidence and sometimes our search leads us to something very painful. Was this just a fleeting feeling for your W? Did she just need to vent a short-termed negative thought but not one that she experiences often?
I have written many things, both on here and in my private writings, that I would never want my H to read because they don't really represent an absolute for me, KWIM??
They may be reactions, or temporary setbacks, or just frustrations that need to be vented.
I think it is important for each of us, BS & FWS as well, to have that safe place to vent our most negative feelings. It is cathartic and once released safely can be so helpful in getting us through a difficult period.


D-day - 12/23/05 LTA - 8 years.
"Love's a matter of trust and I just want to believe in us." M McBride

Posts: 1901 | Registered: Jun 2006 | From: A tunnel where I'm beginning to see the light
Allgoodnamesgone
♀ Member
Member # 26157
Default  Posted: 11:12 AM, February 7th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Now we are no longer as capable of excusing inexcusable behavior.

Yup.


Me- BS
DDay- 8/26/09
Separated after failed R effort.

Posts: 2165 | Registered: Nov 2009
honesttoafault
♀ Member
Member # 27105
Default  Posted: 11:15 AM, February 7th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Tryn: Love your dog!! You're right, he does look like "Got Milk?" ads.

FnF: I really liked your post about telling the truth/lying. It all goes hand in hand with living a superficial life. As you said, many of us here are not used to lying, but as I said in a post the other day, we were starting to lie to ourselves in ignoring a lot of red flags. We kept getting used to things that we knew deep down were inherently wrong in the relationship either rationalizing the WS's behavior or downright lying to ourselves.

It seems so many of the WS's have been doing this all thier lives. They don't know how to have a true "intimate" relationship, something that so many of us wanted so very deeply. We even lied to ourselves at times and thought we did , or perhaps we did have some essence of it in the beginning or every once in a while.

I remember one conversation with WH a few months ago when he kept saying "people don't do this! People don't talk like this!!" in referring to talking about feelings and sharing thier thoughts and fears. He kept saying,"Just be normal. Just act like yourself."
At the time, I kept thinking about what xWH used to say about me over analyzing everything (this was said waaaay before the A when we were "Ok" and it was said kindly). It made me doubt myself. I guess one can "over analyze", but I don't think I really did. They were the ones who had problems not even analyzing at all. Which is where the lies that Fnf is discussing come in. They lie to themselves and construct secret lives. We also start to lie to ourselves too.

Also, Fnf, I'm so sorry about your sister. It must have been so truly devastating for you to lose a twin, someone so close to, someone you can always rely on, and then go through DDay and have the loss of the other person in your life that you felt you could rely on that betrayed you so deeply. I am so sorry.

Miracle, I totally agree with Fnf. PFM is desperate. He has no clue what the real problem is. He is clutching at straws and pushing you further and further away. He thinks the changes he has made is enough, but they are all superficial, and he still doesn't see that.

I know that you have told him repeatedly what the problem is and why you have given up. He hasn't really heard it. Perhaps as a catharsis for you, and to let him know one last time, you might want to write another letter to him, but make is straightforward without any venting telling him WHY you have given up and what he still needs to change within himself.

I am glad that you came here to vent. You help so many other people here all the time. We want to come and give you a "group hug"!!!

Allgood, your WH is also lying to himself. He doesn't really believe you are going through this. You know, in a weird way, because he is acting so much like a little boy, he may feel that this is the punishment he deserves? He doesn't deserve you and this is his penance?

M3: I'm glad that your WH stepped up to the plate a bit there!! Maybe there is some hope!!
Your post describing the obstacles that you have overcome is awe inspiring!! {{{{m3}}}

Ats, I loved your post. You succinctly described a LTA very very well. I copied and pasted it on my own "quotable quotes" page that I am keeping.

As for me, I'm getting back on the 180 train. Got sidetracked there for a while because of crazy circumstances beyond my control, and I'm realizing a lot of co-dependent behavior that is entrenched within me to help and "save" people.

I must recognize that I can't "save" anyone if I don't have my own self/spirit safe and strong. That is not being selfish. It's being downright practical.

Perhaps my mother was so very co-dependent at some points in her life that she worried about eveyone else that she neglected herself and then I had to save her over and over. At least I am starting to believe that is what she believed to cover the BPD behaviors.

All a learning process. I believe so many of us here are willing to make changes for ourselves and for the M and WS. If the WS can't do it with us, we need to move ahead. It's hard to do. It's hard to change. It's hard to make a decision to grow and heal if the one we love can't do it too. We're tying to balance again, and it's so hard, but "do-able"

{{{tribe}}}}


Posts: 1903 | Registered: Jan 2010
m334455
♀ Member
Member # 26893
Default  Posted: 11:36 AM, February 7th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Your post describing the obstacles that you have overcome is awe inspiring!!

Thanks, lady, but don't put a halo on me I'm sure just as many people would tell you I'm a total wack-job.

So, Saturday Goodfellas was on. If you ever want to know what Dday looked like in my house -- watch that movie. I don't think I'll ever watch it again. Ugh.


BW 38, 5 kids
Dday Dec. 2009

Posts: 4034 | Registered: Dec 2009
atsenaotie
♂ Member
Member # 27650
Default  Posted: 11:40 AM, February 7th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Ms Ats and I are as OK as we get, and I think I have a better insight to her thoughts and feelings. I say "think" because one of my issues is I still do not trust her to tell me the truth about us.

It has become a complicated story, because this is our entire relationship distilled into a few issues, but the highlights are:

She still struggles with "letting me into her heart" because she is afraid that she could be hurt if she does (duh! let me offer an example), but that she has let me in further than she has ever let anyone else in. This was to re-assure me and help me feel better, but of course, I had thought she had let me into her heart before I proposed. She now wishes she had not said anything about emotional intimacy and us because it just upset me (conflict avoidance).

She has no sex drive and does not want to have sex unless she is in the mood. Says she was being overly dramatic with comment about fucking me without being present. See comment above about wishing she had just not said anything. She did end up initiating sex this weekend, and I was unable to perform. Later that night she jokingly said that maybe my dysfunction would be a good thing for us. As I mentioned in my earlier posts, there are things WS’s from LTA’s are missing, and I believe the ability to empathize is one of them. I bought the book Tryn mentioned, it looked helpful, and so I passed it on to her.

She asked and I clarified the statements from MC that I was withdrawing emotionally, and actively trying to suppress my desire for her to stop the hurt from little to no sex life. I explained that was behind my sleeping in the spare room. She expressed fear that she was trying so hard to get better and that she was losing me, and that I had given up. She said she wanted me in our bed, and that she needed me “available” in order for her to keep working on building intimacy.

I am bothered not by what else she may have done during her A’s, but by the fact she will not simply ‘fess up. OTOH, I am not likely to believe anything that she says about that time, so we have a catch 22. I just have to accept whatever was, was, and focus on being in the present. I suspect there were other OM during our M. I suspect some of her times together with the OM were more depraved than she has admitted. I know there was much more discussed than just business. Etc, etc.

Apparently the time between her ending her A that started in her first M (she divorced 4 years before we met), and our dating is much less than I had understood. She let slip a comment about talking about me with an IC she was seeing back then to resolve her feelings after the A ended with that MOM. There may have been some overlap with dating me and ending it with the MOM, but I have no expectation she would ever tell me the truth if that were the case. She was clearly more on the rebound when we started dating than I ever understood.

I told her I saw the notes she had kept. They go back to last fall, and there is a lot of anger in them. We discussed them briefly, she said that they were mostly venting. Just as I have SI she has notes, and I understand the need to get angry and hurtful feeling out and in writing to deal with them. She resented/hated me for most of our 20 year M. She was ashamed and afraid I would find out who she really was and leave her. I understand that it is unreasonable for me to expect her to resolve all of those feelings and emotions in a matter of months, even with the best intentions.

I do feel adrift. We are great roommates, and we have fun together. Maybe that is enough. We both are much more open and willing to engage in short-term conflict for long-term benefit. She “sees” our relationship and others with much more clarity, and she seems to be doing well with self-affirmation in all areas of her life except me. She willingly admits to being co-dependent on how I feel about her. I may need to put 3 bad months in a row to make a final decision.

Thank you to everyone who offered support and insights during my collapse this last week.

--Ats

[This message edited by atsenaotie at 11:44 AM, February 7th (Monday)]


LTA BS 53
FWW 60
M 1990, dday 10-5-09
Reconciled

Posts: 3967 | Registered: Feb 2010 | From: FL
Allgoodnamesgone
♀ Member
Member # 26157
Default  Posted: 11:45 AM, February 7th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Honest:

He kept saying "people don't do this! People don't talk like this!!" in referring to talking about feelings and sharing thier thoughts and fears. He kept saying,"Just be normal. Just act like yourself."

That's interesting.
I have to say, my personal opinion is that "regular couples" don't talk like that or don't have to talk like that if they don't want to. This is based upon my conversations with my friends who have intact marriages. Recovering from an affair or some other marital problem is a different story.

ETA: I think with "regular couples" they can discuss their feelings and thoughts/fears in a less structured, less forced way, just like a natural thing. BUt, I don't see it as like an everyday thing.

As to your statement about Miracle's sitch:

let him know one last time, you might want to write another letter to him, but make is straightforward without any venting telling him WHY you have given up and what he still needs to change within himself.

I think she just needs to be very careful in how she words it. Not that for a second I think she will do this anyway, but this sounds like an invitation to have PFM get back in the marriage. I think she needs to say (again) that I expected 100% honesty. You have not done that. I know you deny that, but that is my conclusion nonetheless. There is NOTHING you can do to change my opinion. Now, as for the things you need to do to make co-existing possible, you need to do x.y and z.

And, my feeling is that PFM couldn't possibly keep track of all of his lies over that period of time. I do firmly believe that. But, I don't think that's really the only reason why she ended it. I think it's part of it, because why go through all the other crap if he's not going to at least be honest.

(Hey Miracle - where are you? Why am I talking on your behalf? Lol.)

And, my H: no, he doesn't believe I will go through with it. I asked him what his partner believes about the status of our relationship & he said he thinks we are working on it and that it just got worse because of the Christmas party.

In that way - I guess I can relate to what Miracle did. I'm not ending it with my H because of the Christmas party itself, it's because it's the last damn straw. He's got enough issues as it is, don't take my willingness to reconcile as a sign that you can do whatever and get away with it.
And, yes, he accepts that the relationship will end at some point. Always did. Don't know why he cares. We practically had no relationship during the course of his A and he didn't miss it one bit apparently.

[This message edited by Allgoodnamesgone at 12:26 PM, February 7th (Monday)]


Me- BS
DDay- 8/26/09
Separated after failed R effort.

Posts: 2165 | Registered: Nov 2009
m334455
♀ Member
Member # 26893
Default  Posted: 11:50 AM, February 7th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

We are great roommates, and we have fun together. Maybe that is enough.

No it's not! It's not! It's not! It's NOT!

Having a temper tantrum here for you, complete with all the "it's not fair"s and the "I didn't deserve this"s...

Look, your wife spent her married life with you worrying about you thinking she's a fraud because she's a fraud! Maybe she should have tried NOT being a fraud. Now, she's working on being a buddy/half a fraud? Not enough! Nope, nope, nope.

ETA --

Nell,

You're awesome. I'm glad you're here. Now the 2X4 (sandwich technique here) stop covering up your pain and frustration with humor! You are very funny -- but this is not serving you well emotionally. i know this because humor is one of my defense mechanisims too. (and now for the rest of the sandwich) You're awesome, I'm glad you're here...

[This message edited by m334455 at 11:53 AM, February 7th (Monday)]


BW 38, 5 kids
Dday Dec. 2009

Posts: 4034 | Registered: Dec 2009
honesttoafault
♀ Member
Member # 27105
Default  Posted: 1:14 PM, February 7th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Allgood: Interesting thing to discuss. I agree that people in "healthy" marriages probably discuss feelings as they come up, you know, a disagreement about whatever, and resolve the problem more or less and it's done. It doesn't have to be a long drawn out discussion.
I've shared my feelings with WH over the years, sometimes sharing why a particular thing really bothers me. LOL, I'm a teacher, so perhaps I overexplain things anyway!!!
But, he threw it back at me a few months ago, almost making fun of me....(another thing for my list)

You are also right about my post to Miracle. When I reread it, I realized that yes, it did look like an invitation to finally step up one last time to fix himself. Maybe, I was thinking that..... wishful thinking so that Miracle would stop hurting and pfm could become the husband he should be.
I think your suggestion is better.

The last straw...... yes, yes, yes. I do get that. {{{{Allgood}}}

Ats, you have worked so very hard at helping Mrs. Ats. You have been very insightful as to her pain and what may be causing her actions.
But, M3 is right. Being roommates is NOT enough.

You've given so much of yourself. I agree with you. Give yourself another time limit. 3 months is good. You have given Mrs. Ats a wonderful gift, not only have you given her the gift of R, and possibly forgiveness, you are also supporting her with own healing from years of FOO.
She is trying her hardest, and of course, there is always backsliding.

But, Ats, there will come a time that you must ask yourself if no matter how much Mrs. Ats "heals", will this be the marriage you want?

You don't have to be mad at her. You still love her and I do believe she loves you to the best of her ability. I do fully believe she didn't do this to hurt you intentionally.

But there may come a time with this year coming, that you may want to seperate from the marriage, and perhaps continue a "family" relationship...because that is what it seems....KWIM? You can start your own life.

So this is the kind of 180 you should start....focus more on you, while still being there for Mrs. Ats.

The old marriage is dead. You have to forge a new relationship and that relationship may be an entirely different thing.

Ok, I'm rambling.

M3, lol, we all deserve halos for going through this. Someone once told me that it is their full belief that if we suffer more on earth, we go straight to heaven and don't go to "purgatory". Lol, I think we all have first class tickets to heaven!!!

{{{{tribe}}}

[This message edited by honesttoafault at 1:17 PM, February 7th (Monday)]


Posts: 1903 | Registered: Jan 2010
ImNellNow
♀ Member
Member # 28753
Default  Posted: 1:23 PM, February 7th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

m3,
Oh, I readily admit that I'm hurt and frustrated (and very angry, that's a fun one). I also admit to myself and WH... and everyone else! ... that I use humor to cover up all that icky negative emotional stuff. It makes it more bearable for me. And also some of this crap is just plain funny. And also WH really sucks at dealing with negative emotions from me in general and regarding his actions/words in particular, which encourages me to couch such things in humor instead of having real conversations... and so it goes.

Thank you for the sandwich. I know you're right.

ETA: This message was all about me... no time right now to delve into others' stuff but will get back later... so for now, hugs all around.

[This message edited by ImNellNow at 1:28 PM, February 7th (Monday)]


BS & D
Drinking wine and thinking bliss is on the other side of this.

Posts: 2370 | Registered: Jun 2010 | From: Baby steps on my new path
Allgoodnamesgone
♀ Member
Member # 26157
Default  Posted: 1:36 PM, February 7th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Honest:

But, he threw it back at me a few months ago, almost making fun of me....

Mr. Allgood does that too. When I draw his attention to that (like "Ahem, r u F-n kidding me that you are going to mock me now?") he denies it.

Nell: I agree. SOme of this stuff IS funny in the sense that it's so bizarre.


Me- BS
DDay- 8/26/09
Separated after failed R effort.

Posts: 2165 | Registered: Nov 2009
strongish
♀ Member
Member # 29259
Default  Posted: 2:39 PM, February 7th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Lots of stuff here today. Let's see if I can make any sense of it....

(((Miracle))) - Oh honey, you are always so supportive of everyone here. I'm so glad that you felt you could vent here, with us. That you felt safe enough with us to express your emotions. I can't imagine how difficult it is to be in your sich. Please keep checking in and let us know how you're doing.

fnf - I loved your post.

They can't deal with the truth about our feelings
I think you have really hit on something here. This is clarifying some things for me with my FWH. He was expressed to me that he just wants us to be "normal" again...like that could ever happen. He wants to pretend that the A never happened, or that I never found out about it, so that we can go back to being "normal." You're right.....they can't handle the truth!!

The FWS is no longer having A’s, is transparent, and wonders why that is not enough. It is not enough because in the aftermath of dday we have gained new sight. We see the aspects of our FWS’s personality that enabled the LTA.
ATS - This also became clear to me yesterday and this morning. In fact, I specifically asked FWH to start seeing an IC to address some of his "issues." We had another talk yesterday with little to nothing accomplished. The bottom line is that he still wants to see himself as a "good guy" and will do mental gymnastics to turn any conversation about his behavior and the A into something else. If I can separate myself in these conversations, it's actually kind of interesting to see how he twists what we're talking about to suit him. I was glad that I remained calm, for the most part, but ATS you're right on target. It's not just the LTA that has ruined our M, at this point the A is over and I really believe he is not seeing anyone else. But...and this is huge....he will not examine the part of him that was able to lie, cheat and have a relationship with someone outside of our M. FWH continues to minimize, minimize and minimize some more and I can feel myself closing myself off to him. He has read part of "Not Just Friends" and when I asked him about it the first response he had was about the parts that he doens't agree describe him. Same with the writings of Rabbi Shmuley. He's so quick to tell me why he's different than the cheaters written about in books and articles, but not so quick to identify with any of them. I'm sure it's a defense mechanism but that's not going to cut it. Having said that.....

We are great roommates, and we have fun together. Maybe that is enough.
No, no, no. that is NOT enough. You deserve better. You deserve to be HAPPY!! Give yourself permission to be happy.

(((Nell)))
(((Allgood)))
(((Honest)))
(((m3)))

((Anyone I've forgotten!))

ETA - I almost forgot!! during our little talk yesterday FWH tried to bring up that I have lied to him as well (specifically about my BFF testing postive for STD at her request) and I had to stop right there and push back to ask if he "really wanted to go there."

[This message edited by strongish at 3:17 PM, February 7th (Monday)]


Posts: 490 | Registered: Aug 2010 | From: Texas
Topic Posts: 1000
Pages: 1 · 2 · 3 · 4 · 5 · 6 · 7 · 8 · 9 · 10 · 11 · 12 · 13 · 14 · 15 · 16 · 17 · 18 · 19 · 20 · 21 · 22 · 23 · 24 · 25 · 26 · 27 · 28 · 29 · 30 · 31 · 32 · 33 · 34 · 35 · 36 · 37 · 38 · 39 · 40 · 41 · 42 · 43 · 44 · 45 · 46 · 47 · 48 · 49 · 50

Return to Forum: I Can Relate This Topic is Full
adultry
Go to :
madness  
© 2002 - 2014 SurvivingInfidelity.com. All Rights Reserved.