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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: Long Term Affair Part 22
Laura28
♀ Member
Member # 28997
Default  Posted: 7:04 AM, February 11th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi

I'm still here. Really struggling. I thought we might make it. now I don't Kmow...


Married 30yrs Me BW 57Yrs Him FWH 59yrs
OWzero 1988 EA?/PA? Gaslighted.
Dday May 28 2010.
OW1 1994(6mths PA, EA til dday).
OW2 2002(8yrs PA).
OW3 2009(1Yr PA).
Others???? Status: Not Divorcing..but.."You can't unfuck the goat"

Posts: 2729 | Registered: Jul 2010 | From: Australia
honesttoafault
♀ Member
Member # 27105
Default  Posted: 7:37 AM, February 11th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

{{{{{Laura}}}

Posts: 1903 | Registered: Jan 2010
honesttoafault
♀ Member
Member # 27105
Default  Posted: 7:44 AM, February 11th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Laura: I know this feels like another betrayal. I really do. WH's whole family knew and that hurt like hell. But I did find out later that one sister and her family did not talk to WH for a long time and yelled at him many times about this.
I would suggest talking more to your SIL and find out why she didn't tell you. It may have been that she was threatened not to tell you or she was confused about the right thing to do. I'm so sorry.

Ats: You said you were suspicious about this guy before. Remember, feelings don't necessarily reflect the truth. What does your GUT say.
You need to make FWW feel safe in disclosing any info to you. You first must decide within yourself what will you do if it IS true? What if WW still saw this guy for a while after DDay and your suspicions are true that when she got off the fence was when she really went into NC?
If you decide that you will continue to R even if the worst case scenario is true, let her know. Perhaps then she'll tell you the truth.

If it is true, you know yourself why she held back this info. She was/is afraid of losing you completely. This doesn't excuse withholding info, but truly understandable.

{{{ats}}


Posts: 1903 | Registered: Jan 2010
Laura28
♀ Member
Member # 28997
Default  Posted: 7:45 AM, February 11th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi honest

Please just talk to me. I;m falling apart.anything.


Married 30yrs Me BW 57Yrs Him FWH 59yrs
OWzero 1988 EA?/PA? Gaslighted.
Dday May 28 2010.
OW1 1994(6mths PA, EA til dday).
OW2 2002(8yrs PA).
OW3 2009(1Yr PA).
Others???? Status: Not Divorcing..but.."You can't unfuck the goat"

Posts: 2729 | Registered: Jul 2010 | From: Australia
honesttoafault
♀ Member
Member # 27105
Default  Posted: 7:47 AM, February 11th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

oh, Laura hang in there, vent here, I'm here

I reread your post. You said SIL knew about others? You mean others that WH didn't tell you?

[This message edited by honesttoafault at 7:51 AM, February 11th (Friday)]


Posts: 1903 | Registered: Jan 2010
honesttoafault
♀ Member
Member # 27105
Default  Posted: 7:55 AM, February 11th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Ok, Laura...hang in there.

Breathe...just calm down and breathe. It's okay...

Drink some tea and hug that cute dog of yours or take him for a walk.

This is TT and devastating and makes R so hard.

Breathe... and vent here.


Posts: 1903 | Registered: Jan 2010
iwantamiracle
♀ Member
Member # 22812
Default  Posted: 8:10 AM, February 11th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

hey laura:

did anything else happen?....

i think we need to put little perspective on this, k

she didn't tell you for probably very simple reasons...not too many people know that it IS better to tell, not too many people want to be "responsible" to tell, not to many people want to live with that responsibility, not too many people want to break up a marriage......especially if this is her family...the first instinct is to protect....

we raise our kids for the most part not to be tattletales, it is wrong to tell on another unless there is danger or property damage.....most parents instill this in their kids....they grow up and they still have that foundation....she is basically not being a tattletale....

then there is also the repurcussions that she would have to endure from him, her brother whom she loves...i am sure she does not want to hurt him....and then there is that old adage what you dont know cant hurt you.....something i am sure she embraced because it was "easier" then telling....


take some deep breaths, make some tea, if its nitetime have a glass of wine, or take a xanax...


ats: you need to ask her, without screaming, calmly and rationally without menace....ask her...


i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
atsenaotie
♂ Member
Member # 27650
Default  Posted: 8:20 AM, February 11th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

ats: you need to ask her, without screaming, calmly and rationally without menace....ask her...

You need to make FWW feel safe in disclosing any info to you.

I understand this concept, but with all due respect, I ain't gotta do nothin. I have been doing for 16 months since dday, on top of the 2.5 years before dday when I had been to IC and I was trying to make a better M while she was on to a 3 year A with the last OM. I am done. I have a life jacket, and I know how to swim. If the boat is still sinking, someone else needs to bail and make repairs if they want to save the ship.

Plus, if she denies I will not believe her. The 7 months of swearing I knew all there was to know and then turning my life upside down again killed my trust. The fact that she still hides true feelings from me keeps the stake in my trust.

What if WW still saw this guy for a while after DDay and your suspicions are true that when she got off the fence was when she really went into NC?

Then I am done.

If you decide that you will continue to R even if the worst-case scenario is true, let her know.

I won't. I have drawn enough lines in the sand.

Even if she is right and she was just having a tantrum about me giving away some cookies, I am tired of this non-communicative withdraw that leaves me hanging.

laura, honest has me wondering now too. Did you find out about other OW that you had not known of?

[This message edited by atsenaotie at 8:23 AM, February 11th (Friday)]


LTA BS 53
FWW 60
M 1990, dday 10-5-09
Reconciled

Posts: 3967 | Registered: Feb 2010 | From: FL
Laura28
♀ Member
Member # 28997
Default  Posted: 8:20 AM, February 11th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Honest

Yes. She says there were others. She says she doesn't know who. But he has a repetutation.


Married 30yrs Me BW 57Yrs Him FWH 59yrs
OWzero 1988 EA?/PA? Gaslighted.
Dday May 28 2010.
OW1 1994(6mths PA, EA til dday).
OW2 2002(8yrs PA).
OW3 2009(1Yr PA).
Others???? Status: Not Divorcing..but.."You can't unfuck the goat"

Posts: 2729 | Registered: Jul 2010 | From: Australia
honesttoafault
♀ Member
Member # 27105
Default  Posted: 8:40 AM, February 11th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Oh Laura, honey, I am sorry. It's ok to cry.

Now, the important part: don't let WH know your source!!!

If you decide to confront WH with this new info, DO NOT TELL HIM who told you this.

Now, lets try to separate feeling from fact. SIL says "he has a reputation" is based on rumor. (unfortunately true from hospital). See if you can get more info from her.

If you decide to confront WH that you have more info, again don't tell him where the info comes from, and he will push you to tell.

As Miracle and I have said to Ats, make WH feel "safe" and comfortable to tell you more info.


Ats: I know you feel you have had it. I truly understand. You have worked so hard and so long. Don't let all that go to waste.
Sit on your decision for a while and vent here. You need to vent. You have been carrying this M on your shoulders for a very long time and I think the resentment is coming out....


Posts: 1903 | Registered: Jan 2010
m334455
♀ Member
Member # 26893
Default  Posted: 8:42 AM, February 11th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(1) ATS -- I say push it. Why go this far and not push it? Tell her exactly what you just told us. "I think you had an A with that guy. I think you didn't stop having A's until 6 or 9 mos. after Dday. Etc." Does 2 things: (1) illustrates what her behavior has brought her and (2) lets her know you've got better radar now...

(2) Laura -- My guess is that if we ask around, every single one of us will find out that a lot of people knew. Don't worry about it. Why do people not tell? Well, lots of reasons. Forget about it. I think of it more like this: either just let it lie, or tell everyone and tell them that you had no idea! Maybe it seems stupid you didn't know, but all you saw was X, Y, Z...

(3) I felt like that for 5 yrs I was in the dark. And other people-strangers...knew more about my life than I did!

Ah. This feeling. Yes, I had this feeling at first. Actually, I knew everything about MY life! Just not my spouse. I wasn't there. I didn't do it. I was hurt, sure, but in the end I've acted with integrity.

So what if other people knew I was married to a jerk before I did? Yeah, I probably looked really stupid to some people, but that's OK. I was his #1 priority snow job, so of course I'm going to find out last! Plus, once I found out the shit storm was on...

Anyway, I got conned. It happens every day to people. I'm not the first woman in this world to get screwed over by her baby daddy. Again, super common. I thought it was love, it wasn't. I thought I was married, I wasn't. Etc. Yep. I got really fooled ad screwed.

Oh. Well.

I am not by ANY means minimizing the pain of this to me or to any of us. All I'm saying is -- is that really your life?

Isn't your life the day to day reality you experience?

Yes, knowing what your spouse does when you're not looking gives you valuable information -- but it's not really your life, it's theirs.

At the end of the day, I let him waste my time, to spend too much money, to contribute too little... my bad. I acted in good faith on bad information. That really sucks. Majorly. Now I have good information and I can act on that.

You have to go through the pain to get past it, there is no doubt about that, but the important thing to focus on is your vision of your future. If your spouse can't fit into it -- that is not your problem.

I don't know. I guess this sentiment makes me really mad because it's like your spouse's actions make you feel like your life was a lie -- BUT IT WASN'T -- your SPOUSE'S life was a lie! You were honest. Don't let this steal your whole life from you. Just don't.


BW 38, 5 kids
Dday Dec. 2009

Posts: 4034 | Registered: Dec 2009
iwantamiracle
♀ Member
Member # 22812
Default  Posted: 8:47 AM, February 11th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

ok laura big deep breath....you too ats.....


laura: she says there were more....does this confirm what you have felt, and will you confront him....

can you live with not knowing about them all?

ats: you already knew that there was more to know, she told you that....so is this your decision...that you cannot live with what you do not know....i fully respect that...it was my decision too......

laura: you too will probably have to decide whether or not you can live without knowing everything about his past.....

when there is a ws who has been cheating forever, or feels like forever...there is no possible way to know every little detail, but to know of each and every op at least for me is necessary....even the ones that were not successful but were attempted or even considered....

but so often as we all have seen over and over the ws refuses to give this info....for whatever reasons they refuse.....so a decision needs to be made regarding this...can you live without knowing about all the op's?.....its not easy, everytime you see someone you will wonder if this person was another....especially if the ws felt comfy enough to bring these people into your day to day lives, then everyone becomes a suspicion.....

i personally could not live without all truth...i knew i would never get past not knowing all of it....i needed to put it all together in order to put it away.....not having that opportunity has doomed my marriage, and has hindered my healing....

the path of least regret for me was not wasting anymore time, enough time i spent on a marriage that was a lie....for me doing it for another day was only adding to it...

for me, i have the other end of my decision which are my kids....i had to factor my kids into my decision.....so my marriage is over, but the family is together.....


decide what you can and cannot live with, not today, not even tomorrow, but next year.....then choose the path of least regret....will you still have regrets...maybe, nothing is ever concrete...but choose for the future...you can only choose based on the information you have now today.....you cannot control any other only yourself...so do not base your decision on another....base it on what you already know about your ws....if you feel that you need to give your ws a certain time period in which to fulfill your requirements...do so...you will probably regret it if you do not....people cannot know without being told...

in my instance pfm had 6 months...he chose not to comply, so it was and is on him......he decided that he could not honor my boundaries, my requirements, my dealbreakers......

only each of you know what you can and cannot live with...


and keep breathing...deep breaths...


((((laura))))
((((ats))))


i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
Allgoodnamesgone
♀ Member
Member # 26157
Default  Posted: 8:55 AM, February 11th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

((Laura))

Is it that he has a reputation and you think there are others that is primarily driving your emotional state at the momenet? Or is there something else. (It's not just that sil knew, is it?)


Me- BS
DDay- 8/26/09
Separated after failed R effort.

Posts: 2165 | Registered: Nov 2009
m334455
♀ Member
Member # 26893
Default  Posted: 9:01 AM, February 11th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Ah, miracle. You're so calming, and I'm so angry...

I"m repeating myself a bit here but bear with me: I work close to the Pentagon. On September 12th, 2001, my coworkers and I were all at work in our nasty, smoky office overlooking the smoldering Pentagon. Any one of us could have taken the day off -- but we didn't, because the terrorists can't win unless we actually let them win. It wasn't fun. About three weeks later -- one of my coworkers turned to me in disgust and said "when is it going to stop smelling like an effin' campfire in here?"...

The airport traffic stopped for maybe 6 months. Every night we were awakened by F-16's patrolling the skies. Even now, air traffic is heavily restricted and the flight patterns into and out of National are different from what they once were.

But, you know, we have gorgeous new offices in the next town down now. There are two lovely parks at the Pentagon. It doesn't stink anymore. It's lovelier than it once was. It doesn't mean we don't pause when we pass by the side of the building that was obliterated, or say a prayer when we drive by Arlington Cemetery, but it's been ten years. Life goes on.

Your life will go on. Ok? And it will be beautiful. Don't let today suck because "yesterday" some other people did something awful. That's on them, not you.


BW 38, 5 kids
Dday Dec. 2009

Posts: 4034 | Registered: Dec 2009
iwantamiracle
♀ Member
Member # 22812
Default  Posted: 9:20 AM, February 11th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

But, you know, we have gorgeous new offices in the next town down now. There are two lovely parks at the Pentagon. It doesn't stink anymore. It's lovelier than it once was. It doesn't mean we don't pause when we pass by the side of the building that was obliterated, or say a prayer when we drive by Arlington Cemetery, but it's been ten years. Life goes on.

yes m3 life does go on...and i love the way you put this, it really is a good example of what can be and what is....each of us has had a personal 9/11....


Your life will go on. Ok? And it will be beautiful. Don't let today suck because "yesterday" some other people did something awful. That's on them, not you.

while i love the sentiment, it isn't really yesterday for laura and ats...each new d-day is another blow ontop of the already smoldering pile of rubble....it will take a bit of time for that smoldering to come to a halt.....and it will come to a halt....and life will as you say go on....


i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
m334455
♀ Member
Member # 26893
Default  Posted: 9:37 AM, February 11th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thing is, miracle, if you try to R there is always going to be a blow.

For example, my WH "needs to go get a few things off the boat" on Sunday because it's going to be delivered to another marina to have work done on it.

Who knows? That's the sad thing. That's why I think trying to R might be a waste of time for us both. It's like when he went to New York with his boss for the day right before Christmas. Maybe.

There's really no way for him to win! It's so sad.

See -- with the NY thing I realized -- the problem isn't whether or not he's really going to NY with his boss or even at all -- the problem is that there was EVER ANY possibility that he was not.

But I can't let that ruin my day.

Though I did post the 'Mistress Day" article someone in General linked to onto my FB page, LOL.

Sigh.

And now, I'm going to enjoy my day!


BW 38, 5 kids
Dday Dec. 2009

Posts: 4034 | Registered: Dec 2009
Laura28
♀ Member
Member # 28997
Default  Posted: 9:39 AM, February 11th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thank you all. It is 2,30mam here . i am ehausted. I believe from what she saidthere were others, She doesn'tknow details but has suspected from things she'sheard for years.

He still denies any others exept OW0 - OW3. I don't know. I am exhausted. I found out about hem myself. he has b=never confessed to anything.

Thank younfor being here for me. I amgoig to bed. Takinmg something to sleep. I have told him to leave. he won't go.

Love and thaks to all

Laura


Married 30yrs Me BW 57Yrs Him FWH 59yrs
OWzero 1988 EA?/PA? Gaslighted.
Dday May 28 2010.
OW1 1994(6mths PA, EA til dday).
OW2 2002(8yrs PA).
OW3 2009(1Yr PA).
Others???? Status: Not Divorcing..but.."You can't unfuck the goat"

Posts: 2729 | Registered: Jul 2010 | From: Australia
Allgoodnamesgone
♀ Member
Member # 26157
Default  Posted: 9:45 AM, February 11th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Good night Laura. This too shall pass.

I've also been thinking a lot about the saying "It's darkest before the dawn" or something like that, lol. I don't know. Guess I should check that for accuracy since it's my mantra right now.


Me- BS
DDay- 8/26/09
Separated after failed R effort.

Posts: 2165 | Registered: Nov 2009
UKgirl
♀ Member
Member # 17062
Default  Posted: 9:53 AM, February 11th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

LookingforLove, sent you those paragraphs in a PM.

[[[[DP ]]]] (a few man-hugs! ), my Dad was in Burma too. Well, not in it, he mostly flew over it, dropping bombs or supplies. He has a “thing” about the far east, needless to say. I used to creep into his wardrobe and wear his leather flying jacket with the buckles and rabbit lining and the white silk scarf. It was the only thing he kept. It had a nice smell….. But I’m not sure what I was saying, I made a strange connection. I guess that I’m wondering if WH had to be a different person to have the affair. And in the same way, he doesn’t want to think about that time. The huge difference being that my Dad didn’t have a choice – he could only choose which service he went into if he joined before he was called up. WH had a choice to walk away. Obviously.

Ats, I think you have to say something to your FWW. And that you had your suspicions in the aftermath of dday. And that the chemistry on that evening told you what you suspected. And now you want the truth – again. While on the one hand it should make no difference now, it does on the other because it illustrates that she is still not an open book.

Laura, I think you need to speak more to your SIL. Once you’ve got your head straight and your nerves have stopped jangling. Take notes. Ask her all she knows. And I agree, do not divulge your source to your H. Sit on it for a bit before deciding what to do with this new information. Could it be wrong? And I can understand her keeping quiet – it’s a cleft stick for her and definitely no win whatever she did.

Meanwhile, I still have the “gut” feeling with FWH. It has faded somewhat, but I still think something has gone off (and I’m not talking fish either). I think I will have to tackle it head on and make sure I am watching his body language and listening for contradictions in his words. He is a good liar, so good he even believes it himself. I might end up giving him the rewritten marriage document. An analysis of every year from when we first met – and a preamble on his forgotten engagement to his gf……

We know what our FWS’s are capable of. We really shouldn’t be surprised or shocked by more crap coming out of the woodwork. We let them know that WE know and hold them to the same moral standards we have running through our veins. From now on, we do not accept less than the acceptable. Our intuition has been sanded down and polished to be sparklingly efficient. Be determined, be strong.

Read or listen to inspirational stuff. Like Wear Sunscreen. Or Kipling’s If poem. Or Desiderata of Happiness.

M33’s right. Whatever happens, the world will keep on turning, the sun will rise each day, babies will be born, people will die. And we have to go with it too, however much it hurts.

Hugs tribe.

ETA Allgood, I usually think that at 4am. And start humming "In the wee small hours of the morrrn-ing...." And that’s more than three hours before dawn.
Laura honey, sleep well.

[This message edited by UKgirl at 9:58 AM, February 11th (Friday)]


D-Day: 30 July 2006 LTA: 5yrs
Me, BS, 56 y/o Him, WS, 57 y/o
MOW, pathetic ex-fiancee.
3 grown boys and one 18 y/o
I don't consider myself married anymore.
There are some words once spoken split the world in two. Before you say them and after.

Posts: 3328 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: UK
ImNellNow
♀ Member
Member # 28753
Default  Posted: 10:35 AM, February 11th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Laura and ats,
Before you do anything... both of you... please find your own centers. For your own good. Breathe, exercise, scream and cry, then find the strength in your core.

I am so sorry that your hurt is so fresh and I am sending my love to you.

Here's my feel-good story for today. (Laura and ats, you have kiddos... I know you have had moments like this!) We had a parent-teacher conference last night for Boyo1, my challenging guy. The teacher told us how great he was, ect. Anyway. They are practicing writing by keeping journals. And in one of the journal entries, Boyo1 wrote about me:
My mom is smart. She is funny. I feel safe when I am with my mom. She is a good cook. She is pretty.

It made me feel so good to see that Boyo1 sees me in such a positive way. So, in that vein...

Laura,
You are smart. You are loving. You are responsible. You are a great mom. You have a beautiful home and are sending even more beauty in the world every time one of your butterflies hatches. You make yourself happy by doing good things for people. People know they can depend upon you. People respect you because you treat yourself and others with respect. You are beautiful and kind with a soft heart and a spine of steel.

ats,
You are a wonderful man. You are strong. You are handsome. You are loving, compassionate and understanding. You are a great dad. You see the beauty in the world and in people because you have a beautiful soul. You can make yourself happy and because you are at peace with yourself, you can enjoy the quiet solitude of a day on your boat. You know yourself and you like yourself.


BS & D
Drinking wine and thinking bliss is on the other side of this.

Posts: 2370 | Registered: Jun 2010 | From: Baby steps on my new path
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