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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: Betrayed Men-Part 7
reallyscrewedup7
♂ Member
Member # 30825
Default  Posted: 8:14 AM, January 18th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

CaptainTal
Newbie here too, but your story really hits me too. I have a million questions for you, none of which you need to answer if you don't.

The first one is: has your wife explained how she could turn back on Christ and God so easily?? Strange as this may sound, and the affair and all the damned lies really piss me off, but forsaking vows made to God really has just about made the decision for me to move on.

Really, I will be fine. My kids will be fine. I can't live with someone who can chuck everything that was at their "core" so easily.

I'll have a bunch more later...


Infidelity sucks shit

Posts: 879 | Registered: Jan 2011 | From: Finding my way
OnceInALifetime
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Member # 26023
Default  Posted: 8:35 AM, January 18th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My anger towards women in general comes from just not seeing much personal evidence to support the contrary. My XW cheated with an insane number of men. My close friends, the ones who are close enough to actually talk with me about it, all tell me how unhappy their marriages are. In each case, it's because (according to them) their wives are just impossible to please. These guys are well educated, easy to get along with, have strong work ethics, and are good providers. I know their wives, and their sense of entitlement and dissatisfaction ebbs through. They're all too happy to poke fun of their husbands during social events, but I've yet to hear them give a compliment.

My mother was an "other woman" after she divorced my father. She had this romantic attachment to what she would deem adventure (the idea that all is fair in romantic love; she was a huge fan of that damned Bridges of Madison County book).

It may be that my friends and I have all been enablers, that we have all been attracted to the wrong sort of women. I don't deny that possibility. But I also believe that society often (not always) supports a sense of entitlement in women, teaching them that men are there to take care of them.

I need to work on trying to see the good that's out there, and then trusting my ability to discern it before ever getting intimate with anyone.

My only other choices are to go to the dark side and use them and lose them. Or die a celibate.


BH, now divorced

Posts: 3012 | Registered: Oct 2009
Proview
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Member # 24215
Default  Posted: 9:07 AM, January 18th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

-OK..wow after reading this post, I dont know what to say except fellas...GET THE HELL OUT OF THE USA!!!

I have traveled all over the world for a lot of my military experience and I must say that every guy...divorced, single, or thinking about free falling into the void of marriage (im not anti marriage-its just that u never know what your getting into)...---> GO TO THE FOLLOWING COUNTRIES TO SEE WHAT WOMEN REALLY ARE LIKE WITHOUT THE SELFISH BS ENTITLEMENT ISSUES: Brazil, Costa Rico, Dominican Republic, Germany, and Japan. Then come back and tell that life wont get any better for you. There are some real women abroad and who will let you know how real women will treat you as a man. I know some women are reading this with there panties in a bunch but screw it. I have watched too many of my brothers in arms get screwed over by these pretty pampered selfish, me too women in the US. This may be a little TMI. But i already told my wife if we get divorced, I am out of the US market. Women abroad treat men waaayyy better than we get treated domestically. Sorry ladies but you really need to up your game (not saying there arent some that dont).
Having experienced different culutures, makes you really re-evaluate yourself. Where in the US, kindness is considered weakness, foreign women consider it endearing.
No disrespect to the ladies that are doing their thing every day, but by in large, dating a woman abroad will give you as a man a better sense of self. No one complained when some females were screaming for equality! Where were is the equality in a court system that turns women into permanent dependents? Even child support ends after 18 years. If we are all equal then why should men get crushed in the legal system under the divorce law especially if they were the BHs. dunno just my 2 cent..end of rant...well almost.

Guys, get off your butts and get out there. There are good women out in the world esp at the ratio of 8 women to every 1 guy world wide.
You guys have only had 1 of your 7. LOL. you got 7 other shots..dont be bitter, jaded, and cynical. Learn from your mistakes and successes. Take those 7 other shots. Dont be defeated by the first go round, the fight aint over. This is life and its what you make it. Dont sit it out just bc the first flavor of ice cream you tried gave you indigestion. I bet you there are the some other flavors that if you try them, youll like them.

[This message edited by Proview at 9:11 AM, January 18th (Tuesday)]


Posts: 81 | Registered: May 2009 | From: AZ transplant
Proview
♂ Member
Member # 24215
Default  Posted: 9:17 AM, January 18th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

forgot one last thing...

my very good friend just emailed to say hello and that he and his australian bombshell celebrated their 10th year together and he ran into his ex at the mall shopping. Talk about jaw on the floor. he sent me a picture of what his lady was wearing versus the ex...5 minutes later his ex went into dillards and CHANGED outfits and made sure he saw her in her "new supertight clothes". He said he couldnt stop laughing and neither could his lady....THE BEST REVENGE IS LIVING WELL. dunno who said it but they knew what they were talking...open your hand and heart and let go the anger, hurt, resentment...who knows, while each one of them is open, something good can come right on in...esp if your in the right country!


Posts: 81 | Registered: May 2009 | From: AZ transplant
Jimi40
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Member # 10909
Default  Posted: 10:21 AM, January 18th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Proview, I hear what you're sayin'. I have heard, but not witnessed personally, about other cultures.

So you believe we made this bed that we are lying in? Historically speaking.


You've got nowhere to fall, when your back's to the wall.

Posts: 5524 | Registered: Jun 2006 | From: Niagara
64fleet
♂ Member
Member # 18710
Default  Posted: 11:51 AM, January 18th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I posted earlier, my Dad remarried an Egyptian, he's never been happier. Throw in the cost of living & this country/continent really sucks-his rent/utilities cost him $100/month in downtown Cairo.

Like jimi, every woman I have ever dated screwed around on me-I wonder how it can be me.


time wounds all heels

Posts: 5359 | Registered: Mar 2008 | From: deliverance land
lostcause111
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Member # 19109
Default  Posted: 1:10 PM, January 18th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

If I took the women I have known to me their are two types of women.

1) Peaceful. looks for win win. Fights you on the real BS lets little shit slide. Can have a real talk without defense mechanisms comming in. WS thatget it here on SI are the perfect example.

2) My wife. Fights over nothing. needs to be put in her place. Is often full of shit. So much so her asshole gets jealous. LOL. All real conversations turn into her a deer in the headlights or deflecting.

My wife is a two in spades.

I have realized in the 3 years since d-day my wife will never become a one.

I healed myself and realize real conversations will NEVER happen but in my desire to keep the kids in my life I have given up on ever having an 1.

But something in me has changed. I am me 100% all of the time.

And with regard to the question are you happy staying with WW for me the answer is moot. She simply serves a purpose much like a temperamental refrigerator. She contributes income, cares for the children, provides companionship and occasional sex.

I am happy that I am me again and dont need my M to make me happy.

I choose to be happy because I like being happy.

My marriage was never going to have a proper R because of the severe issues my wife has that I tried in vain to help her with. MC IC books name it.

I have at many levels given up. I cannot fix her issues and when I look back I am a good husband. I treat her with respect (not earned) and care but have NO tolerance for BS.

I dealt with my issue. i stopped being me and let her mold me into some pathetic man whose whole life was the relationship.

I have a life that includes her but is no longer defined by her.

This may seem cold but in a way it is not. I have eased the burden on her and most of all myself.

Cant get blood from a stone IE cant get a real relationship from my wife with mental issues.

This is a yin ang relationship. She starts I stand we have sex. Make NO sense at all and NOT AT ALL what I truely want.

But seeing my childrens eyes daily makes it worth it.

But on the same token I will be me even if the M ends as a result. I will never go back to being the LC that got lost because of "love".


Posts: 934 | Registered: Apr 2008
64fleet
♂ Member
Member # 18710
Default  Posted: 1:19 PM, January 18th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

But seeing my childrens eyes daily makes it worth it.

x2-if the court system was fair I would D, but IRL it means seeing my kids every other weekend if I want a real M.


time wounds all heels

Posts: 5359 | Registered: Mar 2008 | From: deliverance land
Mr. Kite
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Member # 28840
Default  Posted: 1:42 PM, January 18th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Guys i think you do yourselves a great disservice to tar all women with the same brush.

This! The sense of entitlement, ie., that the world owes me something, can usually be found wherever children are raised with more money and opportunities. Some will grow up with that mindset, while others won't. This is not just found in America or the Western world, but wherever parents raise their children like little princes and princesses.

For every scumbag woman who cheats on her husband or boyfriend, there's a scumbag man waiting there to take her up on the offer. Lack of morals, ethics, and decency cuts equally across both sexual genders.

I was married and divorced twice by the age of 26. The first one, I was 22 and she was 20 when we married. She was of Mexican descent, I'm white. I decided that if I didn't get laid every night that the marriage wasn't working. She found her happiness in shopping, TV, and sleeping 10 to 12 hours a night. We were both wrong. The marriage ended after less than three years without adultery on her part as far as I know.

Three months after the divorce was final I married a woman of Filipino/Mexican descent. That lasted three months and was annulled due to the fact that both of us were violent, crazy alcoholics. No adultery on her part as far as I know.

Then I waited 8 years to be married again. This time to WW who is white. We have staggered through 25 years of marriage. She was cold as a tomb when I met her and still is.

The common thread through all three marriages is that at the time just before the weddings, my gut was screaming "No, you idiot! Don't do this." People came out of the woodwork to confirm what my intuition was telling me. But I didn't listen.

It's not my fault that WW is a lying, cheating woman with the emotional capacity of a snake. It is my fault that I married her. No one twisted my arm. Quite the opposite. I made a bad choice and paid dearly for it.

Excellent post, lostcause111.

I have a life that includes her but is no longer defined by her.

This may seem cold but in a way it is not. I have eased the burden on her and most of all myself.

Words of wisdom.


Posts: 900 | Registered: Jun 2010 | From: Mid-Atlantic
BrokenHead
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Member # 24218
Default  Posted: 2:05 PM, January 18th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Although I do not think our WW's behaviors/issues apply to all women in general, I see way to many cases in my little world to think we are just totally jaded.

I do know a few women who seem to pull their own weight, have a balanced, honest, rational relationship with their husbands.

I'd like to be that lucky. Mine hasn't worked a hard day in 25 years, complains how she is bored and no one in her life pays attention to her, is a online shop/return-aholic and facebook addict. Of course it was easy when my boys were younger since they gave her "all" of the attention.

I wonder as I think over my all my relationships in my life there is a pattern. I am a MIDDLE child...and all the affair/entitlement issue-based relationships (including my WW) were with LAST children.

In fact the only MIDDLE child I dated was my high school sweetheart (and my mom in her later years admitted she was the only one she approved of) whom I let get away when I focused on college and partying. I have no experience with FIRST children.

But man is there a pattern here?


Posts: 144 | Registered: Jun 2009
Mr. Kite
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Member # 28840
Default  Posted: 3:16 PM, January 18th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I am also the middle child with an older and younger brother.

First wife was youngest child, with an older sister and two older brothers.
Second wife was oldest child with a younger sister and brother.
WW is oldest child with a younger brother and two younger sisters. No discernible pattern here.

All three sets of parents were middle class with no alcoholism, drug abuse, divorce, or adultery that I was aware of.

First wife got remarried and divorced. Second wife was remarried and divorced twice. Among WW's siblings, one sister has been married for 30 years to an abusive, alcoholic, lying jerk. The other sister has been married and divorced twice. The younger brother has been married and divorced once.

WW will sometime this year most likely experience her second divorce. Six destroyed marriages among four children brought up in a stable, middle class, Catholic home. How did this happen? Maybe it's a generational thing.


Posts: 900 | Registered: Jun 2010 | From: Mid-Atlantic
64fleet
♂ Member
Member # 18710
Default  Posted: 3:54 PM, January 18th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Six destroyed marriages among four children brought up in a stable, middle class, Catholic home

My WW's family to a tee-its her second M(1st failed due to A), her sister's second is failing(her spouse is a WW)her bro just got M'd for the third time.


time wounds all heels

Posts: 5359 | Registered: Mar 2008 | From: deliverance land
SourCherryDrops
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Member # 25883
Default  Posted: 2:04 AM, January 19th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Six destroyed marriages among four children brought up in a stable, middle class, Catholic home. How did this happen? Maybe it's a generational thing.

I dont think that its a generational thing so much, but rather a societal thing. Unfortunately i think in the western world its almost in a self re-inforcing cycle. I agree with what MrKite said

This is not just found in America or the Western world, but wherever parents raise their children like little princes and princesses.

The thing with the western world is the on comparision parents usually have the resources to provide significantly more to their children that what is actually needed. And well, as a parent in that situation myself, i cant really blame them, I want to give my kids as much as i can.

As such i think our society is going to have to face the consequences of an ever increasing feeling of entitlement, from both its men and women.

Then again older generations have been saying the whole place is going to the dogs for thousands of years... perhapes im just getting old and crotchety.

More likely society is just changing, and what will be normal for my kids will seem a little weird and somehow wrong to me, and vice versa, just as some parts of society during my grandparents times seem wrong or weird to me now.


Me BS 37, Her STBX 34, 1*ONS, 1*EA 1*PA/EA, 2*PA
Heading for D after 9 mths of R

Posts: 1468 | Registered: Oct 2009 | From: Europe
jjct
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Member # 17484
Default  Posted: 7:42 AM, January 19th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

She simply serves a purpose much like a temperamental refrigerator.

Funny. Mine was a temperamental oven.
She too, sat around, no job, complaining about having no purpose (in-between shopping and seducing other men).
She "serves a purpose" - but not for me anymore.

Advertising works or they wouldn't do it.
What I find very interesting is the psychology of it - the psychosis of it.
Look,
try an experiment. Ask people if they are affected by commercials. Outside of running out at midnight for a burrito after a Taco Bell commercial, very few will admit to being swayed, coerced, propagandized, or in the slightest way affected by the "dumb things". Many will say they mute the suckers when they come on (except for the superbowl, or funny ones).

That means there's a strong element of DENIAL.
All together now, what does denial lead to?
Yep. Impulsive behaviors...

Ponder that gents.
Add to that the fact that the cartoons, videos, and movies - the entire entertainment industry is just one big commercial and whaddya expect?

Low-hanging fruit to discern how the Cinderella, Ivanho, rescue/redemption meme has become embedded in the hive mind.

It's bullshit, and why my toleration for those images and their subsequent 'sales' is at zero.


Posts: 6019 | Registered: Dec 2007 | From: texas
SI Staff
Moderator
Member # 10
Default  Posted: 10:09 AM, January 19th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

WARNING

This will be the final warning on this thread. If there is any further generalizing, this thread will be shut down permanently and those responsible will be banned.

Those of you that are forcing us to even have to do this final warning, know who you are.


Posts: 10000 | Registered: May 2002
CaptainTal
♂ New Member
Member # 30766
Default  Posted: 10:56 AM, January 19th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

With all due respect, I think the "generalizing" rule can be hard to understand in terms of its application and what seems to me to be selective enforcement. The guideline states the following: "Please refrain from making statements that generalize gender, WS/OP/BS, race, religion or political alignment. Also do not presume to speak on behalf of other people."

As just one of many examples, there is a very popular thread, I believe in JFO, called "Honey, they always affair down". Is this not a generalization? And does this not specifically generalize the OP (as well as in a way the WS?) Yet despite being in that thread many times as a lurker before signing up, and despite it being over a year old, I've seen no warning in it regarding generalizing.

So then is the rule only enforced if considered "offensive"? (In this case a generalization might be seen as offensive to women). But if this is the case, please help me understand what is and is not generalizing:

1) The courts are slanted in favor of women

2) The courts are OFTEN slanted in favor of women

3) IN MY OPINION the courts are slanted in favor of women

Of these 3, which would you consider generalizing? And can the mods all agree on which of these is generalizing?

Also, is generalizing allowed when it is true? The following statement is certainly a generalization: "All Wayward Spouses bring great harm to their Betrayed Spouses". I am making a generalized statement about BS's that they are all hurt by affairs. Is that allowed? Certainly not if we follow the letter of the law, but I doubt I'd get in any trouble for saying it.

I'm honestly not trying to be disrespectful or sarcastic here, I just know that there are many hurting men on this board and that losing our thread would be harmful to some guys, myself included, who draw a lot of strength from it. (I'd also question why a thread would be shut down for a violation - isn't that punishing everyone for a few people's actions? And in a way, isn't that generalizing punishment?)

So with this in mind, I am respectfully asking for some clarification as to what will get us in trouble for generalizing? Is it only something that might be considered offensive (and how is that defined) or is it everything? And if it is everything, please help us understand why this isn't being enforced across the forums as per my earlier example.

I'm grateful for the opportunity to post here, and I hope we can all clear this up and move forward in our healing process.

Best regards,
Captain Tal

[This message edited by CaptainTal at 10:59 AM, January 19th (Wednesday)]


Me: BH (31)
Her: WW (30)
3 kids: 6,4,1
D-day: 06/29/10. False R through November. Now working on real R. Or so I'm led to believe.


Posts: 18 | Registered: Jan 2011 | From: United States
MangledHeart
♂ Webmaster
Member # 1
Red  Posted: 11:40 AM, January 19th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

The guidelines are enforced regardless if they are found offensive. The guideline speaks for itself. All of the moderators, administrators and myself agree that the posts in question were generalizations. We are simply making it clear that we are at the end of our rope with the generalization on this thread.

Members have already been banned. But we have some concerns the banning solution may not put an end to the problem. Hopefully the blatant warning will.

The warning is regarding this thread. If you wish to draw our attention to another thread, do it privately, as the guidelines suggest.


Worry does not empty tomorrow of its sorrow; it empties today of its strength. ~Corrie Ten Boom

Posts: 4834 | Registered: May 2002 | From: Texas
BrokenHead
♂ Member
Member # 24218
Default  Posted: 11:54 AM, January 19th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Tal,
I agree completely, mods can you please give us some examples?

Are you saying it is OK to bash/complain/whine about MY WW's behaviors..and not to try and bring an understanding in a _general_ sense that helps other BSs cope/understand WWs insanities as well as our own?

I think what we are doing is gathering a bunch of observations and performing some analysis for the benefit of those being hit by the same stick, yes?

I would expect to be called out if I was just flaming women in general.

I have no support system in my life and being able to read and post in forums like has saved me a time or two.


Posts: 144 | Registered: Jun 2009
OnceInALifetime
♂ Member
Member # 26023
Default  Posted: 11:59 AM, January 19th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

By this token, the generalizations found in JFO and General regarding wayward spouses and affair partners are so rampant as to warrant shutting down all of SI.

I think the generalizations that you are most troubled by are the sexist ones.

Yes, we have a lot of anger, some of that directed at women in general, especially those men who were betrayed by multiple different women. Perhaps expressing that anger, or what some us see as generalizations that are actually true in society, is not healthy, but I'm not so sure of that.


BH, now divorced

Posts: 3012 | Registered: Oct 2009
Deeply Scared
♀ Administrator
Member # 2
Red  Posted: 12:02 PM, January 19th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'm not sure why the concept of talking about your OWN situation seems so foriegn to many of you.

Do not generalize...it's really that simple.

Read above what MangledHeart posted...it's very clear.


"Don't give up, the beginning is always the hardest." My Mom:)

My tolerance for stupid shit is getting less and less.


Posts: 192049 | Registered: May 2002
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