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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: Betrayed Men-Part 7
stilllovingher
♂ Member
Member # 29959
Default  Posted: 11:38 AM, July 6th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

The prob is I lose weight really quick on my normal diet. So the extra cals from the shakes help with that. I only drink them after I work out too. I do keep in mind the temporary gain aspect of them and that's why I dont do them every day, if I know I'm gonna have a good dinner I skip the drink.
I appreciate all the input guys,thanks.
Going to the gym has been such an awesome relief from all this! I just wanna make sure I get all I can from it.


The only difference between a butt kisser and a brown noser is depth perception.
I'm sure WAL would agree.

Posts: 2385 | Registered: Oct 2010 | From: still BFE, but now BFE, CA
oftenwrong
♂ Member
Member # 27822
Default  Posted: 2:18 PM, July 6th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hello Gents,

Been a long while since I have been on. I recommended some friends to this site and am hopeful they will find some answers.

I am a bit saddened however to see some of the brothers on here standing still on progress. When I joined 16 months ago, many of your stories were heart breaking and you seemed in an impossible situation. Your search for answers didn't stop and you continued to work on solutions.

However, coming up on the 2 year mark, some of your situations seem stuck in time and have not evolved even an inch in this large span of time.

Unfortunately I don't have the answers for you other than what I have championed since I joined. I wanted to acknowledge that it must be a daily living hell with not a sliver of hope on the horizon. I can't imagine what that is like.

If you are in this type of situation, I hope you do not lose your identity and long term happiness in the process. Stay strong.


ME - BSO (35 yrs old)
Her - XWSO (31 yrs old)
LTR 10 years - There can be no 2nd chances


Posts: 995 | Registered: Mar 2010
64fleet
♂ Member
Member # 18710
Default  Posted: 2:50 PM, July 6th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

sorry to disappoint oftenwrong-I got an unmedicated bi-polar WW, & don't see any way out until kids are 18 or one of us dies. I'm hoping for the latter...


time wounds all heels

Posts: 5359 | Registered: Mar 2008 | From: deliverance land
jsngold
♂ Member
Member # 27699
Default  Posted: 2:36 AM, July 7th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Exactly. But it can be a long time to wait until the kids turn 18. Until then, limbo just sucks the life out of you.


BH: 37 (me)
WW: 37 (her) SAB, EA (but not PA, or so she says)
Married: 12.5 years
Kids: 12, 9, and 7
D-Day: 7 Feb 2010
Divorced: 22 July 2012

Posts: 101 | Registered: Feb 2010
oftenwrong
♂ Member
Member # 27822
Default  Posted: 8:37 AM, July 7th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Here is the longer term issue I have noticed:

Humans unconciously pick up traits, mannerisms and thought processes of those around them. This kind of emulation helps us form bonds and community. It keeps a group cohesive and in line with the social norms.

Now, take an imbalanced, mentally ill person who basically is in charge. I say she is in charge because she decides your fate. You would rather not be there. You would rather be removed from this person. She feels differently and therefor calls the shots.

Since she is in the position of defacto leader, her mental instabillity will begin to start rubbing off on you. You will begin to take on characteristics of her behavior and mental imbalance. It is a very very bad situation. The longer you are in this situation, the more permanently ingrained these traits become in you.

It is why husbands sometimes emulate the symptoms of pregnant woman. It is why mass hysteria is contagious. It is why group mentality is so effective.

What I am saying is, you can conceivably take on traits that mirror bi-polar and integrate them permanently in to your own personality.

I know the cost of you leaving is enormous. I know that means you giving up everything you have ever cherished and valued. It is the most unjust, unfair thing that was forced on you for no good reason.

However 64fleet, your sanity, your long term outlook, your long term happiness far outweighs these things. I know it doesn't seem like that now. You are living a slow torture that chips away at your soul each and every day. When your kids are grown and leave the house, and you finally free these chains, what will be left of 64fleet? Each day, a little piece of you is taken away and your soul begins to erode more and more. I see the anger, bitterness and resentment in your posts.

You are an intelligent, honerable man. You deserve better. You deserve to keep your sanity, your morals, your life, and that spark which keeps us having hope and optimism for the future.

I see that die each day in you. It isn't worth it brother. Don't become a shell of what you used to be. You and your kids deserve to have a 64fleet that is happy, joyfull, optimistic, and fullfilled. What is that cost? For me personally, there is no cost too great to achieve that.


ME - BSO (35 yrs old)
Her - XWSO (31 yrs old)
LTR 10 years - There can be no 2nd chances


Posts: 995 | Registered: Mar 2010
oftenwrong
♂ Member
Member # 27822
Default  Posted: 8:43 AM, July 7th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Also,

Having dated un-medicated bi polar woman myself... I can tell you that there is zero hope for the future if they don't seek intensive help.

Even then, it is a very long, slow process without any guaruntee it will have any long term benefit.

Even after medication and they are a bit more stabalized, their thought processes are still so skewed and one sided.


ME - BSO (35 yrs old)
Her - XWSO (31 yrs old)
LTR 10 years - There can be no 2nd chances


Posts: 995 | Registered: Mar 2010
64fleet
♂ Member
Member # 18710
Default  Posted: 10:57 AM, July 7th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I just really don't see any way out-she's guaranteed full-time custody according to all the lawyers I've spoken with, then my kids are w/her 95% of the time w/o me to buffer+I don't get to see them except every other weekend, while CS takes 2/3rd of my paycheck-then 10% of whats left goes to a lawyer. Or I could become a deadbeat dad working for cash only w/o paying any CS.

I refuse to reward her for fucking around on me.

[This message edited by 64fleet at 10:58 AM, July 7th (Thursday)]


time wounds all heels

Posts: 5359 | Registered: Mar 2008 | From: deliverance land
oftenwrong
♂ Member
Member # 27822
Default  Posted: 1:43 PM, July 7th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

If you don't mind me asking.. Why would she be gaurunteed full custody? That seems awfully drastic.


ME - BSO (35 yrs old)
Her - XWSO (31 yrs old)
LTR 10 years - There can be no 2nd chances


Posts: 995 | Registered: Mar 2010
64fleet
♂ Member
Member # 18710
Default  Posted: 4:34 PM, July 7th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Most judges here in the armpit of America are old men, who automatically award custody to the mother most every time. No lawyer I found would fight for full custody for me-I just don't have the $$$$. She has bennies(hlth/dentl) @her job, I have none and she works with lawyers every day in her job. On paper she's great-they don't know about her driving drunk w/the kids, the mania, a whole 750ml bottle of Patron in one nite, etc.
I'm screwed when it comes to custody, so at least I can see my kids daily. I truly love my kids.

I know of only one guy who has custody of his 2 girls-his druggie ex-W is in the pen.

On the flip side-she's been sober over 3 yrs, and is a much better mother than ever before. When she's not manic she's great. I had no idea about bi-polar stuff until after we M'd, she mentioned her aunt had been institutionalized for bi-polar behavior-her aunt actually lost grip on reality-I looked it up & saw similar behavior in her...posting/reading here has pretty much convinced me she's bi-polar. There's nothing quite like her screaming at me & the kids then her wanting to fuck me 10 mins later.

To be honest-she tries really hard, & the dry drunk syndrome has really just about disappeared. There's just too much damage, IMO for me to really love her again.


time wounds all heels

Posts: 5359 | Registered: Mar 2008 | From: deliverance land
wincing_at_light
♂ Member
Member # 14393
Default  Posted: 4:50 PM, July 7th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Not to speak for 64fleet, but probably for the same reason that I saw on another board this week.

In that situation, a FWW a few years removed from her A has decided to divorce he husband for completely non-A reasons that mostly have to do with compatibility at this point. Recognizing that she essentially treated her marriage like crap, put her husband through a ton of distress with the A and a persistent mental illness (happens to be bipolar disorder, in this case), and understanding that she's bailing on a marriage he still wants to be in, she's willing to be completely amicable.

But she expects full custody of the kids, and states she'd be shocked if her husband fought her on that, and she's looking for a place to live...only to be advised that she should demand the marital home in the divorce because the judge will give it to her. He's the one who should have to move so her kids won't have to adjust to a new place, and he's an asshole if he doesn't see it that way -- won't, in other words, put the best interest of the children first.

The gaggle of advisors (BS and WS alike) have essentially convinced her that she's completely in the right in divorcing him, he should suck it up and view the divorce through the lens of his failures to please her or change to suit her after her A, and *he* should be the one to start from scratch and finance her new life at the same time. Hell, they get pissy when he resists any of her ideas or insists on looking out for his own interests/future because she's, essentially, already wasted enough of her life on him.

(Which boggles me, because as someone with a bipolar spouse, it's crystal clear to me that this woman has been teetering on the edge of mania for like three solid months now, and the sudden impetus to divorce is part of the manic process. Everyone else just tells her how spectacular she is, how energetic and awesome and wish they had the gumption she had to start a new life.)

But underlining all of this is the assumption from everyone posting to her that she will get the kids and the house and everything else, and for him to demand anything is selfishness in the extreme. (This is, I recognize, part of message board dynamics, where we tend to support the partner we know from the board while accepting what they say about their spouse at face value. Hell, I see it here all the time. I am frequently baffled by some of the patently horrible "You go, girl!" advice that gets tossed around. But sometimes that's what a message board is for: we're the cheerleaders for people who are going to do what they want to do, regardless of the fact that you can see they're at least half the problem and the disastrous consequences of the decisions they're going to make are obvious five miles off. It happens so often, there are posters I specifically do not read because I know they're going to get horrible, soul-wrecking, relationship-ending advice every time they post because people just like them. And then I wait for the inevitable -- and it's always inevitable -- train wreck followed by "Why do I always end up with crappy people?" wailing.)

But here's the thing: there are actual lawyers telling her that it will go down in her favor, and if it doesn't, it's a miscarriage of justice, because mom's almost always get full custody if they want it. And if they get full custody, they get the house, and if the house has a mortgage, the husband should expect to pay half of it...because she was a SAHM and didn't have his opportunities (despite, you know, the fact that she *wanted* to be that, plus had mental health issues that interfered with her employability, etc.)

If you're in the Midwest and divorcing -- especially the rural Midwest -- that sort of thing is the norm. Of all the divorced people I know, literally two of the men have 50/50 custody arrangements. None of them have primary custody, though a couple have functionally primary custody because their ex-wives bailed, don't want the kids, and are happy to let him have them as long as he pays up on his CS.

Now, I've heard stories, and even seen a few cases here on SI, where the men got custody, or 50/50, had a really good men's rights attorney or some other combination of fortune or luck, and didn't end up neck deep in CS and alimony for the next 15-20 years, but those are rare enough to almost qualify as pipe dreams.

Admittedly, this is all anecdotal. Maybe the trends are different in other places, larger cities, etc.


Machiavellian idiot savant

Posts: 6690 | Registered: Apr 2007 | From: Indiana
64fleet
♂ Member
Member # 18710
Default  Posted: 6:27 PM, July 7th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

A guy I went to school with lives in a camper now-his WW claimed stress from the D during the D & quit her job so now he pays house payment/CS/car payment etc etc.-court ordered every bit. She has custody of kids, he pays for everything-he works 80hrs a wk & lives in a camper in his neighbor's yard. He says he's glad he got the camper trailer-that abt all he ended up with. This all went down last winter.

A richer buddy of mine has D'd two WW, has cost him $250k so far-he still actually helps his ex's kids 'cause she's a druggie & no longer cares.
I don't have anywhere near that kind of money.

I was a SAHD(I quit when my boy was always sick from daycare/abt 6mos old-had breathing troubles when he was a baby) until Dday, I was shocked I had no chance @full custody. I was told 50/50 was a very very slight chance if I had the cash.


time wounds all heels

Posts: 5359 | Registered: Mar 2008 | From: deliverance land
lostcause111
♂ Member
Member # 19109
Default  Posted: 10:13 AM, July 8th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

The slants of the legal system DISGUST me.

It is my fear.

To me your outcome is more determined by the judge you get than anything you do and in my case I think half would be easy.

Well not so fast. I looked over things in my area and it would be like the lotto and I dont like playing that with my children.

But i will in some ways agree with oftenwrong and maybe this makes me a bit different.

Because for now i choose to stay for the kids does not mean at all that I do not do what I want, speak my mind, demand respect, and get my needs met elsewhere if necessary. I still perform husbandly duties and am nice. But things that would get me throttled. You are going over their? The constant spying she does on me I laugh about because their is nothing on me, and disrespect is met with a ruthless response.

If the new me causes her to leave that is her choice. Life is too short to be a martyr and continue to be a doormat and not have a life.

I have a life that no longer evolves around my marriage. It revolves around taking care of me and being the best father I can be. Nothing else matters to me anymore because even though I am stuck I take what I can and enjoy the things I can do and enjoy and dontreally care how WW or anybody thinks about it.

The ironic thing is things at times are better with us and the new me (still NOWHERE near the mark) but i doubt it would matter at this point.

That boat has sailed and I dont care to R anymore and am OK with it.

I know what I tried and it was all and I take peace in that.

I also realize my wife is mentally ill and their si not a damn thing i can do about it EXCEPT not tolerate it.


Posts: 934 | Registered: Apr 2008
oftenwrong
♂ Member
Member # 27822
Default  Posted: 11:07 AM, July 9th (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

64fleet,

Given this situation, what are you doing to ensure your own mental balance and stabillity? I know that you said you don't care anymore and wrote off the M.

However, it doesn't seem to be the case sometimes. Is there a strategy involved on getting thru the next x amount of years where you can detatch completly and not have any of her actions affect you?

What happens if she decides to file D? Will you end up in the same scenario you outlined if you filed D? Do you have to walk on landmines daily to not rock the boat?

If you have committed to stay in this situation, I reccomend that you come up with a strategy to control the situation. Though I rarely recommend manipulative techniques, this situation calls for it. You know her better than anyone else. Find a way to pull the strings and begin to mold her slowly in to what you need her to do.

With Bi polar women, you cannot be direct and affect immediate change. In fact, even the most benign comments can cause and outright argument and attack. It has to be a well calculated, slow, controlling process whereas they think all the decisions made are theirs. In reality, you are setting up an environment to where the decisions are actually yours. (The tail wagging the dog)

That is what I would do in your situation if D is not an option.


ME - BSO (35 yrs old)
Her - XWSO (31 yrs old)
LTR 10 years - There can be no 2nd chances


Posts: 995 | Registered: Mar 2010
64fleet
♂ Member
Member # 18710
Default  Posted: 10:26 AM, July 11th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I think her fear of abandonment will keep her from filing. If not, I'm in the camper in somebody's yard. No-fault D is great that way-I get fucked simply for having testicles.

I don't walk on eggshells or land mines, the opposite in fact-when she does something fucked up, I call her on it-usually I'm met with a barrage of full-bore bitching, but later she will realize I just might be correct. The push-pull is insane.


time wounds all heels

Posts: 5359 | Registered: Mar 2008 | From: deliverance land
oftenwrong
♂ Member
Member # 27822
Default  Posted: 3:27 PM, July 11th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I know the push pull all too well. I will never ever date a bi-polar woman again. I feel for you brother.


ME - BSO (35 yrs old)
Her - XWSO (31 yrs old)
LTR 10 years - There can be no 2nd chances


Posts: 995 | Registered: Mar 2010
countryboy
♂ New Member
Member # 30542
Default  Posted: 2:54 PM, July 13th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

True BP is when your WW tells you she is not in love with you any more and says you can no longer sleep in the same bed. Then 5 minutes later asks you to have sex with her because she needs sex right then and it's to late for her to call any one else to do it.

True story. This happened to me last week.


BS- me
WS- her
M- 18 years
DD1- 7/04
DD2- 3/10
DD3- 2/11

Posts: 38 | Registered: Dec 2010 | From: Texas
jjct
♂ Member
Member # 17484
Default  Posted: 9:56 PM, July 13th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Mine never admitted to the 'too late to call anyone' bizarreness, might be one of the differences btwn bipolar, borderline, and narcissist- I don't know, and at this point I don't care. It's all just "too broken for me!" sabe?

I am very thankful that I got away, we had no kids together (2nd M to be destroyed by infidelity for me),
and my heart aches for the strong men here who have made adjustments...who have adapted.
You humble me.

Absent having to be together with such a broken one,
my advice is to run forest, run.


Posts: 6021 | Registered: Dec 2007 | From: texas
Razor
♂ Member
Member # 16345
Default  Posted: 10:21 AM, July 14th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I am a bit saddened however to see some of the brothers on here standing still on progress. When I joined 16 months ago, many of your stories were heart breaking and you seemed in an impossible situation. Your search for answers didn't stop and you continued to work on solutions.

However, coming up on the 2 year mark, some of your situations seem stuck in time and have not evolved even an inch in this large span of time.

IMO allot of us BH struggle with saying in a toxic M for the sake of the kids or for financial reasons.

Also it isn't just rural areas where the wife gets markedly preferential treatment. The worst of the lot seems to be California. I had a friend who lived out there. He walked in on his W in bed with a 18 year old kid who lived down the block (with his parents). She got the house. She got primary custody of their 2 kids even thou the kids chose to live live with him. AND he was ordered to pay $2500 / MONTH alimony and child support.

I suppose there could be cases where the women gets screwed over. But since this is a BH thread we will look at from the male POV. Mods may object to that tho so I think we have to be kinda careful.

The thing is that allot of us go thru this shit. Staying in a M we are not happy in because of kids or finances. And its a tough row to hoe. You can count me in that group.

For me. The best option has been to stay and just try and make the best of a bad situ. I try and keep the peace around the house and have enuf outside interests that engage my mind and allow me to have a small bit of joy in my life. Thats the best I can offer.


Forgive and forget = Relive and regret.


Posts: 3086 | Registered: Sep 2007
oftenwrong
♂ Member
Member # 27822
Default  Posted: 10:38 AM, July 14th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Boy, I was crazy enough to contemplate marriage not too long ago. This was the cold splash of water I needed to set me straight.


ME - BSO (35 yrs old)
Her - XWSO (31 yrs old)
LTR 10 years - There can be no 2nd chances


Posts: 995 | Registered: Mar 2010
Lost42
♂ Member
Member # 29641
Default  Posted: 2:09 PM, July 14th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Interesting. In my state (deep South), the law states that a spouse who has committeed adultery cannot receive alimony. My lawyer said that this is harder to make stick if you try to reconcile and the divorce happens long after the affair. But basically, in my state you have a get out of jail free card if you file for divorce right after the affair and can prove it (at least with regards to alimony; does not impact child support or division of marital assets). It is also a reason not to have a revenge affair.

Anyway, we are attempting R since August 2010, so I blew this one.


Me (BH) 42
Her (WW) 42
DDay -- August 2010
Married 15 years, 3 young children

Posts: 182 | Registered: Sep 2010 | From: Southeast US
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