WH called me during lunch. He had not called me all morning. He sounded constipated emotionally. I asked him what was going on. He began to cry and said that he was hurting (why? I asked) because he felt that I was avoiding him and pulling away from him and it hurt.
So have I mentioned that this was a sucky week for me? I lost it on two different days in front of WH (very unlike me), there were two days where I hardly saw him at all due to scheduling weirdness in the evenings, and the remaining day was Valentine's Day (fine for him, meh for me). So, yeah, I've been avoiding the shit out of him for one reason or another. And I have been a wreck.
So I told him that I have been feeling not great this week, that in fact I was feeling so not great that I made an appointment to see a therapist yesterday. And his response was "Thank you for telling me" and "I'm sorry that you're feeling bad."
Is this NPD? This inability to see that I am hurting (when it is almost impossible not to notice) and to feel badly only because my hurt is affecting him? I find it... odd... disconcerting... and confusing.
I do not believe that it is his job intuitively to know how you are feeling. I think he did the right thing:
...he felt that I was avoiding him and pulling away from him and it hurt.
You responded by telling him how you felt, and he acknowledged your feelings.
This is a sensitive topic for me. FWW spent our M resenting me because I did not know how she really felt. Forget the fact she rarely told me, and never calmly, I was supposed to know. After all, she knew how I felt.
I do not think it is fair to expect him to know how you feel from your behavior and observation alone. He sensed something amiss, he asked you about it, and he told you how he felt. The model we have been going over in MC with FWW is; when you do X, I feel Y.
Nell, when you avoid me and pull away, I hurt.
Just my perception.
Sat 10am here and they've forecast 96 degrees. Hope you all are not too cold
Life is once more complicated. My aunt (my mum's sister) who turned 90 a couple of weeks ago had a fall and is in hospital. Poor thing is in a bad way. It doesn't look good.
She may soon be moved to OW3's section of the hospital. Now I have to decide whether to tell those in charge about H and OW3 as I DO NOT want OW3 anywhere near her (bad enough she has OW1 as her carer in aged care facility). Shit!! I can only hope that as a relative of a patient they will be bound by confidentiality. I don't know who knows at hospital but would like kept to a minimum.
I cannot deal with OW3 looking after her in the hospital. I was put off visiting her in aged care because of OW1 and procrastinated about telling administrator. I refuse to let these bitches affect my relationship with her in her last days.
I am going to see her now. Say a little prayer for me please.
Laura: Look, I get the OW hatred. I do. But, you did nothing wrong. Go visit your aunt. I think you said you were friendly with some of the staff there - so maybe they can accommodate you, that certainly would be nice, but be prepared for the institutional-like, we would love to accommodate you but we can't do this or that for legal reasons, etc.
(Like changing her duties, etc. may subject themto some kind of liablity, who knows? Maybe they just don't want to deal with a pissed off bitchy OW.)
To be perfectly honest, my approach would be to visit and ask the admin if OW still works there and say, listen is there anything we can do about restricting her access to my aunt. There's a bad history between her and my family and we would prefer not to have to deal with any of that in my aunt's current state. I wouldn't get into the whole sordid A business, especially if you already have concerns that it will become fodder for gossip.
Ats: Sometimes we just need an emotional break. I wound up talking to my H more yesterday and told him that I did not realize how emotionally drained I was until I saw how happy I became over the last 6 weeks. My exact words to him were that trying to reconcile with him was so emotionally draining that divorcing was looking like a very good option. Maybe you are just drained and need a little break from all of this.
I had a lot of mixed emotions yesterday. I did come to believe that the A has not been ongoing. If he had any kind of conversation with OW at the Xmas party, I will not know. I just tried to impress upon him what a huge slap in the face that would have been to me, how disrespectful and disloyal. While I do understand what my H means about not being able to show me he loves me, etc if we aren't really talking, I was surprised that I really, really, didn't WANT to go back to working on our relationship. A few weeks ago, I still missed getting little loving texts, having someone to spend time with, etc., but I think I've come to realize that I miss the attention, not necessarily my husband, kwim?
Nonetheless, for whatever reason, I told him we could try again, but we weren't starting out at a very good place. I wound up getting sick, so I have nothing to report to date as I basically came home from work, played with the kids a bit and went to sleep very early.
I am already regretting this decision and cannot remember why I felt this was the way to go. I guess, it's the kids. I'm panicking about telling the kids and really would do anything to avoid that.
Well, my plan at this point is to do relatively nothing. I'm not micro-managing this. I've lifted the ban that my H said was preventing him from showing me why I should still be with him. Let's see what he does with it.
ETA: I do agree with what was said here that my H could show me his love and devotion despite the restrictions I put in place. But, in the path of least regret way of thinking, I guess I figured, let me see what he's got.
[This message edited by Allgoodnamesgone at 6:16 AM, February 19th (Saturday)]
Laura, it is not 96 degrees here, but yesterday was a nice night. We went to our favorite waterfront spot for French fries and shrimp fresh off the boat (the boat docks at this place).
I think allgood gave you really good advice regarding your OW3. I think allgood also gave me a good insight:
Sometimes we just need an emotional break.
You are right, but while this week has helped to soothe me, it was hard on FWW. She is between coping mechanisms right now. She no longer blames me or others for the problems in her life, but she is still struggling to manage her issues herself.
Last night we finally talked. /She had a tearful IC session yesterday, this is unusual for her. She is usually stoic, and does not want to show her pain. The IC commented on seeing a softer side of her. He also scheduled her back to weekly sessions for the time being. FWW is still very involved in how I perceive her. She also confirmed she is still cutting.
FWW made similar arguments as Mr. allgood that it is not good for her when I am in the other room and separated. So with that, and that DS is home and using his room for the weekend, I was back in her bed last night.
(I don't know how to quote, I'm sorry)
You hit that nail right on the head, UKgirl. The bolded part---I said that to her a few months ago. I told her she was acting like an ostrich that sticks its head in the sand, and ignores the situation. I told her to grow a pair and lay down the law or shut up about it.
Then, of course, I felt horrible for saying it.
She said she has moved $ into a brand new account that FFIL doesn't know about. Of course she did that at the bank they do all their business with, so he might know about it. Last night, she did not want to have ANYTHING to do with this site. She wouldn't look at the computer at all. (I bring my laptop over and we use MY computer so her H doesn't find anything on their computer) So, I started to just read some threads, and some member profile stories out loud. She listened, but wouldn't say anything. My F told me today that she said she feels like I'm trying to "force" her into making a decision. He said "Mom we just want to help you, and show you that you're not alone. Show you that you don't have to put up with any of this."
So I'm going to back off for the weekend. I AM going to give her a copy of "Not Just Friends" though. My, F is going to read my copy. He said that after seeing this site, and reading through some things, that he realizes that he didn't just "cross a line" with that phone conversation he had...he said he feels like he was unfaithful to me. I didn't say anything back...but it felt good to hear him say that.
I hope everyone is having a nice weekend....the more I read your stories, the more I feel I am "getting to know" you.
Laura, I see that you are in Australia....are you in any part that has been affected by the flooding? I have a friend who lives in Victoria--she's been telling me about what happened in Queensland
I hope you are safe, where you are. (and I don't mean to pry or ask for info you're not comfortable revealing)
Ok, I'm rambling.
Laura: Allgood gave you good advice. Peraps you could talk to the Admin. without going into detail. You are in such a hard situation. I pray that your Aunt will be feeling better soon.
Ats: You have been doing a lot of hard work, but your wife is really trying hard. She has to change a lifetime of thinking, feeling, and hurt. There will be many times that she will go two steps forward and one step backwards (and maybe even more at times). But overall, she is making progress. I feel you are tired, and rightly so, but don't pull away completely. Keep venting here.
As for me, I'm realizing more and more that I am addicted to my WH. It's an abuse cycle. He can draw me in with his charm and when he calls and he starts talking about an interesting subject (one thing I always enjoyed doing with him) I would end up engaging with him. <sigh> It's like look here and forget about all the garbage there and I'm so easily distracted. I guess I really don't want to look at the garbage. I'm still in my own fog that I'm trying to get out of.
I must disengage emotionally, but I don't think I'm going to be able to do it this way.
Easy: I think we were cross posting. It's good that your F is going to read "Not Just Friends". Hopefully your FMIL will read it too and it will help her too. She is in a hard place, like a BS fog. Encourage her to protect herself more financially. She cannot control what your FFIL is doing unfortunately, but she must start to realize that she also cannot use your F as a therapist and that she is hurting him and continue to encourage her to talk to an IC, pastor or even go to MC by herself.
I'm sorry Easy, you're in a hard situation.
[This message edited by honesttoafault at 10:09 AM, February 19th (Saturday)]
It's a lot to deal with, and if your FMIL doesn't want help, then she won't accept any. I feel for her, and I feel for you and your F. It's an impossible situation all around. It's good to give yourself a break every now and again.
The giving yourself a break every now and again goes for you, too. Especially if you're introverted, it's extremely stressful to be "on" for someone else all the time. It's good that FWW's IC is bumping her sessions up; she needs it and it'll help you, too.
I assume you were looking for him to delve more into how you were feeling and that's why you thought he was making it all about him?
But. Anyway. I am probably overly-sensitive to him ignoring my pain and focusing on his. It's good to have the tribe to bounce things like this off of because I sometimes have this skewed thinking. Thanks, all!
I hope your aunt is comfortable, and I hope that your visits with her will be comfortable for you.
What do you think your husband could do ? or you could do to make one last ditch effort?
I hate to sound like a broken record...but, maybe a weekend retreat like Retrouvaille woule not be the worst thing.
If he agrees to go it shows that he still cares enough to try and..what can it hurt?
the worst case scenario is that you lose one weekend and are still in the same place.....
but, it could be that jump start that the two of you need to rekindle your marriage.
As I've said before... I am a big believer in that....
that the marriage pre-d-day is over. And, for many of us that may be a good thing.
The marriage was not healthy. The fact that our spouse was engaged in a LTA underlines how unhealthy it was.... even if we were clueless about the affair...
so, the only hope we have is to start over form scratch...rebuilding our marriage.
Kind of like a house that was destroyed by a hurricane...
we have the same foundation...that represents our early years, our dreams and hopes, our history with our spouses, our children, etc.
But, everything else has to be torn down and rebuilt.
It will be different than the old house in many ways.
In some ways it may even be better.
But, a dramatic change is needed. At least, in my opinion.
SO..starting off the change with a grand gesture-comitting to going to Retrouvaille may be like taking that sledge hammer and knocking down the first wall.
Go for it..Allgood...
at least you and your husband will be able to say that you gave it your all.
It does sound like both of you still have love for each other and both of you love your children. There's your foundation.
It sounds to me like your wife is dealing with a chronic depression, and the cutting is a manifestation of that...as were the LTAs.
How long has she been seeing this IC?
Speaking of shaking things up... sometimes a new IC can help you see things differently. If she's 'stuck' it could mean that the help she's getting is not exactly right for her.......
maybe another IC that has more experience dealing with sex addictions and childhood abuse etc.
I will send you a pm about this.......
Remember... your dday is still quite recent. I was and continue to be extremely sensitive about many things that my FWH says and does....
I think its very difficult for men to express what they are feeling...so the fact that he wanted to share his feelings with you is a good thing. Did it come across as all about him? maybe...but, I think he was making an effort to explain how he feels.
I forget...do you guys go to MC? Does he go to IC?
I think that both are really important for R.
I'm re-combobulated now.
So, why is it that I can feel so strong one day and so lousy the next. Nell, I completely understand your pulling away from WH. Maybe that's part of the whole roller coaster thing, huh? I'm glad that you called to talk to an IC though. I don't know how I'd be getting through the days without having someone to talk to. This stuff goes around and around in my head constantly, so much so that I start to lose my concentration. Work has sucked for me this week. I have gotten nothing done. Blah!!
Thanks for the good wishes for my aunt and the advice re OW3.
She is very ill. Has a broken arm, ribs and pelvis - none of which they can treat very much. I think she will be in hospital until the end. They have her on strong pain meds including a patch so she is as comfortable as possible. Going in to see her this morning. She never married so only has my sister and I and two other nieces to help her.
I have decided to suck it up and ignore OW3s presence. She may be in hospital a long time so I doubt admin would be willing to deal with my problem long term.
Will see how it goes but if I believe it necessary I will confront OW3 and tell her "be good to my aunt or else" - exposure to all her workmates, family etc. I will keep this as my "ace in the hole" in case I need it for my aunt. She is truly a lovely sweet lady and I need to do whatever it takes to ensure she is looked after. As I said before I am really a nice person but watch out for the vindictive bitch in me - she makes Lisbeth look like a pussy cat
This stuff goes around and around in my head constantly, so much so that I start to lose my concentration. Work has sucked for me this week. I have gotten nothing done. Blah!!
Me too honey. I know just how it feels!!!! HUGS
Gotta go tribe
Love to all
I'm about to do a brain-dump; anyone mind? No? Great. The rest of this you can skip if you like as I'm going to go completely Nell-centric.
IC went over her list of stuff and said, "okay, so what I wrote in my notes from this summer is that Mr. Nell's got X and Y and you've got Z..." (no, actually, Mr. Nell's got Z, too). "Okay. And Mr. Nell's got S and T, as well?" (Yes. Oh, and I think he's got some R, too.) And she just looked at me deadpan and said, "So YOU'RE in counseling but he is not. Well, that makes sense." Then we chatted about stuff for a while and she said, so we talked about your kids and friends and hobbies for 20 minutes and you're laughing and engaged. You love your kids and they make you happy; you're doing stuff you like to do. So what do you want to work on in here?" I dunno... "We could work on the anger. But, honestly, you SHOULD be angry. Or we could work on figuring out whether you want this marriage or not." Yeah, lets work on that. So that's what we'll be working on. She's got the same "whaddya KIDDING me?!?!" sense of humor that I've got, and we had a good time, so it's good. She also makes me "use my words" when I tear up and would rather get all my emotions back in their respective boxes and deal with facts. So that's good for me. Uncomfortable but good. All in all I'm glad I went.
But I still think WH should be in counseling, not me.
But I still think WH should be in counseling, not me.
Laura - I would start by giving OW3 looks that would raise the dead!! I would make sure to make direct eye contact so that she knows that you are on to her and will, if necessary, make her work life a living hell.
There's NO reason for you to be uncomfortable...SHE should be ashamed to be seen anywhere near your aunt. Let us know how it goes. I'll be thinking of you.
So tonight I'm really wondering if R is going to work for us. As recently as this morning FWH is still trying to find some way to "sugercoat" his behavior. Every time he talks about starting the A he starts by saying where his head was at at that time....like that makes any difference. He simply cannot see himself as being dishonest and a cheater, yet that's exactly how I see him. I have little to no respect for him any more and I don't see that changing anytime soon. I have to hang on until June and my DD's graduation but I'm becoming more convinced that once that's over we will have to S. And I won't do that unless I'm willing to follow through with filing for D. I can't/won't keep hope alive that that will be the thing that finally wakes him up. Let's face it, he continued his LTA right through our previous MC, our DS's graduation, our 25th wedding anniversary and my verbal recommittment to HIM some 4 years ago. He has seen me cry and cry, yell, scream, cry some more, run out of the house and lose some 15 lbs. and yet he still keeps trying to justify what he did. He will SAY that he is not making excuses, but that's exactly what he's doing. Can you tell I'm pretty discouraged tonight. I just don't see that his ego is ever going to let him "own" what he's done.
I'm getting more and more used to the idea that we will not be able to R. It's me...I know that I will have to be the one to pull the plug. What I won't do is take the blame once our kids find out. I will not speak badly of him to our kids...ever...but hopefully I can express to them that this is not the type of M that I want to be in. I'd like to think that I'm putting the cart before the horse, but in reality FWH is NOT doing everything he can to make this up to me. For example, we were supposed to leave at 5 last night to go see a movie. At 5:15 he was still working, no word to me as to when he would be done or even that he was late. I told myself that at 5:30 I was leaving without him. At 5:23 he came down, surprised that it was so late. This is not new behavior but I've always made allowances for him before.....no more. I'm done cutting him slack. But I see myself becoming a shrew and I don't like it. As I see it, instead of being with him making me a better person, it's making me someone that I can't stand. And that's on me. If I can't handle what he's done and how he continues to act, then it's on me to walk away. I will own the problems in our M before the LTA - but by God, he has to start owning his own shit.
Sorry for the vent Tribe. I truly did not mean to ramble on and on. But it's Sat. night and no one IRL to talk to. Thanks for being here for me.
Thanks for the advice re OW3. I think your suggestion is the position I will take. The new, slimmer, hotter me makes her look like a skanky fat old dwarf (I'm 6' and she's 5' and 4 yrs older than me and bears a striking resemblance to H's mother and sister - when I said this months ago he looked and didn't argue!!!
I'm sorry you are where you're at. We work so hard and it is so demoralising to feel we aren't making progress at times.
At 5:23 he came down, surprised that it was so late. This is not new behavior but I've always made allowances for him before.....no more.
My H has ALWAYS been late for EVERYTHING and still is. (Maybe there's a correlation here with selfish, entitled, cheating). The kids and I sorted this years ago by always telling him we had to be somewhere 30 mins before we really did. We generally made it with a few mins to spare and far less stress. He could never understand why the soccer games, P&T meetings, movies etc always started so late He will never be any different.
yet he still keeps trying to justify what he did. He will SAY that he is not making excuses, but that's exactly what he's doing.
For me this is the essence of the problem. They need to take total, complete, unequivocal ownership of what they did.
by God, he has to start owning his own shit.
Yep. He does. No ifs, buts, or maybes.
Months ago mine kept saying:
(a)he was lonely when he was home alone during the day until I pointed out that he wasn't alone - he went off with his whores - and when we were all home he was too BUSY on the farm to be with us (cause he didn't get his jobs done during the day when we were at school and he was whoring!!!)
(b) He didn't think I loved him. I pointed out that I felt the same about him because he never wanted to be with me or the kids and was cranky when he was. He gave this one up too when I explained that even though I was so unhappy I still TRIED and so often tearfully begged him to TRY. I asked him so often why he got so cranky about little things. (I became a nervous wreck at times from walking on eggshells) We both have vivid memories of the many times I begged him to try. So if I ddin't love him why did I put up with all that shit??? Why didn't I leave him or go and have an A if I didn't love him?
Episode 3 of focussing on the positive
Had a breakthrough on Sat night - can't give details as I have to run but I'm feeling SO optimistic. Basically he finally said "I have been thinking alot. To begin I blamed you but I now realise that everything was my fault - all the problems we had that I used as an excuse to play up were actually my fault. If I'd been a better H right from the start we would both have been happier. I was so selfish. I only ever thought about myself and not you and the kids. Instead I looked for happiness outside our marriage and it took me all these years to realise it was right here" He then continued with the I'm a different person now, I have changed, I'm so sorry, will never do it again, we can get through this together, I will help you, I will spend the rest of my life trying to make you happy speech.
I believe he really means it and now have to get my own head together. I do believe him.
But, I have read so many stories here (including those of many LTAers) where the WS promises the world and then cheats again. So I suppose there is still that tiny voice telling me - "don't trust him- he fooled you before!" I have to silence this without letting my "gut" go to sleep.
The temp has hit 98 degrees here and the AirCon is still not working. H rang and said lets' go to the beach and stay for dinner. He finishes work at 3.30 and it's 3 now so I need to get organised.
HUGS to all
[This message edited by Laura28 at 10:05 PM, February 19th (Saturday)]
Strongish: I think that there does come a time when we KNOW we're done. We cannot R alone without the efforts of the WS. Hang in there.
Laura: I know it's hard to believe anything they say, but your WH seems to be starting to take some responsibility for his actions. It does seem like a baby step in a positive direction!
your ic: love love lover her.....not just because she thinks like us, although that is a huge positive on her side...but because she really gets it.....keep going, she will give you sanity when you feel you have none.....and i know you got us, but having that person irl, even if she is paid for it, she is a professional telling you that you are not insane, but your sich IS.....
laura: i loved what allgood posted to you...and agree completely with her pov....
and i am sending prayers for your aunt..
as for your breakthrough: yay.....i do believe from what you have posted that your ws is DOING...ACTIVELY DOING and that is key i believe...
I am already regretting this decision and cannot remember why I felt this was the way to go.
do you really regret it or do you feel stomped on...because i am thinkin that if he decided to wake up and smell the fucking coffee that was poured on his lap, the very hot coffee i might add, i don't think you would have regretted it one bit...
the problem that comes with shit like this is we can only control ourselves...if we could truly predict the outcome we wouldn't need to try so many things because we would already know...but none of us are "seers' who just know....like ats put it earlier, we cannot read minds....as much as we wish we could.....we can't...
and of course you are dreading telling the kids...how could you not...but for now put it out of your head, there is no use in stressing out over it so soon, you have 4 months before you have to break it to them, and who knows....mr allgood may just decide to open his fucking eyes....and if he doesn't, he doesn't and then you deal with it.....stressing out over the kids is not lining up those ducks...so stick to lining up the ducks....and keep detaching as much as possible, which i know first hand is so much easier said then done.....
I told her she was acting like an ostrich that sticks its head in the sand, and ignores the situation. I told her to grow a pair and lay down the law or shut up about it.
go easy on her, learning this shit is more overwhelming then you can actually imagine, as much as you have been there, you were not there at this level with a man you have been with most of your life....not easy for us much less a woman in her 70's....so cut her some slack, i know you worry about your f, but you need to easy up a bit.....
she needs to let it out, she needs to vent, she needs a shoulder and she needs patience and understanding...there are so many of us who still tried, who still put up with shit....fear...she is being ruled by fear.....she is i am sure terrified of so so many things......so continue to be there, and tell your f that he is the one who needs to develop some balls to tell his mom that he simply cannot be her goto person and he needs to find her a suitable ic and then give her the name and offer to take her there...and if she refuses which she probably will, he needs to end all convos with her that stray to his dad.....and then do it again, reccommend ic, this site, the book...and if you feel you can stand it...YOU.....
remember this is her entire life that is now in question....her world has been destroyed by this and right now she can't see beyond the next minute much less into the future.....
I was back in her bed last night.
is this not your bed too???
and i agree with honest's post to you....i think you need to take a couple of steps back and look at it from a non-personal pov...i do not believe that her actions or lack of actions really has anything to do with you, we already know that she has some deep issues and she IS WORKING on them ACTIVELY....progress is there and it is slow and steady.....so i think you need to not take it personally...and yes i know that seems odd considering that she was the cheater...but you know and have known that she really does have issues, and these issues are huge and they are deep...there is no fast fix for either of you...she is on a really really long road to healing, which she genuinely needs to do....you can either be supportive or take the stance of adding to her already extensive list....
and believe me i am not saying that she does not have to step up with you, not at all, just that you knew who she was and IS, she needs patience and she needs to know that you will still be her soft place to fall which incidentally she is also seeking from you....she wants from what you have posted to be your soft place too....i just think she cannot handle too much at the same time.....
her cutting is not a minor issue either....she seems to be at a crossroads and is resorting to old methods of self soothing....or coping...old methods that are not healthy....she is still learning....she is stuck in her teens years....not quite grown up self sufficient human being with healthy coping or self soothing methods....
I must disengage emotionally, but I don't think I'm going to be able to do it this way
this is one difficult hurdle, especially when you have to deal with him because of your kids.....so i suggest you come up with a list of ways that you can, even small ones, small things you can do...modify the 180 train, get on it and stay one it.....
So, why is it that I can feel so strong one day and so lousy the next.
ah, the rollercoaster...and it is not always confined to days, it can be in hours, even minutes....
give yourself some time, this is some adjustment for us, to actually "see" these ws's for who they were, are, who we thought they were and are and who they actually are....and figuring out who they actually are is the hardest of all, we don't know what to believe....remember you have had your own personal 9/11 learning this shit....
so have patience with yourself....acceptance i think is the hardest step in this horrible process.....
he has to start owning his own shit.
i agree completely....i also understand where you come from, i was there....still there in a way...except i already know what my goal is.....
he may never change, how long are you willing to give him...i think june is really sufficient time....but if june gets here and you are still not sure then take more time....you take what you need, no one walks in your shoes but you...only you can decide what you can and cannot live with....but i do suggest that once you do decide what your dealbreakers are and he breaks them, you need to walk away, because then your path of least regret would be doing just that...like dr phil loves to say the only thing worse then being is a horrible sich for 1 year is being in the horrible sich for a year and a day!!!
if you see no changes that YOU NEED....then use that as your guide.....
if you DO see that he does start to step up and does make progress then you will have to re-evaluate your stance....is it enough, is it consistent, will he continue.....
and remember the only person you could ever control is YOU.....
strongish- on the flip side...your husband does not sound like he is getting it.
I think that he really needs to go to IC and MC.
Right now he is talking to himself....he desperately needs another point of view.
He is trying to convince himself that his behavior wasn't so bad, was in the past, that you and he can get over it with minimum work, effort, or change....
and guess what? he's wrong.
The only way your marriage will survive a LTA is with a lot of gut wrenching counseling sessions.
The WS has to begin to confront his/her demons and admit(to themselves) that they were not who they thougt they were....they were not these fine, moral, upstanding citizens, great parents, spouses...
Instead, they have to look in the mirror and admit taht they were liars and cheaters that hurt their spouses deeply and destroyed their marriage.
Your husband seems you want to reconcile on his won...no IC or MC needed at all.
And, he seems to think that the sweep it all under the rug is the best approach.
Its up to you to point to to him that he had his chance on directing your marriage and he basically drove it into a ditch when he had the LTA........
so, maybe, now it's turn to make the decisions as to what is the best thing to do to try to reconcile.
and whatever you need...should be something he goes along with if he truly wante to reconcile.
If he refuses MC and IC after cheating for years then he is not remorseful ..well, then you simply cannot reconcile on your own.
you should continue to see an IC for yourself.
My IC has saved me many times over the last 4 yrs.
I have been very very down and the only person I could turn to was my IC.
and... I would have these terrible triggers even with a very remorseful, hard working FWH.
So, the less remorse you get the more IC you will need to help you deal with it all..
Yes, it may be expensive,but remember...divorce will be even more expensive...