We are on the free trial also so I'll play around a little and see what I find when I try to block other sites. I'll let you know what I find.
But I am just getting so ridiculous worn down by it all. He hasn't spoken to or laid eyes on OW in 5 years. Yet with all the problems we've had, all the therapy and MC and on and on, he still admits to thinking about her daily. At some point, pretty much every stinking day, there comes the "I'm sorry, I lied to you today about xyz". He still admits to struggling with scanning. He still admits to (and occasionally I catch him) oggling some woman's breasts. And he will apologize. Yes, it is great progress. Yes, it is terrific that he recognizes it and apologizes. But when the h#ll is it going to STOP?!?
I don't yell. I don't cry or get hysterical. I try to discuss these trangressions rationally. I am getting pretty good at detaching.
But I blew a gasket today. We had an issue with our DS. We are in MA and Irene is on her way. While being out trying to secure everything H discovered a broken window on our camping trailer. It's a pop-up trailer and the window is on the roof - it's like a crank up vent type of thing. That my DS11 says he broke maybe a month ago and FORGOT to tell us. Now DS has an autism spectrum disorder. He may have actually forgotten. He said there was one time he was going to tell us but we were fighting so he didn't think it was a good time for it (ouch). So H goes on about how DS should pay to repair the damage. I wasn't sure that was the best aproach - if he had told us at the time and we dealt with it then we wouldn't have billed the kid for it, it was an accident. I thought he should be grounded for not telling us. We never did finish the discussion.
And then he goes up DS one side and down the other and telling the kid he has to pay for it. Oh, and by the way, DS is 11 years old. I was very angry. He knew how I felt, and hadn't finished the discussion, but he decided it was his way or no way.
So the evening goes on. I am getting over my anger, but still not whistling dixie. I tried to discuss preparation plans for the storm. And what I get is ... the weatherman is wrong, we don't need to prepare, blah, blah, blah. Oh, oh... I'm mad again. Why can't he just humor me if he really thinks Irene is no big deal? Getting cranky, but I haven't lost it yet. We are on our way to take the kids out for ice cream. And he has to disagree with me about what size to order. The anger level is definately rising. Everything I have said all day is wrong - he knows better about everything. Grrrrr.
So I am cooling my heels a bit once we get home, trying not to get too cranky. We get a town wide call from the fire dept., reminding us all lawn furniture, grills, etc should be stored inside. Oh oh, our grill is still out. So I go outside and realize just about EVERYTHING is still out. A glass table. Plastic tables. Pool chemicals. A 10 foot aluminum ladder. The list goes on.
Seems hubby really feels this storm will be no big deal. This is of course possible where we are, we have a tropical storm warning not a hurricane warning in our part of the state. But the bottom line, to me, is that I asked him to take care of the yard and he said he did. So now I am really mad.
And he flips out on me. Says I am being a bitch by harping on him (may be the first time he's ever called me that) and that I've been nothing but a bitch for the last month. Hmmm... I wonder if it's any coincidence that he had to start "walking on eggshells" around me right about the time he admited to thinking about OW again. Seems he has no use for the wife that lets her detachment slip a bit. He said it was raining and he's sorry he didn't feel like dealing with it in the rain. Sorry he made different decisions than I would have. Yelling at me the whole time.
Really, how much am I supposed to take? How long can a person eat sh*t and pretend it's steak?
OK - rant over. I just had to get it out there somewhere. You can resume your regularly scheduled programming now.
It sounds as if you are your SA's accountability partner. If so, resign your position asap. If the boy isn't in a 12 step program he needs to be in one today. He needs a sponsor to be accountable to--not you. He doesn't need to tell you about every little slip that he has. That's just crazy-making for you to hear.
If you're not working a program yourself and really learning how to detach with love, then you need to get yourself into one. You've spent a lifetime learning how to be consumed by someone else's problems-and it's a hard habit to break on your own. Time to focus on you. Time to learn to trust your gut and to know that what you need to know will be shown to you. You don't have to snoop, ask him for daily reports on his sobriety (or lack therof), check up on his whereabouts, etc, etc.
What you need to know will be show to you when you are able to deal with it. Take care of you. Release him to the care of a power greater than him. Trust in the fact that you will survive whatever comes. Because you truly can.
"What you need to know will be show to you when you are able to deal with it."
This has been so true for me. Thanks for the reminder.
"Live a life not an apology." Edward R.Murrow
"I can be changed by what happens to me but I refuse to be reduced by it."
I think it is the faith this statement holds that has kept me sane all these years. It has been my experience that when I am ready, the information is there. Now, I may not always FEEL ready, but i have faith that my higher power has a plan for me knowing.
I have also learned that an immediate response to a situation is not always necessary. So I take my time and consider the information, the possible consequenses and possible rewards of different options before I open my mouth. To often I have painted myself into a corner by responding reactively. And corners are not happy places to be.
It takes the ability to be in a peaceful place to make meaningful decisions. It is most often the quite whisper of our inner voice that gives us wisdom.
Okay, most of the above was for me... I'm dealing with a bully boss that I'm really having difficulty with. But I guess it's pretty good advise for dealing with a SAH also.....
WH has been seeing a CSAT. I asked to attend a session when he said it didn't look like he was SA after all. CSAT told me WH was in fact an addict. WH is not accepting the label and doesn't want to do their recommended course of therapy (14 week course which includes group therapy). Is willing to work with him in IC. So IDK what is going on in his head. I'm freaking out inside a bit, there is too much at stake but I have to be very careful because I need to get my ducks in a row in case he flips out and dives down the rabbit hole. After that I can play hardball if needed.
And that's where I'm at, and it sucks. And honestly I know I am lucky to be where I'm at, it could be so much worse, but I'm not feeling particularly lucky at this point.
I only have a quick minute to post to you before I have to get out the door. I have been following along in your JFO thread, but haven't had time to post.
Your WH is in denial. Addicts like to think that they are special, and that they aren't as bad as other addicts or that they don't need an intensive treatment program with a CSAT and 12 step group because they have faulty addict logic that tells them that they can manage their addiction. That is where your WH is at. I don't think your WH's CSAT did anything wrong (I had read where you felt sandbagged). I think he was trying to impress upon both of you the importance of recovery and the seriousness of the situation. He is right that you need recovery for YOU regardless of what your WH chooses to do.
Bottom line, he doesn't sound ready to embrace recovery. Get that post-nup you are talking about and take care of YOU.
Sorry all that I don't have more time to contribute lately. Been very busy with life. But I have been reading along and following at work, and all of you are in my thoughts. Hugs to all.
Your Sexually Addicted Spouse: How Partners Can Cope and Heal
It looks at spouses of SA as trauma victims rather than codependent or co-addicts. I appreciated this greatly as I was one that had no idea until I found evidence (tip of the iceberg.) I have been very clear that I accept no acting out and no relapses. This is a one shot only deal.
This book walked through boundaries and self care. It had a lot of stories and at the end had a series from the SA Spouses of the case studies in the book.
I hope everyone is working towards their healing and being gentle to themselves.
I'm going to the course without WH. I'm going to give him every opportunity to change his mind and go too. But I don't see the point in forcing the issue if he's not ready to face that he is an addict.
I'm gathering all the documentation for the post nup, and it's going to take some time. I just hope I can get it all done before he flips out and goes down the rabbit hole. Not saying he's heading there now, I just have to be prepared that he could at any time.
Sack of suck.
Is anyone else dealing with this who is not religious?
I'm having a lot of trouble with everything I read about the 12 steps because I think my husband would be rolling his eyes from the second line. TBH, me too.
I'm a person who doesn't believe in saying "I have no control over myself or my actions so Im leaving it all up to god". I completely disagree with the 12 steps. I think a person can say "I LET my thoughts and actions become out of control" and from a scientific angle, the brain chemistry and wiring changed. Therefore there is a need to reset that wiring and take back control over the actions and one needs to have good reasons for doing that(in other words get to their root problems and of course WANT to recover and DECIDE to recover.). Maybe Im offbase. I understand someone who said that the "god" could be any higher power. But I still feel that is passing off responsibility for one's own actions. Almost like a 'devil made me do it' attitude.
I cant see how he will be helped from this standpoint if he scoffs at the very basis of the program. Also, and most importantly really, the only therapists in my area I have found are VERY ministry/Christianity based. If they are going at this from a religious standpoint its going to be a big turn off for us. I don't know what to do.
Because here's the thing, whether you believe in god or not, it is a huge stretch to accept you have a problem and you can't fix it alone, that you need to trust in something or someone else to do it. That in and of itself is FAITH. So in order to get better, ya gotta have FAITH even if ya don't got religion.
So says the newbie who has no business advising anyone, LOL.
As I WS I hope you don't mind me asking a question to this forum - I'm happy to move this to the Wayward forum if you'd prefer, but I'd be really interested in all of your points of view.
Last night my wife and I had a long, tough chat, where she said to me that she still does not know if this is a mental illness (ie addiction) or if I'm just a selfish arsehole who thinks the rules don't apply to them, and do what ever I can get away with. I'm clearly selfish - my actions have been horrifically selfish, but I can clearly see addictive behaviour.
Can I ask if any of you hold the same opinion, and how you / your partners have reconciled this or understood it.
...she still does not know if this is a mental illness (ie addiction) or if I'm just a selfish arsehole who thinks the rules don't apply to them, and do what ever I can get away with...
In my experience, it goes hand in hand. I feel that the selfish, entitled, not able to concern yourself with anyone else is part of the addiction. I believe that a primary component of SA is in it being an emotional intimacy disorder. If you don't make a connection to how someone else feels, rather than how they positively reflect yourself back at you, then that is selfish, self absorbed asshole, entitled behavior.
Now I would love to be able to say it's all the SA, but I have to be honest and say that for the first 15 years of our marriage, my SAWH was a selfish asshole who chose to make choices for himself that were against our marriage (although in our "real" life he was a perfectly nice guy). He never considered what his actions would do to me or that it was completely unfair for him to have a secret life doing whatever got his rocks off because it made him temporarily happy. It's manipulative and cruel.
Is it an addiction? Yes.
Does that make it any less cruel, manipulative and abusive? No.
Because there is an addictive component, can it be overcome? Remains to be seen.
(Adding that my SAWH is actively working his recovery which is why I'm still here. However, it does not negate or lessen the trauma he has done to me.)
Right now I'm in an angry place, so this may not have the compassion or understanding I normally try to use in life in general.
[This message edited by KickedintheGut at 10:21 AM, September 1st (Thursday)]
hnf, appreciate the pov. still searching for how to make it work for my brain :)
(btw can I say it was disheartening to figure out that by my own doing my abbreviation is "DP" )
kbstr, I totally struggle with that one myself. It isnt a chemical dependency like drugs. Can one change one's thinking by what they 'feed' their brains? Ya. Can one get carried away too far by one selfish choice leading to another? Ya. Its hard to separate the line between 'compulsion' and "I wanna do whatever I want and not stop". Would love to discuss this further since its something I think about a lot.
lost family, Im glad you replied.
Yeah, that 1 pedicure I got to make myself feel better, felt so sick knowing I was paying them to touch me like my Wh did (well not exactly like!)
Funny that you said addicted to almonds, lol. But I get what you are saying. There are lots of things I would enjoy doing, maybe even thought about, get tempted about... and make the CHOICE not to do it.
I don't need a slave and I don't need a person who can do what he did.
There is no higher power for me, our brain and intelligence is the highest power, with it comes what we learn and feel, what makes us human beings and different to animals.
I struggle with the higher power concept as well, but I am now getting there. For a long time what I got as a higher power was the collective wisdom of the group in the 12-step meetings. Between them all, they knew a ton more than I did. The best part is how willing they are to share what's worked for them and what they struggle with still.
If any of you have time to read my profile can you tell me what you think.
I just found out thru a keylogger WH receiving and sending pornographic jokes and this after agreement that if he received these he would delete and not forward to keep it going. Timeline shows him spending time looking at the porn emails and forwarding to a select few of his friends.
I do not want to let him know about keylogger, but do see porn jokes escalating.
These are graphic and degrading, and he knows not acceptable according to our agreement and boundaries.
All SIers please advise!
Really so tired and sad.
I do have passwords and access but...
Have seen incoming no problem. He can't stop friends from sending the occasional "bad" joke.
But he is not supposed to forward. Or keep the cycle going.
He did delete his sent!!!
Married 8 years.
Hubs is firm in recovery from SA and is like a new man and husband. We are happily reconciling and making great progress...nope, ass is back