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User Topic: Long Term Affair Part 24
atsenaotie
♂ Member
Member # 27650
Default  Posted: 3:30 PM, April 8th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

ats: did i miss something did mrs ats go away...i thought the next trip was supposed to be both of you....

yes iwam. All travel was to be the both of us. This trip was to be in the summer to help her sister sort through her deceased mother's things, and side trips to visit my parents and mutual friends. But her sister called and suggested they visit with their father now (sisters' spring break from teaching) rather than summer, so FWW changed her plans. She did not think there was anything wrong with going now, and she is right. I tried to explain that what upset me is her family calls and our plans change. Period. No thought of me and us.

FWIW, she is not having a good time. The weather is cold and damp, but more importantly, now that she is working through her issues, she sees her family for who and what they are. Her sister is annoying her. Areas she thought would be pleasant memories are not so much. Her father's health has gone downhill quickly, so it is probably good she went now.

and ats she is doing so well....

Yes, I know she is, and it has only really been 6 or 7 months that she has been committed to making the M work. After seeing the link wal posted last week with Brene Brown, I shared it with FWW. She liked it too, and we ordered Dr. Brown's book: The Gifts of Imperfection: Let Go of Who You Think You're Supposed to Be and Embrace Who You Are. FWW asked me to have it shipped to her father's, and she is reading it on the trip.

i know its still frustrating for you because rightfully you should not have to still put some of your shit aside...very frustrating because its still all about her....

Yes it is, and often over silly things. Today it is remembering how she would use the music theme "you're a mean one Mr. Grinch" for me on her cellphone at the holidays. She and the kids thought it was a great joke, I am sure OM did too. When I found out and called her out on it I got blame-shifting, but at the time I thought maybe she was right. She said I had no sense of humor, it was just a joke.

Nell, I am with allgood, you could take them. I think you would be running your cellblock within a few weeks. Not that I hope you get the chance.

Scared,

You always think the worse of me...

You know, for 19 years you thought the best of him for MOL, and that did not work out so well. FWW had to prove to me that I was safe. She had to allow time to past when she could have done something and didn't to get me to relax, and even still I can work up into paranoia. Just like my FWW, your WS made this bed, and if he does not like sleeping in it, he is welcome to leave. He is even welcome to whine and make it all about him (again), but you do not need to tolerate it.

Did I miss, has your WS done and IC?. Does he know why he had an A? What need was it meeting? It is my opnion that a LTA is never just a mistake. It flags some deep issue in the WS that needs to be idetified and repaired if there is to be hope for the future.


LTA BS 53
FWW 60
M 1990, dday 10-5-09
Reconciled

Posts: 3967 | Registered: Feb 2010 | From: FL
atsenaotie
♂ Member
Member # 27650
Default  Posted: 3:34 PM, April 8th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

We need to stop always thinking of pleasing our partners and trying to make them happy. WE have been totally unselfish for a long time while they were totally selfish in their As. Now the scales need to be more balanced.

You are spot on with this Laura. I for one was very happy to take off my KISA outfit, and exchange it for some Rainbow sandals, a tropical shirt, and cargo shorts. People can ask me for help if they want it, and I will help if I am so inclined. I am no longer responsible for everything. She (or the kids) say the to me the car is looking dirty, rather than clean it I ask why they didn't clean it.


LTA BS 53
FWW 60
M 1990, dday 10-5-09
Reconciled

Posts: 3967 | Registered: Feb 2010 | From: FL
strongish
♀ Member
Member # 29259
Default  Posted: 5:43 PM, April 8th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Tribe,

It has been a whopper of a few days for me. Just when I think I'm getting some peace in my soul, my emotions get riled up again.

Wed. night - FWH gets into the airport late. I pick him up, deliberately keep the conversation light and meaningless. He "pops" in when I'm snug in bed, sits next to me and asks what I'm reading. I make some stupid remark about dead people but refuse to engage in further conversation. He leaves and goes to the guest room.

Thursday lunchtime - He asks if I would like to talk. Sure....why not?? He says how he thought we were doing better and had really connected on the phone the other night. (I was crying during that phone call, don't see how we could have "connected" but whatever....) I told him that that really wasn't a game changer of a conversation for me. I'm still angry that in order to have any peace in my life I will have to give up pretty much everything that I too have worked for these past 30 years and will lose the benefits of being the spouse of an airline employee, our standard of living and will have to go back to work full-time at the youthful age of 50. He said sorry, so I guess that should have made everything better. In any case, I tell him that I can't be happy with him and that I want a D. He agrees....we cry. Put on happy faces for DS17.

This morning - MC session this morning. I tell MC again that I'm done and she says how she still thinks we should be optimistic about R. She's done this a thousand times, blah, blah, blah. I tell her that I don't feel anything for FWH except for feeling sorry for him and I ask if she thinks I could ever FEEL anyting else, like happiness/joy with him again and she says yes, she has seen couples in just our sich that have been able to R, but it has taken YEARS. She validates that I am entitled to feeling as I do. FWH leaves to go to his IC appt.

On the way home I call a friend that has been through her WH's LTA and ask her if she has felt as I do and if she was able to "feel" anything for him again. She says that she did feel as I do now, and in her opinion that is part of the process. She again encouraged me to have FWH talk to her FWH (her husband is very open to talking about what worked for him/them) and about a retreat center that they both attended. As I described my current state of mind she was able to zero in on exactly how I was feeling. I FEEL like I am the one that has been fighting for my M. FWH has done what I specfically tell him to do, but has not initiated or done any searching himself for how to fix this mess that he created. The result...

When FWH came home from his IC appt., looking bedraggled and forlorn I pretty much let him have it with both barrels. I told him that it appears from the feedback I've gotten from the MC and my friend that I still have feelings for him and am not 110% sure that I'm ready to D. However....I am done being the one to do the fighting for our M. It was time for him to either step up or get out. If I'm worth it, he will find a way, or many ways, to repair the damage that HE has caused. I'm done with the work. I'm here but I'm done bleeding. The wound is still open but I'm holding a bandage in place. He now has the "opportunity" to show me that I am worth the effort it will take for him to repair our M. I said that I will follow his lead, but I'm done coming up with the roadmap. I don't have the answers anyway and I'm sick and tired of being asked how to fix this. HE created the mess, he can google how to fix it! What does he think I do??

I finished by telling him to grow a pair of ba__s. If he needs to cut back on work to be home more, than HE needs to find a way to finance that. HE can beg, borrow or steal the $$ necessary to make up the difference. I'm done "helping" him clean up this crap. Then I left without telling him where I was going or when I'd be back.

Let's remember that I haven't shirked a responsibility one day of my life so he really can't get too wrapped around the axle, but that didn't stop him from saying how "hurt" he was that I was angry again. Oh yeah...I also told him to NEVER again say that he understood how I felt. Until he has to face an e-mail from my BF telling him about our LTA, then he has NO idea how I feel. And his getting teary-eyed because I hurt his feelings is an insult to me. Until he starts vomiting on a daily basis and taking an anti-anxiety med 3 x/day, then he will not know how I feel.

So....it's the 180 for me. It is completely against my nature, but this is my last ditch effort. It's time for him to put up or shut up. I'm prepared either way.

Sorry I've been out of touch the last few days. I'm still pretty shaky and will need to work to feel strong-ish.

(((Tribe)))


Posts: 490 | Registered: Aug 2010 | From: Texas
ImNellNow
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Member # 28753
Default  Posted: 5:54 PM, April 8th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

You all might be right about taking on the big-ass scary jailhouse mamas. Apparently I scare the shit out of WH...

I came home and waved at him, picked up the leash and took the dog for a long walk, answered "I am pissed off and working through it" when WH asked what was wrong before I left. Then I went to go pick up the Boyos from school and he decided to go for a two-hour drive ten minutes before I got home with the Boyos. So HE is avoiding ME. Good call, WH.

Now I'm gonna fix myself a sea breeze, have some hummus and pita chips and watch sitcom reruns while the Boyos celebrate the end of the week with a little Wii. Hastan la vista, mis amigos.


BS & D
Drinking wine and thinking bliss is on the other side of this.

Posts: 2370 | Registered: Jun 2010 | From: Baby steps on my new path
ImNellNow
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Member # 28753
Default  Posted: 5:59 PM, April 8th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

strongish,
We cross-posted. Good for you. You, lady, have got balls. I hope your WH can find his, too.


BS & D
Drinking wine and thinking bliss is on the other side of this.

Posts: 2370 | Registered: Jun 2010 | From: Baby steps on my new path
Scaredstill
♀ Member
Member # 31710
Default  Posted: 6:41 PM, April 8th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Nell,

Apparently I scare the shit out of WH...

DO you think he knows you have visions of ripping his arm off and beating him to death?

Strongish,
Before you wrote this I was thinking the same thing today...that I am doing all the work to clean up someone elses mess....Can I borrow your speech? Couldn't have said it better myself....Hoping your WH sees the light and steps up....grows a pair and does what he needs to do. Hang in there.
Can you listen to your IPOD on the drive tomorrow?

ATS,
Thanks for your words of wisdom and support....he did create this bed. He is not in IC...He goes to MC with me occasionally and only when I schedule. He pretty much just wants this to all go away:)


Posts: 83 | Registered: Mar 2011 | From: DE
atsenaotie
♂ Member
Member # 27650
Default  Posted: 7:17 PM, April 8th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Scared. I am willing to admit to being biased, my FWW rreally has issues to work through. Still, I do not believe that MC can do much good, or R is really possible until the WS identifies their personality/behavior/perception issue that made the A possible, allowed them to compartmentalize the LTA. Until the WS's issues are identified and accepted by the WS, any other effort is MC or trying to R with a damaged soul.

Stongish, I think you are in a good spot. Instead of being hurt or sad that you are still upset, he should be relieved that you are still in the house and that he is allowed to be there too. That you are telling him you want to spend MORE time with him before you decide for sure to D. Honestly, what more could he hope for? At least he is doing the IC, but I know that even when they are willing it is a long and winding road. Uphill most the way.

The seabreeze sounds good Nell. I am planning on vodka, grapefruit juice and soda.

--Ats


LTA BS 53
FWW 60
M 1990, dday 10-5-09
Reconciled

Posts: 3967 | Registered: Feb 2010 | From: FL
m334455
♀ Member
Member # 26893
Default  Posted: 10:29 PM, April 8th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Ats- my poor WH, I'm just like your wife; after Dday I changed WH's ringbone from Real Good Man to Cowboy Cassanova...


BW 38, 5 kids
Dday Dec. 2009

Posts: 4034 | Registered: Dec 2009
iwantamiracle
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Member # 22812
Default  Posted: 11:03 PM, April 8th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((strong)))

(((nell)))


you know there are times when they just suck.....

strong i loved how you stood up for yourself...over in new beginnings someone posted the following on the passive aggressive..and i have to say that it blows my mind at how much i see most if not all of our ws's in this...


The man with passive aggressive behavior needs someone to be the object of his hidden hostility. He needs an adversary whose expectations and demands he can resist as he plays out the dance he learned from his parents. He chooses a woman who will agree to be on the receiving end of his disowned anger. He resists her in small ways setting up a pattern of frustration so that she gets to express the anger that he cannot.

The biggest irritant in being with a passive aggressive man is that he doesn't follow through on his agreements and promises. He dodges responsibility while insisting he's pulling his weight. He procrastinates, takes on big projects but doesn't finish them then feels put upon or hostile if someone else tries to finish it. He often ignores reality as to his irresponsibility and withdrawal. He denies evidence, distorts minimalizes or lies to make his version of reality seem logical.

He uses vague language to sandbag the partner. Inconsistency and ambiguity are his tools of choice. He often gives double messages and expects his partner to read his mind and meet his needs saying ‘She should have known how it is.' He withholds information and has a hidden agenda. He can't take criticism and makes excuses to get himself off the hook. He sulks and uses silence when confronted about his inability to live up to his promises, obligations or responsibilities. When he doesn't follow through, he puts the blame on his partner so he doesn't have to take it and accuses her of having the problem.

The man with this type of pattern shows little consideration of the time, feelings, standards or needs of others. He obstructs and block progress to others getting what they want and then ignores or minimalizes their dissatisfactions and anger. He is silent when confronted as he has never learned to compromise. He may be a workaholic, a womanizer, hooked on TV, caught in addictions or self-involved hobbies.

He may have multiple relationships with women as a way of keeping distant from one fully committed relationship. He is confused about which woman he wants and stays caught between the two women in his life not being able to commit fully to either. He is confused and can't understand why the women get so angry with him. He feels others demand too much of him so resists in overt and subtle ways and feels deprived if must give in to others. The man who copes with conflict by not being there has strong conflict over dependency. He desperately wants attention but fears being swallowed up by the partner. He can't be alone and live without a woman in his life, but can't be with partner emotionally. He's caught in a Catch 22--wanting affection but avoiding it because he fears it as his destruction. He resents feeling dependent on the woman so must keep her off guard. He makes his partner feel like a nothing through his neglect or irritability but he keeps her around because he needs her. His script is ‘Be here for me, but don't come too close and don't burden me with your needs or expectations.'

He has such strong fears of intimacy deep in his unconscious mind so he must set barriers up to prevent a deep emotional connection. He is clever at derailing intimacy when it comes up by tuning out his partner and changing the subject. He must withhold part of himself to feel safe and may withdraw sexually. Closeness and intimacy during sex may make him feel vulnerable and panicked bringing forth his deepest fears of dependency upon a woman. The passive aggressive man lives an internal loneliness; he wants to be with the woman but stays confused whether she is the right partner for him or not. He is scared and insecure causing him to seek contact with a partner but scared and insecure to fully commit.

Due to the wounding from childhood, he is unable to trust that he is safe within the relationship. He fears revealing himself and can't share feelings. His refusal to express feelings keeps him from experiencing his sense of insecurity and vulnerability. He often denies feelings like love that might trap him into true connection with another human being. He feels rejected and hurt when things don't go his way but can't distinguish between feeling rejected and being rejected. He pushes people away first so he won't be rejected. He is often irritable and uses low-level hostility to create distance at home. The relationship becomes based on keeping the partner at bay. He often sets up experiences to get others to reject or deprive him. He is noncommittal and retreats, feeling put upon and burdened by partner's requests for more closeness. He becomes a cave dweller to feel safe.

The man with passive aggressive actions is a master in getting his partner to doubt herself and feel guilty for questioning or confronting him. He encourages her to fall for his apologies, accept his excuses and focus on his charm rather than deal with the issue directly. He blames her for creating the problem and keeps her focused on her anger rather than his own ineptitude. When backed into a corner, he may explode and switch to aggressive aggressive behavior then switch back to passivity. He keeps his partner held hostage by the hope that he will change. He may appease her and clean up his act after a blow up for several weeks, then it's back to business as usual.

The passive aggressive man is the classic underachiever with a fear of competition in the work place. He cannot take constructive feedback from others. His fear of criticism, not following through and his inability to see his part in any conflict keeps him from advancing on the job. He may take three roles on the job or switch back and forth between them.


ats: considering all that she is learning and experiencing i think this little trip is a really good thing...


check in honest..


i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
Allgoodnamesgone
♀ Member
Member # 26157
Default  Posted: 7:20 AM, April 9th (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Strongish: I agree with your friend, I didn't think you were 110% ready to divorce either. In fact, in our recent poll, I think you opted for limboland. I'm glad you recognized this early on.
Now, having said that, I had a near identical speech with my H right after New Year's. I found myself quickly growing impatient with the extent & pace of his efforts, especially as I had more or less told him what I needed for the 100th time, but the bottom line was to take the initiative, show that this is your 1st priority.
My only advice to you is that you should not expect him to respond in the way and as quickly as you would. He probably won't.
I hope you have a different result.

Nell:

Do you think he knows you have visions of ripping his arm off and beating him to death

When I first read your post I was hysterically laughing, but as you seemed to be in crisis, I did not comment. But man you have a FANTASTIC sense of humor/writing style.

Miracle: I read that somewhere too. Yes, a lot applies to my WS as well.

He's still in the basement, but I can tell already that he's going to be looking for love today. I guess I will have to turn the bitch switch on to keep him at bay.

Tryn: (If you are out there) I guess I technically ended it, I just don't like that he files this whole debacle under the category "I f-d up, she finally had enough & ended it. It's not what I wanted." Too much peace in that & all the responsibility (in his head) on me. Now, I know I'm 100% entitled to end it without guilt, but obviously this is a huge decision that was not reached lightly & I almost had to feel that his actions left me no other choice to give myself peace over it.

Busy day for me today. Peace to all.

[This message edited by Allgoodnamesgone at 7:21 AM, April 9th (Saturday)]


Me- BS
DDay- 8/26/09
Separated after failed R effort.

Posts: 2165 | Registered: Nov 2009
Scaredstill
♀ Member
Member # 31710
Default  Posted: 8:23 AM, April 9th (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Nell - Thinking of your today and praying you have a peaceful drive.

Miracle - Thanks for the bit on passive agressive...very applicable and very enlightening and scary :( Most I already knew on some level but to see it in writting ...Wow.

Busy day ahead...peace to you all


Posts: 83 | Registered: Mar 2011 | From: DE
atsenaotie
♂ Member
Member # 27650
Default  Posted: 8:56 AM, April 9th (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

He's still in the basement, but I can tell already that he's going to be looking for love today.

wow, just wow is he planning on the two of you being divorcees with benefits?

iwam, you are so right:

..and i have to say that it blows my mind at how much i see most if not all of our ws's in this...


The woman with passive aggressive behavior needs someone to be the object of her hidden hostility. SHe needs an adversary whose expectations and demands she can resist as she plays out the dance she learned from her parents. SHe chooses a man who will agree to be on the receiving end of her disowned anger. SHe resists him in small ways setting up a pattern of frustration so that he gets to express the anger that she cannot.

Coming out of my missed dday and the eventual dday I took a lot of the blame and ownership for the problems in out M. I see now that most of the problems originated with FWW. I had my own issues, but I was trying to relate based on bad data, passive-aggressive behavior, and projection. Since dday it has been nice to reprocess the old stuff with my new vision, and watch current interaction and know I am not the worthless pos I had convinced myself I was. This is why I truly believe there is a need for our FWSs, especially in LTA, to find and own their internal dysfunction if there is to be any hope for R. You can see the results here. Mr. njgal480 did and they are working. PFM has not and they are not. Mr. allgood has not and they are not. The fact that Mr. Stongish appears to be working on the internal issues

When FWH came home from his IC appt., looking bedraggled and forlorn...
Indicates to me there may be hope if this is what Stongish wants.

I am missing FWW during this trip. This is a very different feeling for me. I used to be happy to have the time with her out of the house. No constant criticism of me, and the kids and work always ran smoother. Then, after dday I would be uneasy and out of control, thinking (knowing ) that she was doing something with someone. Now, I miss her. I will be happy to have her home. I am sorry for her that her trip is not going better (but pleased to have someone other than me be the source of her irritation).

((Tribe))


LTA BS 53
FWW 60
M 1990, dday 10-5-09
Reconciled

Posts: 3967 | Registered: Feb 2010 | From: FL
trynhard
♂ Member
Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 9:41 AM, April 9th (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Allgood... No real technical part about it. You are divorcing your H. He’s demonstrated to you he wants to live a married but singles life.

I think you should hold your head high and make this part of your life very positive. You have some beautiful children together. You are going to be a person capable of managing your life, divorced. You are a woman with strong boundaries only accepting a marriage for what it is supposed to be. I see you as one fantastic woman with courage to change when faced with adversity and end something not working. Just go have fun now. Go be happy!

If I could tattoo your body, I would put this on you

BTW, If I was getting divorced and someone wanted to know why, I am not going to lie or hide anything about it. I wouldn’t volunteer the details to just anyone but I would say only this. My W lives a married but singles lifestyle. That is not the kind of marriage I accept. I think that covers about every part of your H.

This week, I had a good conversation with a guy about The Master’s Golf tourney which Tiger Wood’s marriage was discussed. He said, “I respect Elin Nordegren because she had the courage to Divorce that SOB.” This got me thinking about me. I am reconciling, does that make me “unrespectable”?

No, I respect myself. See, I know who I am today. I am a man able to forgive someone who made a huge mistake. Today, I see my W as un-perfect and that is OK. I have witness her remorse, her change and decision to be a better woman. She demonstrated it to me beyond just words.

In addition, I am really living my life in today. I am prepared for the next hurt to come in my life whatever that may be. My past marriage, I was “treaded” on. I will never again allow my own silent fears settle my displeasures.

You know what? I am happy most all the time these days. I do things that make me happy. It is a great feeling too. Can you be me?

[This message edited by trynhard at 9:50 AM, April 9th (Saturday)]


Posts: 2636 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Indiana
trynhard
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Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 9:57 AM, April 9th (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

So strongish.. what is holding you back?

What is holding back you from filing divorce? really R'ing?

[This message edited by trynhard at 9:58 AM, April 9th (Saturday)]


Posts: 2636 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Indiana
Allgoodnamesgone
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Member # 26157
Default  Posted: 10:33 AM, April 9th (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Ats: I think that is such a good sign - the way you feel about your wife while she is gone. I am happy for you.

Tryn: Thank you for your kind words & encouragement, however, the tattoo --- I believe that would make it damn near impossible to find someone else. Lol. No warnings of any kind. Lol.

ETA: Tryn - I think that a lot of people in Elin's sitch would stay -with all that money, etc. I think that's all they meant. I think there are a number of people who dont understand reconciling after an A - but that's due to ignorance. Now that I've experienced it 1st hand, trying to work thru all this crap deserves a lot of respect, but you already knew that.

Ok, gotta run.

[This message edited by Allgoodnamesgone at 10:35 AM, April 9th (Saturday)]


Me- BS
DDay- 8/26/09
Separated after failed R effort.

Posts: 2165 | Registered: Nov 2009
trynhard
♂ Member
Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 10:41 AM, April 9th (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Ok I’ll give you my update.

This next Friday, 4/15 will be the day I will ask my W if she wants to renew our vows. We are going to Southern Indiana.

This will be the place…

I visited the jewelry store and we devised a plan to get my W’s wedding ring in the shop. They sent a letter saying last year her diamond setting was cracked and never returned to have it repaired. (A true story) They offered a 50% sale price if we bring it in now. You know, a “sale” always get a woman’s attention. When we got the letter I let my wife open it.. lol… she said oh look, “I do need my ring fixed.” So this Monday, I’m going to take it in. Then I am going to tell her I’ll pick it up before we leave Thursday afternoon. I am going to “forget” to pick it. Then present it to her on my knee.

I am going to have two new diamond placed on each sides. To me, one diamond on the left will be a our past, and the other on the right will be our future. It will give my W her chance to wash away all her past sins. Me too. I am going into this with eyes wide open. If she says no, I will divorce her.

When we got married, believe it or not, I never proposed. I did not ask her dad if it was OK. One day, we were in our car. In her anger, emotions, or whatever they were that day talking about our relationshi, of which I could never relate to, she ask me, “ what are your intentions?” I responded, “I am going to marry you.” The next thing I know, we are picking out rings. How immature is that? We were so NOT ready to get married. It proved out in our lives. anyway, not proposing in the right way was something I regret.


Going to the Aaron Lewis (Staind) concert too.... Yep, Tangled is good word.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQWWrWkl4v0&feature=related

Hey, life goes on….

[This message edited by trynhard at 11:03 AM, April 9th (Saturday)]


Posts: 2636 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Indiana
njgal480
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Member # 24938
Default  Posted: 10:42 AM, April 9th (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Tryin-
Don't get hung up on what other people have to say about infidelity.
It is truly one of those things that unless you have lived through it you truly have no idea of how you would react.
In terms of respecting those that leave the cheating spouse....well, one thing that I never realized is that a cheating spouse could be extremely remorseful.
I assumed that all cheaters really wanted to leave the marriage. And,I assumed that since they were cheating they would never change their behavior and the spouse who stayed married to the cheater did so because they were resigned to having that type of open marriage.
Meanwhile, I now know due to my own experience and also due to the experiences of others that I have met during this infidelity journey that it is possible to have the infidelity be a real wake up call for the WS and that the WS can have a new found appreciation for the BS and the marriage and that they can work together to create a new and better marriage.
So, if there was a BS that stayed in a marriage where the WS was not comitted to the marriage and continued his/her wayward ways that's one thing.
But, to see a BS decide to reconcile with a very remorseful FWS that is someone that I would respect.

And... I may be in the minority but... I don't think that it would have been far fetched for Elin to try to work on the marriage ..even after all of the infidelity revelations.
They do have very young children, none of the affairs were 'love' relationships. The women were professional escorts for heaven's sake (no matter what titles they give themselves- Las Vegas hostesses etc.) In a way I might have respected her more if they could have forged a long term reconciliation as opposed to so many of the celebs that seem to have a 5 yr limit on their marriages. They give up very quickly and then move on to the next.

There was one semi- celeb who had a very public affair. He is an actor and heir to the Getty fortune. He was married and they had 4 kids I think...then he hooked up this actress from England Sienna Miller and had this very public affair (lots of pics of them cavorting together that were in the tabloids). This 'thing' went on for over a year I think.
But, last I read (in the tabloids) he went back to his wife and kids. And, everything that I read was very kind to the betrayed wife. Not even the tabloids were putting her down for taking him back.
so..it depends....

[This message edited by njgal480 at 11:41 AM, April 9th (Saturday)]


Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA
Reconciled.


Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
trynhard
♂ Member
Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 10:51 AM, April 9th (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Oh allgood.. I would never want you to mark your body.... But if you ever see this, you know what it means.


Posts: 2636 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Indiana
atsenaotie
♂ Member
Member # 27650
Default  Posted: 11:00 AM, April 9th (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

G'morning Tryn. That looks like a nice place to visit, I hope you two have a great second engagement.

FWW had to have her wedding ring repaired too. During her A, she took it off one day and put it on her right hand as a joke. Her ring on the wrong hand because she married the wrong man. Problem is, it got stuck. She bought a cheap "replacement" wedding ring to wear. After dday she eventually had her wedding ring cut off and repaired. After they soldered it back together and polished it up it looked like new. When I presented it back to her I recited my M vow from 20 years earlier. I was going to take my wedding ring it to have it polished and shined up like hers, but I have since decided to keep it the way it is. Nicked, scratched, and well worn.

I realized today that one of my last A issues to resolve is jealousy. The, as far as I know, unrepentant OM and BIL have memories of their time with FWW. The secret discussions, the flirting, and some pretty good sex. It bothers me that they have these memories that they can relive and think about. I know FWW regrets those times and abhors the memories of what she did with these people. I wish there was a way to make the memories painful for them too rather than an erotic secret they carry with them.

Dip, if you are out there I have the smoker fired up today doing a butt for pulled pork tonight.

--Ats


LTA BS 53
FWW 60
M 1990, dday 10-5-09
Reconciled

Posts: 3967 | Registered: Feb 2010 | From: FL
njgal480
♀ Member
Member # 24938
Default  Posted: 12:10 PM, April 9th (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Tryin-
I think the idea of a proposal and renewing your vows is great.
I've written on here about how helpful it was for me to have the 'new' memory of the recommitment ceremony as opposed to thinking of my anniversary date as representing a failed marriage and broken vows- having the recommitment ceremony on our anniversary date definitely helped me to reclaim our anniversary.
Now, as it approaches I do not have any triggers at all. That date reminds me of our commitment to each other and how we have both worked so hard to save our marriage.
I hope that the vow renewal is as much of a blessing to you and your wife.

Ats- Your wife is one lucky woman. Your love for her is evident in your posts.
As for the OM and BIL's memories of her.... I'm sure on some level they realize your wife's behavior was an example of your wife going through a very toxic period in her life.
She was involved with them because she was not healthy.

I forget now... did the OM's wife ever find out about the LTA? and in BIL's case your wife's sister never found out. My guess would be that BIL has been unfaithful to his wife.

For all the LTAers...there's a really good post in the Reconciliation forum about the Four Pillars of Reconciliation (what the WS needs to do for a successful R).


Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA
Reconciled.


Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
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