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User Topic: Long Term Affair - Part 25
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Default  Posted: 8:30 AM, May 23rd (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage


loved loved loved reading your post....

you have come such a long way and i am so happy that your path has turned that proverbial corner and now at this junction a confirmation, validation and a blessing of the path you are on.....

i am so happy for you my friend, so happy indeed....

laura: oh my gosh, what good news about your dog....and i am so happy for you too, you too have come such a long way in such a relatively short and your "F"ws have done a lot of hard work together....and i am happy that you are beginning to feel a sense of peace with where you are...

allgood: i hear you on the dreading the telling to the kids....and your kids are little...all ages of your questions from them will vary as will their reactions...we are here for ya hon....

nell: i hope the more you have to say is good...

miracle update: suddenly pfm is no longer going in early in the morn...i told him this am that i wish he were, its much easier when i do not have to see him and deal with him in the mornings...

his first response: i did it for you, and also the projects are finished....the latter is a well as the first reponse...he really isnt doing this for me he is doing it so he can feel better....he was caught...

all i wanted and still want is no more lies...he can have his friend, just dont come telling me you are being an honest man doing everything you can for as long as it takes to recocnile this marriage...of course he does not get that part...all he gets is that i was hurt by this latest betrayal...its the why was i hurt he cannot seem to process...not that it really is my issue i am lack of acceptance of who he lack of acceptance of believing that i cannot believe him at all....

its a major connundrum of sorts...but the basic truth is me, i have to accept who he is and stop trying to believe otherwise...when this inconsistancies pop up, when the lies are outed....its me, i have to stop getting angry over it, its not worth it, i know who he is and i have to accept it once and for all....he is a liar, a cheat and a manipulator.....and this i know, expecting otherwise is not only foolish but sets me up for hurt.....

check off this aha moment...and remind myself of this daily, hourly if i must.....its time for me to believe who he is now and always was.....when people show you who they are believe them....

same will hold true on some of these levels for my son...i cannot fix him, i cannot control him....i am not even sure i can guide him anymore....he is laying his path and there does not seem to be a whole lot i can do about it....with exception to adding to it, i cannot alter it....and i will not add to it now...not hopefully for a bit....i need to be able to give him time..and pray and keep sending him to therapy, both ic and family in the hopes that he gets his "sight"....

thanks tribe, i have been letting it out more and more....i am no longer silencing alot of what i need to get out....some still needs to remain private ..but i am finding that it no longer matters...he cannot get into my head, that door has been i believe closed....and i think i realized that he is is not capable of that....he will try to read into everything, but he is so screwed up with his perceptions it really doesnt matter...and my son too, his perceptions are so srewed far from reality...its scary...and apparantly genetic..

yup need a girls nite...

i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
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Default  Posted: 8:37 AM, May 23rd (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage


Thanks for asking about me. How are things? I don't know. Better? Same? Beats me?

WH and I have a long-standing non-infidelity related problem that I gave him an ultimatum on about 3 weeks before Dday and our fireworks two weeks ago were about him crossing the line there. You see, I didn't say "you can't act like X very often" I said -- "you can't do X ever again--. So, now I've got to back up the ultimatum. And therein lies the problem. I was trying to figure out if there was a way to back up the ultimatum without filing for D and I think I've found a solution, but this is really, really his very last chance. My kids and I are getting off this crazy train, we just are. I didn't spend 6 years in therapy to recover from having bipolar disorder and a mother with Munchausen's by proxy to get my chain yanked around by an out of control person willy nilly. It's almost as bad as still being crazy, and it's a terrible environment for children.

So, the fireworks have calmed down for now, but the issue isn't resolved.

As for the relocation - it's a problem for multiple reasons. The house is not on the market yet, so that's not an issue. I need a few small repairs and some fresh paint, and a new walkway so it's not the world's hugest project but everything is a huge project with this many small children. The two biggest parts of the problem are (1) a couple of houses in the neighborhood have gone through foreclosure this spring so I just don't think we can get enough $ for the house right now and (2) This house is going to sell for way more than $500K more than I bought it for due to the extensive renovations we did, but that means I need to figure out what our adjusted cost basis is going to be so I can see where the line is when I have to start paying capital gains taxes. We definitely have equity in the house, but it's very likely that it would be completely offset by the tax liability.

BTW -- I didn't even think of the tax thing until Friday, when a friend asked me to try to find her a tax lawyer because she and her husband short sold their rental when he was out of work for 7 months last year and now they're facing a $52K tax bill on it... ugh.

So, that's about it.

I would very much love to be able to write a post like yours Laura. I really would.

But, for right now, I need to do some work and then some more MATH about the house, etc. UGH.

I will say, though a few more short things. While I still don't see real remorse in my WH, after our fireworks of two weeks ago he does get it a little more. He was shocked at how much I think of this (I told him about 10 times a day -- thank god, it used to be like 40) and he's brought me breakfast in bed the past two weekends. Also, the Pasha asked WH (right before we went to the new Pirates movie) whether Jack Sparrow was a good guy or a bad guy and WH said, "well, he's not really either. Sometimes good guys turn into bad guys and sometimes bad guys turn into good guys. Jack Sparrow used to be a bad guy, and he still does some bad things sometimes, but over time he's becoming more and more of a good guy." Also, when we did a good job with The Pasha's temper tantrum on Saturday the little guy was in time out, but we explained that time out is not a consequence, it is for him to learn to calm himself down, and WH said The Pasha would have to wait for another day to go get his new fish as his consequence because it's important for him to learn that if he doesn't listen and does bad things there's going to be a consequence he will have to face for that.

Also, WH did say, totally out of the blue that he loves me very much and he wants to keep our marriage more than anything and he'll do anything I say. Very pretty words. But there were some actions to back them up too - he watched the little one while I took the bigger ones to the movie, and also while I took them shopping for summer clothes, he grilled lunch. etc. He was very helpful around the house and with the kids without asking. And it was a tough weekend, three of them are getting over being sick, one is teething, and the other is my chronically grumpy kid.

Wow. I wrote a book! Thanks for asking about me!

Laura --

I am glad you have realized this about your WH's A. My WH actually expressed this exact thought to me on Dday, and even said I'm a perfect wife (which is not true, for no one is perfect but the sentiment that it wasn't based in a dissatisfaction with me was thoughtful). Anyway, I hope you fully internalize this with time. It will repair your self esteem more than anything.

I am lucky that a smart person said to me that the reason to say the consequence is A, B, C rather than a D right now -- and the reason that is a sufficient way to back up the ultimatum -- is that I still love my WH, and that's important. And it really is.

Many people I know think that I love my WH more than he loves me, but I disagree. I am more loving in the sense of actions, but I know that I could have a happy and fulfilling life without him. Maybe he could do the same, but I honestly don't think so.

I think I also mentioned this already, but maybe not, he actually said there is something wrong with him mentally. I disagree with his word choice, I would use emotionally, but extreme child abuse and neglect, especially in the first three years of life does cause huge mental and emotional problems, and possibly even brain damage. Studies have shown that children who do not form proper attachments by age 3 have a difficult time forming attachments at all. I think of some of his issues as almost a handicap -- like, if it were our emotional issues that were visible rather than our physical ones he would be blind, or in a might ATS's or dip's wives. So, as an analogy, I can help him, but only so much -- if he were blind, I could not move the furniture, and drive the family places, and help him make sure his clothes match, but he'd still have to get himself on the metro and to work, etc. But he couldn't just sit in a chair moaning woe is me, I'm blind, all the time. it's like my friend who had cancer and lost almost all his hair permanently at 17 and finally, 2 years later, still bemoaning his scraggly hair, I said look dude, you're alive after having a cancer that is 99% fatal. Shave the rest of the hair off your head, pretend you're bald by choice, grow a bad-ass goatee and move on with your life already.

BW 38, 5 kids
Dday Dec. 2009

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Default  Posted: 8:44 AM, May 23rd (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage


Thanks for sharing about your vow renewal. That is so, so beautiful! I have learned so very much from you and I can't thank you enough for that. But THANK YOU!

BW 38, 5 kids
Dday Dec. 2009

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Default  Posted: 10:31 AM, May 23rd (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Tryn: Congratulations!! What wonderful news and such beautiful vows. Thank you for sharing your journey with us. I loved the picture. That is something that you should print and frame, it is so symbolic.

Laura: I am so happy that your dog will be ok. What a gift!! Also, it is wonderful that your R is going so well and you have come to a place of more acceptance and healing.

Allgood: Stay strong, you are doing all the right things. It will be difficult telling the kids. You may consider telling your oldest by himself so he can ask questions if he feels he needs to. The main thing is to let the kids know that mommy and daddy love them and that will never ever change. Make sure they understand it is NOT their fault, kids tend to internalize something like this and think that if they act better that Mommy and Daddy will get back together.
It will be a long tough road, and it will be harder in a way because you will have to be strong for your kids who will be mourning the new situation.

Miracle: You are getting stronger and I am so glad that you are venting and posting. It is so hard to do what you are doing, especially since pfm still does not get it and still continues to lie about stupid things. It's good that you are letting go of trying to control manchild. We can do only so much. We can guide them and help them and love them, but we cannot control them. It's hard to watch them make mistakes, but this is part of growing up and learning. Experience is the best teacher. We want to protect them, but we can't.

M3: you are sounding stronger and more focused. I feel you have made a good decision about this behavior that your WH does that you will no longer tolerate. I like your WH's response to your DS about Jack Sparrow. It sounds like he is coming to a breakthrough on his own. I hope all goes well with your plans about selling your house. This economy is tough and so many people are suffering.

{{{{Nell and Strong}}} my thoughts are with you.

As for me, I'm trying to deal with my emotions that are coming to the surface so easily. Something I'm working on with IC. It is not just A triggers, but what people would often describe a person as being "too sensitive". Right now, I'm too sensitive to many things. At least I recognize it for what it is, but it's so much work to have to stop and talk to oneself to see a situation objectively and not react in an emotional mind set.

I'm getting there.

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Default  Posted: 11:10 AM, May 23rd (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I don’t have time to read up – DS16 is behind me exam revising. But I need to get this out there.

I’m in full panic melt-down mode. I made a commitment. Two black Labradors. Now I’m wondering if I’ve done the right thing. They are beautiful – the owner lives in rented accom and the lease stipulated no pets and they had three dogs. When one of our two labs died 8mths after d-day, I decided not to replace her, using the excuse that it wasn’t fair on the other lab. Well, she died last summer and I had already made up my mind there was no way I was going to have another dog as I felt much too insecure in my m.

I saw the ad on the internet on Saturday (I was looking for a second hand therapy couch and came across pets….), FWH said the time was right, the house was empty without a dog and two would be best, blah, blah. He said ring and we’d go over and see them. So I did. DS16 has also been pestering for a dog – he kept “hearing” and “seeing” our old one.

Yesterday morning, before we went to see them, I wanted to cancel – FWH he couldn’t understand why I was having second thoughts. I said we had the time for us now that we weren’t tied anymore. (Of course I was also thinking that if he had left me during the A, I would have been left with the kids and the dogs and if I had thrown him out on d-day, I would have been left with the kids and the dogs. I don’t believe in getting an animal for the short term or on a whim – a dog is for life. And I’ve acted on a whim.

These dogs are lovely, but not properly housetrained, so we’ve had a few accidents already. I got so stressed that I woke at 4am with a bad head that turned into a full blown vomiting migraine. I struggled around this morning, had a sleep after a cup of soup lunch and now I’m waiting for quiet time at the park to go out for a gentle walk with DS16 in control of the dogs. H is playing golf.

It’s ridiculous, but I don’t think I can cope. I feel I have made a commitment to H in some way. But all I feel is trapped and tied. Suddenly, my time has stopped being my own. I’ve no doubt that the bloke would take them back, although it would be awful for his kids knowing that they couldn’t stay.


seems i have some reading to do on Tryn' I'll bbl when i can be alone with my laptop....

D-Day: 30 July 2006 LTA: 5yrs
Me, BS, 56 y/o Him, WS, 57 y/o
MOW, pathetic ex-fiancee.
3 grown boys and one 18 y/o
I don't consider myself married anymore.
There are some words once spoken split the world in two. Before you say them and after.

Posts: 3328 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: UK
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Default  Posted: 12:33 PM, May 23rd (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage


OK first let me say that you all are truly amazing the way you keep up with each others life's and support each other. It makes me feel safer posting here than any other thread I've been on.

My heart and prayers go out to all of you. Your strength and fortitude at surviving in these terrible situations helps me gain perspective. You are all truly amazing.

Tryn, I have to admit that your latest post struck a chord, or caused an aha moment with me. The word "FEAR" is reverberating in my head. I still love FWW and I've never left or filed for D because I really have never gotten to the point where I find it completely unbearable with her but I'm still not happy. Your post nailed it (at least for today) with the word fear.

Miracle, I also looked at your post and saw a lot but the word "CONTROL" stuck with me. I've come to realize today that 2 of my biggest hurdles are FEAR and CONTROL.

I am terrified of going through anything like this again (fear) and the minute I feel my FWW isn't getting it I feel like I cannot attach myself to her because she is not in control of her thought processes yet and her lack of control over that and my lack of control over the fear of her doing it again makes me crazy!! Talk about your circular logic!

I know I need to work on these things I just have to make myself "want" to work on them. Today would have been our 30th anniversary. I say would have been because I don't count any years after her A started as being married. She completely gave me up in every way for him. I guess I'm fearful of allowing myself to be that trusting or personally devastated again. I guess I now see the mountain before me I just have to decide if I want to try and climb it or not. I can't control her or the future so what am I afraid of? (rhetorical question)

Finally if the ladies get a "girls night out" how about us guys having a "guys grill in"

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Default  Posted: 12:37 PM, May 23rd (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

UKgirl: When our dog died several years ago, the DS's and WH were pestering me for another dog and I kept making excuses for why not ( I do have allergies)Every once and a while we went to a shelter, but I nixed everything. BUT, last month we came across a dog that was just like our Prince, in looks, temperment, etc. So I decided yes.

That's the difference here. UKgirl, I get the feeling that YOU don't want or not ready to have a new dog. You are doing it like I was initially, for WH, for the kids, etc but NOT for YOU.

You don't seem like you are ready. Take the dogs back. DO NOT FEEL GUILTY.
Your body is telling you that you are not ready for this committment. It's time that you had time for YOU and taking care of you. You don't need more responsibilities other than healing.

Some day, you may be ready and want another dog, but until then....NO.


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Default  Posted: 12:41 PM, May 23rd (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Sounds like run of the mill panic/anxiety to me. I think you will be okay as long as you can keep your heartrate where it should be.

(Speaking of which, I'm having a bit of work-stress anxiety right now... using SI as my crutch so this will be short)


miracle and jollum,
I love the ah-ha moments, especially the ones I have over and over again. Or is "ah-ha" only available the first time, after which point it becomes an "oh, yeah" moment? Anyway... good on you for seeing and believing.

Your STBXWH's full name is Rudely Nogood, isn't it?


I am more loving in the sense of actions, but I know that I could have a happy and fulfilling life without him. Maybe he could do the same, but I honestly don't think so.

I don't think so about Mr. Nell, either. He got hella lucky with me the first go-round and now he's exactly the same guy he was when I got together with him, except he's gained a bunch of weight and is 40 with two kids. Whereas I am even better than I was before. (Yes, indeed... I'm much smarter about people and I look better than I did when I was in my 20s... Is my current story and who among you is going to disagree with me?)

Good on you for dealing with your emotions and not just running with them. They're slippery little suckers, those emotions. They'll run you in circles.

I don't even know what happened in the previous page... hello to everyone.

Alligators. Gotta run.

[This message edited by ImNellNow at 12:43 PM, May 23rd (Monday)]

BS & D
Drinking wine and thinking bliss is on the other side of this.

Posts: 2370 | Registered: Jun 2010 | From: Baby steps on my new path
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Default  Posted: 12:57 PM, May 23rd (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

gots little to no time..


sit down and work out every scenario in your head...then pick that path of least regret....

of course you are in a arent ready to commit and i believe you would if you believed mr ukgirl did really "commit" the way you have needed him to from the getgo....

freedom is a blessing, and lonliness can be heartbreaking....

not an easy choice.....choose which way you will be able to be happy with next year and then 5 years from now....

and finally, act upon your path of least regret...not your ws's or even your kids....speaking of which...what is the plan for your youngest..will he stay home or go away to college....that also might influence your future choices...or i should say your choices for your future...

gots to go pick up my boys now will be back later to comment on the rest of the posts...

oh and nell...."Rudely Nogood"....sounds like a great new name...what ya say allgood should we christen him with his new name???

cant wait to see what you might come up with for pfm... ...since you do have such a way with words and since you do do this very well im thinkin you should do this in your spare time should you ever have any for all our ws's.....


i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
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Default  Posted: 1:25 PM, May 23rd (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage


You need to jump on being one of those delf-published Kindle millionaires before it's too late ...

Hi jollum -- I didn't give you a proper hello before due to my 5 am induced sleep coma. (Oh, by the way all, it's not just that the 3 1/2 year old accross the street still has her baby monitor on, that bad enough, but she has NIGHT TERRORS.) Anyway, FEAR and CONTROL. Oh, yes. Many a fight I had with my IC even before Dday about control. She'd say "you need to say X or do Y with your H" and I'd say "Don't you think that's a bit controlling?" and she'd say "Are we talking about a person who appears to be in control of himself?" ...

So, the reason I share this is ... while you can't live in a controlling relationship permanently, a WS is a person who has on some level been out of control. And that leaves you in a pretty weird spot if you want to R. It's that old "Am I my brother's (wife's, husband's) keeper?" thing.

So, how do you deal with this? As you can see, different people choose different paths on that one. But it IS a huge part of the "trick" to figuring out R.

Now, FEAR. Fear is easier to manage if you break it down into teeny tiny pieces. I will give you an example:

My Fear: WH will cheat on me again

Ok -- now you break it down into the tiny sub-fears and analyze how likely these sub-fears are to be accurate. I would also throw in this idea: it's Dr. Phil, and yes, he's cheesy but he also hits the nail on the head sometimes -- the big ultimate question for a BS is: if this happened again, would you be OK? Could you pick yourself up and recover or not? If not, why not? That's what you need to mitigate or eliminate to make R possible.

Anyway -- subfear

FEAR: I am afraid that if I do not R WH will return to OW and she will harm my children.
HOW LIKELY IS THIS: WH does not want to be alone. It is likely he will be in another primary relationship ASAP if we divorced. OW married another man while seeing WH, so she might not want to leave her M for WH. However, OW did rat WH out, so maybe she does want to leave her M now that WH is making more $ than her BH. Likelihood of OW having access to my kids -- possible. OW harming my kids: OW abuses her BH. OW hit her former nanny and terrorized her so bad that nanny still has nightmares 3 years later. OW offered to keep my 4 year old child for the night when my 16 day old baby was hospitalized and then locked my older son in a dark room for the night because he was "too old to be scared of the dark." OW told a friend my oldest child is a horrible spolied brat. I asked nanny if she thought Baby Paddy would be in danger if WH left me and hooked up with OW again and her response was "it's not that hard to make the death of a disabled baby look like an accident." OW has hit her child in front of me. OW's oldest child is disturbed, in special classes at school for behavior problems and was rubbing his genitals on people and running around naked at age 8. Likelihood she would harm my children: at least 98%.
Ways to mitigate the fear
(1) attempt R
(2) expose OW's actions to WH
(3) get affidavits of her behavior and prevent visitation where kids could be expose to OW if WH leaves for OW
(4) pray ... etc.

So there's a (disgusting) example of how to analyze fear...

Another, short version, is that I realized after analyzing some specific fears that I would not be OK if WH cheated again and my financial situation was still bad because I would just feel 900% even more stupid. So, I need to fix some financial stuff.

BW 38, 5 kids
Dday Dec. 2009

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Default  Posted: 1:31 PM, May 23rd (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Tryn... thanks for sharing your special day with us.

Coincidentally, in my email today:
flickspire - Over the Rainbow Movie

I'm sharing it with you today because I think it will move all of us in a good way. Sit back, relax, breathe.

I haven't read page 12 yet and have some thoughts on previous pages but only a short time online while FWH is outside working on our lawn/yard before it rains again. So I'll send a hug to all of you & hope you know I am here, caring about my LTA friends.


Posts: 808 | Registered: Feb 2007 | From: Canada
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Default  Posted: 3:45 PM, May 23rd (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

since he chose "prayformiracle," how about Mr. Are-You-There-God-It's-Me-Stupid. It's one of those God-awful hyphenated names, but could be shortened to Mr. Stupid. Which is not nearly as clever, but seemingly apt, based solely upon his interpersonal actions. Is he a smart man, otherwise? I would think he must be, to be the breadwinner, etc. What would you say his emotional age is?

I don't think there are writer-millionaires any longer. I have a friend who is an established author, whose (award-winning) book was made into a movie... and her publisher dropped her because her second book didn't do as well as her first, and she can't find a new publisher. It's dismal in the literary world.

Just spreading joy and lightness. Nell out!

BS & D
Drinking wine and thinking bliss is on the other side of this.

Posts: 2370 | Registered: Jun 2010 | From: Baby steps on my new path
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Default  Posted: 3:49 PM, May 23rd (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

You people need to stop getting a life and keep me entertained.

I disapprove of your success in erasing many of your co- dependent traits because now I 'm bored and have no one to whine to!

NAAAHH... Everyone have a great night!

BW 38, 5 kids
Dday Dec. 2009

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Default  Posted: 4:29 PM, May 23rd (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Jollum: I think we were cross posting. Ahhh, control. We do try so hard to control what we can to no avail. The only thing we can control is ourselves, our reactions to things and our attitude. Easier said than done. M3 gave you great advice on how to deal with fear. I do the same thing as to thinking "what's the worst thing that can happen? Can I deal with that?" I know I've let fear control me since dday. Now, I'm trying to take control of that fear. Keep venting here, it helps.

M3: I really liked your post about how to deal with control and fear. Breaking it down the way you showed makes it feel like it is more manageable. Thank you.!My God, OW is horrible!! She is scarey. Hopefully, your WH now sees her as she truly is!
Don't worry, I'm not dealing with my co-dependency that well and I'l try to keep you as entertained as possible

Nell: OMG you are right, those emotions can run you in circles. It feels like they've been running my life for far too long and I couldn't get a handle on them at all. Now, I'm learning not to fight them or try to squash them like I was. I'm learning to recognize that I'm feeling what I'm feeling and to realize that often the overwhelming emotions have been triggered by something in the present and to try to deal with what is happening in the present. Very hard at times, but I guess with practice it will get easier.
I like your nicknames for Mr. Nogood and pfm
Mine is "Mr. Dishonest" but I could use an "aka" for a laugh. Now, Nell, you just have to charge us for this and you will be getting paid for your literary efforts

Hi lostsuol! It is so easy to get behind if you don't keep up!! I hope you are doing well.

For me, I just want the rain to go away for at least two days in a row.


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Default  Posted: 4:44 PM, May 23rd (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

As always lurking...

Tryn - what lovely picture, wishing you and yours many more blessings and much happiness

Laura - so glad your friend is doing okay again. Don't you wish we could recover so quickly? Tails wagging and eyes full of trust?

Really amazing posts - I see myself in so many of the posts. Anti-versary coming up soon for me along with 40th wedding anniversary in July. Triggering horribly from it all -- not sure how to celebrate this 40th anniversary. I would like to be like Tryn and really renew the vows but it still really feels fake to me - I feel sadness and fear as so many have posted. And truthfully, I cannot get over feeling pissed off. I cannot. I am still angry. Is this the second year of living angrily?

Our other house looks like it is going be sold and closed in a week or so, so I will finally have enough budget to get some MC and maybe IC. I need it. After a year of this - I am exhausted. I need help professional guidance for coping and recovering. I do, I know now I can't do it on my own with or without spouse's help, remorseful or not.

Nell - do you remember the Mr. Wonderful doll from a few years back? If you pushed his button, it would spout phrases like "I'd love to do the dishes" etc. I can envision a similar Mr Stupid doll (and a Mrs Stupid doll so as not to generalize) with phrases like "I didn't mean to hurt you", "I AM reading the book", and the always popular "sound of crickets chirping".
Maybe I'll post something about it on General, might give a few hurting souls a few chuckles.

Thank you all - I don't post often enough but I do read. You are an amazing tribe


BW- Me 60 FWS - 65
M 43 years
DD June 9, 2010
On and off LTA with dept secretary
But store up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where moth and rust do not destroy, and where thieves do not break in and steal Matt 6:20

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Default  Posted: 7:08 PM, May 23rd (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I did the exact same thing!
Three years ago... I had this urge to get a puppy. We had a dog years ago when the children were little etc. And, I had been thinking about it on and off for here I was 2 yrs post d-day and I bought a cute little cockapoo puppy home- I had the exact same panic stricken reaction.
I realized that it was a mistake. That for the first time in my life- I needed to NOT be a caretaker. I needed to be taken care of!
So...with a lot of tears and a lot of trepidation and guilt... I called the breeder and gave the puppy back.
I have not regretted the decision. A huge part of our reconciliation has been taking trips and spending quality time together. I could not have gone on all the trips.
Lately, I've been thinking about volunteering at our local animal shelter to help walk dogs etc.

Tryin- I love your pics and the description of your vow renewal! I am so.... happy for you.
I also can relate to everything that you said about your journey to reconciliation and healing.

I am feeling better about R every day.

Laura- It sounds like you are on your way to a strong and successful reconciliation. I'm glad that EMDR has been helping you.

Miracle- I hope that you can find peace and happiness.'re right.. another girl's night out may be exactly what you need!

Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA

Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
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Default  Posted: 8:26 PM, May 23rd (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hugs Tribe.

Tryn, congratulations on and best wishes in your new phase.

Laura, glad to read things turning out much better than it initially sounded for your dog.

iwam, our children are a genetic and environmental combination of both their parents, so it is expected there would be some pfm tendencies in manchild. It really sounds like you are doing all you can.


FWW 60
M 1990, dday 10-5-09

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Default  Posted: 9:12 PM, May 23rd (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage


what a scary future you have painted in your fear channel.....i say change the channel...

but since you cannot, this is where you need to find out everything you can on what you can and cannot do concerning any op's regarding your kids....because if he needs to be attached...and she is not the one he attaches to, i would say cover your ass for any possible choice he may make....

maybe a post nup regarding child custody issues is in order....

and if the bottom line is you fear leaving him for this reason...i understand that need to protect your kids.....and you will hopefully take lots of steps to protect yourself too....we all do what we gotta do to eventually get to what we want to do....and there is an bankin on it myself...

gotta give your ws a few props...the way he described jack sparrow was very well said....

honest: dealing with the emotions...

thats really the nut we all have to crack isnt for you being "sensitive"...well pray tell why are they complaining....lets see...your husband treated you like dirt, spoke to you like dirt, married another woman, had 3 kids with her, threatened you all the time with addine a 3rd if you didnt do his bidding....took all of your personal money leaving you with none and your house deep in mortgage.....wants to take your kids overseas....and we arent even gonna go to the other shit that has happened or is happening in your life...and your a tad sensitive....well...i would say that there might be something wrong with you if you werent...

im betting that there are so many of us bs's here who can turn on a dime, from happy to sad, or happy to mad, spitfire mad....want to kill someone mad....i would say we are all a bit sensitive...

anyone complains about this again...tell them to go fly a kite in a lightening storm and when they get hit by lightening...remember...dont be so sensitive bout it...

and you are working on putting the multitude of pain in a box....a box that could go up on a shelf, taken down now and then as a reminder of where you have been and where you are going...and then back up on that shelf so that it doesnt interfere with the daily grind of life....

and yes honest, you are getting there...we all are...


wow, your goin for some of the biggies....fear and control....

have you ever read the serenity prayer...

God grant me the serenity
to accept the things I cannot change;
courage to change the things I can;
and wisdom to know the difference.

Living one day at a time;
enjoying one moment at a time;
accepting hardships as the pathway to peace;
taking, as He did, this sinful world
as it is, not as I would have it;
trusting that He will make all things right
if I surrender to His Will;
that I may be reasonably happy in this life
and supremely happy with Him
forever in the next.

every now and then i read it to remind me....i of course need reminding, especially in the surrender part....

sometimes we hold on so tight, and try so hard to control that which we cannot because we are truly afraid of being consumed i think with the hurt....and it will feel like the end of the world as we know it....control the sich so it cant hurt we can...and as much as we all know we cannot control others we still try....

lostsoul: its good to see you....last you checked in you were worried i think about the job and the ow....anything on that hopin no news is good news...

nell: mr stupid....seems too underwhelming....and too simple...

is he a smart man...well he picked me...granted i wasnt his only pick....i think he could be smart...but stupid keeps creepin for making money...well he's made alot, and lost some too....thank god he didnt lose as much as he made....stupid creepin in there too....

i got creepin not...

promise: its good to see you again....40 should be such a joyous occasion....i think you goin to ic is a fabulous deserve it...and if you are workin on the too...


he's exactly the same guy he was when I got together with him, except he's gained a bunch of weight and is 40 with two kids. Whereas I am even better than I was before. (Yes, indeed... I'm much smarter about people and I look better than I did when I was in my 20s... Is my current story and who among you is going to disagree with me?)

me disagree...thats a hell to the NO...


I am feeling better about R every day.

oh my gosh...I LOVE THIS and i am so so happy for so deserve the happiness you finally YAY


thanks for your vote of confidence....but i have to say i make lots of mistakes....lots...and for some reason..this kid is always the one who gets them....although that may have alot to do with the fact that he is the one who gives me the biggest run for my money....but then much of that is because of the things pfm would say to him...i didnt protect him from him well enough....i stayed with this man when i probably should have left his sorry ass...but i didnt know.....

this is what i do...i go back and forth and back and forth...i really want to be able to say why he is the way he is....i think if i could lay blame it will give me someone else to be angry with instead of him....even of that someone else is me...not to mention he was my responsiblity....

ok, i need to really does not matter does is what it is and it will become what WE make of it...him and i....not so much change that yet will become what HE makes of is his life and he is close to adult hood....i will still guide, that is still my job...and thankfully i have 2 therapist to help me do the if it doesnt work i'll blame them...

done ramblin...

how are you ats? you have been quiet...


eta: strong check had a really rough couple of days....(((strong)))

[This message edited by iwantamiracle at 9:27 PM, May 23rd (Monday)]

i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
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Default  Posted: 11:24 PM, May 23rd (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

NJgal: I'm glad that you are feeling better about R every day. You deserve to be happy.

Miracle: Ats is right. Children are a combo of their genetic tendencies and environment. You are doing the best that you can do. That's all you can do, and love your kids with all your heart. It may sound simplistic, but that is one of the biggest gifts you can give your children: unconditional love. I never felt it with my parents, but thank God I had it with my grandmother. I knew in my heart that if she got mad at me for some stupid thing I did as a kid, she would still love me. I would want to make up for it, apologize and make it right, but I still FELT she loved me.
If you have given that to your son, then he has an incredibly precious gift that will see him through his life.

You said my WH treated me like dirt, but not before dday. He treated me well, always saying sweet charming things, etc. This is why I had no clue. I miss the "feeling" or belief I was loved. That is what hurts most of all for me.

No one is calling me too sensitive, except WH right now. I just used that as an example of how I view myself right now. For example, the other day, something triggered some deep emotions (not A related) and I had to run out of the business establishment before I burst out in tears. I was able to get control of myself and process it for what it was worth, but I don't want to have to run out like thtat to compose myself. Everything is at an edge with me. I guess the pendulum has swung to the opposite direction of me keeping everything inside?


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Default  Posted: 3:03 AM, May 24th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

((brokenpromise)), getting out from under the house obligation and expenses must be some relief.

Laura28, I keep waiting for your planking photos.

A man I respected died recently. When news of his extra-marital A came out 4 years ago I excused it my mind, blaming his BS for not meeting his needs or being a bitch. I did not attend the service, I feel sorry for he and his family.

FWW 60
M 1990, dday 10-5-09

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