But I have a question, he has been telling me that he is doing the right thing while I know he watching porn and he has been telling me that he is using his money for tools and doing the right thing with that also so today I asked him to bring home receipts so I could see and he said why should he have too if I won't show him my receipts and bank account which I only opened recently as a security blanket because he controls all the money.
Should I have to disclose all my information because I ask him to disclose all his?
I understand that NPD is controlling and manipulative but it is also very confusing because the next sentence he said made sense. He said, "if you don't trust me why are you still with me?" And then he siad "at some point you have to take me at my word unless you have proof" He is right, if I can't trust him I have to leave but I am afraid because I am not sure I have what it takes to make it. Which I think is because he has controlled every part of this relationship since day one.
But as he continues to fall furhter into debt, his decisions with money and his attitude that he works the hardest and noone in the house should ever have more money then him just eats away at me. He has controlled the money because he makes the money and he continues to blame me and make me feel guily for not working when he asked me not to and he has continued to gamble and buy tools and then ask my daughter to buy his pepsi and cigerettes.
This has been going on for ten years and only bothers me now, what does that say about me?
The next thing is, he calls me constantly when I leave the house without him, and if he thinks I am taking too long he calls asking me when I am coming home, I used to think it was becuase he was worried about me but I know I now that it is because he wants to control me and he needs to know my every move so he can shut down the computer in time.
I am confused because this is a lot of work all the lying and porn watching and it just seems like he would want to be alone so he would not have to continue this so called relationship?
Last but not least, he says to me that he wants to schedule a session tomorrow night, meaning sex. What is that about, I continue to say I am to tired or just don't bring it up and then he will ask me what is wrong?
This is so confusing to me, why would anyone go through so much trouble to keep something they really don't want?
Or does that not matter either and fall into they have no feelings category.
Usually has empathy for others important to him
That says it all.
Since they're important to him, of course he's going to make a show of caring. This is a hard thing. Maybe the hardest thing. But to suss out pretend empathy and caring from fake? It's your mission, 'should you choose to accept it.'
(a little mission IMPOSSIBLE humor yuk yuk!)
It is difficult to differentiate btwn pretend and real, I know this, but ask yourself - DO you know what true remorse feels like?
Why, yes you do. Do you know why?
You've felt it yourself!
I still agonize over the money I stole outta that guy's pants when I was 11? In the changing room. Dummy left his wallet in his old pants.
Having empathy...just bc others are important to you is manufactured. Not there.
A construct, a purposeful machination, a building, an on-the-spot "creation* of a facade - it seems like real,
but it isn't.
Soon, you will learn to trust your gut and spot such things - from afar even! - and avoid them like the plague.
NPD is a plague, distorting and affecting everything in their orbit.
downy's post and advice to you is quite beautiful. I'd recommend 2 things
- go back in the NPD ICR forums and read. (I read for over a month!) What patterns do you see, repeated over and over again?
- he is NPD?
Then truly, the only way I know is to detach.
I see some pieces of green hay sticking out of a pile of horse manure...is it ok to play 'king of the mountain' in?
<<<<jj, whistlin....yo FRANK! Where's the sinkin ship when we need one?
Narcissism is nastier than cancer, at least a disease is curable. His lack of real understanding is harder to deal with, but you'd think after all these years id be used to it. Well I'm not and I have decided to go back in my mind and remember all those things he did to me that I forgave. These things will push me forward to the future that I didn't want, but one that I prayed for when I was his victim of insensitive cruelty. He is a nasty, selfish, jerk, and my head will remind me when my heart forgets.
Thank you all for your ears, I need to know that someone understands my pain of staying, my pain of leaving, of detaching, of moving on, of years lost on someone you thought loved you more than themselves only to have their stupid affair mean less than the real tragedy, realising you lived with a stranger who was incapable of real love. Blah, blah, blah.
[This message edited by wontdefineme at 9:31 PM, January 5th (Thursday)]
Gonna show my age on this one but music is therapy. Poor yourself a drink, have good cry; if I could only show you how it feels to be on the other side of it all.
Someone that I used to love - Natalie Cole
Keep climbing one step at time - many positive thoughts.
Ah, but she can't take you any way
You don't already know how to go ~ Eagles
...but he gives THE BEST speech about how he would never do that. Even you guys might believe him. Ha.
Hmmm......I know that speech. Including his voice choking up with tears streaming down his ace, slobbering all over himself, sputtering, "I can't believe you can accuse me of something so horrible. I would never do that to you. Why would you say such a thing?"
The next thing I knew, I was apologizing to him.
The letter is a nice idea and it's very well written. But I wouldn't send it. He's not going to suddenly "get it" and become honest. If that were the case, he would have come around years ago.
And as far as your age. It's never too late, and you're never too old to free yourself from an NPD. You simply will not believe how peaceful your life will be without all the lies, the drama and all of the me, me, me bullshit. YOU can finally start to count.
When another woman takes your husband,
sometimes the best thing you can do for
yourself is to LET HER HAVE the worthless
OC born 2001
Remarried 2008 (New Guy)
I'm soooo there- meaning still working on acceptance and moving forward.
I postponed filing for D back in Sept. and committed to trying a little longer and to taking the kids on a fam vacation in March (that I'd still take with my H if we were D just for my kids, but of course he wouldn't).
Of course I'm not seeing the things he promised, the promises were empty as usual. The selfish controlling behaviors continue.
And the lies... whether just stupid little white ones or ones that affect my kids... they continue no matter what I say or do. It doesn't matter. My healing, my comfort, my feelings, none of it matters. Not even if he's trying to keep me around.
It's funny how an A just opens your eyes to the REAL problem that you knew was there but just couldn't quite put your finger on.
I hate this. HATE HATE HATE! I wish I could be as ignorant as him, as selfish... but I can't even stomach the idea. You just DONT treat people you love this way which of course = no real love was ever there. 13 years and 3 kids plus fostering a relationship with a StepD... building a life around this empty shell.. it hurts beyond description.
I know you all know what I mean. Just very sad today...thx for listening.
"Freedom" has a whole new meaning. Like i don't even know what that meaning is.
Then he tells lies about my medical conditions saying that they started AFTER I left him. Umm I have proof that I was on STD for 5 months before I left him. My attorney hammered him on this point and also asked him if he thought I was really disabled. He had the shitty attitude to say "well, I guess the state doesn't approve anyone who isn't disabled". Dumbshit, it is the Federal Government. My attorney got me up there on re-direct and asked how soon I was approved for SSDI, I told him 3 months after I applied. Attorney said, you mean to tell me that you were NOT disqualified like most everyone else is, NOPE. You didn't have to get a lawyer and appeal, NOPE. This made his attorney and him look like complete fools as they said that I could at least do a part time job. But, when I had to sit there for so long I was in so much pain that the baliff and stbx had to help me to the chair and I was visible shaking.
But now the 2x4 part, I broke the 180. I know, I know I was so stupid that starting Tuesday night I began writing him a email telling him how he could have stopped this divorce at anytime, that I never wanted it, that I was still in love with him. I spent 3 days writing it because it is hard for me to look at a computer for long. But I really poured my heart out in this letter like I haven't in months. I was so stupid to think that it would mean something to him. And as we all know, it didn't. I have been hearing crickets all day. It has caused me to be out on the ledge again after seeing him but this time I have made an appointment for this afternoon to get on antidepressants and I have a IC appointment Monday. I told them they had to get me in as I am just too close to not making it.
I have been talking to someone who understands this hell we live and he has helped me get through the tough days. His messages have helped me to understand that we all fall off the 180 sometimes but that we learn to deal with seeing them again and we get stronger. He has been a great friend to me.
And just to add insult to injury, I reached out to an old friend who has actually tried to committ suicide and ended up in a psych ward and he slammed me for crap about how my emails have been rude and that I am not nice to him. Seriously? That is what you do to a friend when they tell you how close they are to suicide. Good bye you POS!
I thank God that I have SI and all of you who have lived with an NPD or I do not know if I could do this. It was so much easier before I knew what stbx was and lived in my fake marriage. But I do not want fake, I want peace and the ability to not feel out of control. I know that I can't do this alone and need counseling. I know that stbx will only pretend to want to stop the divorce in order not to pay me the ordered SS. I am finally admitting that I can not do this on my own, I need ADs and a counselor who understands PTSD and depression.
Last, I want to apologize for not having been much help to anyone else lately. This has been the most difficult month for me and as soon as I can I will start helping again. We all need our own little zebra duck that we wear on a string around our necks so we never forget the pain of the NPD. Ooh, how about a t-shirt that says "I survived my NPD spouse and I got this lovely t-shirt and my life back." LOL
ETA: just saw on Amazon that they have a yin and yang duck that is black and white. I think that is so fitting for our NPDs, they show us their good side till were hooked and then they give us the evil side. HA I have to order some of these for my house, one for each room.
[This message edited by soverybetrayed at 1:03 PM, January 6th (Friday)]
I began writing him a email telling him how he could have stopped this divorce at anytime, that I never wanted it, that I was still in love with him. I spent 3 days writing it because it is hard for me to look at a computer for long. But I really poured my heart out in this letter like I haven't in months. I was so stupid to think that it would mean something to him.
At some point, you might notice that you do love your ex husband. And, you are so incredibly grateful that you are not married to him, simply because it is not very healthy for YOU.
With rejection and infidelity, a lot of us go into that weird space of losing our own sense of self. We tend to forget how beastish our spouses have been in the marriage, and all we know is we love them and want them back. I think some of the research on abandonment and betrayal likens this phase to being the child out in the middle of the forest, left there ... abandoned. We howl, we cry, we want our beloved to come back to us. And they don't. They take us to court, they lie, they blame, and most assuredly, if they are NPD, they are NOT the least bit interested in our best interests. Heck, if your mate is like mine, he will look at you and not be able to recall one good thing about the marriage or you. Nada ... zip.
This is hard work. All of it. Being dismissed and maligned by people we love is heart and soul stretching. And yet.. it is also like going through an advanced course in being fully and deeply human. I will not whack you over the head with 2 x 4s here. I do recommend you not attempt to do yourself in, simply because I know the truth of the old saying; It is darkest before the dawn.
I promise, you will come out the other side of all of this. The point at which you notice you have been wearing a victim outfit that was the wrong color, did not fit, and just was not you ... is the moment your new life begins.
I am confident you will get there. It seems we all do eventually. It took me a few years. I too broke the 180, and wrote those pleading letters of love. I am not proud of myself. But it is a phase essential for walking forward to what is next.
Be kind to you. Lots of us here have been where you are. This too shall pass.
"Last, I want to apologize for not having been much help to anyone else lately. This has been the most difficult month for me and as soon as I can I will start helping again."
The above statement is the only reason I will gently deliver a velvet covered 2X4. You need to take care of you. This is a large tribe and others will step in when needed. We need you to be here to help when you can but remember you can also accept help when you need it.
Two steps forward and one step back is still a step ahead of where you were. Hang in there.
It's all good. You please worry about you. Hang in there...you are being so incredibly strong right now. It will get better. I know it. And you will be free of the NPD BS.
Do something nice for you, a relaxing bath, your favorite meal or snack, read a good book, listen to some uplifting music, anything YOU like to do just because you like it and because you can.
You're in my thoughts and prayers...
Keep the zebra duck idea in your head, maybe pick up a couple if they will make you laugh and help keep you going
I went to the doc this afternoon and she figured out why I was suddenly having all these feelings of worthlessness and being so depressed. I have been out of the medication she put me on for my Epstein Barr, Fibro and Chronic Fatigue for about ten days now plus I was out of another med she put me on to help me sleep. So I have my meds now but it will take some time to get my system but up to normal again. She can't mix these drugs with anti depressants or anxiety meds.
I have an appointment with an IC on Monday and then see my PCP again on Friday to see if I am doing good. She also gave me a 24 hour hotline for behavioral health. I won't hesitate to use it if I start feeling like i did on New Years. I hope I won't need to use it but at least I have someone to reach out to.
I even treated my grandbaby to chinese tonight since we haven't had it in at least 8 months. We deserved a treat, she had a fantastic report card.
So I feel better now that I have reached out to someone and stopped trying to deal with this all on my own. My PCP is very understanding and didn't roll her eyes or rush me when I started bawling.
Thanks guys, you are the best.
I am a glutton for punishment because he never will be the man I thought he was.
Last night we had an argument about money and he sat there with his head down and tried to switch the blame to me. I told him that he is the one who had to prove he can be trusted not me. I am not accusing him I just need reassurance and he should be intelligent enough to know that.
I think that I act this way because I know what is wrong and feel like it is a self inflicted disorder that can go away if he wants it to. When I realize what I am doing I quickly shut my mouth and just agree with whatever he is saying because I know it is no win situation.
this is no way to live and I am seeing what the real man is like and wonder how I did not see any of it for the last ten years.
When I asked him if there were any others besides the one I know about he said it is all in my imagine. That there was only one and that he will never do it again. When he acts so sincere I want to bleive him and then relaize that he is good at what he does he has had years of practice.
I am still trying to figure out why he doesn't want me to leave, I read that N usually find someone that has all the qualities they lack so that they can take credit for it all. is that true?
Tonight I received a call from someone that I know that he is already involved with another woman that she is friends with. Dagger to the heart. NPD leaves a trail of destruction and here again I'm meaningless to him and just always have been. I feel so close to the edge right now. The last pregnancy is when he had the A and now the thought of him carrying on with another woman while I'm in this condition is too much. I hate this friggin disorder and hate what it has done to my life and my children's lives.
Somewhere in the back of my mind I hoped he would get help and take this time to reflect and fix himself although I know logically that is not possible.
I've prayed morning, noon and night for a miracle and this just confirmed that it will never come. I thought I was stronger than this, but I think this was the final nail in the coffin for me I have nothing left in me to fight.
Before we separated he said to me that he would never date anyone while we were married because it was adultery regardless of if we are together or not. I guess I'm still naive and hoped that would be true. I would never break my vows no matter what and cannot even think of dating with the turmoil going on, not that anyone would even want me in this condition. I'm so low I can taste the soil in my mouth. I gave this man every part of me, forgave everything, loved his children...my feelings were real, my love was real and he is simply indifferent to my existence.
Then I think what kind of a woman would be with a man with a pregnant wife? Not the kind I want around my one year old. Oh if you pray, please pray for me, this is too much right now for me to handle. I hope my heart catches up to my brain so the pain will finally stop.
My twins were 8 mos old at DDay, it was the worst. When I needed my H the most, he was being intimate with someone else. I understand how that hurt is amplified.
All I can say is concentrate on you and baby, take good care of yourself. If he's gonna go, try to just let him, 180 like crazy. You will be better off in the long run. Lean on anyone you can: family, friends.
Strength and peaceful mojo to you.
I understand how much you want him to change and you know he won't. He is showing you who he is, believe him. I still love my stbx but my head knows that the man I married is not good for me and I deserve better. So do you.
Focus on your baby and your one year old. They need you and can't live without you. You are their mom and no one needs you more than they do. Plus, your stbx isn't worth your life. Hasn't he taken enough from you already? Why allow him to completely take your life? You are a better woman then he will ever be a man.
You have the fight in you it is just so far under the hurt that you can't find it at the moment but you can get through this. go to IC, talk it out, get them to put you on antidepressants. Talking helps you a lot.
The folks here talked me down on New Years Eve when I was ready to end it all. I didn't think I would make it but they helped me and made me realize that while he took 12 years of my life I didn't need to let him take the rest of it. I will NOT let him destroy me and you can NOT let your NPD WH destroy you.