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Topic: BS Questions for WS's - Part 6
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dzaster
♀ Member
Member # 30977 |  Posted: 3:30 PM, April 5th (Thursday), 2012 |     |
Lyonesse -
With my IC we have worked on setting healthy boundaries. Prior to IC, I didn't even know what boundaries were, much less had any.
We've also worked on my FOO issues to determine why I am so attracted to destructive "relationships". All of my relationships prior to my M were destructive and with a similar type of man...part of my attraction of my H is that he was my best friend for years prior to us dating and he was not destructive.
But ultimately, without identifying my FOO issues prior to getting married, and my "need" to fulfil that desire for destruction and emulate my daddy issues, I sought that out again.
We have worked on repairing that relationship (abandoned by biological father at age 5) in my head (and my heart), and have worked on exercises for me to complete when I start the negative self talk that results from that.
We have also worked on directing my energy toward healthy ways to meet the needs that I may perceive as not being met with my H. No one person can fulfill all needs for another, but need to have healthy non-destructive ways to communicate about those needs and to have those needs met.
Hope that helps.
Me - FBW/FWW 39, Him - FBH/FWH 40, DS - 16, DS - 13
His D-days: 2001, 2008, multiple 2011
My D-Day: 11/19/10
R-day: June 2011...going well
"Every new beginning comes from some other beginning's end" - Semisonic
Posts: 201 | Registered: Jan 2011 | From: California | Lyonesse
♀ Member
Member # 32943 | | Posted: 3:38 PM, April 5th (Thursday), 2012 | |
dzaster,
Thanks for your answer!
When you say "worked on" what does that mean? I guess my question is whether this IC is effective - he doesn't seem to do any of the talking in the session or give WH any advice or feedback. Just listens to him talk.
Does that sound like a "normal" IC session to you? I don't have much experience with this - went to an IC myself a few times and it was more like a conversation, with her pointing out things I might have overlooked, or asking me to try to reframe things in my mind another way. In contrast, WH's IC doesn't seem to offer anything in the way of a response.
Me: BS, 40's.
Posts: 1137 | Registered: Jul 2011 | From: West Coast | dzaster
♀ Member
Member # 30977 | | Posted: 3:44 PM, April 5th (Thursday), 2012 | |
Lyonesse -
Sounds like it's time for a new IC.
Mine gives me feedback all the time and prompts me to think about things by asking questions.
When I say "worked on", she has recommended books to read, she has provided me with exercises to do (e.g. writing down my "needs" and then listing those that were met prior to the A, those met in the A, and listing healthy alternatives for meeting those").
If the IC is not interactive, then I think it may be time to look for a new one. Mine has been hugely beneficial.
Me - FBW/FWW 39, Him - FBH/FWH 40, DS - 16, DS - 13
His D-days: 2001, 2008, multiple 2011
My D-Day: 11/19/10
R-day: June 2011...going well
"Every new beginning comes from some other beginning's end" - Semisonic
Posts: 201 | Registered: Jan 2011 | From: California | Lyonesse
♀ Member
Member # 32943 | | Posted: 3:49 PM, April 5th (Thursday), 2012 | |
DZ, thanks -- I also feel he should be getting more from the IC, but not sure what most people do in their sessions.
Both your answers were very helpful.
Me: BS, 40's.
Posts: 1137 | Registered: Jul 2011 | From: West Coast | wantmyfamilyback
♀ Member
Member # 33676 | | Posted: 3:45 PM, April 6th (Friday), 2012 | |
Calling all Waywards!!
My H and I have been in R for 5 months now. Two weeks ago, my WH reopened his secret FB account and wrote on OW's wall. (see other posts.)
Ia this the end of the road? Is there any hope for R, if my WH is obviously still thinking about OW and acting on it?
Me= BS 28
WH= 30
2 OWs
D-Day 1= 7/?/10
D-Day 2= 9/23/11
D-Day 3= 10/16/11
M= almost 9 years
K= DD 2 & DS 6 months
Status= changes almost daily.
Posts: 256 | Registered: Oct 2011 | BaxtersBFF
♂ Guide
Member # 26859 | | Posted: 8:57 AM, April 7th (Saturday), 2012 | |
At this point, you aren't really in R. He hasn't committed. What you've had is False-R, which is the initial consensus to R and subsequent failure on the part of the WS. It is a half-assed effort by your WH to do the right thing even though he doesn't really feel it yet.
What has he done to figure out why he had an A? Is he taking responsibility for his actions? Has he realized that his comments about not knowing what he wants, needing time alone, and being sorry, are just excuses and keep him in a position of hanging onto the A and the OW?
It isn't necessarily the end of the road. That decision is really up to you. The thinking about OW isn't surprising, the lack of control in contacting her is the problem. The thinking about the OW is part of that drug effect. Knowing that she will respond (that she still thinks kindly of him) is keeping the A alive for him.
WH - 43
BW - gerrygirl
Posts: 5455 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise | wantmyfamilyback
♀ Member
Member # 33676 | | Posted: 11:11 AM, April 7th (Saturday), 2012 | |
Thank you Baxter. I can't believe I've wasted that last 5 months in false R. I told him that although he might not have noticed any progress in our R, I had finally gotten to the point where I didn't have to compulsively snoop on him and now that's all down the drain. The small amount of trust I had gained is gone and now I am exhausted. I don't trust him, but I am too tired to continually monitor his online crap.
He really hasn't done shit to figure out his problems or take responsibility. He's been in and out of IC and acts like he doesn't really need it. He contradicts himself all the time. I told him that by writing on OW's wall was an attempt to get her attention and she how she'd react. To see if she might still be interested and guess what she sent him a happy birthday message.
Our MC told me to stop doing all the work and leave it up to WH. I told him I'm not leaving. Not because I want to put up with his shit forever, but because I'm not going to be the one responsible for breaking up my family. He fucked up, he can leave. But, of course, now he is back pedaling and saying he doesn't want a divorce, he loves me, blah blah blah.
And now I'm just tired.
Me= BS 28
WH= 30
2 OWs
D-Day 1= 7/?/10
D-Day 2= 9/23/11
D-Day 3= 10/16/11
M= almost 9 years
K= DD 2 & DS 6 months
Status= changes almost daily.
Posts: 256 | Registered: Oct 2011 | BaxtersBFF
♂ Guide
Member # 26859 | | Posted: 11:55 PM, April 12th (Thursday), 2012 | |
nlove,
Remorse is going to be different for each person. Also, determining the difference between remorse and regret may be something better suited to the BS than the WS. The Ws may not realize remorse is happening if they are doing the work, while they may believe remorse is in effect while they are trying to convince the BS they are doing the work.
In my mind, remorse is a matter of finding the truth. Maybe another way to put it would be "staying in the game" although I have tried avoiding that phrase because nothing about this is a game.
I think the BS is probably the best judge as to whether the WS is experiencing remorse. Afterall, if the WS is exlaiming remorse, but the BS isn't seeing it, then does it really exist? Maybe, but it is unlikely.
For my own situation, remorse really didn't come until I realized that my BW was ready to be done. I realized what I had to lose. I realized that I wasn't being honest with myself. So, for me, remorse seems like a personal, even selfish, thing. So much about the WS is related to selfishness, that it seems to even pervade the healing process too. But somehow, the BS seems to really be the best judge. My BW knew when I was being honest and when I wasn't. I had to trust that about her. And that has kept me on track with remorse instead of regret or shame.
WH - 43
BW - gerrygirl
Posts: 5455 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise | nlovemyfamily
♀ Member
Member # 15258 | | Posted: 9:44 AM, April 15th (Sunday), 2012 | |
Thanks for your response BaxterBFF,
Wondering from all WS point of views just how much was rebellion or spitefulness a part of your acting out in an A? My XH has no relationship with his 3 adult kids, says he needs them in his life more than anything but also says he knows his lifestyle with the AP is not in the best interest of his family? Can you help me with his crazy thinking?
Posts: 403 | Registered: Jul 2007 | From: nj | roccodom
♀ Member
Member # 19714 | | Posted: 12:35 PM, April 23rd (Monday), 2012 | |
This is a question about IC also. Currently my FWS is going to two ICs. One a psychiatrist that does talk therapy also. And another that is more of a cognitive behavior specialist.
I don't ask him about his IC, but he sometimes offers what was discussed.
On one occasion, he told me he had a bit of a revelation in IC and that the A was the perfect storm of low self esteem, opportunity and conflict avoidance (there may have been a couple others but I don't recall).
This deflated me. Cause after A #2 - he had the same revelation. And, I didn't view him to be conflict avoidant anymore - quite the contrary - he would get more upset and let me/us know - then say - he was letting it out which is what he is suppose to do. He became conflict avoidant when he got the first offer from OW (a card propositioning him) and didn't tell me. A few months later - full blown A after mutliple times of saying "no".
He obviously saw that I was deflated and I told him that he had already had that "revelation" at which he got angry and said he can't talk to me about his IC. I understand that I should be more calm when he discusses it but it was an impulse reaction.
Just recently, he told me that he was discussing whether the last A was an exit A. This was the 2nd time in 3 months this issue has come up. Last time, I rolled with it - asked him if it was and he said that they had decided it wasn't. So I paused a little when he told me it was brought up again. He said that they determined that it wasn't - AGAIN.
He could tell I was upset and later talked to me about it. I said that I was unsure what he should be focusing on but it seemed that it was all about me and the marriage if exit affair kept coming up. He has talked about how he felt about me during the A - always in sweats, put on weight - yada yads. But now he is "in love" with me.
I just said - the focus should not be on how you felt about me during the A cause although I don't doubt that he felt it - I just feel that it's a defense and justification. NOt a good one but none the less. He should be focusing on HIM. Why does he continually make this same choice. How can a person be in IC and MC from his 2nd A and have another A?
He has asked me to come up with 10 questions he should focus on in IC. WEll, I am hesitant to come up with them cause this is his work - not mine. He is not trying to be an ass but says he goes in there a just rehashes the same thing. Can he really not know this is not the way to go? I have asked him to pose his discussions with IC on here and ask for advice, but he doesn't. I think he just has a HUGE defense mechanism that prevents him from fully looking at HIM>
Any advice would be much appreciated.
BS - me (45) WS - him (45)
married 16 yrs (DS 11yrs, DD 9yrs)
#1 PA - DDay 12/97
#2 PA DDay 5/08
#3 PA DDay 2/12
Trying R
Buddhism teaches that a craving for things outside ourselves causes an unhappy and pointless search for security.
Posts: 785 | Registered: May 2008 | From: MO | tuscandreamer
♀ Member
Member # 17406 | | Posted: 8:19 AM, April 24th (Tuesday), 2012 | |
A question of curiosity for the WS...
Quite often I read in General that we BS's are frustrated by the fact that our WS's are snoring beside us while we can't sleep because we are upset about the A. Are you WS's really sleeping? Do you ever have nights where you wake up and can't go back to sleep?
BS 45
WH 42
Dday #1 6/20/07, Dday #2 (different OW) 5/16/09
3 DDs (13, 8, 5)
Reconciling...
Posts: 478 | Registered: Dec 2007 | From: Canada | mamacita19
♀ Member
Member # 34936 | | Posted: 11:36 AM, April 26th (Thursday), 2012 | |
My WH gets it and has been trying to do what he can to help me, although I feel like he could be sharing his feelings more.
WH had a 3 month EA with an old high school gf. I found out about the EA and we "supposedly" were trying to R, when he went and met her and had sex once. Four months after PA, he confessed to me because he knew true R would never be possible unless he did. I was devastated because I thought we were in R for months and so I then questioned everything about our M, him and what I thought I knew about myself.
He now grows frustrated at the slow pace of R. Granted, we are only 3 months past PA dday. I tried to explain that he dropped the Atomic bomb on our M and in many ways I'm trying to start from scratch. Hell, I'm still in shock some days. His frustration leads to hopelessness that he has damaged our M beyond repair. I don't know that this is true, but he feels that way and he totally blames himself.
I'm having a hard time processing my own feelings, but I don't want him to be in the dumps because it hinders our progress.
Here's my question...what happened during your R that would make you feel hopeful? Was there something that your BW shared or did that gave you glimmers of hope?
I want him to be hopeful and keep working on this but I also can't say things I don't feel. I'm just hoping something clicks soon that can make us feel like we have reached a small milestone.
TIA
BW - 40
WH - 40
Kids - 8, 6, 3
Dday 2/9/12
I'm getting there, little by little.
Posts: 79 | Registered: Feb 2012 | longroadhome
♂ Member
Member # 32428 | | Posted: 8:35 PM, April 26th (Thursday), 2012 | |
tuscandreamer -
Do you ever have nights where you wake up and can't go back to sleep?
Absolutely. Not as much as Mrs LRH, but sure, I wake up and think about everything and toss and turn for a couple hours. I've been remembering more of my dreams since all of this, also...and over-analyzing them.
It's all part of the mess.
Me: WH
Her: BW, and the most amazing, beautiful person I've ever known
That which we call failure is not the falling down, but the staying down.
Posts: 410 | Registered: Jun 2011 | longroadhome
♂ Member
Member # 32428 | | Posted: 8:41 PM, April 26th (Thursday), 2012 | |
mamcita19 -
Here's my question...what happened during your R that would make you feel hopeful? Was there something that your BW shared or did that gave you glimmers of hope?
My hope did and usually still does come from me...what I've done to work on my M and myself. I don't require Mrs LRH to give me hope. It's great when she does, but it's not her job. Sometimes it the opposite. She gets upset at times that I am as hopeful as I am when she's feeling so down.
Don't try to manage his mood for him. He needs to feel what he feels. If he's down in the dumps, it's for a very good reason.
Me: WH
Her: BW, and the most amazing, beautiful person I've ever known
That which we call failure is not the falling down, but the staying down.
Posts: 410 | Registered: Jun 2011 | nlovemyfamily
♀ Member
Member # 15258 | | Posted: 10:59 PM, April 26th (Thursday), 2012 | |
wondering if fws hindsight can be explained in re: to sacrificing family respect and devotion while in A. Would love to hear more of the WS thought process on keeping the A ongoing and not ending it when they know they should, for the benefit for the family.
All FWS hindsight needed!
Posts: 403 | Registered: Jul 2007 | From: nj | nordicbabe
♀ Member
Member # 35419 | | Posted: 4:31 AM, April 27th (Friday), 2012 | |
Ok, I've sort of posted on other threads but I suppose this is where I should pose this question.
I've been separated for almost 6 months. four days after dday I asked what was going on with the young lady at work and he said they were on hold. I flipped and kicked him out. He said good, he was done, it was over with me.
We've done a bit of counseling but finally I just went IC as he wasn't making any effort. He was waiting for the young lady to leave her partner, which she did after about two months.
They are seeing each other but he tells our kids he's confused, doesn't know what he wants, wants his family back, likes this girl a lot, but WILL NOT file for divorce.
I have very limited contact with him, although he emails about whatever nearly every day, sometimes up to 50 emails a day.
I've always been teh fixer but I refuse to fix this one. Just getting on with my life. The more I pull away the more he finds reasons to contact me. But he still sees the young lady (who breaks up with him on a regular basis. Yeah, she's a drama queen).
So, it's better for me financially at this point to not file (I'm a SAHM) and although I miss him I can't see how we could reconcile.
I guess my question is what in hell is going on in that insane brain of his? Yes, I know I should care but of course I do and want to understand what in the world he is thinking. He has refused to sign papers when I've handed them to him, but will shout divorce every time he gets in an argument with his skankasaurus. I tell him to bring it on and he never does.
Thoughts?
Posts: 1458 | Registered: Apr 2012 | nordicbabe
♀ Member
Member # 35419 | | Posted: 4:33 AM, April 27th (Friday), 2012 | |
A little more info: therapist says he cannot let go, he needs the attachment to me and the more I'm pulling away, not dealing with anything but kids and finances and making it clear that I am moving on and making plans for MY future the more he's going to try to reel me in, as he is not ready to end things but being pretty PA he can't take responsibility.
OH, and the kids refuse to meet the young lady and are clear they think she's a rotten person.
He has also had bouts of crying, telling the kids about his self-loathing. He told them last week that 'I fucked everything up with your mother so I'm just dealing with what I've got in front of me. I can't turn back time'.
Posts: 1458 | Registered: Apr 2012 | tired girl
♀ Member
Member # 28053 | | Posted: 10:49 AM, April 27th (Friday), 2012 | |
Roccodom,
So your H has supposedly come up the fact that he is conflict avoidant. Has he gotten down to the reason why that is? Has he explored what has gone on with him in his past that caused this to occur?
This would maybe be the sort of thing that he could explore with an IC to help fix his conflict avoidance. He needs to working on that, not looking at what is wrong in the M. What is he doing to fix HIS issues, such as the conflict avoidance so this type of thing never happens again? Has he looked at boundary issues? So this woman pressured him, obviously he didn't know how to shut it down effectively, what is he doing about that? Why is he not looking at that in IC? These are all things that have to do with HIM and not the marriage or you. And things that need to be dealt with in order to fix his issues.
That would be my take as a start in IC.
Me 43
Him 43 Hardlessons
DS's 24,21,19
D Day 1/18/10 his
3/8/2012 mine
Both feet planted firmly in R
You can't heal what you won't feel.
Posts: 3104 | Registered: Mar 2010 | From: az | onlysolution
♀ Member
Member # 23160 | | Posted: 4:31 PM, April 27th (Friday), 2012 | |
Do you ever have nights where you wake up and can't go back to sleep?
I had many nights like this during the affair. But, post dday I began to sleep much better. It bothered my BH that I was peacefully sleeping while he was awake.
FWW: Me 52
BH: 54
Married 34 years
Recovery - Over 4 years
Posts: 448 | Registered: Mar 2009 | onlysolution
♀ Member
Member # 23160 | | Posted: 4:35 PM, April 27th (Friday), 2012 | |
Here's my question...what happened during your R that would make you feel hopeful? Was there something that your BW shared or did that gave you glimmers of hope?
My BH was my champion for hope. I did not believe that we could get past what I had done, he did. No matter how painful and messy things got, he always assured me that being with me was what he wanted, not matter what had happened. My BH opened up to me more than he ever had before and that gave me hope for our future.
FWW: Me 52
BH: 54
Married 34 years
Recovery - Over 4 years
Posts: 448 | Registered: Mar 2009 | | Topic Posts: 1000 | |
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