I guess for now I am grateful that the OW situation came about..I mean, I am not happy there was an OW but it helped shine the light on this other situation.
I hear what you are saying. I am not making light of what these other members have gone through..they are just in a different place than me. I am going to take whatever I can learn and use it for me. I am a true believer that there is always something to learn even if it doesn't make sense at first.
Tomorrow is my 2nd meeting. I may look into SA groups tho cause this is thru the SCAT and although I shouldn't have..it crossed my mind a few times..that she is killing 5 birds with one stone. She just sat there and said very little. AND my daughter is in the field and has mentioned several times about doing group therapy cause it will take up less time in her day and make more money in the hour.
I will take it one meeting at a time to see if it benefits me.
Thanks again. Hope you are having a decent day!
What helps me, and you have to get past the initial intros because that is largely about the SA and not the spouse/partner, is to hear what they share subsequently. Then you see yourself in others. I was highly resistant to the whole co-dep thing. Then I listened to seven other women share their co-dep traits with examples, and I had at least one example in common with each of them. Stupid crap, like I would always buy the generic soda because it was cheaper, even though I didn't like it, while my WH has no issues spending money on whatever he wants and thinks it's ridiculous I do so. It took someone else saying that to realize that's what I do. And now it's a running joke in our group, no one is allowed to buy generic soda anymore.
It's really surprising how you hear other's stories, and think why don't they do X, and then turn that thought inward and think, well, why aren't *I* doing X? Or you hear how someone dealt with something, or how they had an epiphany, and you learn something new, either a new coping tool or mini breakthrough, whatever. Today, one member shared how upon initial discovery she dived headfirst into a new hobby that is easy to go overboard in. I share that same hobby, and also went a bit overboard with it when I started. Guess when I started that hobby? When my WH claims the acting out started. He didn't state that specifically, it happens to coincide with the date. Now I'm wondering if I knew something was up on a subconscious level and I used that hobby as a means of escaping my impending reality. I would not have put that together in IC, I know.
The group leader told me today, she tells everyone to try six meetings before they commit to a group. Not necessarily six of the same group or organization meeting, although they can, but six of any meeting to understand how the process works and see how it plays out in your head over time. I think that's wise. I can already see the difference in my third meeting in my class and the first two. I cannot wait to see the difference in the 12 step, because it's a different format and a different mix of people.
Just saying, give it a chance. Maybe it might help more than you think.
My heart goes out to every single one of you as well. This is a very strange hell we are all in and I'm sure none of us ever dreamed we'd be here.
But it is so very helpful not to feel alone. Not to feel like my husband is some freak of nature (he IS but he's not the ONLY freak). I know that when I tell him things I've read here they do help him as well.
We are in R and he is completely honest and open with me about what he was/is feeling and what he did. We are both working to uncover the reasons why he had this manifestation of his disease. The short answer is that he stopped working his AA program and going to meetings. He didn't start drinking so the disease got him in another area. We weren't having as much sex as he'd like, we had drifted apart, he'd lost his career of over 30 years (the ONLY thing he'd ever done!) and were moving 3,000 miles away. He turned to internet porn and masturbation. After awhile it wasn't enough (just like a junkie). He started responding to ads on CL and emailing but not actually meeting up. Then when that wasn't enough he started the meet ups. He responded to CD's because it felt less like cheating and it was so taboo. All the while he was filled with self loathing and fear. He wanted to stop, but couldn't. And each time he gave in he felt worse and worse. He didn't think he could ever tell me and that just drove him further into despair.
Along comes his XW (who is a recovering heroin addict) and she was the ear he needed. I was 3000 miles away and she was there. She was "safe" because she was an addict and I'm not. He had half-assed plans to leave me for her because then he'd never have to tell me what he was.
He says when I caught him the first feeling he had was relief. Once he admitted the SA behavior to me the spell of the XW was lifted (he uses the term fog ironically). He has committed fully to our marriage and his R. He is doing every single thing I am asking him and doing it with good will.
When he slips and starts to blameshift of rugsweep I call him on it and we talk. We are forming a stronger marriage than we had before.
Having said that, I'm not relaxing yet. I know we have a long, hard road ahead. I just wanted to post something positive in hopes that it might help someone else the way you have all helped me.
I know that I am one of the very lucky ones that my SAWH snapped out of the fog so quickly and has been so fully committed to his and our R. I also know that with an addict things can change for the worse very quickly so today I am hanging onto the positive and the peace that I have. I still cry every day and I still have a hard time with mind movies and the ick factor of what he did. We still have STD testing to come.
Thanks for giving me a safe place to come and safe people to talk to.
I am constantly impressed with the strength, courage and spirit of the people on this site and this thread in particular. I would love to name you all individually but it would take too long. ((HUGS)) to each of you.
I've decided that my husband has no bottom. I'm sure of it now. Right now, at this very minute, he is having sex with a stranger, a man, and his SA OW is watching them and maybe participating.
Or he might be dead in someone's apartment. Or stabbed or raped or whatever.
I did call him in the afternoon and begged him not to do it. He pretended he didn't know what I was talking about, and then he basically hung up on me.
I will call the attorney tomorrow and map out a plan to protect myself and my children during the separation. I will pay her retainer tomorrow.
Cheeta, I don't know about the gay issue. I've been following some online conversations about it, and I'm still undecided about my husband. I did read somewhere that the vast majority of sex addicts do end up with same-sex partners at some point. I just don't know if it's because they need more and more thrills, or they run out of willing females, or if they are so hyper-sexualized that they just don't care about gender at some point?
It's all a mystery to me. And not a good one. Cheeta, I'm so sorry you are dealing with it - I hope that more info comes into the light soon. I'm learning that with sexual addiction, you can't ignore unpleasant or scary things, and no matter what, it's better to know the facts, no matter how painful. Ugh.
I need a good night's sleep. Thank you, all. I hope you all have a peaceful night.
Gotta run, but wanted to tell GhostWalker that *I* almost texted the 2 Asian Hookers who my SA WH is texting/calling all day and night--24-7. I'm talking 1:00 and 3:00 in the a.m. I don't know HOW he has time to work! His addiction is just so advanced now. Thank God I don't have to live with him anymore! (sep. for past 2 years).
Anyway, I am very tempted to text them/mess w/ them...lol!
I know I shouldn't, but I still might do it...heh. He KNOWS I can see our shared family cell bill, so I DID text him about his idiocy.
Hang in there, Everyone. And so happy for those that found S-Anon groups to go to! It's wonderful!
Still looking into moving out. He's neither admitting to, nor seeking help, for his addiction. So be it.
I can't fix him. He seems remorseful today. BFD!!! I asked him to give me a reason to stay. He lurrrves me. Right! Stay strong everyone! This is a rough ride...
"Stay strong everyone! This is a rough ride..."
Good words. Thank you! And same to you.
Are the mean things my sah says because of his sa? He says the shallow things about what a woman should look like etc and the cooments he's made to me about my body etc are because of his sa and that treatment will change his mind so that he can find me attractive enough...is this normal?
I do know, since he started going the CSAT and the classes, and now the 12 step, I have noticed a change in his attitude and disposition. He seems calmer, happier, and he says nice things more often. He still has his moments of a-holiness, LOL, but he actually apologizes for it relatively quickly afterwards now.
IDK if that's what you are looking for. I've heard withdrawal of affection and advances are normal when acting out and when in early recovery. My WH has never said hurtful things about my appearance or not wanted me sexually, really. Our sex life did not wane on his behalf when he acted out in the past, only mine, if at all. But he was/is highly compartmented and a control freak, so that fits his MO. I think it is probably driving him bonkers having to do the abstinence for so long. But he has never been textbook, LOL.
I do think their "guilt" causes them to vilify us in order to justify their sick behavior. Don't listen to him! If it wasn't your appearance, it would be something else. Stand tall, lady and don't let him screw with your head!!!
Besides the irritability of addicts in general, it had to do, in my SAFWH's case with needing to push me away. He LOVED his isolation, his fantasy world. Whenever I tried to get close, it threatened that life. So the meaner he was, the more I pulled away, especially considering my FOO issues. Of course, then I was a cold b*tch...it was a wonderful dynamic.
Be well everyone.
The real thing Hurt for me in that situation would be that I don't really need to take that type of verbal abuse from anyone. I don't take it from strangers and certainly won't from someone who is supposed to love me.
I do think my SA would rather D me then to tell me his secrets. That's a real hard pill to swallow, but its the truth.
Do you think they "know" their lying to us? Mine lies about responding to a message he didn't even respond to.
Do you guys have any clue why he would be doing these things?
Besides the irritability of addicts in general, it had to do, in my SAFWH's case with needing to push me away. He LOVED his isolation, his fantasy world. Whenever I tried to get close, it threatened that life.
Scaredy Cat, this sums it up for me. Yes, my husband LOVES his isolation, his double life, his fantasy world. LOVES isn't even a strong enough word. It's like air to him - he feels like he can't live without it at this point. Throughout our marriage, he has never been mean, but when he's acting out, he's always kept me at arm's reach, controlling me, being defensive and condescending and distant until I gave up and stopped believing my own instincts. We had fights, but I could rarely prove anything, and then he got to continue his stuff in peace. I'm beginning to think that he encouraged the fights and even possibly escalated them because after each fight I just gave up trying to prove anything. It was just too upsetting and unpleasant for me.
I do think my SA would rather D me then to tell me his secrets. That's a real hard pill to swallow, but its the truth.
Torn2bits: my husband walked out on me the day I found his 3000 pages of sexts to the OW and others, detailing all the depravity. So yes, I discovered his secrets, and he would rather D me and basically walk out on his kids than face me since I know his secrets.
In fact, he hasn't been able to look me in the eye for nine weeks. Hasn't bothered to try to explain. Has given up and written me off. A friend told me that the day I found out the REAL truth about him is the day he decided he will never even look at me again.
And I've been married to him for 15 years. A marriage that's hung on because we genuinely like each other so much when this stuff isn't going on.
It all makes more sense now. I have so many regrets.
When I uncovered H's Ashley M account and an another account with "locked" photos, he took his home laptop to work. I asked questions, naturally, and he shut me down. Hard. He has taken every step to ensure I uncover nothing else. I was getting too close to the down and dirty.
Now suddenly, he's willing for me to move into a rental home because it might not be "a bad idea to separate for awhile". He WOULD rather D or S than tell me his secrets! So true!
I'm so glad I found this place. It's like we share a secret language that few understand. Hugs to all, I have a long work day ahead...
On another note: 13 & 14 November is one date when I have confirmation that SAWH had sex with one of his regular partners. So far I'm ok, but I might need some serious hand holding this weekend.
"Live a life not an apology." Edward R.Murrow
"I can be changed by what happens to me but I refuse to be reduced by it."
Well I have a question. What constitutes a slip?
Ive been out of town but, to make a long story short...
I saw on my keylogger that he right clicked on a boob video and the menu came up, but he didnt appear to click on any of it. He saw the boob video in the sidebar of youtube when he was watching something related to cameras, so he was not looking for it. But he was definitely curious to see it!
It appears that he didnt watch it but im wondering what he right clicked for! To open in a new window(he doesnt usually do this). To somehow get around being found out? But how?
Also some history is missing but I cant find anything showing him deleting it.
We had a discussion before I left that I hoped he would tell me even if he accidentally saw a woman in provacative pose or even thought about seeing something innaproppriate and that it would build trust. He promised he would, but he hasnt really. We had a fight yesterday and I lost hope he will tell because I think he only would have if and when he feels close.
I will check back in a bit, have to go for now.
I think it's worth bringing up for discussion tho, however you want to broach it. I'm finding that if I don't keep discussing these kinds of things, he gets lax. Like yesterday, he sent me a text asking where *I* was, because I went somewhere with the kids I said I might go a few days before. I hadn't told him, because I was just going to reply when he sent a text that he was coming home. Well, he didn't text, he went home and was home for an hour before he bothered to text me. That was not our agreement. He is supposed to report all his whereabouts until I feel like he doesn't have to anymore. I mean, I can tell he was home for that hour because of stuff he did around the house (put out all the lawn trash, etc) but that is not our agreement. So we will have to discuss that again I can tell.
A lot of it is on me, really, because he probably thinks I am more trusting of his whereabouts, computer use, etc than I really am because he does not know I keylog and GPS him. THAT is what I trust, and allows me peace of mind, not his actions, yet anyway. I need to see a longer period of doing what he says until I can trust *him*. But I can't really discuss that with him in depth, can I?