I feel so hopeless. He will never "get" the devastation he caused me and he will never get the help he truly needs. I can no longer live this way. Somehow, some way, I have to find the strength to get out! Thanks for listening, my friends...
Please don't end your life. Don't let him destroy you. I understand what you're saying, I've been to the point of ending it all many years ago. But I'm glad I did not, even though I'm presently coated head to toe in WH's shit. Shit washes off. I can be clean again. So can you.
[This message edited by Nature_Girl at 9:38 PM, January 21st (Saturday)]
All I can say is what everyone said to me: this is NOT YOUR FAULT. This is a sickness, and your SAH can't see anything in the real world right now. He's lost right now. You don't deserve this. You deserve better, and all of the women here on SI know this about you. And we care.
(((Nature_Girl))) I am so sorry you had to see those photos. I've been thinking of you all evening and hoping you're okay.
Hugs to both of you. I'll be thinking about both of you again tomorrow. You've both gone through a lot - you're so strong. So, stay strong!!!
Yesterday, I had, what I'm learning from SIers, was probably an anxiety attack from being at the mall with my mom. No triggers that I can directly figure out - just a reaction to being around a large group of people, I guess. That scares me - it was kind of like a dday in that I didn't know it was coming...now I'm worried about when I'll have another...it was very awkward and embarrassing...
Then last night I was speaking with WS's mother. I mentioned to her that I was heading to Keystone in early February and that the family therapist would also like for her and WS's father to come in to Keystone sometime to discuss boundaries, since WS will be heading back to stay with them after discharge until he and I figure out what "we're" doing.
WS's mother FLIPPED out. Said she refused to let WS come stay with them again - it was "too hard" on her. Said maybe WS's father could go to Keystone to talk to the family therapist, but she certainly was not. Oh, how she loved her other child, her daughter, at least she had one good kid...ETC
Now, I'm not saying she doesn't have the right to feel the way she does...but it's her SON. A mother's love should be unconditional. I mean, if WS wasn't in recovery and was still actively engaged in addiction, that would be different...I don't know, just seems like abandonment to me. WS has been telling Keystone that he has no FOO issues, and at first I thought that, too...but upon further reflection...well, I think we were naive. While WS's parents were certainly not physically or sexually abusive (that I know of), I think his mother is a functioning alcoholic (drinks all day, every day, never drunk, hides bottles in her bedroom, packs it when she travels, won't travel when she can't bring it, uses it to self-medicate, etc.). The more I read about co-dependency, the more I realize that WS's father fits almost every attribute of that, too.
Keystone contacted me and asked if WS really came from an Ozzie and Harriet situation...I was like, well...um...no...(who does)? WSs parents are financially supportive (which is great) but very emotionally distant and sometimes manipulative. I remember once WS had an emergency back surgery - life threatening, almost lost permanent control of bowel, bladder and sexual function. I was 5 hours away at the time, MIL was 8 hours away. WS's mom refused to come down for 3 days! She "had company to entertain." My mom and me had to go pick him up and drive him to the hospital, send him into surgery, wait hours to find out the results, wait hours for him to wake up, keep him company in the hospital over the next two days...ETC
That is not "normal"...right?
I don't know. I feel so bad for WS all of a sudden. Not that it makes me love him anymore as a husband...I'm still conflicted on that...but the maternal part of me feels for him. I can't imagine being abandoned by my own mother like that!
It's not an excuse for his behavior, but I think it's a big part of his puzzle...what led him into this addiction. I hope he can explore it further in therapy.
I don't know...thoughts and opinions? I'm not actually a mother...am I reading this wrong?
Nature - my heart breaks for you, too. Love to you.
"Live a life not an apology." Edward R.Murrow
"I can be changed by what happens to me but I refuse to be reduced by it."
SAWH and I had an actual conversation the other day. Probably the first authentic conversation weíve had in months. I had to talk to him about how I feel about the possible Ďnew gymí issue. SO- I was sneaky and manipulative and cornered him while he was in the shower. That way he couldnít escape/run away, although he tried. My eyes & heart opened during our talk- SAnon says not to shame and blame, but truthfully thatís what Iíve been doing. Blaming and shaming. Iíve been very hurtful to him from my own deep pain. Yes, I need to be honest about how I feel and where these feelings originate from, *however* I was beating him over the head with it, using the past, my anger and my resentments to justify my own behavior.
While we were talking, I suddenly Ďheardí and Ďsawí my own behavior, I was in a place to recognize what Iíve been doing. And Iím ashamed of myself. Iím a better person than Iíve been showing my SAWH. In my heart and in my mind I set myself up as better than, as one up, because of what he did. In reality, Iíve done my own damage and held us and him back through my own words.
No matter what he did in the past or what he does in the future, I need to be the compassionate, open, loving person I am; towards myself and him. The best person I can be. Hereís another thing I realize. Given my horrible behavior towards SAWH, where is his incentive to repair, improve, to change our M? Why work on a relationship that hurts so much? If it were me in his place, Iíd absolutely refuse to work on a M where I was relentlessly punished all the time.
Punishing him for my emotions isnít productive regardless of my goal. In other words, whether we S or D or R I must take ownership of my feelings and take care of myself. I recognize that there is a strong part of me that just wants to be taken care of, to be allowed to be a self-indulgent child. This aspect of me has actually held me back, slowed my growth, hurt me and the members of my family. I have the right to my feelings, but I need to Ďwoman upí lol and take care of myself emotionally.
Interestingly, two days after this conversation, I ran across a former co-worker & friend who knew both SAWH & me back in the day. She took my cell number and said sheíd call me because she may have a place for me (and DS16) to stay. Apparently she has a friend who lives alone with her son and has extra rooms in her house. Itís in the school district & potentially could be a solution. Even if it isnít a good fit, itíll be great to reconnect with an old friend. Sheís incredibly supportive & helpful & loving. Struggling through As & addiction is tough & you learn who your friends are. People I thought were a friend arenít, a person who I havenít seen in years is coming through with flying colors.
What it all comes down to is the recognition that Iíve much much work to do on myself. I need to act towards SAWH as Iíd hope to be treated. None of my decision making process will change. He did what he did and Iím still working towards being in a place where I can authentically decide S/D or R- meaning work my financial plan & continue to hunt for a full time job. Because until then Iím stuck.
As always, any and all feedback welcome.
But I understand how you feel. I guess it comes down to the whole, "you can only control yourself," thing. I struggle with that every day.
Today I'm feeling a lot of regret about this. My SAH is telling people that I was "mean" to him and that I "yelled" at him all the time. That I said some very insulting things to him.
And I did. Of course I yelled at him because I knew he was acting out, and I just couldn't prove it or stop it. I yelled at him because of money problems, which I attributed to the acting out. I yelled at him because he told me he wouldn't get life insurance because he was too heavy, but then he wouldn't exercise or lose weight.
He hasn't told anyone that our marriage ended because he's a sex addict. Or that he cheated on me for our entire 15-year marriage. Or that he sought out S&M encounters with real people. Or that he found OW on fetlife.com and told her he loved her and would leave me for her. And he hasn't told people that he left this family and is living with her and doing some really scary things on Craigslist with her.
And I'm beginning to believe his story myself. I keep thinking that I did yell at him. I felt powerless, so I yelled. And I have to admit I yelled some pretty mean things regularly during the six months leading up to D-Day.
Why do I feel so bad about it? My yelling had NOTHING to do with his acting out. Or did it? He said it made him feel so bad that he acted out more.
Sabina, all I can say is that you'll probably have fewer questions and regrets than me if you manage to get your feelings under control - unlike me who let them all hang out.
I'm going to talk to my IC about it this week. I know she's going to tell me that I was powerless and that he made the decision to act out, and that I had nothing to do with it. But I am still sitting here wondering about it and blaming myself.
What a mess I am. I think that part of me still believes that this relationship isn't over - I haven't fully accepted it, deep in my heart. And I feel a lot of pity for STBX. Again, I'm a real mess. Thanks for reading this.
[This message edited by ChoosingHope at 1:39 PM, January 22nd (Sunday)]
So sorry you found those photos. I dread something similar happening to me and always feel hesitant when hunting in cupboards or boxes I haven't opened in awhile .
Your yelling is completely understandable. It had nothing to do with your WHs acting out so don't let him convince you otherwise. Nothing justifies their acting out, they make that choice all on their own.
It certainly sounds like your WH has some FOO issues after all. As a mother I can't imagine abandoning my kids like that. In my situation my MIL and FIL are very supportive of my WH while he is seeking help and no longer acting out. They made clear their disappointment in his past behaviour and were shocked and upset by what he has done, but they are still his parents and will love and support him while in recovery.
It felt so good to be able to share this with someone IRL. I know if I'm going to carry on, I need real people in my life to be with. I'm trying to reach out & find support.
WH could tell I was extremely upset & had been crying. He kept insisting I tell him what was wrong, but I told him I need to keep my thoughts to myself for the time being.
Ladies, please don't beat yourselves up over the yelling or disparaging comments. Early in discovery, I was a raving lunatic. I didn't find SI immediately -- and I guess I did everything wrong. BUT, since then, I think I've been a champ. I've been very careful with my words and actions. It's a shame SAWH didn't feel the same way about how he spoke to me.
I'm okay today. After an emotionally draining night, I told him to make plans to move out. He knows I mean it. I still feel extraordinarily sad it has come to this. But he really left me no other choice.
Stay strong! Hugs to all...
[This message edited by scaredyKat at 7:37 PM, January 22nd (Sunday)]
It's not always about being kind and considerate. Addicts will take that and use it to wrap the garbage. if you can God bless you, you do it for yourself anyway. But an addict will use it against you as surely as you breathe.
In all honesty, my H never did this to me. He has always told me I was beautiful, sexy and desirable. BUT, even so, we slept in separate bedrooms and he never made a move towards me for sex. In talking to other friends, they swore this was not uncommon and many slept separately and had infrequent sex. Even so, this was puzzling to me. (And a big red flag!)
Little did I know, my H's sexual needs were already being met. Mine weren't!!! As far as I can tell, he spend 18 months to two years f*cking other women. He always stood firm that he was only looking for sex, not a romantic, longterm relationship. This I believe.
Even so, the damage done to my self-esteem is damning. His escalating sexual appetite and SA behavior destroyed our marriage, finances and family. I wish he would own his shit and get help, but he won't.
Again, I am getting off this pain train and I have asked him to leave. Wrapping all of you in warm hugs and wishing you a better tomorrow...
Kat - I can't believe how hurtful that must have been for you. You are such a beautiful person on the inside. I don't know about the outside, but who cares! The inside is all that matters!
This is my view of sex...well, this used to be my view of sex within my married relationship: two people with invisible "light" orbs about them connecting for a temporary moment and becoming one "light" orb, a special, spiritual, energetic connection. With that being said, it didn't matter whether I had makeup on or whether he had morning breath...it wasn't about combining the physical, it was about combining the spirits.
That was my take on things - I thought it was his, maybe not envisioning light orbs specifically but the same idea. Now I know it was a much more carnal affair for him. It was not special. It was not "spiritual."
So what I'm saying Kat, is that if your H didn't realize the specialness of sharing in your "light" orb, then that was his loss.
Still hurtful though, I can only imagine.
Love to you.
Hope - I would feel the exact same way. Frustration over the WS's lies and version of the truth. Confusion as to whether relationship was still in existence (just because the marriage ends doesn't mean your love does). Just keep reminding yourself of the truth - that you did everything you could for your marriage. That ultimately you chose your life over living death. Then don't be sorry for that. Whenever you have doubts, post here and we will remind you.
Sabina - It is hard to "woman up." I think on some level we all want to be taken care of emotionally, and ideally in a marriage, spouses take care of each other. Proud of you for taking care of yourself in this situation. It IS hard.
Notmetoo - I too have neglected my female relationships during the course of my relationship with WS. I wonder if this is a common thing among SA spouses. I know it is common among physically abused spouses. Hmmm...
I'm not ugly. But the whole time he was giving his love, affection, and sexual attention to several skanky whores was when I was biologically at MY sexual peak. I was cute, my body was in GREAT shape, I was energetic and gravity hadn't taken it's toll. Now I'm old and there are wrinkles on my wrinkles. I find my body disgusting (you know I say that if SA wasn't in my life I could have easily accepted aging and been graceful about the whole thing?) But to think that I was completely and utterly ALONE for that important part of my life makes me so sad...
And the VERY ugly part of me wishes horrible terrible violent things on all whores (especially the ones who pass STDS on) who think screwing married men is such a game. At best I hope they experience the same sort of betrayal. And get run over by a bus. Many times.
My grandmother did nothing, and my paternal grandfather molested either all of his kids, or most of his kids.
My father & mother did nothing, and so my grandfather molested me and most of his grandchildren.
Am I going to also do nothing? Am I going to allow this curse to pass on to another generation by risking my precious children seeing something my sick WH has around the house? Or worse, what if he acts out some day & molests them???
Am I going to do nothing to prevent harm from coming to my children?