I dont think I really bristle at the term of being co-dep. I certainly dont think that makes a person bad or lesser in any way. I have my issues, I just dont feel that is one of them. I didnt want to auto rule it out so I read more, maybe not a ton. I read things online. I read (half of so far) "the new codependant" and bits of her other book on co-dep. I got handouts at my group for specific traits of codeps of sa and have a workbook which I almost completely do not relate to. On that checklist/handout there were a few (Maybe 5 out of 50) which I did experience post dday and most have since subsided. Just like when I had a car accident I had reactions while driving for a while, but now I dont.
When my dday happened, my h, crying, asked me what should he do to stop himself.... and though I had ideas in my head of things he could do, I decided not to share that with him. I told him he has to find those answers on his own, which he did. Then I left him on his own for more than a month. If that is not non-controlling I dont know what is! lol.
One more note on my counselor. Im frustrated again.
We had our mc and he mentioned that his primary way of showing love is by giving gifts and that I didnt want him to(initially in our marriage) (he didnt word it this way). I acknowledged that was true, but that I think his primary love language is physical affection, and said why I thought that. I said "he is even more affectionate than I am". Then we discussed the gift thing a bit. She asked if I had trouble reciving gifts and I said no its not that, and I mentioned my money/spending issues(penny pincher related to money=security and a past of poverty). Well, she says "Its clear that you have trouble receivving gifts and are uncomfortable with affection or even talking about it, which is due to something in your past which made you feel unsafe, understandably so, which I want to discuss that at another time but right now I want to address.... and then she CHANGED THE SUBJECT.
I did interrupt her and repeated that the issue was not gifts, but spending money, that I didnt even want to spend money on uneccesary things for WH or even my own dd. She kind of ignored that and moved on with the conversation on intimacy. I didnt bring up, that Im also not uncomf with affection! We are not huggy feely in front of her, but thats kind of just how we are. We hold hands in public and stuff. I ONLY said he was more affectionate than me. Gosh.
So, today it is bothering me. I dont know what to do about this, because I feel she will think Im in denial or some such. Ive been through stuff in life yes. But I feel she is trying to stuff me in a box which I dont even fit into. One of my "issues" is that I really disliked being misunderstood. Ugh.
I dont want to not be open to what therapist says, because thats what Im going there for, but I just feel she isnt getting me. And I also realize this is probably looking like Im in some sort of denial.
Let me at least assure you Im not manipulating this to my version of the conversation. One part of my "issue" with being understood is being concerned with the accuracy of details, lol.
Am I just out of my mind?
I agree with NG.
No therapist should ignore you when you tell him/her that what s/he just said doesn't actually describe you. Also, no therapist should "uncover" an issue like that and then just move on. This is an issue I've had before, where therapists seem to ignore something important just because they're on a different path. Tell the MC how it made you feel and make sure it gets fully addressed before you talk about anything else.
On a related note, WH and I are going to see CSAT for the third time this week, and neither of us are happy right now. On just our second visit she did the, "....So what do you want to talk about?" That bugs me because I feel like we're there for something specific and she should be guiding US, not asking us to guide her. We're not there for general MC.
Also, here's a question for anyone else who went with a SA spouse/partner to CSAT. Did they make you fill out a sexual history? The one we saw made me do one, which I didn't necessarily mind. What seemed strange is that she didn't tell me why or address it at all after I filled it out. I feel like she's just tabulating info for a study or something, and I don't want to feel like a guinea pig.
Also, she works with another counselor in her practice who she referred me to (and I think refers all her SA spouses too) and I called and she waited a long time to call back. When she did, I missed it. She said she would call again. She hasn't. It's been a week. I know I should call her, but I kind of feel like she already doesn't care.
Therapists make me go, "Ugh!"
*latest* dday: January 26
Me: BS, 29
Him: f(?)WH, 30
R? I think...
Next Wednesday my new attorney is going to email STBX a letter saying that I've retained her. It will tell him to get an attorney himself because the divorce process has begun.
Just to refresh everyone's memories, on Sept. 14 I opened his email account and discovered more than 2000 pages of sexts, mostly with one other sick SA woman. I asked H to leave our home, and he left without much of a fight to live with OW. This is after 15 years of marriage. Several times in the following weeks, I begged H to come back home. Embarrassing but true. I managed to get him to see one CSAT during those early weeks, but he refused to go again. I haven't checked on him lately, but I think his/her online sex profiles are still up and running, and I assume they are still soliciting dangerous sex on Craigs List. They are very sick.
At the same time, he has asked to come home several times. I have said no and strictly followed the NC rules for the last five months for so. (The first month was just a mess.) Lately, he seems to be very contrite, quiet, and will do whatever I ask. I don't ask much, but I feel a sea change - I think he's either finally exhausted by the chaos, or he wants to come home. More than that, I think he believes that he can actually keep the current situation indefinitely - him living with OW and acting out, and coming to this house several times a week and acting like Dad of the Year to his two adoring children. Why does he think this? Because he's paying most of the bills. And also because NOT ONE PERSON from his "real" life except for me has confronted him or acknowledged that they know he's leading this sordid, dangerous double life. So he hasn't had to hit rock bottom or face what he's doing.
I'm writing all of this because I don't know how he's going to react on Wednesday, and I think it's all relevant. I am going to take my children up to my parents' home for a few days, so I assume we'll be safe. BUT I worry because:
1) The CSAT thinks he might kill himself.
2) I am afraid he might fly into a rage and do something to us or our home or even my family in another state.
I never, ever ever ever thought I would write or feel these things about my husband of 15 years. He's never been verbally or physically abusive BUT about a month ago he showed up to visit the children and had been drinking. I told him he had to come back another night and he refused to listen to me. Chaos ensued, and I told him that the children and I would leave the house if he wouldn't. I managed to get my daughter out the front door, and he took away the car keys and my cell phone and then locked my daughter and I out of the house with my son inside. (My children are 5 and 7.)
My daughter had no shoes or coat. She was freezing. It's a long, long story, but we eventually went back to our home, I knocked on the door, and he let her inside. I grabbed my phone and left and called my parents who were in town, and they came and sat with me until his "visitation" was over. I didn't want my sweet 75-year-old father to confront him. I just wanted him to leave.
Why did I put my child inside? Because I knew from experience that he GOT WHAT HE WANTED (visiting the kids) and he wouldn't do anything to them or me at that point. She was freezing, and I didn't know what else to do.
Now, when he gets the note from the CSAT, he's going to realize:
1) For the first time, people know what he's really done (right now he really assumes that I haven't told another soul the whole story)
2) He's not getting what he wants (see what happened the last time this happened)
3) The gig is up, his life in the "real world" is over and he's stuck full-time in BSDM SA land with the fat lunatic in her dumpy house, etc.
I'm terrified. I keep thinking suicide or some sort of attack on me. And I swear to all of you that I never thought I would write these words. My marriage was not like that for the first 14 years, even though we went through several episodes of SA.
I'm sorry this is so long. I hope it makes sense. My head is swimming, and I'm terrified. I am hoping for any advice of any sort: how to protect myself and the kids; how to protect my home; whether I or someone else should prepare him for this news; whether someone should be around to help him after he hears it. (The last one is hard b/c in the last two years he's basically dumped all his friends and family as the SA spiraled out of control - and he belongs to no church or support group and no longer has a CAST.) I have plenty of dear friends and family members, but he literally has NO ONE.
Advice and prayers welcomed. Thank you so much. I'm not going to edit this so I'm hoping it makes at least a little sense.
I'll send you a PM in a bit (or you can shoot me one right now, I'll even go for a phone call if you want). I can talk more openly that way...
ChoosingHope, Im not sure what advice to give you but you were heard and Im concerned for you and the kids. I did experience something similar myself. Not in this marriage but my first one.
He was abusive, and PD and obsessed with control. He showed up at my place and threatened me on two occasions, once with a knife. I was worried he wouldnt sign the divorce papers and more worried that he would fight over the custody agreement. He wasnt willing to give me sole custody, but gave me sole legal. That a-hole was no parent at all, but he had to maintain some control.
Luckily for me, I suspect he already had another 'victim' in line, and that may have helped in his letting go. I guess what Im saying is it went more smoothly than I had expected. I want to reassure you but at the same time, you just never know.
Is there any way you can feel him out without alerting him?
Please go forward as safely as you can. Could your lawyer give you any advice?
I will be thinking of you and do remember, you are not doing anything wrong. You are not destroying the marriage, he did that.
I don't know if this is any comfort, but sooner or later his reality would have been shattered and he would have most definitely had consequences he did not want, and whatever he will do when that happens would have happened anyway independent of you. You can't live a life like that and not eventually get arrested, killed, found out by those important to you, etc. What is important is that YOU are doing what's best for YOU in your time of need, and YOU are prepared for the fallout. It's much better you know ahead of time than you dealing with this on the fly as a result of something else.
It doesn't feel like it now but it may be your blessing in disguise. IF he's gonna go apeshit, it's better to do it on your timeframe when you can be prepared and sheild yourself from it.
You are in my thoughts and prayers today...
I'll be in another state when he gets the letter.
When I return, I'll have my father with me.
I think I'll call ADT and take him off our alarm list, and I'll change the alarm code to our house so he can't get in while we're away.
I have a separate bank account in my name.
I just can't figure out if I'm crazy and paranoid or not. It's ridiculous, but I really think he believes that this situation can continue - that somehow it's his right. I mean, he is living with another woman! (He would say that it's because we can't afford for him to get his own apartment, and frankly that's sort of true because he lost his biggest clients last summer when he neglected to do any work for them, thanks to the SA.) But obviously that doesn't account for years of cheating on me and the sex addiction and the acting out. . . .
It's interesting that even *I* am second-guessing my "right" to divorce him.
I swear, if there are any twenty-something or thirty-something women reading this thread, all I can say is to GET OUT NOW. My husband started out as handsome, brilliant, successful, kind and funny. This SA and probably some other mental factors have turned him into an entirely different person.
Does your SAWH still have keys to your home? If you haven't already, I would definitely change the locks. I think it's a good idea to stay elsewhere for a few days --once served, you'll know his reaction immediately, I'm sure.
I assume your children are in school. Please inform the school what's going on and be sure SAWH is NOT allowed to take the kids out for any reason. This is crucial.
I'm so sorry you're going through this, honey. Please be safe, stay strong, and pm me anytime. You are doing the right thing...
Edited to add - Hope, we cross posted. Yes, get him off the alarm list. I'm glad you already thought of this.
[This message edited by Ghostwalker at 9:34 AM, March 22nd (Thursday)]
Yes, I think he expected this situation to last indefinitely.
Things seem better in the daylight. I think I need to prepare him in some way, but I can't figure out a smart or safe way to do it.
I don't want to tell the school anything. I don't want anyone to know about this. He can't really take the kids out of their school very easily. And I don't think he would do something like that.
I think I'm more worried of him coming over to our home in a rage and upsetting the children. But it's really the great unknown that I'm afraid of.
My update: The day after my son was released from the hospital, my Stepfather went in. He has been diagnosed with terminal lung cancer -- and has refused any lifesaving treatment. Today I was told it has metastasized and has migrated to his liver. He doesn't have long to live.
He is my mother's sole caretaker, she is disabled and wheelchair bound, and we have some very tough decisions ahead. She does not want to go to a nursing home.
DS has relapsed twice since he's been home. I've been distracted by the current family crisis and, apparently, DS drank while I was tending to Mom and Stepdad. He has an alcohol evaluation scheduled for tomorrow and I'm afraid he won't keep it. God help me, I don't know how much more I can take.
I looked into taking a Family Medical leave, but my company is considered a "small" business and they do not have to guarantee me my job back. I am going to file, and I need my job. Like Hope's husband, my SAWH's income dropped dramatically while busy with his dirty, little hobby. It's highly doubtful he can support me.
Pray for me, my dear friends. I am beyond spent. Hugs and strength to all....
I wish I had something helpful to say to either of you ladies, but I have to admit I definitely feel my lack of experience in this forum! So...I have no advice. But I have good thoughts and hope and whatever else I can contribute.
As for me, I am presented with an interesting (and much less disturbing than other people's) conundrum. I found out today that WH's phone has a feature that allows him to delete calls from his call log. So I want to ask him about this. But on the other hand, I don't know if he knows about it, and I certainly don't want to inform him of another way to keep things from me! Well, I guess this is the beauty of the detailed phone bill, right?
I wish I lived closer and could help. I'm so sorry. I know you're tough and smart and will get through this, but I'm sorry that you have to deal with everything at once.
I will be thinking of you and sending up lots of prayers for you, your son, your mom, and your FIL.
You are also dealing with so much. Please know I am also here for you. Somehow, some way, we can do this, my friend...
I don't have advice to offer CH or Ghost or anyone else. I just wanted you all to know you're in my thoughts and prayers; you've been heard. I'd suggest CH talk to NG by PM as NG has just gone through a similar situation.
We are doing ok. SAWH and I have continued in a positive pattern, he has been listening and been supportive and has been open and transparent with me regarding questions I've asked or issues I've brought up. Honestly, it's a refreshing and much needed change and has given me energy. I'm just doubtful and hesitating given everything that has happened.
"Live a life not an apology." Edward R.Murrow
"I can be changed by what happens to me but I refuse to be reduced by it."
DS has his appointment this morning - send prayers that he'll keep the appointment and be open to whatever they recommend for his alcoholism.
Love to all...
*Hope* As an unimportant side note, I reread my post above and wanted to clarify that the times my exh threatened me were prior to filing and not in relation to. Thats what I meant when I wrote that I was scared of his reaction when filing, but it turned out he didnt have a bad reaction to it. I realized that wording was not going to put your mind at ease! Sorry for that.
Phoenix, Ive had similar things happen like that SO many times where I want to ask him about something, but if he isnt already aware I dont want him to know about it!
I say if you have access to the detailed billing, dont mention the delete button. I guess you can see if hes deleting any logs and that would be a huge red flag. In that sense it can be your secret weapon.
Does your SAWS care if you masturbate? If masturbation is off the table for him, does he think if should be or us too? Or does he not mind at all if you do it? Or not know?
I know its tmi.... so no pressure to share! hehe