Do not back up. Severe tire damage.
I could really use the male POV on something. Why did this crap make me feel worthless, not really a man or at least a lesser man? I get the anger, the sadness and all the crap I feel working through this. All “OK and normal” in my book. What she did – not my fault, not because of anything I did or did not do and not because of anything I lacked. I get this and fully believe it. Also get it is because he fed her the right shit and he was “safe”, not because he was some fantastic guy or a great fuck. His character was mediocre at best (outside of his screwing multiple friends’ wives) and he was really pretty good in bed but not out of this world from what I have been able to figure.
I am not a girly guy, I like contact sports, not afraid to stand up for myself, but I am not afraid to wear pink if you know what I mean. I don’t give a shit if someone thinks I am less manly because of it. I have always thought none of that shit really defined what a man was. Honor, integrity, courage… those were the kind of traits that define a man. Crying is ok, doing what needs to be done even thought it will hurt is required. Hell that is what courage is – doing what needs to be done when you are afraid.
I know it does not make me less of a man. So why does it make me feel less of a man because someone else (my W) let someone else (OP) park his pecker in my favorite parking space?
2 years on and the pain and anger from betrayal and the dishonesty is something that is often overpowered by feelings of jealousy, shame and worthlessness. I have also learnt from a lot of the posts in SI that part of it is how much we attach ourselves to this relationship (how much self worth is invested in the M vs. within ourselves), the loss of innocence, to be able to grieve and to consider it the demise of the M (as it was) and of the person (as we believed her to be).
I may be in denial about the crushing shame now because in the early days, I wished the earth would swallow me up literally, that no dark place would be dark enough to hide....from the images in my own head. Or it may just be that something inside me has died a slow agonising death. Part of my grieving process also included knowing that I was being the fool, and continued to be if I felt that I had to keep denying the basic FACT of being cuckolded.
But I am not less of a man because of her flawed choices, to even feel these things lets me know that I am man enough (I do have failures elsewhere). I know its her weaknesses and her fuck ups; that the APs were no more 'manly', she was less of a woman; much less a mother and a wife. It wasn't them who attracted her in as much it was her idea of who she projected and saw reflected in them which was the main drug for the addiction and attraction. All they had to do was have the necessary parts and not be entirely repulsive (and that's not always a criteria).
[This message edited by noescape at 6:54 AM, March 14th (Wednesday)]
It is our choices...that show what we truly are, far more than our abilities.
J. K. Rowling, Harry Potter and The Chamber of Secrets, 1999
British fantasy author
The sex thing was not that big of a deal for me. She had partners prior to the M and so did I. Sex is sex, but love is love. She really messed up on the second one. That is the way I see it at least.
Maybe u feel worthless about it like i have cuz all those things you mentioned Honor Courage etc are tied to the marriage at some level for me and not a individual quality that i have.
...all those things you mentioned Honor Courage etc are tied to the marriage at some level for me and not a individual quality that i have.
No. Marriage is the environment in which you most regularly exhibited those qualities. It's the canvas on which you painted. Nothing more than that.
Marriage is a feedback mechanism, which is one of the reasons it's so hard when we discover that our understanding of the marriage was inaccurate. We question the validity of the feedback loop through which we have both interpreted our experience and had our worldview reinforced, often for years.
The sense of loss, of directionless, is because we need a new feedback mechanism to give us authentic and accurate measurements, and haven't figured out what that is yet.
Marriage is a valid and useful mirror for getting this sort of feedback. It is often the most significant mirror, because of the time involved, the near-constant data updates, and level of investment in the outcome.
It is not, and should not be, the only mirror, especially going forward after infidelity. How heavily you weigh it is, I suspect, highly individual. But there are more metrics out there than whatever ends up in the Shit My Wife Says column.
[This message edited by wincing_at_light at 6:07 PM, March 14th (Wednesday)]
noescape – two things really struck me. One is the grieving aspect of this. Grief is not always a connection between thought and feeling. Often feeling leads thought in grief. The other is the loss of innocence. I had not consciously thought of this and one day my IC brought it up. Felt like I was hit in the gut and I know this is something I am grieving about.
64fleet – yeah I can’t imagine who would not feel it as they work through this quagmire.
Wert – cheap thrill is right. The sex thing became no big deal for awhile for me. Then it did again. I hope the “no big deal” part comes back for me.
Hardlessons – replaceable and worthless are defiantly what I felt. There are things that I have said and done that go against my core beliefs in honor, integrity, courage…, but if 100% were the standard than I don’t know what person I could ever look at and think they possessed those traits.
WAL – thanks for helping me see the connection – your mirror analogy/feedback mechanism resonated with me and really helped me at least see one primary reason for the disconnect.
BTW when I originally posted on the 13th it was the first day I had my humor back. I even joked with the W a couple times about her A, laughing at some irony and I actually meant it and felt it I had never posted anything crude or funny here before and thought my “his pecker in my favorite parking space” at least deserved a laugh from someone.
I know it is not a reflection on me but I often (but not always) feel like it is.
same applies here i believe. just harder to see it.
penis parking....yeah i laughed at that one
im not to keen on sharing my parking spot either.
My wife is nicer and does many better theings than pre affair.
Do I feel like I can trust her and love her? No.
I have seen no real evidence that she has addressed anything and she is still underneath the same psycho woman that did not give a shit about me or our children. She was an enemy of the family and now she just wears a mask.
So I play the game but it is different. I dont really give a fuck what she thinks. I no longer look at this marriage of partners.
I view it as a monarchy.
I will confront ANY BS she starts on the spot with ruthless intensity.
Am I nice to her? Yes as long as she does what I want period.
It really makes a lot of sense to continue let the crazy person drive the bus which is what I did the entire marriage.
I do what i want that I feel good with. If it ended tomorrow it would be no surpise to me and I would live and be happy and not have to deal with a used up vagina.
It is another path as my wife is not one of the WW who owned her shit. She is a runner and always will be.
I accept her as she is and know enough to always be ready, watch my back, and to live the life I want to live with no excuses.
My wife of 8 years met a guy at a friends party on New Year’s Eve where they had a kiss (I was caring for our crying child). The past two months I’ve uncovered lie after lie to find out she is going to work for him, possibly move in with him, and has left the marital home with me remaining with my 2 little kids. He has also since filed for divorce from his wife and has a child.
I feel like I’m living in a movie with the amount of secrets, lies, and cover ups. The worst thing about it is that she’s putting it all on me for my lack of attention, selfishness, etc. and that she’s been “pouring her heart into this marriage for years”. All couples have problems but I would NEVER cheat and believe in the institution of marriage. I’m now in a likely losing battle for my kids to keep them safe, shielded, and have some sense of normalcy as she tries to move them two hours away from their home so she can find happiness in her new life.
I do believe what goes around comes around and really don’t see how it could last; just need to try to move on with my life and start picking up the pieces. Just wish I could fast forward 12 months to remove the pain and see if they end up together, which is the hardest thing to get past right now.
You can't change the past.
Stop living in it.
There is some great information and advice on this site. The healing library is a great place to start. The Betrayed Men post in this forum does not get the same attention as the General thread. People from all sides of this struggle can offer insight to help you. Please feel safe to let it out on this site.
The fact that she's putting all her brokenness on you is a sure sign that she's not getting it, not growing, not learning. Huge advantage to you! (rather than the worst thing, turn it into the best thing)
A poster once said;
"Even though I am half the man I was...I will always be TWICE the man the OP is."
Fucking married women is
plucking low-hanging fruit.
May we all dine from rare and delicious tables from now on.
One of my friend is a real doofus, tech nerd that is not too sharp in the finer things socially. Anyhoo, he was in a relationship with this woman for a month. Met her once and one conversation later, I told him, she is too damn smart for you. That was my hint to him. She is a grifter through and through.She hustled him with bills and rent ect but I said my piece then and let it played out.
Anyhoo, in one month, they broke off six times, got engaged, pawn the ring, attempt to buy a house. She doesnt have a job ect...easy mark for her.
Here is the funny part, she got him to convert his plan to Verizon. He did and after they broke up, the biatch actually email him remind him to send in his verizon paperwork so she can get $25 fucking dollars referral fee. Now when he asked for his wii games back, she doesnt reply. Crazy shit!!1
Here's my story and I apologize in advance for the length of this.
I'm currently 4 months out from initial discovery. My WW had an LTA that lasted over 3 years. It started out as online flirting on a cooking site and developed into a full blown PA with-in 3 months.
Over the three years there were 7 total meetings, plus over 1K emails many with graphic pics and vids. All of the meetings were bad but 4 in particular were extra low in my book. 2 happened when we were on vacation in FLA staying with relatives and included sex at a nearby park outdoors.
The other 2 happened while I was recovering from back-to-back major surgeries, the first a decompression of my lower vertebra and the second a total hip replacement. I was totally incapacitated after both but especially the second. On these occasions she also choose to spend the entire night with the OM and sleep naked with him. These last two were also disguised as needed road trips because she was so frustrated in caring for me.
I could go on and on but I think you get the main gist. All contact in this one and only affair has ceased as of 12/4/11 and an NC was sent while I watched.
OK, so here's where I feel I may get flamed. WW & I have been married for 38 years & while I first wanted to kick her to the curb and kill the pos OM, I've decided to try and somehow find a way to save the marriage. Please note that I am NOT a cuckold and I'm still extremely angry, hurt, full of rage & asking why & how she could do this to me. I do sometimes ask myself if I'm mentally ill for agreeing to try and R after all shes done. However, and I can't help it, I still think that after 38 years the marriage at least deserves a chance to survive.
We have been in MC since 1/6/12 and for a while I felt that it was moving along and maybe it could work. However, over the last week or so I've reverted back to almost square one and can't seem to get the mind movies out of my head. Every day since has been a progression of more anger, hurt and rage and I feel like I'm going nuts again. On top of that, no matter what WW does to try and help me heal, it's not enough. I want to run as it would be so much easier than staying and living with this unbelievable pain. I'm trying to reassess everything and get back on track but I'm not sure I can any longer.
I need some advise from other male BS's who have been through this. Am I doing the right thing trying to save this, or am I wasting my remaining life trying to save an un-savable marriage?
OK, so here's where I feel I may get flamed. WW & I have been married for 38 years & while I first wanted to kick her to the curb and kill the pos OM, I've decided to try and somehow find a way to save the marriage.
I'm not sure why you feel you would get flamed for this point of view. Lots of BH's here share it with you. I am one of them.
Look, trying to find a way to somehow salvage a marriage out of the mess of infidelity doesn't make you a cuckhold, it makes you a strong and forgiving man who is willing to consider the possibility that a WW might be more than just the sum of their fucked up behavior during a short span of their lives.
You are going to get advice here to lawyer up. That's not bad advice. Doesn't mean you have to get a divorce. Just means that you might want to protect yourself in case the marriage is unsalvageable or in case your WW still has her head all screwed up. Doesn't mean you have to take the advice either, no one is going to judge you either way. They are simply trying to help based on their experiences.
You will probably get advice to 180 (look it up in the healing library to the left top of the page). Not bad advice either. The 180 is mostly about helping you to get your head in a better place. You don't have to do all aspects of the 180, or any of them at all, if they don't seem to fit your situation. Again no one will be pushing you one way or the other or judging you for your choices. Just trying their best to give you the wisdom of their particular experience. Just keep in mind it is just that, their particular experience. Might not apply to yours.
I know it feels right now like all of these details of your WW's A are just more than can ever be forgiven. That no one could possibly find away to get past all of it. And that may be so, only you can decide that for you. I can tell you that I put my FWW's behavior up there with some of the most fucked up shit I have read on this site and I am still here working toward Reconciliation, trying to make my marriage work. I don't think that makes me a wimp or a cuckhold. I think it makes me a man who is willing to walk as hard a road as neccisary if that is what it takes to hold my family together.
Of course I am lucky to have a FWW who is right there doing the work with me. Not everyone is lucky enough to have that. If you feel that you honestly have a WW who is remorseful and willing to do the work? Well then there is nothing wrong about trying to work through this mess. No shame or dishonor in that.
Good luck to you. Feel free to PM me if you need any support.
[This message edited by noescape at 2:33 PM, March 21st (Wednesday)]