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User Topic: Spouses/Partners of Sex Addicts-9
GeniusOrAFool
♀ Member
Member # 30940
Default  Posted: 3:50 PM, October 3rd (Wednesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Nature_Girl,

The way I feel, my WH's fate is his own and the product of his choices. I wish him no ill. Right now, his life is pretty stable as I am on the slow D plan right now...with about 4 yrs to go. But, once we D and go our separate ways, who knows what will happen with him. He could do his usual 'walks through sh*t and comes out smelling like roses' thing...cause this is how it usually goes for him. Or, he could very easily spiral down and become lost in the sexual abyss of his SA...a very sick, lonely man. Who knows.

The good news for you in your situation is that you are no longer being pulled down by your STBXH. You have untangled from the insanity. I know you are on a hard road, but certainly a better road for you and your kids. I wish you continued strength and peace.


I'm back together again.
I'm staring in the mirror
and it's been so long
since I've seen you my friend.

~Citizen Cope


Posts: 454 | Registered: Jan 2011 | From: PA
cupcakegirl
♀ Member
Member # 33594
Default  Posted: 12:44 PM, October 4th (Thursday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hello everyone,

Just popping in to say hi and hug each and everyone here. I have been out and away- completely focused and rolling up my sleeves in order to work on my own recovery and self care for many months.
I can feel the one year mark from formal disclosure approaching- sometimes I'm anxious, sometimes angry, sometimes sad and other times grateful. It has been grueling work, but def stronger.
My SAH has passed all his polygraphs,stayed in recovery program w/ weekly meetings meetings and steps, gone to FOO camp, and had verbal abuse therapy. Next week he starts EMDR to tackle more FOO trauma to continue his recovery.
It seemed like every time he got one issue under his belt and in line, another bigger, insano one was waiting in line right behind it. But I do see huge progress in the longest year of my entire life.
SAH is def showing signs of a more mature recovery, which is nice after this year of fits and starts of his healing. The hardest part was not his quitting acting out, it was how to deal with emotions in a healthy way and living life as it really is- ups and downs and good times and bad- and dealing with reality in a healthy way. It was also learning how to treat others with love and respect as a separate human being- that was SAH's stumbling block. That addict behavior goes waaay deep and it blows my mind how complicated recovery can be. I am glad he is wanting to work at this.
Exhausted and busted up from this year, I'm alive and much better off than the years I spent clueless and up to my eyeballs in s*%t.
Hugs and peace to you all in this heartbreaking battle. ccg


Me:BS, 43
Him: SAH, 48
Married 21 years
DDay 1: 2007
First day of transparency in M: 10/17/11
Polygraph 1/13/12 passed!
Polygraph 7/8/12 passed!
Polygraph 2/4/13 passed!
Next Poly is 2/14 passed!

Posts: 238 | Registered: Oct 2011
kristind83
♀ Member
Member # 35301
Default  Posted: 3:54 PM, October 4th (Thursday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My WH has just had 2 appointments with CSAT. His CSATrequested for me to attend next week so we can discuss his treatment plan. Are there any questions that I need to ask? I have a list started but feel like I may be missing some.


Me: BS (30)
Him: WS (32)
DD 5 DS 2
D Day #1 06/13/09 EA lasting 9 months
D Day #2 12/15/11 LTA 2 years PA
Beginning to trust real R

Posts: 63 | Registered: Apr 2012 | From: Illinois
cupcakegirl
♀ Member
Member # 33594
Default  Posted: 4:49 PM, October 4th (Thursday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Kristind83,

Glad to hear your WH is seeing a CSAT. Have you been given a formal disclosure where your WH types up a complete history of his acting out and discloses to you in the presence of a CSAT?

I did have a list of questions prepared at our controlled disclosure. I asked for my SAH to take a polygraph following disclosure and Q&A session. I also asked things that I was bothered by, that had never been answered or were not answered in the disclosure. I asked questions like, how much money did he spend feeding the addiction (he later added everything up in a CSAT worksheet), I asked for answers concerning particular times I was gaslighted, about his cycle of acting out, about any secret email accounts/contacts/phones, ED pill usage, any gifts given to skanks, and about any possible illegal activity.

All in all, I had about 60 something questions. First he disclosed everything(something he had been typing up)since the addiction started, then I got to ask questions. After that, he took and passed a poly basically saying that I have all the correct info with nothing false or left out. Then we started to talk about a recovery plan.

Think about what things have bothered you or just have never added up or made sense. Did you ever wonder some times when your gut was screaming? I went through and said things like, "remember when I found the strange charge on our cc bill for something you could not explain and we had a big fight you you called me crazy? Was that an addiction purchase?" I had to know it all for me to move forward- all the times I was gaslighted and accused of being snoopy. I, at the time, needed the validation that I was following my gut and he was acting weird. You know what? My gut was right about 99% of the time.
Good luck on your questions! Sending strength and peace to you. ccg


[This message edited by cupcakegirl at 4:50 PM, October 4th (Thursday)]


Me:BS, 43
Him: SAH, 48
Married 21 years
DDay 1: 2007
First day of transparency in M: 10/17/11
Polygraph 1/13/12 passed!
Polygraph 7/8/12 passed!
Polygraph 2/4/13 passed!
Next Poly is 2/14 passed!

Posts: 238 | Registered: Oct 2011
kristind83
♀ Member
Member # 35301
Default  Posted: 6:52 PM, October 4th (Thursday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

No formal disclosure yet however it was mentioned to WH that we would be doing it in the future. This time is for me to see the CSAT and address any concerns I have and to get a general layout of his treatment.


Me: BS (30)
Him: WS (32)
DD 5 DS 2
D Day #1 06/13/09 EA lasting 9 months
D Day #2 12/15/11 LTA 2 years PA
Beginning to trust real R

Posts: 63 | Registered: Apr 2012 | From: Illinois
beautifulmess7
♀ Member
Member # 35259
Default  Posted: 3:55 PM, October 5th (Friday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

The hardest part was not his quitting acting out, it was how to deal with emotions in a healthy way and living life as it really is- ups and downs and good times and bad- and dealing with reality in a healthy way.

I completely understand that statement. It rings so true to me right now. My husband hasn't acted out in over a year. We just did a disclosure, which has been really hard. The main issues that he will need to work on revolve around all those interpersonal, emotional, FOO, relational issues. He needs to figure out why he has the urge to lie about small things, learn how to feel his emotions, overcome his desire to keep secrets, and so, so much more. Acting out is the least of our concerns right now (which I guess is a good thing).

kristind83 - The first meeting will be a lot of general stuff. You might be introduced to some concepts of sex addiction, go over basics of the recovery plan, and stuff like that. I would ask what the planned length of the program is, what type of therapy he will be focusing on, what your role will be (or not be), how much you should expect to know about their progress, and what steps other than therapy does he want your SAWH to be a part of (ours required that he be on medication and attend SA or SAA meetings in addition to his weekly therapy). It is also important to know when they will be working on the full disclosure, how long you can expect to wait, what that process will be like, and anything else that is on your mind. There are no "right" or "wrong" questions. This also is not a one-shot deal. You can ask to talk to him again whenever you want.


Posts: 242 | Registered: Apr 2012 | From: Virginia
kristind83
♀ Member
Member # 35301
Default  Posted: 5:10 PM, October 5th (Friday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thank you. A lot of these I had thought of but I missed several. Just feeling anxious I guess. His IC helped with other issues but I know the CSAT is our best choice if I want my marriage to be healthy.


Me: BS (30)
Him: WS (32)
DD 5 DS 2
D Day #1 06/13/09 EA lasting 9 months
D Day #2 12/15/11 LTA 2 years PA
Beginning to trust real R

Posts: 63 | Registered: Apr 2012 | From: Illinois
Notmetoo2011
♀ Member
Member # 32912
Default  Posted: 6:57 AM, October 6th (Saturday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Can someone fill me in about how most CSAT's approach treatment. My H has been seeing the only CSAT in our area since January. This CSAT has trained with, and gone to workshops put on by Stephanie Carnes, but does not seem to be following any set treatment steps or doing any of the things I hear others talk about here. We have had no formal disclosure (though I feel that I do have all the details), no mention of a polygraph. She has given H a workbook to work through but that is about it. I see the same CSAT and while I feel she understands what I'm going through, she doesn't seem to be giving me any concrete steps to take to aid my recovery. It seems to be more like regular counseling with a lot of " how have you been feeling" type stuff.


Me-BW 47
SAWH 48
Married 25 years.
4 children
D-Day 26/07/11
Multiple PAs, ONS,

Posts: 262 | Registered: Jul 2011
Missymomma
♀ Member
Member # 36988
Default  Posted: 8:58 AM, October 6th (Saturday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Notmetoo - I went through this with SAWH's therapist. Turns out he wasn't done with the training and not a certified CSAT, yet. Find out if they have been certified or are still in training. Then you have to push for disclosure. Thankfully, my CSAT has years of experience and really helped me. Is there any way you could get a different CSAT for yourself further away? Maybe find someone that will see you once a month and then do phone consults the other weeks. It just seems wrong for a CSAT to be seeing both of you, then they are more of a MC than IC.

[This message edited by Missymomma at 8:59 AM, October 6th (Saturday)]


DDay - 6/15/11
R started - 7/1/11
False Discl- 9/27/12
Real Discl - 2/12/13
Poly - 3/1/13 Pass!
Me - BS (46)
WH - 52 (SA, NA, WA)
Kids: 2 littles and 1 grown
The road to recovery is long and hard. Some days I am up for it and others not!

Posts: 1084 | Registered: Sep 2012 | From: Texas
GeniusOrAFool
♀ Member
Member # 30940
Default  Posted: 9:17 AM, October 6th (Saturday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Notmetoo,

I wonder if your CSAT lacks experience(?) She may have trained and attended workshops with the best, but until they get some very real experience under their belt in treating SA, I imagine they can be quite 'green' and ill equipped. And, while I believe that CSATs as a whole are the most excellent resource for treatment, help, and support for both a SA and spouse, I am sure not all are 'good'. Some are probably just 'fair'...and, unfortunately, some may actually be 'bad'.

I can tell you that my CSAT knows her stuff, has a very clear vision for what appropriate treatment should be for both the SA and spouse.
Some of this includes '90 days of abstinence' where the SA does not have sex, view/do anything which is associated with their particular SA interests/behaviors, or mb...AT ALL for 90 days straight. And, any 'slip' in this agreement means resetting the clock and beginning at day #1 again. This is a VERY important 1st step in resetting the faulty, ingrained 'arousal template'.
Has this been a part of your WH's treatment?

Also, it is very important for not only regular/weekly CSAT IC sessions for your WH, but also that he attend a SA support group with frequency...and that he have a personal 'sponsor'. All of this is very time and commitment intensive. But, both my CSAT and my WH's 'old' CSAT (2 different CSATs) were on the same page about this treatment regimen. And, it is consistent with anything I have researched about treatment.

BTW, with my CSAT experience, there was never a formal disclosure, but since I knew enough already, it wasn't necessary. A polygraph was never mentioned, but again, it was not necessary in my case.

As far as this CSAT supporting you as a spouse, there is much to be discussed...from how you are feeling today ~ to what you are seeing in your 'recovering' WH ~ to validation of everything you have been through with him ~ to healthy ways to engage in self-care and self-healing for YOU alone ~ to exploring your own issues (possibly co-dependency)related to how SA somehow happened in your M ~ to boundaries, etc, etc. There is much to discuss.


I'm back together again.
I'm staring in the mirror
and it's been so long
since I've seen you my friend.

~Citizen Cope


Posts: 454 | Registered: Jan 2011 | From: PA
Missymomma
♀ Member
Member # 36988
Default  Posted: 9:24 AM, October 6th (Saturday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Well, things are going better for me today. Last night we went out to a party, which was nice to be out among friends. We seem to be in a better place now. The last 2 weeks have been rough. Going to schedule for MC next. There are huge communication problems in this marriage, that is something that I do take 50% ownership of (well, maybe 40%). R is a long road with an addict. The hard part for me, sometimes, is pretending around people that nothing ever happened. I am so bad at pretending and am glad I have other paces to vent, like here.


DDay - 6/15/11
R started - 7/1/11
False Discl- 9/27/12
Real Discl - 2/12/13
Poly - 3/1/13 Pass!
Me - BS (46)
WH - 52 (SA, NA, WA)
Kids: 2 littles and 1 grown
The road to recovery is long and hard. Some days I am up for it and others not!

Posts: 1084 | Registered: Sep 2012 | From: Texas
Notmetoo2011
♀ Member
Member # 32912
Default  Posted: 5:20 PM, October 6th (Saturday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks for the responses missymomma and GeniusOrAFool. There is no other CSAT (at least none listed anywhere we have searched) within 500 or more miles.
The CSAT herself said that one of the reasons she and her husband came to our area was the lack of help available here for SA. She previously worked on the West Coast and from what I can gather did a lot of work there with sex offenders .

I don't think she has been a CSAT for that long. I think this might be a second career for her. I do find her helpful but I was worried that she didn't seem to be implementing the things so many people here talk about.

Genius
My SAWH never did the 90 days of abstinence from sex with me. However he has abstained totally from porn and masturbation (which were daily rituals for him before) since DDay. By the time he found this CSAT we were 5 months out from DDay so maybe she thought it would not be helpful at that point. SAWH was "into" only very specific kinds of porn (BDSM), and his acting out with people were centered around those fantasies primarily.

The CSAT did put him in contact with the SA group in our area which he goes to weekly and finds helpful. Maybe I'm just expecting too much.


Me-BW 47
SAWH 48
Married 25 years.
4 children
D-Day 26/07/11
Multiple PAs, ONS,

Posts: 262 | Registered: Jul 2011
DrivingPast
♀ Member
Member # 32984
Default  Posted: 8:30 PM, October 6th (Saturday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

notmetoo,

I havent had a great experience with csat either. My husband saw a male and a female for mc (I saw her sometimes on my own)

Similar to you, his never did any disclosure, just gave him a workbook but they never went over the things in the workbook, no recovery plan, or anything else.

The woman (well both of them actually) assumed I was co-dep before I walked in the door, due to him being sa. She made several wrong assumptions about me and jumped to conclusions during our sessions. She said a couple things that I felt were damaging to our recovery, marriage-wise.

As far as I could find out he is the only 1 on 1 csat in our area. The other one does group things only.

Its been very disappointing, and Ive been strongly wanting to do an "intensive" weekend therapy at one of the major sa centers. But my bad experiences have made me wary of that, and its also extremely expensive, but it does include a poly, and I know I need to have that.


BW
married more than 10 yrs to a possible SA
D-Day May 5 2011
"Because one knows people best through their fears - the ones they overcome and the ones they are overcome by."

Posts: 1304 | Registered: Aug 2011
Missymomma
♀ Member
Member # 36988
Default  Posted: 9:40 AM, October 7th (Sunday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

SAWH and I had a long talk about his CSAT. He said he gets more out of SA than IC. I told him that was apparent to me, as well. He leaves IC and is pouty and in the poor me mode. We talked about how his IC let's him wallow in self-pity for over half of each session. That they haven't really been working on much of a plan until disclosure. Of course, SAWH is responsible for the fact that he goes into therapy and he is very manipulative. He admitted that he was, that he tends to control the sessions. Unfortunately and fortunately, SAWH has a very high IQ and can manipulate most therapists. I have seen it first hand and he has been in therapy while actively addicted and they never called him on it. He agreed that he would give the current IC a chance with more information. But we are going to start MC with a CSAT that my CSAT has recommended. We will talk to this woman and see if she has any recommendation. It is a relief and it was a very honest, calm conversation. He is really trying to be open and honest.

[This message edited by Missymomma at 9:40 AM, October 7th (Sunday)]


DDay - 6/15/11
R started - 7/1/11
False Discl- 9/27/12
Real Discl - 2/12/13
Poly - 3/1/13 Pass!
Me - BS (46)
WH - 52 (SA, NA, WA)
Kids: 2 littles and 1 grown
The road to recovery is long and hard. Some days I am up for it and others not!

Posts: 1084 | Registered: Sep 2012 | From: Texas
GeniusOrAFool
♀ Member
Member # 30940
Default  Posted: 9:54 AM, October 7th (Sunday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Notmetoo,

You said that maybe you are expecting too much. Can you be a little more specific? What were your expectations? Did you assume certain things...certain experiences...certain outcomes...while on this road?
I ask because I wonder if you can identify the source(s) of your disillusionment or disappointment. Maybe that would help with better aligning this recovery process with what YOU need.

DrivingPast,

My 2nd IC ('regular', but excellent IC who happened to have addictions experience) told me that the absolute BEST course of action with SA is to go to an inpatient treatment center for an extended period of time. She believed that the 24/7 treatment and support was 2nd to none and the right design and intensive for achieving the best short and long term success. She felt that any other treatment, CSAT/support group/etc, simply didn't cut it and drove the chances of successful recovery DOWN significantly.

In my personal experience, she was right.


I'm back together again.
I'm staring in the mirror
and it's been so long
since I've seen you my friend.

~Citizen Cope


Posts: 454 | Registered: Jan 2011 | From: PA
Missymomma
♀ Member
Member # 36988
Default  Posted: 10:33 AM, October 7th (Sunday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Notmetoo - How long has SAWH been in recovery? That is going to decide how much change you will see. Personally, haven't seen nearly enough change until the last month and mine has been in recovery for 1 yr 2 1/2 months. Of course abstinence came right away. Thought changes take a lot longer to change. Concentrating on yourself and what you want in your life really seems to ease some of the anxiety, at least it is what my CSAT says and works the best for me.

DrivingPast - Sounds like your intuition is to do an intensive in-patient. i always say go with your gut feeling on that. Also, hope he is going more often than once a week to SAA. Does he have a sponsor?

Geniusorfool - Interesting that your CSAT said that. Mine works at an inpatient facility 2 days a week but doesn't feel it is necessary in our case. She did feel that 3-5 years of therapy and at least 3 days a week of SAA would be optimum. Have to say, I have been most impressed with the local SAA.


DDay - 6/15/11
R started - 7/1/11
False Discl- 9/27/12
Real Discl - 2/12/13
Poly - 3/1/13 Pass!
Me - BS (46)
WH - 52 (SA, NA, WA)
Kids: 2 littles and 1 grown
The road to recovery is long and hard. Some days I am up for it and others not!

Posts: 1084 | Registered: Sep 2012 | From: Texas
GeniusOrAFool
♀ Member
Member # 30940
Default  Posted: 3:08 PM, October 7th (Sunday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Missy,

Just to clarify: It was not my CSAT who strongly recommended inpatient treatment. It was my prior IC who was a 'regular' therapist, but who happened to have addictions experience. She was an excellent IC...who became our MC for several months. She was the one who actually diagnosed the SA...based on my detailed accounts of my WH's history and several months of my WH attending with me for MC with her.

I later, and more recently, for the last 9 months have, myself, been seeing my CSAT.
She never mentioned inpatient treatment. Her regimen for my WH would have been weekly CSAT, support group attendence several times/week, and the use of a sponsor or accountability partner. However, she was not my WH's CSAT. He had his own CSAT.

And, yup, my CSAT said 2 - 5 yrs of treatment...much like yours. But, she was very frank with me to say that MANY SA's never have success mostly because their hearts are not really in recovery. I found this to be true.


I'm back together again.
I'm staring in the mirror
and it's been so long
since I've seen you my friend.

~Citizen Cope


Posts: 454 | Registered: Jan 2011 | From: PA
Missymomma
♀ Member
Member # 36988
Default  Posted: 3:41 PM, October 7th (Sunday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Oh, ok. That makes sense. My SAWH was in rehab for the drug addiction but they didn't even really deal with the SA, as it had begun when the drug addiction really escalated. They stupidly thought it was a symptom of the drug addiction. However, about a year sober from drugs he began the SA again. This was when he stopped going to twelve step meetings. So, in total, he had about 2 years of active SA. He had some parts of SA like sexual anorexia before that. Really, the statistics for staying sober from anything are not great but they drastically increase when doing a 12 step program and therapy. Either one or the other doesn't have as high a success rate.


DDay - 6/15/11
R started - 7/1/11
False Discl- 9/27/12
Real Discl - 2/12/13
Poly - 3/1/13 Pass!
Me - BS (46)
WH - 52 (SA, NA, WA)
Kids: 2 littles and 1 grown
The road to recovery is long and hard. Some days I am up for it and others not!

Posts: 1084 | Registered: Sep 2012 | From: Texas
kristind83
♀ Member
Member # 35301
Default  Posted: 8:03 PM, October 8th (Monday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

WH had first SA meeting tonight. Small group but said it made him feel comfortable. Has CSAT on Thursday with me then another SA meeting Thursday night.


Me: BS (30)
Him: WS (32)
DD 5 DS 2
D Day #1 06/13/09 EA lasting 9 months
D Day #2 12/15/11 LTA 2 years PA
Beginning to trust real R

Posts: 63 | Registered: Apr 2012 | From: Illinois
Notmetoo2011
♀ Member
Member # 32912
Default  Posted: 7:30 PM, October 9th (Tuesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Genius,

I guess in saying " maybe I'm expecting too much", I was referring to my hope that a CSAT would have a more structured approach to therapy than the two ICs I briefly saw. I was hoping for a some sort of step by step process to help guide me towards my own healing and to help me with developing appropriate boundaries, and to help me work through the myriad of feelings I'm experiencing.

Missy,

My H has been in recovery for about fourteen and a half months. He is doing everything he can to make amends but I don't know if anything will be enough. Unfortunately what I want , which is to erase the past, is impossible to have, so I'm stuck here spinning my wheels.


Me-BW 47
SAWH 48
Married 25 years.
4 children
D-Day 26/07/11
Multiple PAs, ONS,

Posts: 262 | Registered: Jul 2011
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