I have to find me again.
You are such a kind, giving person....but I also think that you are stronger than you think!
So I am a little confused, I think you are implying that your W read your SI posts and that is what upset her? Then, being upset she did not want to have an open and frank discussion?
ats.. not exactly. When WW went to use my iPhone to do the search on the actrees, she commented that I had all eight search pages open. (Each page was open to a different thread, none of them were my posts). I think all were threads from the Wayward Side which I had been reading to increase my own understanding, awareness, healing and self development. My reply to her was that she could close any page to do her search.
IMO, it was another reminder of what she has done and she is in a self defensive mode to lessen the guilt / shame she feels.
I do not believe that she goes to SI and reads my posts.
In my house this is FWW's "I just want to live alone and be a dog hoarder" speech. ... This attitude is the WS's way of excusing themselves from obligation to try to be a better person, to be a participating M partner. It is falling into the shame spiral and wallowing.
I have learned that it is not your opinion here that will matter. What does your WW think? What is her opinion? Does she believe she needs help? If so, does she want to do the work that help entails? You can lead a WS to IC, but you cannot make them drink.
Again IMHO, WW has not initiated D proceedings because she wants me to do it and that will eliminate her responsibility for it. That is, I am leaving the M to be happier without her.
If my FWH ever said that he had no feelings for me....I would show him the door.
On DDay1, I discovered condoms in her dresser and confronted her that day. She lied by telling me that she had a brief A and had ended it 3 months prior. She expressed her committment to me, seemed genuinely remorseful, and we began the painful forensics needed to build a healthy R. She was filled with sorrow, kind, affectionate, sexual, and spent the time with me to strengthen our fractured bonds.
On DDay2 (two months later), she confessed the truth: the story she gave me was false and she had been having an A for over two years. She told me everthing I could bare to hear. She shared her NC letter sent the day before, she gave me her passwords to personal email, work email, cell phone. She expressed remorse and hope.
Why did she choose to reveal the truth? She noted the articles I had shared since DDay1 and had included in her NC letter how As destroy one's sould and harm others as well.
So why on that day (a Friday) did she reveal the truth? On the prior Tuesday, I had asked for the password to our cell phone records and she told me she "did not want me to have it. He has a family and she was agraid as to what I would do." I said I should have it and we can discuss it with the MC next week. She checked the records and was horrified to see the detail: every phone call, every text, every photo. Sender, date, time, duration.
So post DDay2. WW was totally unprepared for the hurt and trauma I felt. She consoled, she threw up defenses, she expressed grattitude, she withdrew. And I pressed her almost daily to do more to repair what she had destroyed. Last May, I badgered her with you do not care, you do not do enough, you do not love me, admit it, admit it.I told her I knew where I would live, how we would divide our finaces, how we would be able to provide for our children through college. "No, No, yes I no longer love you"
As recently as the beggining of December, she bought some novelties to try and spark our sex life as the mental damage of her A still affects me both emotionally and physically sexually.
Not one of my finer moments
I don't have much useful advice -- just want to say to fourever that the idea of staying seems hard and complicated while you're deciding it and grieving but once you reach acceptance ... I sum it up by simply saying "I made a promise and I decided tO keep it
I think the H&C “I am uncomfortable” was about sex.
A quality man always invites.
Sex is more than a physical act for me. It is the emotional statement that I am imprtant, valuded, and loved. Only my W can provide this - not an OW.
I think you might need to affirm your wife a whole much more than what you are doing.
I have done this throughout our M and alng the way at some point these affirmations became insignificant to her. And I agree, there is no limit to what I can provide in the ways of affirmation.
A good quality man is Positive
A woman must FEEL secure. You wife is not safe. You must make sure YOU do things, say things, to make her safe…
There is something unique about the brokenness of a WW engaged in an LTA that needs a different approach. In a way it's about appearing different from before or from what she expects.
Okay tibe, if I were a bookmaker the odds would be 100 to 1 in favor of D for Mr and Mrs h&c. If I were a betting man (which I am), I put the odds at 50:50. My W seems determined that she has no emotional connection with me, cannot be fulfilled in our M, and we both will be happier without each other. I have traveled a rough path, feel the love for her, am willing and beginning to show my love for her once again, and have perservered and conquered many challenges in my life. I am up to the challenge to regain the connection and joy in our M.
Last night, W and I relaxed in the hot tub as our childre (all home for the holidays) scattered on their individual activities. Against Tryin's great advice, I wondered into heavy discussion territory to my own detriment. One of the items I would like to share that occurred at the end:
I told my W that I was sorry that I was not there for her after DDay2. She had remarked during a MC session how she felt like driving off a bridge after I found out about her A. I was very, very deep in my own pain to even notice. W says " I would not have expected you to support me as you were the one that needed the support."
I followed with "I emphathize with your pain, your sorrow." WW asks "why would you empathize with my pain?" in disbelief that I could do so. "When did you notice my sorrow?" I replied "this week. I am sure that it has been there a long time and I have failed to notice due to my own dispair and blindness to the pain of you and others. I can understand your pain. Yes, it came from your choices and actions. Some of us make huge mistakes which can have unforseen consequences that can haunt us for a long time. I will never know what that pain feels like just as you will never know what the pain of your infidelity has done to me.
I am your husband. I will treat you as my W as a husband should. I will be caring, supportive, affirming, affectionate and sexual. If you tell me you are "uncomfortable", "stop", "go away" then I will for a short time. I will come back later with these same appropriate behaviours. I will do this as long as I am your husband"
I am in a good place. Infidelity has damaged and destroyed a part of me but it will not define me. I have had many good years in my life and I look forward to 2013 being the best ever!!! Lots of smiles, foolishness, laughs, and fun.
Happy holidays to the fantastic folks here on the LTA thread.
Bring on 2013 - a new year, a new life, a new home, & possibly a new car.
Have decided on my divorce present to myself - a new bike. Had a look at a new Specialised S Works package for about $10k but have found that Boardman cycles are now imported direct into oz from the factory so similar package for half the price. My bike looks like an antique compared to the new technology.
The new year holds so many positives & exciting challenges.
To the tribe - thank you for your love & support over the past 12 months. I hope & pray that you all have a wonderful Xmas & a very prosperous 2013. It is an honour to know you all.
When are you going to "come out"? Time to edit some of your details I think.
I remember when you first joined you had reasons to conceal who you are but hey, I think perhaps it is time for a new beginning here.
(Plus you slipped in your last post ). The super sleuth in me notices little things like that.
Wishing you and your beautiful children a wonderful Christmas and New Year.
Wishing all unremorseful OWs and OMs the biggest fucking Karma Bus Santa can deliver!!!
Think of you often.
Laura - thank you.
Merry Christmas and Christmas Eve and New Year to everyone!
I'm really, really tired, but at least I finished my shopping today. Now I need more food. Told Mr.M3 we needed more food -- he said, we've got...what else do we need? and it was like 15 kinds of meat (which The Pharaoh assures me is a guy thing) so I said, well, everything, side dishes, beverages... LOL. So, a short trip to the grocery store for that and DIAPERS (what a blessing)
Well, anyway, I hope everyone enjoys their gifts in my home, and that each of you has a lovely Christmas (DP, try since you're without your children, I have trouble imagining that pain) I have a clean guest room, kitchen and two clean bathrooms, so that's my Christmas Miracle ( )
I wish I could give each of you a big HUG for christmas. May you all have a blessed holiday. I'll give you all a *real* update on me in the New Year.
It is so ironic that WW betrays me and SHE does not feel safe.
Sometimes, heavy discuss just happen. I avoid them because looking at my past, nothing but more pain usually results. People say things they don’t really mean and we misunderstand during those kinds of discussions. Heavy discussion might lead to Unforgiving comments that remind and make your wife feel shame.
Keep with this theme h&C and you will be rewarded….
I am your husband. I will treat you as my W as a husband should. I will be caring, supportive, affirming, affectionate and sexual.
A quality man opens his mind to what his wife says, he thinks, and never let’s her misbehave. He demands a loving relations and he let’s his woman make the choice.
H&C..This is me today… I react with words, clear communication, and clear consequences. If my wife says….
Wife, “I have always been unhappy in the M”
Me, “Honey, We have had many happy occasions together. With some time, I could list them for you. All M have ups and downs. This is why I have a responsibility to you and you have a responsibility to me. When you are not happy, it is your responsibility to be open to me, you cannot send me body language, it must be very clear verbal language. And I must do the same. I can only behave in a way that will make you happy if you make me understand it. If I don’t, then you should leave me.”
Wife, “We are so different”
Me, “Yes, that is why I value you. It would be boring to be with someone too much alike” “I want you to be different.” “We have been together for a long time. We have many common things. Do you want me to think about them and list them?”
Wife, “I do not have an emotional connection to you.”
Me, “Honey, I get feelings are feelings. Thoughts come before feelings. So you start behaving in a positive, loving, caring, affectionate, and sexual way to me, Your emotions will change.. I too will make the extra effort to give you all those I mentioned much better in return. “
Wife, “The A made me more affectionate”
Me, “Look, if I experienced a new woman, yes, I would have special feelings too. What you did was a choice. I forgive you. Now, make the choice to be affectionate to me or do us both a favor and get out of this marriage. We don’t need to fool ourselves. If you need someone else, go for it. But to hide, do things in secret just hurt yourself, me, our kids that much more. Be open honey! We don’t need to play these stupid head games anymore.. Just go, don’t be that woman any more.”
Wife, “I tried but I got nothing out of IC.”
Me, “That is totally your choice.” “It helps me”
Wife, “I should have D”
Me, “Then GO! Please don’t stay in misery on my behalf. If you are not going to act in a loving, caring, affectionate, nice, and sexual to me, then YES, I will make your life miserable. Why would you, by choice, want to live in misery, I don’t. Love is patient. I am being patient. It only last for so long. I am asking you to be that woman I married, who choose to love me.”
Anyways.. Stay strong H&C.. study How to forgive. It sound like you really need to make the CHOICE to forgive.. then execute the forgiving behaviors.
Peace out LTA...
[This message edited by trynhard at 7:37 AM, December 24th (Monday)]
I have updated my profile (tag). I know it is the predominant practice on SI to list DDay(s) but not universal. I am no longer defined by my WW infidelity. It is part of me but does not define who I am.
I have lots to work on (myself) in 2013 which will keep me very busy. Being a better husband, being a better father, being a better son, being a better friend, being a better colleague - just being a better person.
There was a recent post in Reconcilliation "What did you lose due to the A?
. I lost the best friend I ever had - my W. And the truth is I lost her long before the A started. I took care of her. I provided for her. I complimented her. I supported her. I was affectionate with her. AND I did not truly listen to her worries, concerns, fears. I just told her how to fix them, how they were not real, how she put them before me.
In 2013, I am going to work very very hard to gegain that friendship that led me to blurt "will you be my wife?" so many years ago.
Merry Christmas to all and best wishes for great joys this holiday season.
Deck the halls with boughs of holly, fa la la..
Love from Nell and her boyos (who have put the gifts into piles so as to make the unwrapping process that much quicker). XOXO
As Christmas day here in OZ draws to a close and Christmas festivities on the other side of the world begin I would like to wish my friends everywhere a very Happy Christmas and a wonderful New Year.
Today I received a message from an old friend that I am know you will remember fondly.
Strongish has created a new life for herself. I am sure that her H's betrayal will always be a part of her history but the message she sent me was so full of hope and happiness I couldn't wait to share it with you all.
This is what she said:
Please pass along to the Tribe that I have a wonderful man in my life. Barely 2 weeks after my D was final I was introduced via e-mail to a friend of a friend. We hit it off on-line, met in person and now are totally infatuated with each other. It's hard to say why we connected so instantly but we did. He is very respectful of my relationship with my kids and is hesitant to criticize my ex other than to say that he would not have let me get away.
The bottom line is that he is pretty amazing and I feel very loved by him which is a new feeling for me.
Hope all is well with you. Please pass along my best wishes to the Tribe.
So tribe. There is hope after the darkness. Strongish clearly had the strength to go out and find the light. I wish the "light" of a new beginning for each and every one of us (in whatever form it takes).
Love you all
[This message edited by Laura28 at 1:50 AM, December 25th (Tuesday)]
Laura great news from Strongish...it gives hope for the future.
Dip - hope the grilling goes well. Here it was 30c not a cloud in the sky great beach weather.
Enjoy the break tribe
Turns out FIL saw them on Xmas day but couldnt even be bothered to call me to say that the kids were ok....wtf
Court have been advised that the DVO matter is resolved so this should now disappear...hopefully some progress can be made in the new year re access.
HUGS HUGS HUGS HUGS HUGS HUGS HUGS HUGS HUGS HUGS HUGS HUGS HUGS HUGS HUGS