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User Topic: Long Term Affairs - Part 30
njgal480
♀ Member
Member # 24938
Default  Posted: 5:48 AM, February 15th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

m33-
you have a good memory!
It did take me about 4 yrs to finally feel OK with my decision to reconcile and for the roller coaster ride to ease up.

Smitty-
What you are experiencing is very typical. We as BS are dealt this shocking blow.We are traumatized.
In the past most of us believed that any infidelity would be a deal breaker and now the WS is asking for forgiveness and we decide to try to R.
No wonder that we waver and go back and forth in our minds as to what we should do and why we feel as we do.

7 yrs- glad to hear that you are feeling OK.


Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA
Reconciled.


Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
njgal480
♀ Member
Member # 24938
Default  Posted: 5:48 AM, February 15th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

m33-
you have a good memory!
It did take me about 4 yrs to finally feel OK with my decision to reconcile and for the roller coaster ride to ease up.

Smitty-
What you are experiencing is very typical. We as BS are dealt this shocking blow.We are traumatized.
In the past most of us believed that any infidelity would be a deal breaker and now the WS is asking for forgiveness and we decide to try to R.
No wonder that we waver and go back and forth in our minds as to what we should do and why we feel as we do.

7 yrs- glad to hear that you are feeling OK.


Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA
Reconciled.


Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
njgal480
♀ Member
Member # 24938
Default  Posted: 6:06 AM, February 15th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Laura- You can't rush healing.
You will be able to say "I love you" when you are ready.
Everyone heals on their own timetable.
As for your FWH bringing up the LTA and willingly discussing it-well my FWH will not do that either.
Mine was willing to discuss it all that first year after d day but after that it was like pulling teeth.
It caused quite a bit of added turmoil year 2 and 3 when I would trigger etc.

But I came to a point of peace around the 4 and 1/2 yr point for me when I began to see my need for peace and tranquility as opposed to re-living the LTA with my FWH.

I do still feel the need to discuss the LTA even now- 6 yrs after d-day.
I have SI and have some friends that are BS and we re hash it all.

M33-You sound happy and peaceful.


Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA
Reconciled.


Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
RSEB
♀ Member
Member # 34728
Default  Posted: 6:07 AM, February 15th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Good Morning everyone,

First before I start I want to say how truly thankful and humbled I am that you all have given me, a FWW such honesty and insight into your hurt. When I first lurked in the LTA forum for a while I was very afraid. I didn't want to trigger or hurt any of you, you have been through enough.

As a FWW I wanted to let you know my side, and this is only how I feel. I have commited the same horrible actions that your WS's commited. We knowingly and selfishly and brokenly commited adultery for YEARS not looking back once. However, now I look back, I look back EVERY single day. I cry to myself a lot, I have also cried with my BH holding me. I look back at my life, the lies I told and I am embarrassed. It is as if that wasn't even me, but the sad truth is that it was. In my case, as you can see in my profile, the MOM was a friend for a long time, we dated briefly about 20 years ago. Our family's were intertwined, more so obviously due to the A, both his BW and I were pregnant at the same time, our boys became best friends. His BW counted on me as a friend. At one point when she thought she "caught" us, about a month before D Day, both MOM and I talked her out of it. To type that made me pause again, and regroup because I betrayed her in different ways but as much as I betrayed my BH. That being said, I called her yesterday. It crossed my mind out of the blue as I sat here on the couch yesterday in my misery. I don't know what came over me, it is not something I had been planning. I blocked my number and to my surprise I could remember their home phone number. They used to have private numbers blocked but to my surprise she picked up. We spoke, she did not hang up on me. First and foremost I asked if MOM was there because if he was, I didn't want to talk to her because I would not break NC, even if it was only with him being in the house with her. She assured me he wasn't home. We spoke for about 10 minutes and I apologized. I told her she did not deserve any of it and I hope that she is happy and I am sorry that I betrayed her friendship. That was the basis of the conversation. It was something I had to do, it was something she deserved. She was not angry at my calling and she said thank you.

Now on to the rest of my V Day. It was horrible. I could not wait for the day to be over. My BH came home, I finished his special dinner I made him and I sat there and watched him eat it, the kids and I had already eaten earlier. He did not mention V Day, not a wish came from his mouth. We did hug when he came in the door, he seemed relieved and safe when we hugged. I asked him how he was,he said not good. I didn't say anything. I didn't want to give into the negative, as Tryn suggests. I just couldn't wait to end the day. We had basic conversation at dinner. The rest of the night we didn't say a word. I could not find it in myself to be upbeat. I felt I had been beaten. It makes my head spin this rollercoaster and usually I try to be upbeat for him, for our M, but yesterday I kept getting knocked down and I just couldn't get back up.

Nigal, I read your post, thank you so much for your detailed history, I truly appreaciate it, it gives me hope, but at the same time it fills me with fear because I don't know if my BH is as proactive in his recovery, but I must say in year 2 and now year 3 he was still crying every week, that was until I started following Tryns advice to not get drawn into my BH's negative. Even last night if I would have said something I am sure he would have started to cry. So did I do something wrong?

Especially after reading Laura's post. I hear how you implore for your WH to address his A's even to this day. I must say I have read your profile many times Laura and you are such a strong woman, I stand in awe. Should I still be offering my BH's apologies? I have not in a while because I am trying to be "quality" and not bring up the A. Am I doing this all wrong? God talk about second guessing myself.

I just want to do what is best to make my BH feel better. Laura and everyone actually since D Day my BH does not track me, does not VAR me, or keylogger me. He doesn't want to live that way. I have given him all PW's but he doesn't check. FB we look at together once in a while. To me that hurts just as much because he feels that the damage has been done. He doesn't think I am doing anything secretive, but he has said if he did find out there was something going on it wouldn't matter because the life he thought he had was already destroyed three years ago and if there was someone else he would be surprised but it wouldn't destroy anything.

Well today is another day as I sit her surrounded by our wonderful children, getting ready for school. I am re grouping, trying to get in gear to be positive for my BH. I hope today is a better day, it couldn't have gotten much worse.

THANK YOU SO MUCH TO YOU ALL


ME - FWS


Posts: 259 | Registered: Feb 2012
7yrsflushed
♂ Member
Member # 32258
Default  Posted: 7:43 AM, February 15th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I am re grouping, trying to get in gear to be positive for my BH.

RSEB, remember you are being positive for yourself as well. The changes you are making are just as much if not more for you than your BH. He is the beneficiary of your new attitude and outlook on things.


D-day 5/24/11
BH = Me
STBXWW = Her
2 children
The first true sense of calm I felt in YEARS was when I filed for D...
Separated 6/2013, D official around 6/2014

Posts: 1583 | Registered: May 2011
trynhard
♂ Member
Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 7:54 AM, February 15th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Laura,

I was watching a show on TV the other day about men in the Florida Keys who are paid to salvage boats, tow boats etc.

The man on the show was a smoker. He had been hacking, shortness of breath, and coughing for weeks. He could not catch his breath starving for oxygen. So, he finally went to the doctor. The doctor took x-rays, listened to his lungs and gave his diagnosis. Emphysema caused by tobacco smoking. He had a collapse of small airways in the lungs during is bodies forced exhalation. Emphysema is an irreversible degenerative condition. He cannot fix it. This man has a huge health issue. He told the camera crew for them not to tell his family or say a word. He told nobody. The doctor didn’t even need to instruct him as to what he needed to do… quit. Quitting slows the progression. Medicine can slow the progression even more.

Then he said, “I am not ready.” I know he wants to quit. Does he want to suffocate sooner? Does he want to have lung collapse sooner? He said, “he just can’t.” When is he going to be ready?

You can SSSSSHHHH me. You can push me back so you do not have to face those words I give to you. I can bury what I know, and I can go silence. Does your H get SSSSHHH’d too? I am not your H. I am standing up to you and not going to go silent to you. I don’t want stop sharing my successes that I know you read. I don’t want to stop telling other how they can survive infidelity. There are different ways of going about surviving this trauma. I want to share what I have learned how to be a better communicator, the #1 reason for all M failures. Good understands the behaviors behind the words like trust, I want to encourage you to change, behave more loving, not less. I want you to make the choice to change one way or another so that they might find happiness, a feeling. It may be in your M, or not. I know stuck in the middle is misery not complete happiness. I laid my life down for my wife, jump in front that car, my feelings squashed and smashed to finally just accept the things I could not change and I want you to do the same. The OM trespassed on me to a point I wanted him dead, I wanted him to cry everyday for 90 days, he should suffer life like me. Did you not have those same kind of feelings? I got to a point those feelings are just not significant anymore and you can feel the same, making those feelings insignificant. Since you don’t track, that is trust whether you know it or not. You don’t need any more information about his failures. You are now months away. He is going to misbehave if he wants. Lift yourself out of your misery so you too can be in a fruitful life with a few actions everyday. You can do things that will make you feel different. I love you Laura. Imagine that? a man half way across the world loves you. Why? for all your art, your kind words, the things you said to me when I was down, unclear, waffling.. It’s been a while since you shared feelings about yourself here. It is valuable and I respect your feelings. You are giving to us a precious gift and that is meaningful.

Your H obviously is not giving you something you need. What is it is the key toward resolution and far greater feelings.


Posts: 2636 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Indiana
hopeandchange
♂ Member
Member # 33287
Default  Posted: 8:45 AM, February 15th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Now don't get me wrong. I keep my eyes open - I will never be fooled again, believe me. I maintain access to her passcodes and phone records. I'm not stupid
.

Turst. My view.

On DDay2, W gave me complete access (passwords) to email and phone accounts wanting to be completely transparent. It took several weeks before I even attempted to open one of her accounts. When I finally did open her email, I added a filter (obvious to her) that would forward any communication between W and OM. Went back into the accounts a few more times and 3 months after DDay2, I have not been back at all.

I made the choice to trust. I decided it was not worth the misery I would feel checking up on my W nor the misery it would cause her to be checked up on by her husband.

Stupid? IMO - no; I have chose a way to live that does not add more negativety than already exists.

Will I be fooled again? No. I have felt great shame that my W chose to have sex with someone other than me; the feelings of being inadequate, not good enough, not the best. IMO it is the choice to cheat that makes a fool out of the WS and not the BS. If my W ever chooses to cheat again, it will be her character that is damaged - not mine. I will feel the pain of being betrayed (again), I will have learned another unpleasant and unkown (today) aspect of who she is, and I will continue on in my life the best way that I can. I will not consider myself "a fool" for having worked on R with her.

That said, yes there are times when I wonder "where is she, is she being honest). These feelings have ebbed over time but still exist. But TRUST is allowing my W the freedom to enjoy her life without me verifying what she is doing. My view.

h&c


BH (me, 50)
WS (her, 48)
Divorced!
3 wonderful teens
Heading for Happiness

Posts: 401 | Registered: Sep 2011
hopeandchange
♂ Member
Member # 33287
Default  Posted: 8:50 AM, February 15th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Quick note - W and I had a good Valentines Day. Simple. Exchanged texts wishing each other a wonderful Vday. Exchanged cards with notes stating our love for the other. Attended "flash mob" party raising awareness of violence against women around the globe, dinner with our DD and DS. A very nice day / evening.

h&c


BH (me, 50)
WS (her, 48)
Divorced!
3 wonderful teens
Heading for Happiness

Posts: 401 | Registered: Sep 2011
trynhard
♂ Member
Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 9:30 AM, February 15th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

RSEB
I can admire your courage sending that message to OM’s W. As hard as that must have been, it was good. One of my lowest days was about this very subject. I was trying to force my W to apologize to OM’s W. Perhaps something I needed this to happen to me. My W’s OM saw my best friend at a restaurant. He made a point to come up to may friend and told him he was deeply sorry for all he did. I suppose that was his way to send me a message. I accept that. He has nothing else of any value to say to me. He is not longer in my world.

You did something that was very powerful many of us cannot do.. You stayed in the frame of goodness. You can look at yesterday as why am I so offended about a simple day, a one day event? Did he misbehave? Yes. I am not sure if you gave your H some pressure about his misbehaving yesterday. It sound like you avoided it. Sometimes, we all need to just not say anything until the time is right. The phase one I have discussed with you is showing him what he will be missing should he continue to misbehave.

I will say this about my M. My own silence was my own enemy. I suppose because the things I always said were hurtful so I avoided it as a protection to me and my W.. Arguments happen in all relationships and will pass, but hurtful words stay forever. To argue not saying hateful things is talent. A learned talent. If your family was not this family, you cannot learn it in youth. It must be learned later in life.

As for your apologizing.. Many books will tell you get ready to say you are sorry many times. My wife said it many times without reading a book. My wife gave me apologies with great feeling only three times. One was shortly after my own reality was exposed, one at Retrouvaille, and the other I cannot remember now.

Forgiving, as I have told you, is for those betrayed not to make those who betrayed us to feel guilty. It is the betrayed person who does not make YOU feel guilty, bad, and bring on those feelings in YOU. For all kinds of brain chemical and electrical reasons, as we work through our grief, the betrayed minds need to process it. It is those continuous thoughts that repeat thousands of times. Each time it happens, the impact is less and less even though so minuscule. I think it took me 42 months to really accept. To control our own minds is not easy. The value of SI, IC, therapy and other groups is for us to vent here and not in the presents of our spouses. Someone like your H does not have those outlets to vent. His vents make you feel guilty. It is important in all R to have a vent. But vents to you violates forgiving and is not for the greater good of the M.

You are now years out. Your H has not made the progress on his own because he avoids, his personality type, his way of doing things. He is just not what I considered a healthy quality man. It seems he tries, but if he is not making the effort, he is not going to change. He is not much different then me months ago.. it is all about fear.

Me, 7years, ats, dp and maybe H&C to name a few, are at places where we know with certainty we don’t need any woman to complete us. Your H is not here. He has yet to vision his life can be happy without you. He is still a victim of those famous last words, “I do”. He has not had.. enough. He is still in his grief lost with no one to guide him, support him, or lead him. Does he need a mentor? Yes. Can you force one on him? No. It is the way he deals with conflicts in his life. It is the way he learned.

Fear kept me in my M. I feared and my W feared. We both never got to a point where we had enough. I sense your close to disqualify your H, your having enough. Your M is still salvageable until one of you finally has.. enough. Will that be you or will that be him? You can lead him to having “enough” in a way that might reverse the direction along the way. He might just make a choice to give reciprocity and end is grief.

I cannot tell your future as to what may happen, but I can give you a way for you to reach your own happiness. You will come out on top one way or another because you will “get it”. You do things for the good of the M.. even if it means a conflict.

It is not that hard once it sinks in. You love to the best of your ability. Love is all those things I have motioned, they are written about the book “The Five Languages of Love”.. the list is hundreds. You control your feelings in a very strategic, calm, non rattled way to the best of your ability. You learn to communicate in a safe, direct, non-hurtful way to the best of your ability. You understand when others misbehave, you take a stand, and the best way is to add very light loving pressure, adding more and more until the misbehaving stops. And if other cannot, will not stop misbehaving, you love yourself enough to say.. I have had enough. A theme.. I am going to live my life in the highest of integrity, I am patent, nice, giving, and anyone who treads on my goodness will not longer be part of my circle of goodness.

So, what your guys doing Friday night?

[This message edited by trynhard at 9:47 AM, February 15th (Friday)]


Posts: 2636 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Indiana
trynhard
♂ Member
Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 9:52 AM, February 15th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

hopeandchange

Good for you.. My W tried to give me a test by saying let's not do anything for V-Day.. Let’s just spend an evening together.

So I bought some chocolate and strawberries, fixed them dipped in the chocolate. A card and a plant.. gave my DD one too.

She came home to see that stuff with just a card for me. I got a big smile.

Yep, I passed the test.

Trust, I’m with ya H&C.. fooled again? I doubt it. I will know far in advance before I get tricked. I will know because my W will not be loving me the way she is suppose to be loving me.

[This message edited by trynhard at 10:34 AM, February 15th (Friday)]


Posts: 2636 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Indiana
gotta2know
♀ Member
Member # 37115
Default  Posted: 11:43 AM, February 15th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I had the most miserable Valentine's and I deserve it. I am really down on myself today and am embarassed at what I tolerate from my husband.

We said twice in the night "Happy valentine's" and had sex 1 of those times. I got up in the morning and served him oatmeal in bed with a single rose. I planted 4 other roses around the house with a nice note attached to each one. He thanked me and I went to work.

All morning long I thought I would get a nice note from home, flower, etc. Nothing all morning long. I know he was tied up working but I thought he had a minute to send a nice note. When we argued at some point in the past I complained about getting flowers on the required days and that I wanted them on random days, so I guess I deserved it. I just wanted him to want to do it for me from his heart knowing it would please me anyway. Can't complain too much about that one I guess I did it to myself.

Anyway, we met for lunch late and I was already hurt. He knew it and held my hand a couple of times but I am missing so much that he just can't fill it and doesn't even want to know where I need filling. I had probably sabotaged this day by setting expectations he didn't necesssarily know about.

Last year we had 2 Valetine's. We had an early one because he was going to be out of town for Valentine's. Then I busted him having contact so he rearranged plans to be home for Valentine's. Then he went out of town and met her anyway. Valentine's is hard for me! In addition to that I heard him a month ago talking about how he loves her. He doesn't know I've seen the letter talking about leaving me in 1 1/2 years. Yesterday was miserable!

After lunch he was mad at me for ruining lunch. We were supposed to go to our son's basketball game but he came later and didn't sit by me because I was disappointed with the lunch and him being late for the game. After the game he texted me that he wouldn't be doing anything for Valentine's with me.

He called me while I was driving and I asked him if he wanted to be married or not. If we are divorcing we need to start talking about how we are splitting up things.

I went home and cried. He told me he was getting a hotel for the night. He asked me how to split things up and he offered to take the debt, leave me the kids and house. He left. I didn't call him! He came back home in an hour and sat in the living room pouting.

I left to pick up our son and was going to a local basketball game. He sent me nasty notes and I stooped to asking him to come to the basketball game. He did.

We sat through the game together, had our son go home with our daughter and went out to eat. It was late so there wasn't any nice places to go. We sat at Friday's barely speaking. He told me he was sleeping in the spare room.

Got home, he went to the spare room. I poked my head in and invited him to our bed and left. About 4am he was in the living room and I wasn't sleeping so I got up and started some laundry. We had a few nasty words and I went back to bed. He came in later proposing we divorce because there was just no other way. I didn't say anything just laid there and cried. He walked out of the room. He came back in about an hour, touched me and said he was sorry things didn't work out. I just said it's ok. He laid there for a bit longer and then started touching me til we had sex.

This whole things is psycho! I am so angry with myself for putting up with his crappy behavior to me. He calls me names. He says mean and hateful things to me. Tears me down to a worthless nothing.

I know I wasn't the best wife before this happened but I have honestly tried since his affair. I have pointed out to him many, many times that he hasn't given our marriage a chance in hell since I found out because he's kept her in the picture. He doesn't even come close to getting it. I was so wrong, he is not a quality man anymore. He is nothing but a lying, cheating bastard who is getting away with it. He can turn things on me and say such mean and hurtful things without a bit of regret.

He will never be able to fill the holes he has dug out of my heart, he doesn't care enough to. I am so damned mad that I let him treat me this way. I wouldn't treat a cock roach the way he has treated me. I didn't beg for the marriage but I did say I don't want to fight. Neither one of us is begging for the marriage. We both say we don't want to live this way. How awful it must be for him to have 2 women at his beck and call. How awful it must be to have a woman by his side that lets him treat her the way he does, begging for any crumbs he will give.

I am worthless today. Today is my dad's birthday, and probably his last, I am going there tonight to spend the quality time with him. I will salvage myself enough to get through it but damned I don't want to live like this anymore. I just can't. However, what changes do I make? None, absolutely none!

Thanks for listening.


BW - 46 (me)
WH - 46(repeated cheater, cake eater)
Married 17 years
DD 4/8/2011 and many more
3 children- 22(mine), 16 and 13
Living in misery trying to understand why I choose to do so.
I like the saying "feel the fear and do it anyway!&

Posts: 165 | Registered: Oct 2012 | From: SD
RSEB
♀ Member
Member # 34728
Default  Posted: 11:46 AM, February 15th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Trynhard,

Thanks again for your advice, always SO thought provoking.

As far as what we are doing tonight? Nothing. As I said our DS has baseball tonight and I knew we wouldn't have a sitter.

I could try to get my Dad for tomorrow...but I can't motivate myself to do it. My BH is in such a crappy downswing again today, judging by his texts that I don't want to waste my Dad's time to come here, go out spend the money and me just sitting there full of resentment and him still just trying to push down and avoid his anger.

Do you know what I have been thinking about? In all our years together, I am the one who has ALWAYS made the effort. I have been the one to make things special and cozy. My BH is the one who has gone along for the ride. I heard him once when we were dating tell a friend of his that if it weren't for me (FWW) trying and putting in so much effort, we wouldn't be where we were. My BH swears he was wonderful that he was happy, he thought things were great. I have told him in MC, yeah sure, as long as FWW did what BH "expected", dinner was on the table, his breakfast and lunches were packed, house was clean, DD was taken care of, yes things were wonderful. But if FWW started to "slack off" there was hell to pay through verbal arguments and abusive language. So FWW hated that and quickly and quietly did everything she could to avoid those "problems".

So now here we are, BH is DEFINITELY not happy...so is he getting up off his butt to try and figure out how to change his outlook? No he still flies off the handle, takes our whole family down with his lows when he gets into his moods, and god forbid FWW as he puts it "stresses his out" well he just can't handle it.

Well the problem is, FWW is still here, she no more tricks up her sleeve. She has gone the 99% for 1186 days and plans to continue on that path, but God FWW is tired. And when I'm tired, I feel the resentment, but I don't have the right to feel that resentment because of "what I did"...that is where the feeling of having no rights comes into play again.

I am searching within myself to reach deep down and get that strength to rise above all these horrible feelings, but I don't think it is coming before tomorrow night.


ME - FWS


Posts: 259 | Registered: Feb 2012
Laura28
♀ Member
Member # 28997
Default  Posted: 3:45 PM, February 15th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

TRYN

You can do things that will make you feel different. I love you Laura. Imagine that? a man half way across the world loves you. Why? for all your art, your kind words, the things you said to me when I was down, unclear, waffling.. It’s been a while since you shared feelings about yourself here. It is valuable and I respect your feelings. You are giving to us a precious gift and that is meaningful.

I love you too TRYN. I love this whole tribe. I feel closer to all of you than to anyone IRL at this time.

I SSSHHHHHH you because I cannot do what you suggest. Your wise counsel has helped me and so many others so much. I WANT to do the things you suggest, and FEEL more positive about our M but I just can't.

I sat in Mass the other day and thought it would be so much easier if I could forgive. It would be so much easier if I could trust. But I just don't have it in me at present. And this frightens me in some ways more than the thought of another OW. I don't want to be this person. I know you say people can change. I want to change. I just hope this is the TIME factor.

It's a little like those early days when I had uncontrollable rages or sobbing fits. I hated that. But I couldn't stop it. Now they have pretty much gone. It didn't seem to matter how much I tried to stop them - I just couldn't. They eased off and eventually stopped with time. I can only hope my current feelings will also get better in time.

RSEB

I shared my feelings because your H may be like me. It is hard to describe the powerlessness I feel. Like your H I also feel like my life was destroyed by my FWH's actions. I know all about starting a new M but the reality is it all happened. You can't take away the past. I think you just have to learn to live with it. That is my struggle.

I can also relate to your "silent" V day evening. I said earlier that FWH took me to dinner. The restaurant was lovely, the hosts friendly and the food was very good. We talked a little about everyday things. I was tired from a busy day at work but tried to be upbeat. FWH chatted to the hosts and was often distracted by a TV on the other side of the room. He didn't mention the As. He could have. He could have said "I am really sorry and I am so glad we are still together for this V day". That would have been enough. That would have been all it would have taken to make my evening. But he didn't.

RSEB

Don't ever stop saying you're sorry. Say it every day.

Say it like you mean it but don't expect a response or discussion. I don't want to talk about it every day. There is no need to. But I do want FWH to acknowledge the pain I live with every day and he could if he did that. Perhaps if you accept his feeling that his life has been destroyed (I know you do but he also needs to know this) then he will feel better and that will help you both.

BIG HUGS to all

Laura


Married 30yrs Me BW 57Yrs Him FWH 59yrs
OWzero 1988 EA?/PA? Gaslighted.
Dday May 28 2010.
OW1 1994(6mths PA, EA til dday).
OW2 2002(8yrs PA).
OW3 2009(1Yr PA).
Others???? Status: Not Divorcing..but.."You can't unfuck the goat"

Posts: 2729 | Registered: Jul 2010 | From: Australia
njgal480
♀ Member
Member # 24938
Default  Posted: 3:52 PM, February 15th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

RSEB-

I'm a little disappointed that you said this:

"I could try to get my Dad for tomorrow...but I can't motivate myself to do it."

" My BH is in such a crappy downswing again today, judging by his texts that I don't want to waste my Dad's time to come here, go out spend the money and me just sitting there full of resentment and him still just trying to push down and avoid his anger."

You're projecting what he will say and how he will act.
You really can't say for certain how he would react to a date night that you had planned.

I'm also surprised to read that you are not motivated enough to organize your father as a babysitter and are worried about spending money on dinner or a movie.

(Do you realize how expensive divorce is? You would be spending thousands per month to support two households.)

A few dollars on a dinner or movie is not much if it helps to heal your marriage.

And the worst case scenario is that you go out to a movie and he stays depressed.

So what? at least you get out, see a movie...and maybe...he will respond positively to the effort that you made.

If my FWH had not pushed through despite all of my bad moods and continued to try to organize fun trips and date nights etc. we would most likely not be reconciled today.


Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA
Reconciled.


Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
Laura28
♀ Member
Member # 28997
Default  Posted: 4:13 PM, February 15th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

RSEB

During my FWH's affairs I was you. I was the doer, the problem solver, the fixer, the caregiver to everyone, the placater when arguments began, the bill payer, washer woman, cleaner, and worst of all the backup sex partner. FWH did nothing. He was lazy, irritable, the problem causer, the one who started arguments, never cleaned up after himself and yet whined if anyone else left a mess, and a selfish sex partner. I kept thinking that if I did everything BETTER he would be happier and our M would be better. I had no chance because he put his efforts into his OWs. I resent that.

I was the one who should have had the A.

Now he has changed. He takes his share of everything and rarely starts an argument. His actions are now "loving" the M.

I don't know what you can do. Tryn has given you excellent advice but in a weird way I can see myself in your sich. For more than 20 years I did what you are doing now. I tried to make the M work by doing everything right. It got me nowhere.

Now I know what was happening I wish I hadn't wasted my life and efforts on him.

I hope you don't waste too much of your life on your H.

God FWW is tired. And when I'm tired, I feel the resentment, but I don't have the right to feel that resentment because of "what I did"

I think you have every right to feel resentful. The behaviour he is exhibiting is the same as when you were in the A and he didn't know. Knowing what you did does not give him a free pass to be a pig.

After I found out, I kept trying. But FWH started to try to and that is the only reason I stayed. I was hurt and yes I had sobbing fits and rages but between those I tried.

Funnily enough I was already planning my exit before dday. Not because of infidelity (I was clueless) but because he was a pig.

He begged me to stay and changed. So I thought "I will follow the SI advice and give it time". But you can only give your sich so much time.

HUGS

Laura


Married 30yrs Me BW 57Yrs Him FWH 59yrs
OWzero 1988 EA?/PA? Gaslighted.
Dday May 28 2010.
OW1 1994(6mths PA, EA til dday).
OW2 2002(8yrs PA).
OW3 2009(1Yr PA).
Others???? Status: Not Divorcing..but.."You can't unfuck the goat"

Posts: 2729 | Registered: Jul 2010 | From: Australia
trynhard
♂ Member
Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 7:57 AM, February 16th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

gotta2know
He laid there for a bit longer and then started touching me til we had sex. This whole things is psycho!

I must say.. You are crazy gotta.

Your sex is not going to get him back. Get that out of your mind. It is exactly the opposite of what you needed to do.

“Honey, I want you to be of comfort to me, but it cannot be with a third person in our M. When you give me solid proof, without a doubt in my mind, she is gone forever, only then am I willing to give you my sex”

Be a value woman today… It is not hard… It's real easy say to him…

“I am not as stupid as you think I am. I want our marriage, but you having OW around will get you exactly what YOU want, not me, A divorce. Just go file.” No argue, not debate, no sex, matter of fact.. No throwing things...

Should he start to lie..

YOU LOOK AT HIM IN THE EYES.. wait a few about 30 seconds.. "Go ahead and lie to yourself." Calm, collected, confident, rock like.. YOU BE THE ROCK!

You have a scared little weak man. As weak as they come in life. Force him to make a choice. It will be easy if you let it be easy.. Keep it simple. Just do it. No argue, matter of fact. You have proof, don't justify it, just say it like you know it, no proof needed because he has the proof already in his weak mind. Act like you know, not debate about it.

Like the smoker who says.. I am not ready.. I'm just not! OK then.

Heck, the worst that can happen after a few month is your own peace will come. You won't have to think about what the hell he is doing. You won't care. You will have a neat peace and your good will come. Never know, maybe a biker chick is attractive to a man.. Your sex must be pretty good since your man can't dump you... You are pretty hot huh? Plus a smart business woman! what the hell more does a man want? You don' even need a man. You can do all this on you own.. Yep.. you have everything to gain and nothing to lose.

[This message edited by trynhard at 8:24 AM, February 16th (Saturday)]


Posts: 2636 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Indiana
trynhard
♂ Member
Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 8:29 AM, February 16th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

RSEB.. you must take your time. Take one bad behavior at a time and lay on the pressure. You had a great chance V-day. But so what, more good chances will happen. It takes about 3 months for a man to change. But I am more about changing YOU so YOU are happy. You are not going to be happy with a man not doing his part in the M. Maybe, he never did.. No wonder some other man tricked you into beleiving he was more worthy of your sex and partial love. It just is the way it is..

He is critical? Maybe that is what you work on now.

Be ready when the timing is right and he is critical. You are going to lay the wood to him. But, you do it in a good way.. Safe way, like I describe.. Now go practice for when the time comes. If you want write one out here... let's look at it. If not, I don't think that moves things foward.. but not my choice to make.

[This message edited by trynhard at 8:38 AM, February 16th (Saturday)]


Posts: 2636 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Indiana
RSEB
♀ Member
Member # 34728
Default  Posted: 9:23 AM, February 16th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Good Morning everyone,

Laura, Nigal and TrynHard, and everyone else...thank you ALL for your words and guidance again. I am taking it ALL in. Your words are invaluable. I had such a horrible thought this morning, imagine SI would suddenly just shut down, cease to exist. I don't know what I would do facing all this without you. THANK YOU SO MUCH!!!

I just wanted to check in quickly to update. Today is quite busy for us.

Nigal, After I had posted my post about "not having it in my to go out", I sat around for about an hour, regrouped myself and called my Dad. I did set a plan for us to go out for dinner tonight. I too started to realize that my BH and I would need a night for ourselves, and it was my job to make sure we get it, to make him realize my love for him, just something a little special, a few stolen moments for us to share. Then I logged on an read your post. It made me smile, and realize I had made the right decision.

My BH came home from work last night. He gave me another huge hug, said he was happy to be home. He said he "hates the outside world".I think when he is not with me, it makes him think too much. It upsets him.

Then he came over to me and surprised me with a little box of my favorite chocolate covered caramels from this little shop around here. It was wonderful. He said my calendar must be wrong and that today is Valentine's Day. lol So our whole family went to watch our DS play basketball last night. It was a fun evening.

Sadly this morning it is snowing here and that would involve my Dad, who is a bit older now driving in not to safe conditions, so we are going to have to postpone our romantic date night, but we have already decided to hang out all of us together for the day and go out tonight with the kids. I am looking forward to that as well.

It is funny this rollercoaster ride we are all on, but I will continue to hold on to the "highs" as tightly as I can.


ME - FWS


Posts: 259 | Registered: Feb 2012
Brandon808
♂ Member
Member # 35619
Default  Posted: 9:42 AM, February 16th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I don't think I've posted here yet. Sometimes I forget that my xww's A qualifies me for this thread. Almost wonder if there needs to another one for A's that started before the M and lasted throughout the entire M.

RSEB - Glad to hear about your BH's surprise. Sounds like he considers coming to you a refuge from the outside world. It also sounds like he may some issues with depression. His rigidity in not changing and his insistence in not facing his A before you M'd makes me wonder if he is suppressing some feelings of responsibility for your LTA?


xBH
D final 8/2012

Posts: 3365 | Registered: May 2012 | From: southeast
m334455
♀ Member
Member # 26893
Default  Posted: 3:17 PM, February 16th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Laura, it WOULD be easier on you if you could forgive. However, you can't until you can. However, I noticed the same theme with you, RSEB and gotta -- a power struggle and letting someone else's behavior and mood control your emotions.

This is reactive behavior and codependent. Any time you think "I wish that he..." You could consider turning that into an "I think that I..."

And once you've had some practice expressing your "I think that I's" to yourself, to us, in a journal, etc. you need, in all fairness to express those things to your spouse.

You can observe what you see in your partner, you can de decide what you need and want from a partner, you can express to your partner your needs and wants -- but you have no control over whether or not a partner who is not meeting your needs steps up to do so.

Life is unpredictable, as we all know, and some of us in this world respond to that by trying to control outcomes. For example, before I even finished typing the previous sentence Paddy ran up and hugged me and screamed "Boo!" Loud enough in my ear to hurt.

When you give up your illusion of control over anything other than yourself it's beneficial. I can set goals, work towards them, hope they are not frustrated by outside sources and manage how I react if they are. That's about it.

When you start owning your own truth and expressing it unemotionally, that's the extent of anyone's true power to control anything.

Laura, you tried to control by being a "good wife". I get that -- I was a super-cool wife. I still do that a bit (Super Bowl?!) but I have no motives attached to it now like I used to. RSEB -- you were also being "good wife" but when you couldn't take it anymore you checked out and found an AP. Gotta -- you basically have battered woman syndrome. If you're just THIS much more compliant things will get better. Not true. In reality you're just getting crushed like a bug. Keep going to IC -- you can break out of that and feel much better.

For each of you -- only you know what you want -- I'll use RSEB as N example; maybe you want your BH to get AD's or see an IC or plan outings for you, etc.

Oh, and RSEB -- never contact the "friend" BW ever again. First of all, it's an indirect OM fix/guilt assuage, and on Valentine's?! Really?! So selfish. Second, just because she was gracious doesn't mean she felt that way. So help me God if I ever hear from or run into my WH's LTA OW again I'm going to beat the crap out of her. Just leave her alone.

Njgal -- other than that, I am pretty peaceful. Starting to feel the strain of 4 months off work (financially) but I'll be going back in A few more weeks ( and I suppose they'll decide whether to fire me or give me double secret probation shortly thereafter.)


BW 38, 5 kids
Dday Dec. 2009

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