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User Topic: Long Term Affairs - Part 31
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Default  Posted: 10:25 PM, March 2nd (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

iwantamir: I am going to rescue trynhard on the point related to me.

The 'promiscuous' comment from Part 30: I am 1 year from dday, not 3 months, and it was a shitty thing for me to say as it was about something before my wife and I met not about the A. I did owe an apology due to the circumstances.

I am not a marriage counselor. I chose "MC Jack" in the spirit of a handle like "MC Hammer" or Young MC"...there is a lot of 'rapping' here, no? At the time I did not know what MC stood for on this site. Duh.

Posts: 792 | Registered: Mar 2012 | From: West Coast of Hopa-hopa-land
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Default  Posted: 10:51 PM, March 2nd (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

mc, i stand corrected...i did only skim...whilst i got the promiscous comment mixed up, smitty did post something where tryn gave him some advice that was a bit rushed for a newbie.......and his dday was in dec.....and that was what i was trying to refer to......

as for your comment to your wife then, as long as you are in part 2 where you are actively reconciling, then yes its a comment that would not help that cause....and just because you are just over a year out does not mean that you have reached that point in your process...

my own process has been quite long, and while i decided and made the choice not to reconcile after 6 months i still had so much information never mind the history that no longer existed to process.....i had been a walking living breathing zombie for quite sometime....

the first counseler that i saw, was the marriage counseler at first...said it perfectly....i had suffered my own personal 9-11.....and thats not something you just get over....look at our country trying to get over the reality of 9-11...we are still healing, i still don't look at planes the same, and living in New York i honestly still think about it quite often even though i was not directly back to the comparison...i was directly affected as was and will be my not a day goes by where its not at my forefront of my mind at least not yet...i am working on it step at a time....and i am over 4 years out...

i thinks its wonderful if you are in part 2 and have been able to process through part bravo....

i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
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Default  Posted: 12:27 AM, March 3rd (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

FnF: It's good to see you. I hope things are going well with you.

SisterMilkshake: Thank you for your kind words.

UKgirl, I'm so glad to see you vent. You have been holding a lot in for soooo very long.

You are right, there are many, many BS's who did little or nothing to contribute to the decay of the marriage. Many of us tried in our own way to "fix" our M before DDay, not knowing what was wrong. What I meant, though, that when both parties are in the second stage, as Miracle said, they need to work 100% and both parties, including the BS needs to see what different ways they can work out the new marriage. For example, I tended to do everything and never ask for help and then get resentful. Then when I was finished, WH would say "do you need any help?" That would only get me more upset. I have learned that if I need help, I ask for it and not get resentful. I can only control myself.

I have also learned that I cannot make WH love me, I cannot control him, no matter how good I am, no matter what I do, or what I did, it couldn't change him. Ats' post to me a while back saying that I cannot "nice" my way back into a M is spot on.

Miracle: It's good to see you again. We missed you and your wisdom. You are in my thoughts and prayers as you go forth on your journey.

It's a long, long process to heal, especially from a LTA.

We are all at different stages. Some of us need to vent in a safe place, some of us need hugs and support, some need advice. We have always been a family here helping each other the best way that we can. The tribe here has literally saved my life many times and I'm forever grateful to all the wonderful people here.


Posts: 1903 | Registered: Jan 2010
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Default  Posted: 9:40 AM, March 3rd (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

But, there are always reasons people cheat.

The key in a happy life is to examine our own behaviors. To bury our heads and think there is never a cause and effect in every relationship is doing you a disservice. If you can somehow let yourself go, look at all the responsibilities and lay them at our own feet, want to change, you can empower yourself greatly. You are going to end up is a far better position. I can assure you, most people looking for something outside the marriage is doing this because they are not getting it inside the marriage.
MC_Jack you said you couldn't see what Laura was talking about and this is one post in particular that I feel may have made Laura feel unsafe and upset. This does sound a lot like blaming the BS.

Yes, my FWH wasn't getting his needs met in our marriage. Neither was I. I tried MC with FWH years before the affair. He claimed we were ganging up on him and he didn't get a chance to tell the MC how awful I was. He heard nothing the MC said.

Whose fault is it that a WS isn't getting their needs met in the marriage? In my case that falls squarely on my FWH's shoulders. He never talked to me. He expected me to read his mind. He also assumed he could read mine. He always "KNEW" what I was going to say and/or do.

If I tried to have a calm unemotional talk with FWH about our relationship and how my needs weren't being met, he would immediately get defensive and start yelling at me about all my shortcomings.

No, it was much easier for FWH to cast me in the role as the controlling bitch, and to succumb to some smelly twats ego stroking than to take a hard look at himself. I will shoulder no blame for that. I won't even shoulder the blame for the "decay" of our marriage. Everything I did was in direct reaction to FWH's actions and it was pure survival mode for me and my children.

The only blame I will accept is that I tolerated my FWH's awful behaviour. As Dr. Phil says "We teach people how to treat us."

BW (me) 50ish FWH 50ish
Married 34 years, 3 children
d-day 3/10 LTA (4 yrs./fucking & flirting)

"Oh, why do my actions have consequences?" ~ Homer Simpson
"She knew my one weakness: That I'm weak!" ~ Homer Simpson

Posts: 8975 | Registered: Nov 2010 | From: The Great White North USA
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Default  Posted: 9:48 AM, March 3rd (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I am going to share a post I made in General. It is still bothering me, and maybe some of you can help me get the right perspective on this.

I am sorry for being negative today. I am triggering (my stupid fault) and am feeling angry, hurt, hateful, and just really set back. Also, approaching d-day antiversary and apparently it is bothering me..... a lot.

This is something I felt I had accepted. Maybe this is common. You feel you have accepted something, moved on. And then it jumps up and bites you again.

We all "say" what the WS's and their AP's "had" wasn't real. Rainbow farting unicorns, soulmate shmoopies, fantasy bullshit and all that.

The fact is, what OW and my FWH had was real. No, FWH never "loved" or even "luuurrrrvvvvdddd" OW. He liked it a lot. He enjoyed it a lot. They had a real relationship. It was a NSA relationship, but it was a relationship. It was fucked up and dysfunctional and shallow, but it was real. This may not apply to many of you (ONS, short term A, prostitutes, serial cheater, SA) but to those who's WS had LTA's this is in, my opinion, true. FWH had a passionate, sexual relationship with someone else.

They did have "something". As OW so disgustingly had to point out it must have meant "something" for it to last as long as it did. Even if it was two pathetic people using each other, they had something. What is more is OW knows my FWH in a way I never will. OW has a piece of my FWH that I can never get back. A piece of my FWH's memories. Even if they are shitty, OW is there. OW has time that belonged to me. OW had passion and sex that belonged to me. That is all very real. OW is forever a part of our history, moreso FWH's.

Seems to be one of the reasons I can't seem to move on from OW. I just so want to throat punch the fucking cumdumpster. I want to smack the smirk off its slutty fucking face. The smirk of knowing my FWH in a way I never will. Of having some of my FWH. Of having secrets with my FWH that I will never know, not because FWH wouldn't tell me, he just has a bad memory and a different perspective. The smirk from knowing that my FWH thought so very little of me and my feelings that he humiliated me with a disgusting, immoral, lying, cheating slut. He showed OW that I wasn't of any value, whether he meant to or not.

FWH doesn't look back fondly at all on OW and what he did. He is ashamed and disgusted. But, the fact is, when he was doing it he was enjoying the hell out of it. No amount of shame and disgust is going to change that. He had an enjoyable relationship with the OW. Was it worth it? He would say no. Does that change the fact that he had passionate enjoyable sex? Hell no.

It is like the cake analogy that I came up with. You are very hungry. You go to a grocery store. You go to the bakery. You see a cake. It isn't even that great of a looking cake but you are very hungry and desperate. You want it. You take it. You go into a dark corner of the store and hope no one sees you eating the cake. You eat it all up. It was heaven, it was glorious, it was so fucking delicious. And, for extra thrills, no one caught you eating it and you didn't have to pay to eat the cake.

You are walking out of the store, feeling smug, satisfied and cocky. That is until the store detective taps you on the shoulder and invites you into the back room. You are busted and they throw the book at you. You have to go to court, it is humiliating. You have to go to jail. That sucks. Was it worth it? Hell no! Was that cake delicious, glorious, heavenly and did you enjoy it? Yeah, it was and you did.

There is absolutely no "unfucking the donkey" as deathbybetrayal so eloquently states. Will I get to the point of truly accepting this?

It has been three years since d-day.. I feel we are doing well. We are happy with each other. I feel I am going to be on the long end of the healing spectrum. *sigh*

BW (me) 50ish FWH 50ish
Married 34 years, 3 children
d-day 3/10 LTA (4 yrs./fucking & flirting)

"Oh, why do my actions have consequences?" ~ Homer Simpson
"She knew my one weakness: That I'm weak!" ~ Homer Simpson

Posts: 8975 | Registered: Nov 2010 | From: The Great White North USA
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Default  Posted: 10:09 AM, March 3rd (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

That's exactly how I feel, SisterMilkshake. Right down to your cake-eating analogy.

It was real. And it F'ing sucks.

♪I'm not fine; I'm in pain
It's harder every day ~ Maroon 5♫

BS:45 WH:47 needhelp123
8yr EA&PA w/MCOW emp/frmr emp
19y M * 25y T, 2 teens
DDay 12/31/12*5w TT
Sick tired sad

Posts: 273 | Registered: Jan 2013
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Default  Posted: 10:48 AM, March 3rd (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

my 18 cents. I have gained A LOT from the posts from EVERYONE on the LTA thread. It provokes thought, self examination, and has helped me tremendously in dealing with this trauma. And what a trauma it is. In order, the most devastating events in my life.
1. My W's A2. The loss of my vision.
3. The deaths of my two brothers.
4. The mental health of my brother and its devastating affects on him and our entire family.
5. My DD being diagnosed with JA. I really think this is No. 2 on my list but she deals with it so well, it is so easy to forget about it.

So now on to Tryin's advice. I have gained a lot of insight from it and I wnet back to the beggining of this thread and found these posts from Tryin.

We can be the most attractive person on the earth and still get cheated on. Why? Because some people are so greedy and selfish they can never be satisfied

I know this about me. When I accomplish something, it gives me great inner strength. And it was about me. It was a great discovery to the secret of the best possible M. I accept personal responsibility for my choices and actions. I lay blame at my own feet where it belongs. I look at only me and I let my W look at her. What could I have done differently? How can I be different today? To share my own discovery is wrong?

So, my take was that the WS is solely responsible for the A. Full stop.

And then, Tryin followed with this post noting that the BS was not "perfect" and can improve. And I agree with that - we can always improve upon ourselves.

And if it is implied that "if only the BS was better, then the A would not have happened". Well, utter nonsense. I was not a "perfect" H but I was good enough H, IMO, that my W could have honored her promise to be faithful and enjoy happiness in our M.

So if you were that attractive, where did you learn it? Can you make a list?

Yes, I could make a long list and will share a few things along the "Five Love Languages theme"
1. I wrote my W letters. Yes, letters telling her how wonderful she was and how much I appreciated her. I would travel on business, write a letter, and get it in the mail when I arrived at my destination.
2. I complimented her cooking. My W is a really good cook and prepares all of our meals. I make it a point to comment on most every meal.
3. I helped with Dinner by setting the table and then doing the dishes afterwards.
4. I learned how to give really good massages and offer back or foot massages on a frequent basis.
5. I give careful thought to gifts for her. When W was feeling down after repratriation from a foreing assignment, I arranged a surprise luncheon with her local friends.
6. I am attentive to her sexually. During her A, my W would still say "you are so good to me"
So. Affirmation, check. Services, check., Affection, check., Gifts, check. Uh oh, Communication. Still working on that one.

One of my W biggest complaints is that I "refused" to let her work when our children were young. I would just point out that there would be no financial benefit due to increased costs for child care and more income taxes and that it was wonderful that she could spend time with the kids. They all attended mothers day out 3 hours a day. Still, she was very busy and I did not fully understand.

Another of my W's "negative" memories was when I said "you should be more organized" as I helped her load her car and I had carried out items that should be loaded last, not first. Again, I did not understand how much effort she had put inot this and gave her a critical remark instead of a positive. (I had satyed home from work to help).

I was not (and never will be) a "perfect" H but will continue working on myself towards that goal. I was good enough that my W should not have had an A.


BH (me, 50)
WS (her, 48)
3 wonderful teens
Heading for Happiness

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Default  Posted: 11:09 AM, March 3rd (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thank you sister for posting your perspective.

I see things in the same way as you.

I am under no delusion that my WW and the MOM had a real, though constrained and limited, relationship. Constrained by the long distance. Limited by the f*cked up qualities of the MOM. But he is an expert in their field, and a whole lot of their "relationship" was work and career related. So I see that MOM leveraged a student/teacher power structure, he is probably an SA/NPD (his wife alluded to that to me). But that doesn't change what they had together. It only explains the limits. I will never be a surgeon so I will never be able to 'understand' my WW's stresses, etc. from her job. I will always have an empathy deficit to MOM since I don't have shared experiences in the field, even if his empathy was just to use my WW. Shame on my WW for being so stupid, and like you said, sister, communicating to MOM that I wasn't worth anything.

So now what? I wish we had an answer for us all. At least our WSs have the priorities right for now.

In terms of your assessment, an honest assessment accepted and forgiven is more powerful.

I am not a marriage counselor. I chose "MC Jack" in the spirit of a handle like "MC Hammer" or Young MC"...there is a lot of 'rapping' here, no? At the time I did not know what MC stood for on this site. Duh.

Posts: 792 | Registered: Mar 2012 | From: West Coast of Hopa-hopa-land
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Default  Posted: 11:11 AM, March 3rd (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I was good enough that my W should not have had an A.
And there you are taking responsibility, hope and change. Even if you were the worst husband evah your W should not have had an affair. ((((h & c ))))

cheerless ~ welcome to the tribe, sweetie! So sorry you have found yourself here. Share your situation whenever you are comfortable. Sometimes the LTA thread is a little slow, especially on weekends, and then other times it is almost impossible to keep up with. (((cheerless)))

iwant ~ yes, I miss the house decorating, too. Since I was first I assume I was the one to let you down on this thread. However, no one was decorating for awhile now, so I didn't think of it. I loved the house on the beach that Laura made with all our dreams.

BW (me) 50ish FWH 50ish
Married 34 years, 3 children
d-day 3/10 LTA (4 yrs./fucking & flirting)

"Oh, why do my actions have consequences?" ~ Homer Simpson
"She knew my one weakness: That I'm weak!" ~ Homer Simpson

Posts: 8975 | Registered: Nov 2010 | From: The Great White North USA
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Default  Posted: 12:26 PM, March 3rd (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

sending you a pm

[This message edited by njgal480 at 1:03 PM, March 3rd (Sunday)]

Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA

Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
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Default  Posted: 12:48 PM, March 3rd (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have not posted a lot in this forum, mainly because it is usually so long and I can't keep up with all the postings and different people and their perspectives. I thought today I would try and was a little stunned at some of the posts here.

A LTA to me is always emotional as well as physical on the WS and AP perspective. If it was just sex, it would to me just develope into a ONS, short affair, or prostitutes and then they would be on to the next one.

LTA's take lots of planning and lying on the WS and APs. It is not a spur of the moment thing that just happened. It is an ententional act upon the WS to get involved in a LTA and to keep it going on until they are caught, if ever. Was it caused by things going on in the marriage they are unhappy with, yes I think sometimes that is the case, sometimes not. We can debate all day on the true fault of the breakdown in a marriage to the point that someone cheats with an AP. But to me the bottom line is they choose to cheat and lie and to keep cheating and lying was their decision alone. The BS had no say so in this sitch, so how can he/she possibly be responsible for something he/she is not aware is happening. They want to do it so they do without the thought of the consequences to all those involved. If they were that unhappy why did they not come to their spouse and have a decussion rather than an affair. The affair to them was easier than discussing what was going on in their heads with their spouse.
I think this thread needs to be more of a support for the BS and helping the WS understand what they did and help them to figure out maybe why they did what they did and the damage that is caused by a LTA to a marriage. Not saying that EA, ONS, prositutes, etc are not just as damaging, but it is a totally different kind of damaging IMO. LTA have to deal with the EA as well as the PA over a long time. So much history is involved that a BS often questions their whole married life with this WS. Where to even start to try and put this puzzle together is such a long and painful process? Where does it end? Does it end? So many questions to be answered and often with spouses who have feelings for the AP. Can you win this game and if so at what price to your own integity and self respect?
I guess I just would like to see more support for the new BSs and to never give them a hint that an affair is their fault at all, no matter if their were problems in the marriage or not. I do not think that this in any way shows support, but is an excuse for the WS to justify their LTA. JMO.....(((HUGS)))

M-9 yrs T-11 yrs
4 children-none together
DD#1-9/5/11 LTA 2yrs
DD#2-7/3/12 False R
DD#3-4/29/13 (OW broke NC)
Status: Your guess is as good as mine.

Posts: 2420 | Registered: Aug 2012 | From: Texas
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Default  Posted: 4:33 PM, March 3rd (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage


there is good news and bad news.....the bad news...the road is long, the road is hard, the road is laden with many obstacle...the good news is that yes there is a light at the end of the tunnel....njgal is walking proof of that......and you will get there as long as 2 things take place....

the first...your ws does everything he can to show you who he is now without giving you grief about any of it......its really important that he understands that you need him to "get it", that you need to "feel" his remorse, "see" his remorse and finally believe his remorse

the have to want it, choose to do whatever it takes to achieve it and commit to it 100%.....

as for what the ws and the ap having a "real" relationship....all relationships are "real"...its their level of functionality or disfunctionality that determines their worth so to no affair has any does have destruction but no worth...kind of like a tornado or 9-11......lots of value..whereas a marriage has value, a marriage even if one partner sucks a moose egg has value......because a marriage is not meant by any party to destroy but to build one enters an affair to build upon it.....everyone including the ws enters a marriage to build upon it....

persepective is everything...yes what they had was real.....but it had no value and held nothing but destruction and the road to healing is long no matter which road you take...

and healing happens when you choose to heal, when you make choices everyday that lead you down the healing road!!! and yes its long, yes its hard and yes it sucks....but always remember somewhere in the recesses of your heart and mind that at some point in time there will be healing...

as for "we teach people how to treat us"....( i love dr phil btw),..i agree and that goes for ourselves too..we need to teach ourselves to treat our bodies and minds better...improve our inner dialogue to reflect what we dream, what we choose for our we often talk to ourselves dictates what we are willing to accept from others.....we have to change that inner dialogue to reflect that we are good people who deserve the best in all aspects of life....and thats where it starts..

so what will you start telling yourself about what you deserve, what you will accept and what you need and then choose to do what is necessary to achieve your goals

and finally goals...its so so important to have them and each time you reach a goal make a new one....make your choices reflective of these goals....and no goal is impossible, unless you make them so.....your goals need to be reasonable and obtainable not out of reach in the land of pipe dreams but in the land based in reality.......

you will get there sister, i have faith in you and others here as well......even myself...why because we don't just want it, but we act upon it....


oh and dont apologize for not decorating......not necessary to apologize for something that is not your fault..

so tribe how would you like to decorate this "house 31" this healing house....

laura if you are still reading at all i would be very appreciative if you could post that picture of all of us "oldies" and maybe the newbies can chime in...we should all have our "dreams" in view whenever possible and always set a tone for it

i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
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Default  Posted: 10:24 PM, March 3rd (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Sister: It is a very difficult thing to believe that a LTA was all sunshine and lollipops. It became part of the WS's lives and how they lived and made decisions which then affected the BS's life. Was it a "real" relationship? It was a LTA relationship, but how deep or much emotions were involved depends on the situation.

This is a tough pill to swallow. It hurts like hell, especially the reality that we believed for YEARS was all an illusion. Because it was a LTA, it takes a looong time to assimilate all the new information with what you thought was "real". Never mind the emotions that go along with it.
I really like your bakery analogy

Hopeandchange: I'm sorry to hear about the loss of your brothers and your daughter's diagnosis. {{{hopeandchange}}
It doesn't matter how good or bad a spouse we were, the A was wrong. There are plenty of spouses who are living with an alcoholic or a person who is emotionally abusive and don't cheat. NJgal's fWH was and alcoholic and she didn't cheat. My first xWH was an alcoholic who was never home and always in the bar and I didn't cheat. My current WH is emotionally abusive and has many, many Narcissitic Personality Disorder traits (with some Borderline thrown in for good measure) and I didn't cheat. Hell, most of the BS's here lived through hell and didn't cheat.

TrustGone: I agree, an LTA is different. Too much to process. Can you win at this game? Some scars are very very deep. If the WS is not 100% in to create a new marriage it is not possible to R. Someone said it here, perhaps NJgal, that if a WS just says they are remorseful and does not go to IC to see why they chose to have an A instead of trying to work it out with their spouse, it is like a "dry drunk", a person who just stops drinking but doesn't get to the underlying problems they were addicted in the first place and therefore can succumb to drinking again.
Also, because it's an LTA, a lot of questions will go unanswered because it was so long and part of the WS's life. They won't remember everything because it was so long. We will not get all the pieces of the puzzle, so we must decide what pieces are important for US to know. This is different for everyone.


everyone including the ws enters a marriage to build upon it.

I guess I know this deep inside and why I have such difficulty because that's what WH did with OW. How many times has he said, "She is my FULL wife!" So theirs was the REAl relationship, and I don't know what mine was.

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Default  Posted: 11:10 PM, March 3rd (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((honest)))....i am so so sorry for your pain...the truth is both relationships were and are real......what they mean though are different....he DID enter both to build upon.....your ws is one of those rare fucktards thats wants it all and has the audacity to go for it no matter who he hurts.....and honestly you don't know what goes on between him and wife #2.....she is second to you and frankly you both need to kick him to the curb......

you do not know what he has told her from the getgo he is a consumate liar.....and he lies to both of you....

even my ws entered my marriage to build upon......he just didn't want to give up his ow#1.......he was another cake eater....doesnt mean the relationships and marriage werent real, and most especially what i learned here was that it matters not what it was to him because it was real TO our entire marriage while was a lie, was a lie to them not to US...they were the liars.....and it is hard and it sucks to know that there is no point in either of our marriages where we were "it" and that our marriages were at least truthful at some point....but they were always truthful to and i were up front and married ...our marriages were real for us.....there is no reality there is only perspective, because what is real to you may not me real to me and vice versa...there are facts and then there is perspective of the facts.....

its time honest for you to move forward with YOUR life and make a new reality, a new present and an exciting future.....its time for your to decide, to choose and to commit as hufi always likes to say.....and YOU CAN DO THIS....i have faith in you....time for you to change your inner dialogue, you deserve sooooo much need to love yourself dear yourself enough!!!

i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
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Default  Posted: 2:53 AM, March 4th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage


I have received several pms from people about the current sich on LTA.

My response:

I loved the days when I felt totally supported. When no one suggested that my FWH's multiple LTAs were in part because I wasn't good enough. The LTA house has become depressing. It seems to be more about who is the best "expert" than being supportive of one another. I feel the humanity is missing. I guess I just yearn for the days of venting and having others support vents, of having some fun sometimes, of planning fantasy revenges, possible happy futures, sharing frustrations and fears and even the tears when R's looked like they were going down the gurgler. There were so many nights when I cried for my friends, hoped with them or laughed with them. I miss that.

I have also received several telling me that miracle is back and wants me to re share our favourite things and places.


You were my rock during my darkest days. You gave me courage, hope, taught me about putting on my bitch boots and finding my path of least regret. I will be forever grateful. These are for you and for my oldest and dearest and most supportive LTA friends. The ones who used to lift me up not bring me down.

We have had three floods in 5 weeks at our place:

Some of my birds have found shelter on my latest project. (I have gone from butterflies to birds to flowers)

And this is especially for my dear friend Dip. I almost used it once before but changed my mind. I hope you like it honey!!!




I recently was chatting to Strong. She is incredibly happy. She cannot believe how much and how quickly her life has changed for the better. She finds it hard to come back to SI as in her words "It was such a dark period in my life". So I promised to pass on a message:

Please pass along to the Tribe that I have a wonderful man in my life. Barely 2 weeks after my D was final I was introduced via e-mail to a friend of a friend. We hit it off on-line, met in person and now are totally infatuated with each other. It's hard to say why we connected so instantly but we did. He is very respectful of my relationship with my kids and is hesitant to criticize my ex other than to say that he would not have let me get away.

The bottom line is that he is pretty amazing and I feel very loved by him which is a new feeling for me. I am so very blessed to have found this man. He is a little older than me, but never been married. He laughs about how a confirmed bachelor became so intent on getting married! He is very romantic and is so incredibly generous. I receive white roses at least every other week, cards in the mail and then he'll sneak some into my bag when I'm leaving his place so that I find them as I'm unpacking. He's quite extraordinary.

Hope all is well with you. Please pass along my best wishes to the Tribe.

Strong and her new friend announced their engagement on Valentine's Day.

[This message edited by Laura28 at 3:07 AM, March 4th (Monday)]

Married 30yrs Me BW 57Yrs Him FWH 59yrs
OWzero 1988 EA?/PA? Gaslighted.
Dday May 28 2010.
OW1 1994(6mths PA, EA til dday).
OW2 2002(8yrs PA).
OW3 2009(1Yr PA).
Others???? Status: Not Divorcing..but.."You can't unfuck the goat"

Posts: 2729 | Registered: Jul 2010 | From: Australia
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Default  Posted: 6:24 AM, March 4th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I so love that beach house, Laura, thanks for posting.

I actually have tears flowing because I am so very happy for Strong. What a happy ending (beginning) to her story that who could even know when we all started back then in LTA. It wasn't even really that long ago and look how quickly everything has changed for her. Please pass on my most sincere wishes for happiness in her new marriage and congratulations!

BW (me) 50ish FWH 50ish
Married 34 years, 3 children
d-day 3/10 LTA (4 yrs./fucking & flirting)

"Oh, why do my actions have consequences?" ~ Homer Simpson
"She knew my one weakness: That I'm weak!" ~ Homer Simpson

Posts: 8975 | Registered: Nov 2010 | From: The Great White North USA
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Member # 37529
Default  Posted: 8:28 AM, March 4th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

The key in a happy life is to examine our own behaviors. To bury our heads and think there is never a cause and effect in every relationship is doing you a disservice. If you can somehow let yourself go, look at all the responsibilities and lay them at our own feet, want to change, you can empower yourself greatly. You are going to end up is a far better position.

I actually find the above statement very insightful and helpful to me a recent BS.

I can assure you, most people looking for something outside the marriage is doing this because they are not getting it inside the marriage.

This statement probably goes too far, I agree. However that doesn't make all the advise that is given bad.

Tryn I hope the last couple of days of posts on here have not scared you away. Often I have felt ignored in the LTA forum and not part of the group, except Tryn has read everything I write and responds with such great thought out responses. While I don't agree with every post I am able to form my own opinions on my situation with his insight. Don't stop the amazing things you do Tryn, you are appreciated.

BS - Me 38
WS - Wife 39
D-Day - Oct 12
Married 10 years
OM1 - 12-year LTA
OM2 - 9 month A turned into open relationship with couple for another 1 1/2 years

Posts: 405 | Registered: Nov 2012
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Default  Posted: 8:40 AM, March 4th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I just wanted to weigh in to support Laura and the others. I don't post on here much because I don't feel supported here and because some of the posts are so incredibly long that it's hard to follow them. So I give up because I can't do them justice. I have found the tone unwelcoming and I do feel that Tryn is dominating the board. I just don't want to deal with his "women are like this and men are like that" comments. These simply don't ring true for me and are distracting. offensive, and unhelpful. So I just don't participate. Early on, however, there were some very helpful threads, so I check in every once in awhile.

So many of us BSs - male and female -- are the giving, strong types. To some extent co-dependent. We soldier on stoically. My WH and I had a lot of external pressures during the time of his LTA: we were trying to get pregnant w/#2, which was difficult due to his inferility; he was unemployed for 2 years; #2 ended up having special needs; WS got a job, finally, but it was out of town, so I had to be a quasi-single mom, while holding down my own stressful job. During that period I gave, gave, gave. Supported my family the way I had to. (And my daughter, at six, is doing astonishing well considering she couldn't walk until she was 3 and had an autistic dx). So to say I needed to give MORE -- hell, no. Even my WH says there was not much I could have done. I'm not going to engage in a discussion about how that approach is completely irrelevant to my situation. I did the best I could reasonably be expected to do under very difficult circumstances. Obviously there are ALWAYS things we can improve and do better. But the main thing is for ME to be more demanding of my WH, not less. And this is true of many of us co-dependent, "strong" types, male and female -- we need to make the WS more aware of what they're taking for granted in their relationships. Typically they will be pretty clueless about all of this because they've lived so long in a selfish hole. You can't expect them to just step up. Hopefully they'll do that eventually, but the subtle approach -- the "nice approach" doesn't always work.

My WH knows that I want to make my M work, but he also knows I waver constantly in whether this is a situation I can live with. This may be taken as a threat by him -- I don't much care. It's my truth, and I am communicating it to him. And yes, it keeps him on his toes and that's a good thing. HE has to win me back and HE needs to make me feel safe. I also need to spend time healing and trying to feel good about myself again. So navel-gazing re how I could be a better wife to my WH... screw that. I have ALWAYS tried to be a good wife to him, and had he expressed any needs, I would have done my best to respond to them. I fact, throughout the M I probably erred too much in that direction and should have stood up for myself more.

OK, this is a bit of a vent and I think I'm done now.

BS (me): 49
WS: 50
Married: 25 yrs
Kids: 2
OW: Co-worker, 7 yr LTA
DD 8/1/2012, Working on R

Posts: 1035 | Registered: Aug 2012
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Default  Posted: 9:06 AM, March 4th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

But the main thing is for ME to be more demanding of my WH, not less.
This is what I need to do, also, Blobette. For far too long I allowed FWH to not pull his weight in this marriage and in his parenting.

BW (me) 50ish FWH 50ish
Married 34 years, 3 children
d-day 3/10 LTA (4 yrs./fucking & flirting)

"Oh, why do my actions have consequences?" ~ Homer Simpson
"She knew my one weakness: That I'm weak!" ~ Homer Simpson

Posts: 8975 | Registered: Nov 2010 | From: The Great White North USA
♀ Member
Member # 29288
Default  Posted: 9:58 AM, March 4th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I agree with the need to demand more and I am going to add another twist to it--demanding more from my FWH is what I needed to do to be a good partner in the relationship. I thought that I was doing him a favor by taking on as much of the family responsibility as I could, while allowing him to focus on his career. In retrospect, that was a mistake. It was too easy for him and his perfectionistic, obsessive personality to focus entirely on his job and not on his family. Big surprise when he didn't feel connected to me or our children anymore! NOT. That gave the OW the opening she needed to drive an even bigger wedge into our relationship.

I am a better partner now and a better steward of our M when I demand my FWH's attention when he drifts off a little too far into his career again. I won't back off this time when he says he needs to work. I am much more forceful now in saying he needs to spend time with me. He now agrees that our relationship is more important than his career. It was a tough way to learn that lesson, but we have both learned it. We have both improved as partners in the M.

Me--BW (56)
Him--FWH (53)--5yr. LTA--OW probably BPD
Married 19 years
DS-18, DD-14
Reconciling--but boy is it hard!

Posts: 1225 | Registered: Aug 2010
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