You have already told him what he needs to do. Stick to your guns and insist, not because it is "my way or the highway", but because there is so much evidence out there, on SI and from many other reputable sources, that what you are requiring is the only way that R can work. Staying for your DD, but holding resentment over it, will do nothing but cause more problems. None of you want to live like that. You know that, it is clear from your posts.
I have never had to deal with my FWH wanting to leave and be with OW, but I know that if I had, I would have been a mess. I am not sure that I would have had the strength to do as much as you have done so far. You have made a good start by laying your requirements out. You may take one step back for every two steps forward, but keep at it. Look back at what you have already done and be proud and take strength from it. Stop waiting for him to make a decision. You decide for you and your DD.
I am so sorry he is doing this to you. It is one of the worst cases of mental abuse I have ever seen on SI. To continue to stab you in the heart on a daily basis is beyond cruel and what he is putting your DD through is also abuse at it's worst.
You did the right thing in asking him for the things you did. His refusal to do anything should show you that he does not have you or your DD's best interest at heart. Have you read the "Hoover" thread? If not it may give you some insight into what he is doing at this point. He is deep in his "fog fantasy" and nothing will bring him out of it until he hits rock bottom. Much like a drug addict who has to hit rock bottom before they will seek help.
For now you need to calm down and put your priorities in order, which are to protect yourself and your DD for this continued abuse.
You should really tell the other BS. I know you don't want to inflict this pain on someone else, but they are in the dark right now, which to me is worse than knowing the truth. I have seen by telling the OBS sometimes helps bring them out of the "fog fantasy" they are in. No guarantees that it will do that with you WH, but they deserve to know. It often brings them out of "unicorn glitter shitting fantasy land" when they start seeing the consequences.
Undoubtably seeing you and your DD suffer is not enough for him to let go of the OW. You have got to start making him see the consequences of the pain he is inflicting on you and your daughter. Have you tried the 180? Not for him, but for yourself. This will help you detach and start building up your self-esteem. I am not very good with the 180 as a whole, but some of it has helped keep me sane, to let go of some of the pain, and to detach from the craziness of it all.
I know what you say about having a good marriage. We had a good marriage pre-A too. No one could believe that he would/could do this to me. Everyone was envious of our marriage and love for each other. It was/is devastating and heartbreaking to learn you really didn't have the great marriage that you thought you had and the person they appeared to be was not really who they actually were. (((HUGS)))
I bumped a thread in General for you to read. It is called "Hoovering-Don't Get Sucked Back In". Please read it. A lot applies to your situation, I feel.
"Oh, why do my actions have consequences?" ~ Homer Simpson
"She knew my one weakness: That I'm weak!" ~ Homer Simpson
I'm not making it. I heard a recording of my husband talking about how much she means to him and that she means more than I ever did I knew he loved her I just didn't realize the extent.
We are supposed to leave Thursday for our trip but I can't keep my big mouth shut. I have probably ruined the trip.
We are supposed to leave Thursday for our trip but I can't keep my big mouth shut. I have probably ruined the trip. We battled at lunch. I won't tell him all that I know.
Anyway, I have the divorce papers ready to give him. I just haven't decided when to give them to him.
5 days to go and it feels like forever. I really should have left him a LONG te ago.
Now, as soon as you get there, hand him the divorce papers. Fuck his trip up. Blindside him for a change. Thinks he is going to cake eat, fuck him. I'll bet he'll be squirming the whole time.
Then go have a fantastic vacay. Enjoy the sun and sand, read some fun novels, treat yourself to a spa day, do what you want to do and have a great time. (((gotta)))
Be on vacation by yourself. Take a taxi to Altos de Chavon. Buy yourself something nice. Start your new life in a nice place. We are all behind you and are happy to be a part of it.
Even though it doesn't seem like it you are doing well by standing your ground in your discussions with him and not letting him turn it back on you without fighting back.
Gather yourself back up and it's time to fight back figuratively speaking. I know you mentioned he didn't want anyone knowing about his A well time to start taking back some more of your power by outing him. You can start with the other BS. You know where he lives so go by when you know he is home and drop an envelope off with a letter outing the A and some evidence he can't ignore like copies of emails, texts, your WH's cell number so he can search his wW's phone for the number, etc. Also you mentioned that his parents are dependant on your family for income well you can out him to his parents since his A is jeopardizing their ability to live going forward.
Yes he will be mad but right now he is still manipulating your feelings to continue his cake eating. The next time he threatens to leave or do something drastic call his bluff and stick to your guns. If he offers to leave let him leave, help him pack some bags. If you aren't actually ready to follow through with it then just don't answer him. It will be hard because he will keep pressuring you but ignore his ass and let him make a decision on his own. If he leaves then go complete NC on him. Tell him it's time for him to make a decision, he is either in or out and if he feels resentment for staying then he can go. You aren't forcing him to stay. He only says that stuff because he believes you will back down.
The man you knew and fell in love with is gone. He is now a pod person. When he comes to talk to you picture him with a donkey's ass on his shoulders instead of his face or something so silly you can't help but not take him seriously. Change the ringtone on your phone so when he calls it makes a jackass/donkey call or something appropriate so you can prep yourself for the conversation if you choose to even answer.
My WW used to tell me she wanted to leave but never did. I told her to go. She decided to do just that by building her house and I didn't argue or fight with her one bit about it. Did it suck, sure, but I would rather be by myself with my kids focusing on me then with a person that doesn't truly respect or love me the way I deserve to be loved.
You can do this, take it one day at a time and keep posting it helps.
When I stopped the monitoring it helped me a lot. You know he is still involved in the A and have decided to file so perhaps still record if you feel the need but not listening will help you to detach some. I found it very hard to stop searching even after I had filed. It was like a habit I couldn't break but I felt so much better when I did. No new info means no new stabs to the heart. Even though you know it's still going on not actually hearing it may help.
[This message edited by 7yrsflushed at 3:44 PM, April 11th (Thursday)]
I am so sorry that he is treating you so badly.
Please reconsider and tell the OW's BS about the affair!
I really have a feeling that when her BH finds out about the LTA that things will change.
Her BH deserves to know and who knows how it will affect the the secret affair partners...
somehow miraculously ....when the affair is out in the open it's not as much fun.
And very often the affair ends.
There's no guarantee that is what will happen in your case.
but what have you got to lose?
At least you will have done the right thing and told the other BS.
If you decide to do this do not tell your WH your intentions.
Don't give him or the OW a chance to derail you.
Have you had a chance to find the book : Love Must Be Tough by James Dobson?
It gives good advice on dealing with a situation like yours.
gotta- I have mixed feelings about your trip.
My heart breaks for you.
On the one hand if this is a family trip and not something that you will ever be able to afford on your own...well, maybe go ahead and do what the others say-have the best time ever, ignore your WH, enjoy yourself in spite of him.
But, on the other hand, if you are devastated by this news and will be upset the entire time maybe it would be better for you to not go, confront him before the trip with all of your evidence.
do NOT tell him how you know, do not give up your sources
just keep telling him that you know everything.
(he will most likely assume you hired a PI).
At least this way -you will ruin his trip as well and you will begin your journey to a new and happier life.
He is so abusive I don't know why I'm even here.. I am angry as hell about things I've heard him say to her and he doesn't know I've heard. We have been fighting all day. I know I shouldn't even engage him at all because it is so over. His feelings for her are very intense and I heard him tell her he's never loved anyone more than her not even me.
He is now saying he doesn't want to go on the trip and that we are headed to divorce. He dictates to ME what he will and will not tolerate. We have lots of issues.
Idk it's so childish. He needs to just be honest but he is so far beyond being honest. He feels nothing for me is the real truth. He doesn't have any empathy at all for me. He is nothing short of mean.
I guess if we don't go we don't go. Get t over with quicker, right?
Keep you posted!
180, 180, 180! ((((gotta)))
I don't think he"s baiting me. It was quite a process for reservations, etc. since its international and it was all set up through his work. He is just an asshole of a cake eater. I have nothing to lose by filing. He is either going to pull his head out of his ass or he is going off for rainbows and unicorns. Either way I win. Either way it hurts I know ending this roller coaster will feel much better than riding this misery. I don't know why I feel so apprehensive. This is nothing short of hell.
I give all of you credit for working thru thia. if you were able to reconcile. There is so much to get over. At this point, I don't see him wanting to reconcile. He has no heart for me.
I am sitting with my dad who has brain cancer. I wish so much I could talk to him about this but it would hurt him to know I am not happy. I am just going to soak up his warmth. I love him so much! He is my man!
My WH gave me a nice (pah) hard shove about 8 months after Dday -- almost as bad. We'd been together about ten years at that point.
Anyway, if you do it, tune out his bitching as much as possible and just tell him You want a divorce? This is divorce. Welcome to Hell, jackass.
K -- apparently I'm really angry for you. I do angry pretty well. I've basically been enraged for 3 1/2 years now. Well, except for the 4 months last year that they just kept me heavily sedated...
Well, dear tribe, I have problems but they're not infidelity problems so onward I march. Have a blessed weekend all.
i am so so sorry for all your pain....you have been given great advice.....
he will not decide, you will have to....he really is not choosing, if he really chose her he would be gone and would welcome the bh being told...he is not choosing you then she would be gone....he simply is not choosing....he seems to be torn and afraid of losing both of you, or is feeling too guilty, but not guilty enough....
you need to choose...which i believe you already have.....you told him what you REQUIRE, he either meets it or he doesn't and honey i am so sorry he doesnt....
gotta: love sisters suggestion and even m3's suggestion....
well i say fuck the money and planning for the trip...do you what you need to do for you....you need to put yourself out a year from now...which decision would you have regrets about...going or not going...can you go and manage to have a good time...and for god sakes please stop monitoring, you already know what you are going to do...please stop torturing yourself..it serves no purpose anymore, you have enough validation to keep your stance....
I say send him on the trip, and get all his stuff out of the house and have him served when he gets back. I think your lawyer can get all that arranged while he's gone. Put it all in a storage unit and give him the key. If your lawyer gets the papers fixed up right you can change the locks and tell him not to bother coming home. Tell OW's BS too. If he does come home, call the cops and don't open the door.
Even if you can't or dont' want to do it Gotta, I think you should discuss it with your L. Just discussing it and hearing what the L tells you will be beneficial for you I think. I know hearing just what rights I did have and how things could turn out helped me greatly in taking steps towards filing and during. You build on each little step.
Now for a mini-vent. [vent]I am angry again and I can't pinpoint why. In general I think it's just wanted to be done with my situation and the frustration that I still have 2.5 months more to go with her in the house. For now I just ignore her or give her one word answers when she tries to talk to me but I get irritated that she is still even trying to talk to me. Being detached is awesome don't get me wrong but being detached allows you to clearly see the flaws in the person you chose to be with. I could see if she was actively trying to change but she isn't so she just becomes uglier to me each day. Not necessarily in the physical sense but as a person. The constant need for external validation is still there and once you know what to look for it radiates off of her. Stress just makes her pile more on top of it as well so it's getting worse.
She literally jumps from one thing to another chasing validation while she ignores the day to day stuff that she should be doing and there's the fact that this constant chasing is physically breaking her down. But she doesn't see that. I see the train wreck happening but can't or rather won't since it's not my job anymore try to stop it anymore.
I feel bad even complaining considering some of the in house situatons that I read about on this site. For the most part my life is fine even with her in the house. I am just so ready to go out and spend time with peopple that are normal. I don't necessarily mean date just be around normal people. I am not even trying to meet any new women now for one reason and that is how do I explain to a women in todays environment that yes, I like her and would like to spend time with her but by the way I am getting divorced and will be separating from my W in July of this year, until then we are still living in the same house. In my mind, that sounds like a scenario a guy trying to cheat on his wife would come up with.
Mentally I have already moved on but physically I am still stuck in the same situation and because I have morals, I get to delay trying to meet new people for 2.5 more months. The lawyer even told us that while she is NOT suggesting it that since we had signed the agreement, technically, we could date other people. She told us so we both knew that neither of us could later come back and try to change grounds to adultery. While I have no intention of bringing new people into my kids life for some time, in all honestly I won't date now because I know my W would do it and I couldn't handle her actively dating other people in my face. When she is gone she can do whatever she wants to do since I won't be around to hear or see any of it.
I guess I haven't had attention from someone that was generally interested in me for so long I am jumping at the chance to even have someone notice me and be able to act on it. But hey if 2 years can go by that fast then 2.5 months won't seem like an eternity right. [/vent]
Have a great weekend all go out and do something fun.
[This message edited by 7yrsflushed at 8:53 AM, April 12th (Friday)]
Good for you. Be strong, really try to not share any more stuff with the WH. My vote is that if you decide not to go on the trip, you go to the airport and hand him the divorce papers in the ticketing line, then excuse yourself to use the bathroom and take a taxi home. (So he doesn't have time to put MOW in your seat). It would also ruin his vacation. Or maybe not. If he's abusive, that would be fanning some serious flames. But it was fun to dream up.
Hey, 7years, look into classes or meet ups. Being out of the house will make the time go much faster!
[This message edited by 7yrsflushed at 9:47 AM, April 12th (Friday)]
i am the female version of you so it seems..only my end is a bit further off. I too see the flaws, and some of what pfm does makes me insane...so i step back do some breathin and its about this time that manchild( oldest son) will step in and drive me even further to the insanity place.. seriously though, i step back, i also do things outside of the home to keep me sane, give me things to look forward too. i try now to go out dancing once a month if not more....a few drinks helps me unwind and forget and get lost in the music and dance my heart out. i am open to meeting someone but that is not the priority. i have been fortunate in friends who drive so i do not have to worry about drinkin and drivin...and yes i NEED the drinkin part..keep in mind its usually 3 to 4 drinks max....but its the only way i can seem to forget.. i don't get drunk, i get buzzed, and i dance and dance and dance...its sucks though when the local band playing isn't any good.. ....i also take zumba now which also helps..its not like regular dancing and i have to concentrate on the steps, got 2 left feet for it.. working out helps but not as much cause i hate it, love the way it makes me feel but i don't enjoy it, kwim....i enjoy dancin...anyway a bit longwinded i seem to be....i think its time for me to shut up now...
But I have been drawn back recently because of some life changes... and because there are few if any other places to share my thoughts and fears...
I have been very lucky! My FWH and I have been reconciled and happy, living and loving and growing... but due to circumstances and the economy, my FWH has gone back to work, and I am REALLY having a rough time adapting.
FWH retired 2 years ago, after 31 years with the police department, and we were both just very happy...
but because we were still fairly young, our health insurance as retirees was killing us!! I worked part-time and it wasn't enough. So FWH has gone back to work as a police officer again for a University here! The pay is decent, but the difference in the cost of healthcare is massive! I love the fact that he has stepped up and is doing what he can to make it easier..... but I just never counted on having to go back to shift work, nights alone, and the fear that maybe... just maybe.... the impossible could happen again!!
Now he has not given me any reason to think that he would ever repeat what he did, and we have been very happy and satisfied... but I am really having a hard time! And there really is no where I could just throw that out!! So here I am!
I am woman, hear me ROAR!!
What you accept, you teach!
Me 53, WS 54
Reconciled for life!
DD 24, DS 27