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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: Long Term Affairs - Part 31
Laura28
♀ Member
Member # 28997
Default  Posted: 4:44 AM, May 23rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

((((miracle)))))

BIG HUGS

Laura


Married 30yrs Me BW 57Yrs Him FWH 59yrs
OWzero 1988 EA?/PA? Gaslighted.
Dday May 28 2010.
OW1 1994(6mths PA, EA til dday).
OW2 2002(8yrs PA).
OW3 2009(1Yr PA).
Others???? Status: Not Divorcing..but.."You can't unfuck the goat"

Posts: 2729 | Registered: Jul 2010 | From: Australia
hopeandchange
♂ Member
Member # 33287
Default  Posted: 12:41 PM, May 23rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

It was easier to avoid the conflict, avoid looking inside, and just blame me and our marriage. To do otherwise would require intimacy. Hence its avoidance...

MC_Jack
yes, yes and yes. It is sad but my stbxww also lacks the ability to self reflect. Everything negative about our M is my fault. Recently she started to say "if I (ww) had acted differently..) and then caught herself because this would be an admission that she also contributed to the issues for which she says have ended our M.

Do you want to wait for her to decide, or have you decided?

The decision is made (by her) and we are divorcing. We have taken our kids to a family counselor to better understand their concerns. Just biding time now as we work our the details and she finds a place to live.

We were discussing custody with the counselor and I thought we had settled on a four / three day arrangement every week with stbxww also getting every third weekend. Her four days are the week days. SHE WANTED MORE!!! Seems she wanted to be able to do things with the kids on Sundays and weekends are so important.


he is a volunteer firefighter

Miracle.. for this one item, you should be very proud of your son. He gave his time and effort to train and is willing to do so again (and at a risk to his own well being) to protect the community. Very admirable.

As for everything else, it is hard, really really hard to see someone you love and cared for fail. And fail destructively. I wish I had answers - I do not. I struggled through a long and bad situation with my oldest brother. And unforthuantely, it never got better. He is now deceased.

Wishing all a good weekend and I am making an effort to do the same. Four days for me due to the Memorial Day holiday and an off Friday.

Be safe. Be Happy! Be Healthy. And live with ease.

h&c


BH (me, 50)
WS (her, 48)
Divorced!
3 wonderful teens
Heading for Happiness

Posts: 401 | Registered: Sep 2011
honesttoafault
♀ Member
Member # 27105
Default  Posted: 2:28 PM, May 23rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

{{{{{Miracle}}}}
I think you do need to have a long talk with your son. Since he is paying for his own college and is failing, I feel that it his decision to make if he is going to continue there or at a community college, but it is good to tell you how you feel. About paying the insurance, since he's had another accident, he should pick up his own insurance. I told DS18 that he can stay on our insurance, but once he has an accident (that he caused) he's on his own.

It's very hard to watch them fall. What helped me was to tell my sons when they were older teenagers that I wanted them to listen to my advice with an open mind and think about it. I will let them make their own decision because I trust they will do the right thing. Then I stepped back.
It's hard!! But usually, they did choose the right thing. and I think that's the important, that they feel they are choosing.

H&C: I hope that you and your WW can work out custody without fighting. Hang in there. You'll be at peace soon.

Hi Laura!!! How are you??


Posts: 1903 | Registered: Jan 2010
hopeandchange
♂ Member
Member # 33287
Default  Posted: 5:20 PM, May 23rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I hope that you and your WW can work out custody without fighting.

Honest.. thanks!

At my kids ages, they will do what they want to do and spend time with whom they want to spend time. This is about setting expectations for them - that they will spend time with both of us - and setting the expectations for my stbxww.

Things will change. It will be different. Instead of casually being with the kids every day, it will be a different efffort on us and the kids for each of us to get the parenting time. It still has not set in with her that things will be different.

In some way, I have enabled this as I did not / have not kicked her out on the street. I am encouraging her to get good independent advice: financial, legal. And I counsel her on certain areas myself. I still wish her well.

stbxww is meeting with financial planner today. I set the expectation that the level of child support does not mattter: I have said I will cover my kids expenses and it does not matter how the money gets there. Greater child support to stbxww - then she writes the checks. Less child support - then I write the checks. The expenses are the same. This will be our next issue.

Be safe! Be Happy! Be Healthy! Live with ease!

Have a great weekend.

h&c


BH (me, 50)
WS (her, 48)
Divorced!
3 wonderful teens
Heading for Happiness

Posts: 401 | Registered: Sep 2011
njgal480
♀ Member
Member # 24938
Default  Posted: 5:36 PM, May 23rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

h&c-

You have a good heart.

But...that worries me in terms of the divorce.

I would not want to see you get a raw deal.

Why not go by the letter of the law and then you can decide later if you want to give the kids more money etc.

Don't you see the possibility of your WW taking advantage of the situation?

There are many cases where the custodial parent does not spend the child support money on the kids!

If you give her more money than the state requires who's to say that she will do the right thing?

She could be out partying with girlfriends and spending your hard earned money.

Wouldn't it be better for you to provide the children with whatever the courts deem to be appropriate and then if something comes up where the children need more money then they come to you?

at least then you will know for sure that the money is going directly to your kids.

Same thing with parenting time.
Please DO put everything in writing.
And do NOT assume that your WW will do right by you unless it is court ordered.

Do not give her custody every single weekend or Sunday-alternate weekends instead.
Yes, you're right.
The kids may end up making their own decisions about where to stay etc.
But, you should demand a 50/50 parenting situation for now.


miracle- I'm so sorry that you are having difficulties with your DS. It sounds like you have a good plan in mind in terms of how to proceed.


Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA
Reconciled.


Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
honesttoafault
♀ Member
Member # 27105
Default  Posted: 6:10 PM, May 23rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

H&C: I agree with NJgal. Just give WW what the law requires. Put it in writing. Everything. This is business and as in every business it's best for all parties concerned for everything to be spelled out. You are going to have joint custody, so WW gets half CS. If you want to take care of their clothes for example, buy it fro them

Posts: 1903 | Registered: Jan 2010
MC_Jack
♂ Member
Member # 35016
Default  Posted: 6:12 PM, May 23rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

H&C, what njgal said. What happens if in 2 years you meet someone else and want $$ available for a new family, but can't because you *codified* a contribution amount greater than what the law would have really required. *** I think you are trying to martyr yourself.***

njgal, iwam, honest - thanks for the thoughts. The most difficult part of dealing with my WW's depression, from both my and her point of view, is that she also has thyroid disease - and as a result suffers from not always having the right hormone levels. So it is all confusing. Her depression comes and goes. But it has been doing that for as long as I've known her.

YES, she does have some deep rooted fear. I am convinced there is something hidden. What it is I have no idea. She probably does not knwo either. The anxiety, the having to be busy all the time, the perfectionism, etc. is all a distraction I believe.

I had a good IC today. If I am going to heal and truly love WW, I need to let go of all the false expectations and idealizations. See her for who and what she is. I am very good at denial as well.

- Jack

[This message edited by MC_Jack at 6:13 PM, May 23rd (Thursday)]


I am not a marriage counselor. I chose "MC Jack" in the spirit of a handle like "MC Hammer" or Young MC"...there is a lot of 'rapping' here, no? At the time I did not know what MC stood for on this site. Duh.

Posts: 792 | Registered: Mar 2012 | From: West Coast of Hopa-hopa-land
honesttoafault
♀ Member
Member # 27105
Default  Posted: 6:16 PM, May 23rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

H&C: I agree with NJgal. Just give WW what the law requires. Put it in writing. Everything. This is business and as in every business it's best for all parties concerned for everything to be spelled out. You are going to have joint custody, so WW gets half CS. If you want to take care of their clothes for example, buy it for them when they are with you. Try your best to think of the expenses ahead of time, like sports, school trips, etc.
Have it all in writing!!!

Stop enabling WW now. Let her take care of herself now. You have gone over and above the call of duty in helping her. She wants this D??? Then let her see the consequences of her choices. I'm not saying you have to be mean, just step back and let her do things on her own. She needs to know that if she gets a flat tire or something in the future, you are not going to be "on call" for her.
You are a kind and good man and your WW does NOT deserve you.

You know what I always see? The "bitches" (mean women) get the nice guys and the "bastards" (mean men) get the nice girls.
Why can't the nice people marry each other and let the bitches and bastards drive each other crazy?


Posts: 1903 | Registered: Jan 2010
honesttoafault
♀ Member
Member # 27105
Default  Posted: 6:30 PM, May 23rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Been having a hard time lately. Hurt my back trying to clean the pool after staining the deck. Never hurt my back before. Again seeing the reality, but vowing not to put my head in the sand again. Scared about that.
4 year anti-anniversary of DDay1 coming up.

My mother always said that it is not just the date that brings up triggers for an anniversary (divorce, death) but also the sights, sounds, smells. Studies have shown that scent is strongly associated with memory. Just think of smelling pumpkin pie baking and you are automatically sent to the holidays.

This time of the year, with the smell of the fresh air, flowers blooming, warmth etc, brings it all back when WH decided to tell me in the back yard about OW and OC's and then proceeded to tell our DS's.
It's not just the date.

The other thing I just wanted to add, is that I finally realized after an argument with WH that the reason I always seem to listen to him is that he always puts a GRAIN of truth into his arguments along with pushing my emotional buttons and it gets me everytime.
<sigh>

He is now blaming me for his heart problems because I'm always stressing him out!!

I thought I'd share that for a laugh.

I hope everyone has a good Memorial Day weekend.

Hey Dip!!! Stop by and say hello. Whenever I think about BBQing, I think of you.


Posts: 1903 | Registered: Jan 2010
iwantamiracle
♀ Member
Member # 22812
Default  Posted: 8:55 PM, May 23rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

hi laura...thanks for the hugs...hugs are always welcome

thanks everyone for the wishes and hugs...

hope: yes he is a volunteer firefighter and i am extremely proud of him for it...especially since i sort of forced him into it when he turned 18, he was already not doing well in school and had no job and was being quite lazy about it...so i told him he had to at least volunteer for something, i was not going to just let him sit at home playing video game after video game.....and he embraced it....resentfully at first, but now he loves it and i fact wants to go into it the field full time for pay....however here in New York, they only offer the test every couple of years...the last test he just missed and that was the first test in 10 years....so hopefully it won't be that long, and then hopefully he will pass and make it....but in the meantime he has to have a plan B and plan B needs to be implemented in the event that plan A never comes to pass....


life in the miracle household has been slightly quieter..pfm seems to have temporarily let go of his issues....meaning he is waiting for an oportune time to attack me again...(verbally)....but until then...life goes on...and so do I !!!!!! in spite of HIM....


((((tribe))))


i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
iwantamiracle
♀ Member
Member # 22812
Default  Posted: 9:02 PM, May 23rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

oh and honest...the antiversaries will get better once you make your decision and start acting upon it....and the more steps you take towards your new life the easier it all gets...i promise....this past antiversary was 4 years for me..and the day was almost over before i realized the actual date of it....and it no longer mattered as much, and it was so freeing!!!!

i am looking forward, living in the present, looking forward to my future and leaving the past just there in the past....at least most of the time...

and of course it still hurts, but its not a sharp pain anymore....and yes it still makes me angry, but its not all consuming anymore....and each day, or maybe like each month it seems to get better.....i still have my days like the other one when he was the "old" pfm attacking me.......but they pass....


and hope your ww does not have the market on selfishness...pfm actually told me that i should be the one to leave since i won't put any of the money i have started to earn towards the household...a job i had to get so that i could eventually divorce the ass.....i don't think so...i had told him that the day i use my money for bills is the day he leaves......and that is that!!!!


i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
7yrsflushed
♂ Member
Member # 32258
Default  Posted: 9:12 PM, May 23rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Wouldn't it be better for you to provide the children with whatever the courts deem to be appropriate and then if something comes up where the children need more money then they come to you?
This is almost verbatim the advice I was given by my L when I initially was discussing the agreement. I agree with what everyone else has stated. I was thinking of giving my STBX all of our brokerage account because frankly I still wasn't thinking clearly. She advised me to stick to the 50% rule of law since it was a joint account and if I felt the need to give more I always could. She told me she would do as I directed but I was paying her to provide advice and guidance so I listened. Those 1st discussions took place in Late January and the agreement was signed in March. Less than 2 months later and I can tell you that I would have been kicking myself in the ass repeatedly all day every day if I hadn't listened to the lawyer. Your mindset towards your WW WILL change once you detach and most definitely will change once she is out of the house and you both are moving on in separate directions in life. It is no longer your responsibility to provide for your WW. Pay what the state or your lawyer suggests then if you want to give extra for your children then you can do it directly from your pocket and give it to them or pay for something yourself. They FIRED us from our jobs as husbands so we are no longer required to perform any services at all for them.

Ultimately it's your life but believe me it may not feel like it now but you eventually WILL detach and your feelings and mindset WILL change completely.


D-day 5/24/11
BH = Me
STBXWW = Her
2 children
The first true sense of calm I felt in YEARS was when I filed for D...
Separated 6/2013, D official around 6/2014

Posts: 1570 | Registered: May 2011
7yrsflushed
♂ Member
Member # 32258
Default  Posted: 9:26 PM, May 23rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

oh and honest...the antiversaries will get better once you make your decision and start acting upon it....and the more steps you take towards your new life the easier it all gets...i promise....this past antiversary was 4 years for me..and the day was almost over before i realized the actual date of it....and it no longer mattered as much, and it was so freeing!!!!
^^^PURE TRUTH! I can tell you that after those first initial steps it gets easier and you do gain momentum. I expected that I would be down but I am not. This has been a good week and the closer I get to July 1 when she moves out the more excited I get. Two months ago it felt like time was standing still but now the weeks seem to be flying by and it's because I am doing what I want to do and not worrying at all about STBX. It's like she doesn't exist anymore and gets smaller and smaller each day. Stringing together those consecutive days of not caring, doing what you want to do, and focusing on you DO have a snowball affect. Once you get that glimpse of happiness again you want more. It's out there Honest just keep working towards it.


D-day 5/24/11
BH = Me
STBXWW = Her
2 children
The first true sense of calm I felt in YEARS was when I filed for D...
Separated 6/2013, D official around 6/2014

Posts: 1570 | Registered: May 2011
MC_Jack
♂ Member
Member # 35016
Default  Posted: 10:10 AM, May 24th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Honest,

how do we get you to a massage for that back injury? Maybe at least have the douche WH hook you up with something.

That pool of yours sounds nice!

Jack



I am not a marriage counselor. I chose "MC Jack" in the spirit of a handle like "MC Hammer" or Young MC"...there is a lot of 'rapping' here, no? At the time I did not know what MC stood for on this site. Duh.

Posts: 792 | Registered: Mar 2012 | From: West Coast of Hopa-hopa-land
honesttoafault
♀ Member
Member # 27105
Default  Posted: 10:21 AM, May 24th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Jack: Thanks, but the pool is a quagmire right now
Going to the chiropractor later, hopefully it'll help

Posts: 1903 | Registered: Jan 2010
hopeandchange
♂ Member
Member # 33287
Default  Posted: 12:44 PM, May 24th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Wouldn't it be better for you to provide the children with whatever the courts deem to be appropriate and then if something comes up where the children need more money then they come to you?

All.. thanks for the feedback. Unfortunately, I did not communicate my thoughts well in the origianl post.

So I have repeatedly told stbxww that I would pay for all the kids expenses (insurance, clothes, activities, etc). except for the groceries they ate while staying with her. And stbxww would pay for her own expenses including utilities (phone, internet, electricity). stbxww said this was unacceptable and I must pay CS (in addition).

My point to stbxww was that with higher CS payments, I will pay less of the kids expenses (insurance, clothes, activities, etc) as she will be paying for (some of this) with the CS payments. Same offer - I pick up all of the kids expenses - it will be just the path the money flows.

Frankly, my offer to pay all of these expenses directly is a better one for her as she does not have to worry about the increasing cost of insurance, unexpected activities, or that new pair of boots that are absouutely needed.

Our falimy counselor pointed out that "well, it seems that the kids would see h&c providing all of their financial support and this does not seem equitable / fair to stbxww" Sorry folks, I am truly from another planet as this (h&c providing the financial support) is the truth and I do not see why it needs to be disguised for either my stbxww's image or my kids understanding.

My four day weekend got off to a rough start (vision issues) and is getting better (contacted by some old friends wanting to get together).

Be safe! Be happy! Be healthy! Live with ease!

h&c


BH (me, 50)
WS (her, 48)
Divorced!
3 wonderful teens
Heading for Happiness

Posts: 401 | Registered: Sep 2011
MC_Jack
♂ Member
Member # 35016
Default  Posted: 12:45 PM, May 24th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Honest, let's get the pool cleaned up for an LTA tribe pool party. I will bring the cocktails!

Iwam, thanks for the reminder on how important tough love is with raising kids.

Have a great week end everyone--


I am not a marriage counselor. I chose "MC Jack" in the spirit of a handle like "MC Hammer" or Young MC"...there is a lot of 'rapping' here, no? At the time I did not know what MC stood for on this site. Duh.

Posts: 792 | Registered: Mar 2012 | From: West Coast of Hopa-hopa-land
njgal480
♀ Member
Member # 24938
Default  Posted: 4:41 PM, May 24th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

honest- hope your back feels better soon. Enjoy the Memorial Day weekend with your boys!
How much longer before NPD returns to haunt you?

H&C- OK...I get it. But, I think your WW's attitude points to the need for you to have everything in writing. This way there is no misunderstanding. Then your answer can be- this was the decision of the courts.


Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA
Reconciled.


Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
SisterMilkshake
♀ Member
Member # 30024
Default  Posted: 10:19 PM, May 24th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Just stopped by to say hello to the Tribe and to say a special "hello" to Laura. So happy to see you post here again.

I have been lurking, as usual. Have a wonderful weekend Tribe, I imagine it will be kind of slow this weekend so I hope all goes well.

(((Tribe)))


BW (me) 50ish FWH 50ish
Married 34 years, 3 children
d-day 3/10 LTA (4 yrs./fucking & flirting)

"Oh, why do my actions have consequences?" ~ Homer Simpson
"She knew my one weakness: That I'm weak!" ~ Homer Simpson


Posts: 8976 | Registered: Nov 2010 | From: The Great White North USA
Laura28
♀ Member
Member # 28997
Default  Posted: 6:36 AM, May 25th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks SMS

Prayers and HUGS please everyone for UKgirl.

Her mum passed away a few days ago.

Please keep her and her family in your thoughts.

Laura


Married 30yrs Me BW 57Yrs Him FWH 59yrs
OWzero 1988 EA?/PA? Gaslighted.
Dday May 28 2010.
OW1 1994(6mths PA, EA til dday).
OW2 2002(8yrs PA).
OW3 2009(1Yr PA).
Others???? Status: Not Divorcing..but.."You can't unfuck the goat"

Posts: 2729 | Registered: Jul 2010 | From: Australia
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