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So I sent exfucktard a request to stop laying the burden on our children to arrange changes in visitation. I explained that during the parenting class(court ordered, I attended she did not) they emphasized not communicating through the children. Here is her response;

Did they also discuss how important it is to show respect to the other parent and let go of hatred? Let me know when that happens and it will be much easier to communicate with you without involving the kids. You contact me as little as possible and as remotely as possible - often taking several days to respond or longer, don't even acknowledge my physicla presence or try to avoid me. I am honoring your subtle request to keep my distance and allow you to move on with your life.

So much for living in the same town.

She is right, I have nothing to say to her so I don't. I am never rude, simply indifferent to her prescence. Do I respond for the kids sake?

No, just document.

I just posted on this topic. It's been happening since we separated, so I don't have any good advice how to handle it, just some big hugs sent your way.. How they don't realize the problem with it is beyond me..

I understand how irritating it is when your X communicates through your children. It seems unbelievable that they don't get that this is not good for the kids. My stbx has talked to my DD about staying at his place on Friday night but he still hasn't asked/told me. This is Tuesday. My DD told me about the plan. We have a joint calendar if he doesn't want to use email.

I know that my stbx wants in his wonderful passive aggressive way to make me angry. I am looking at it as a free evening and do not plan to get angry at all.

I do plan to bring this up at our next mediation session. and to request that all scheduling be determined by the parents not one parent with our DD. I don't know how much mediation can do in this regard but I doubt the mediator will think much of scheduling an overnight without mentioning it to me at least a week in advance if not more.

I very badly want to reply simply,

Yes I have moved on, as always my concern is the children and no I don't respect people who lie and cheat.

Ugh!

DO NOT REPLY! Do not give her the satisfaction that you have to tell her that you've moved on.

All emails should be handled as a business transaction. NO EMOTION. Save that for this forum.

Do changes in visitation happen a lot? It rarely comes up with us and we have 60/40 custody. When I make a doctor's appt, I set it up on my outlook calendar and "invite" him. That way he knows about things that may interfere with the schedule.

I know it's tempting to reply. They really do have a playbook. After having my son call me today to try to change the schedule, and me refusing since the request came from my son and not from him, most of the texts I got were, "Get over it ButterflyGirl. Why can't you move on? Grow up. Give it up. Let go. Stop being mad that I don't love you anymore."

Without any emotion, I only responded to the texts dealing with the schedule and sending messages through the children.

How I would love to be like, "Are you fucking kidding me? You think I want you back?? Look how you are treating me you dumb shit. I deserve so much better than you!"

But this only feeds their ego. I would not respond to any of the emotional comments. Completely ignore any and all of it. There is no response to get it through their head that we don't want them anymore.

Only respond firmly and reasonably about the issue at hand, sending messages through the kids..

ahhh.. yes, I've received the "get over it" emails and "move on with your life" too. I don't know why or how they confuse indifference and healthy space as infused anger which affects the kids. Mine is NPD so I get that. What I have learned over and over and over again is DO NOT RESPOND! it does no good. they won't 'get it' and it will frustrate you more to be engaged in defending yourself to someone who can't comprehend. So, that's my 2 cents worth. do yourself this favor and don't.

Yes changes are a regular occurance mostly because she isn't interested in being a parent. I am more than happy to pick up the slack. This particular occurance came up as I asked her if she had any schedule conflicts with me taking the kids away in August. She replied that she had no problems with it. Well obviously she forgot DD has a play because she called tonight telling me about it which prompted my request that the communication take place between us. Mistakes happen I understand that! I just feel its her responsibility to deal with it not my 10 year olds!

Double ugh!

I agree the issue is the kids!

Triple ugh!

My Poor kids!! Their mom is the cunductor of the crazy train!

But her yoga will fix all of it as long as we all leave her alone to fuck meaningless people in her kids lives!

My X would not take the kids out of the equation. No matter what happened. He would tell the kids his plan, they would tell me. I would get frustrated with him... and tell the kids he needs to talk to me... It only made the kids more determined that if they brought us together that we would fight. Eventually to save my kids any more angst, I would reply by email.

Dealing with him really is like dealing with someone from a foreign country that needs an interpreter. He tells the interpreter, interpreter tells me.. I respond directly to him.

Do what you can to minimize the kids being involved on your end. And deal directly with your X when you have to initiate contact.

I will tell you I worded the emails to him along the lines off :

XNPDH,

I am confirming that you sent DD3 with a request to change your friday pickup on may 3, to her school instead of the halfway point.

You picking her up from school that day is fine. Please inform me directly if your plans change.

OR..

DD3 informed me of your intent to pick her up from school on may3, for your visitation weekend. I had planned on taking her shopping at xxxx store along the way to the halfway point. If you can get her her track shoes at track schack that day.. (she needs them for a meet the following week) If you can do that, then we can change the arrangements.

If I wanted to change, I sent him an email and gave him a time, date to respond by or I would take his answer as an ok for me to do what I planned. Otherwise he never answered.

And I can guarantee if I asked him to spend money on a kid... he would not take them.

Good luck,

Hugs,

K

We want them to stop fucking up our kids.

We want them to give a shit about the damage they're doing.

They don't give a shit. Their kids still love them so they must be a great parent, right?

Wrong.

I hate it too but I'm wasting my breath trying to convince him. He's read the articles, he knows he's hurting them. Its a small price to pay for him so long as he gets to hurt me. I'm working on not giving him the satisfaction. I fail mostly.

Its the last button he has to press. Its disgusting that he's willing to hurt these innocent kids but unfortunately being an incompetent parent is not against the law.

What an incredibly genius way to teach kids how to be passive-aggresive in life!!!!!!

Turned....don't answer her. She's baiting you and you are sooo willing to get hooked on her crazy train.

Don't do it for the kid's sake. They need to learn how to deal with things like a responsible adult (even though they are 10).

k9

Oh, Brother... I soooo relate to this exact Crazy Train. (crazytrain was exWW ringtone- changed because it literally made me jump)

My indifference is interpreted the same way by the demon in my little's lives. She also sends information through the kids. Or... pumps the kids for information she thinks she should know (according to them).

In her head I hate her, I haven't moved on, I resent her, I need to build a life without her... it is all about how I MUST view her. In reality I could care less beyond how her stupid choices affect my littles.

I ignore. Ignore. Ignore... but she still does the three week (like clockwork) emotional build that ends with a tirade email accusing me of the above and full of threats for court action so she can have the kids more than half the time. It is exhausting. But I still ignore.

Ignore is the safest best course of action. email or text all necessary schedule changes and money issues bluntly. Do not engage.

It is weird, because frankly, I do not think she really loves the kids... I think they are simply an accessory because that is how she treats them- she only does stuff with them on the occasions there are lots of people around and never when there isn't and I've heard she constantly laments being a single mother all the time (from the Mom's at the little's school).

StrongButBroken is correct: we want them to take the littles into account. They wont.

Just bolster them so they have the tools to deal with the type of person their mother is. It pays off. Mine are actually better adjusted than many "normal" family kids, recognize their mother's actions as not a judgement on them (as all three tell me all the time- the littlest little by shrugging and saying "that's mom), and are thriving despite their mother's half time influence. (it helps that she ignores them and they hole up in their rooms to avoid her when they are over there- which makes me very sad for them)

In her head, she probably needs you to hate her because anyone who can do this to their littles, their little's security, the little's father, the marriage, and you as an individual who loved her needs to think you hate her because she knows how horrific this all is and hates her self... OR

She just wants everything to be about her and how unjust you obviously are for being a real person.

Stay strong brother. Watch out for the littles.

[This message edited by quedagh at 10:31 AM, April 17th (Wednesday)]

turned, I hope that you were able to resist the urge to respond to her. My ex-shat thinks that I hate him too (wrote me an email saying that my hatred was palpable and that Teslet was picking up on it)...but I'm merely indifferent and also don't have anything to say to him.

It's just tough shit for them. This is the path they chose, did they not think we would stop talking to them and being friendly? Oh well.

But do answer any requests that come through your children via email with a request that she respond directly to the email. Eventually either she will get the picture or your children will see that she is a fucked up fool that can't figure out how to text or email their dad.

Thanks gang! Tesla I replied to the extent of confirming the dates for a summer vacation that I'm taking the kids on. I did not address anything other than those dates. I need to finalize them to make travel arrangements She really does not bother me in the least with her misdirected nonsense. She is a truly a fucked up person. The kids have figured that out. She could not be more wrong thinking I haven't moved on. I have. In fact many people in this small town have said how nice it is to have the 'old turned' back

If you respond back (via email) with a note saying the kids told you... If and when you go back to court these emails can be utilized to show just how screwed up the other parent is.

It is a form of documenting.

Also the problem with the kids being messengers is that they are now the responsible party in communication with you. talk about a powder keg... what happens if a kid forgets to say something and all hell breaks loose??? The kid will fee horrible.

My X made my kids responsible for almost every aspect of their lives, even if they were fairly young 10-12yo. I had one kid calling him every afternoon for almost 3 years to remind him to call that evening to speak to her sisters, because they thought he didn't love them anymore... so she took it upon herself to remind him.

Their actions and lack of actions can really screw up a kid...

Hugs,

K