Wheres that popcorn I heard about.
Once a cheater always a cheater?
I think the only real truth to this is that once you cheat on someone, you can't uncheat so to speak (you will ALWAYS be the one who cheated).
But again with everything on this site everyone comes from their WS and BS perspectives, as evidenced by hardlessons post above, the divide can be quite partisan at times where WS and BS pick and chose what gives them comfort.
AS a BS I don't believe once a cheater always a cheater, but if I find myself single in the future I would not date someone who had cheated on their previous SO......I've already been burned and would rather take my chances with a fresh first time betrayer I guess?
Only my opinion, no need to take offence.....
This kind of thing is pretty insulting, though you may not intend for it to be
What is insulting about it? I said I don't buy into the phrase. I do believe people can change and not be a cheater any longer. I simply said its "rare", what is wrong with that? If you think people can change and your wife is one of them, then she would fall into the rare category, as well as pretty much all of the posters here.
I don't think the phrase "Once a cheater always a cheater" is true. I simply use it as a guideline for myself. In other words, even though I don't think its true, I act like it is out in the dating world. I know that may not make alot of sense to some, but its just a guideline I use in the dating world.
The other reason I say it is "rare", and this is simply my opinion, is I think alot of people who have betrayed their spouses DO stop cheating, never to do it again. And I'm sure alot of them have no desire or look back on their affair with fondness, or miss the excitement that the affair brought with it. But I'm sure there are also SOME that made the choice to not cheat because they don't want to lose their family.
[This message edited by nofool4u at 9:24 AM, May 14th (Tuesday)]
I don't think my wife wold do it again but- I don't know for sure. I think my mate who cheated on his wife will do it again and will hope he doesn't get caught- again, I don't know for sure.
"Once a cheater always a cheater" - I hope not.
Multi famam, conscientiam, pauci verentur.
Ok but to throw a wrench in the works.. before ANY WS cheated for the first time, they were a non-cheater. So really it proves just about nothing.
Mmmm yeah. My H was 36 when he cheated on me and he'd never cheated on anyone else before (yay lucky me ).
I cheated on my college sweetheart when I was 21 (emotionally, not physically). So given our track records I guess I looked like the worse bet.
[This message edited by purplebreeze at 9:56 AM, May 14th (Tuesday)]
I am not here about generalizations (although I have been guilty of using them in a weaker moments). I am here to feel better about things that have happened in my own life. So will my W cheat again ? I don't know. I do know that I am no longer naive enough to pretend that people don't cheat and will be much more cognizant of things that seem off in the future.
Truely healing for me means that I will be perfectly fine if my W does it again. I will realize it reflects on her and not me. I would probably date again and even get M again. Would they cheat ? Again I don't know.
I also know that my W does not look back at her time with fondness, does not think any of it was worth it. Why ? She may think of a happy memory for a little while, but the reality creeps in and reminds her of the price she paid and how bad of a person she was.
Even if I am looking through TV channels and anything that is even sort of related to infidelity comes on, she has to leave the room. She comes back in tears with apologies. For a long time the mere mention of APs name made her throw up.
It is beginning to get to the point that it hurts her more to be reminded of what she has done than me.
Don't get me wrong, she did a horrible thing and it is just she suffers from her choices. However the once a cheater thing does not apply any longer to my situation. If she does cheat again, she knows what will happen. She will lose someone who cared enough to support her even in spite of her cheating on me. I would view it as her loss. She came very close once and never wants that again.I have safeguards in place now and she is working on making amends. Eventually balance will have to be restored, but today amends are being made. Right, wrong or indifferent it is my sitch and really the only one I have to live with.
DS 1, DD 6
Dday 8/31/11. ONS that occurred 3 years earlier. Lied to for 3 years.
Every truth comes to light in a long enough timeline.
If I see a pitbull in a fenced in yard, there is a chance that if I enter that yard it may not bite me. But I'm not going to jump the fence just the same.
"Affairs are not mistakes, they are a series of deliberate choices." - CrappyLife
BUT that requires self reflection and admission, if they simply say oh i'll never do that again, without committing to the core changes that have to happen, then yes they will do it again. If they commit themselves as I have to being a different, a better human being, partner and friend, well then if you think I'll stray and can't trust me then we shouldn't be together.
Very simply, communication and commitment is key and there is always a reason 'why' they A happens, be it psychological, bad marriage, drugs/alcohol abuse, you have to take out the roots to fall the tree.
The reason "once a cheater, always a cheater" tends to me more true than not, is because so few people actually do the work and change the character flaw that caused them to cheat in the first place.
If I read my daughter's teacher's resume, and it said that he was a former child rapist, I would be appalled. Maybe he has changed, but I am simply not going to take that risk. My daughter, her health, and her safety are much too important.
Same with me. If I were to ever be in a position of looking for a new relationship, I would never take a chance on someone who I knew cheated in the past. My well being and happiness is much too important to go through this crap ever again with someone new.
At least the current man "only" cyber-cheated.
"Love means never having to say you're sorry."
I have also lived my life and based our R on this. My H will always be more prone to cheat, so he has to have extra safe guards in place. Like an alcoholic he will not take a drink/ have close friends of the opposite sex or alone with them at any time.
[This message edited by Hearthache again at 11:11 PM, May 16th (Thursday)]
This too shall pass
I edit a lot because that stupid box is so small!
I think "cheater" is a catchall term. For some it might mean a NPD for whom cheating is just part of an array of narc behavior. No hope there. For others it is part of a SA. Treatable? I wouldn't get involved, but I think couples have reconciled through it. For some people it's a sense of entitlement, midlife crisis, all kinds of different issues.
Kind of rambling....
I like to compare this phase to "Once and alcoholic, always an alcoholic." The alcoholic/cheater will always have the underlining addictive personality but if they choose to they do not have to live as an alcoholic/cheater.
EXACTLY. I've used this analogy before as well.
An alcoholic may take the steps to never drink again because they have a problem, but they still have an urge to take a swig.
The whole "underlying personality" thing implies a lack of control, which by logical extension implies a lack of responsibility.
Personality is a complicated thing, and a common theme is that it is the sum of many parts. Assuming that an alcoholic is always an alcoholic assumes that there is some permanent neurological fixture that cannot be undone.
Yes, someone who was addicted to a substance like alcohol or caffeine is likely to re-acquire those addictions very quickly if they fall back into those behavioral patterns. Said behavioral patterns are an equal danger to everyone, however - I really wouldn't trust a known cheater any less simply for being a cheater over someone who denies being a cheater but engages in questionable behavior.
Actions > words. Sustained actions = behavioral pattern. People who are continually dishonest and destructive and make no effort to change are obviously going to continue in those patterns, while those who make the effort to alter their behavioral patterns effectively adjust their personality over time.
While I can understand some of the analogies and think it's fine for a personal perspective on it - I have a hard time trusting any dog at all, even the submissive and stupid kind since both my kids have been bitten and I consider all dogs unreasonably dangerous at some level - I don't think that trying to rationalize it against the objective whole is necessary, or even helpful.
If they cheat once...give them another chance. If they cheat twice....get out.
The first (although clearly a choice) can be a mistake. The second time...they know the consequences.
For the love...give it another try.
For others, it's a conflict avoidance thing. Those people aren't ready to be in a relationship.
For some people, it's secondary to substance abuse or mental illness. Those people need treatment.
For some people, it's self-medication for low self esteem. Those people need therapy.
It's certainly a flag of some sort. I'd say the flag is bigger and redder the closer to the event. But it's certainly easy to say "there are too many fish in the sea to bother with this" and not pursue a relationship with a former cheater. Why not? Of course, that doesn't insulate you from relationship problems with a "non-cheater" (who might be a former cheater too.)
But I would never knowingly have a relationship with a cheater..even a former cheater. It's just too much of a risk. I can say that I respect our former waywards because I have followed their posts..I KNOW they are remorseful and have done the hard work on themselves. But if I were to meet a man(if/when I am single) and they tell me they have cheated in the past,Im out of there. I will not risk getting to know them well enough to know if they are TRULY remorseful and have changed. My heart has been damaged enough...I would never knowingly risk it again.
[This message edited by confused615 at 1:13 PM, May 17th (Friday)]
..that feeling you get in your stomach, when you heart's broken. It's like all the butterflies just died.