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User Topic: Concealed Carry
lynnm1947
♀ Member
Member # 15300
Default  Posted: 7:00 PM, May 22nd (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

This is what I, as a Canadian, do not understand about Americans. Unless we hunt, we do not own guns. If we hunt, our guns are registered. Except that is, the unregistered Saturday night specials that whackos buy in the US and smuggle across the border to use in crimes. My other half is American and says if he lived in an area (i.e., many parts of America) where most people packed guns, he'd do so, too. I tell him he'd better not suggest we live in such a place because he'd be living there alone. And I mean it.


Age: 64..ummmmmmm, no...............65....no...oh, hell born in 1947. You figure it out!

"I could have missed the pain, but I would have had to miss the dance." Garth Brooks


Posts: 7284 | Registered: Jul 2007 | From: Toronto, Canada
NotDefeatedYet
♂ Member
Member # 33642
Default  Posted: 8:03 PM, May 22nd (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Ownership of arms and armor was there, as here, an economic factor more than one of nobility. Going all the way back to the Roman Republic, before the Marian reforms, the reason nobles had weapons and armor was because they could afford them. It is a very European idea that a citizen should own and maintain his own weaponry to be used in the defense of his home/land.

Any time the Romans grew tired of anyone, they confiscated all their weapons. That's part of the reason there is no more Roman Republic. Many of the European countries also have a long history of conscription. Weapons were associated with military. Here, the revolution was fought by a bunch of farmers. When they started getting bullied, the British tried the old confiscate trick.

I hear a lot of people say they could never see a reason for regular folks to fight their own government. I often wonder what it must have been like to live daily under that threat. It was important enough for the writers of the Constitution to put it right behind freedom of just about everything. When you create a town, one of the first things you do is establish law and order. The second amendment does just that. We the people are responsible for the law and order of our country.


"It's a fool that looks for logic in the chambers of the human heart."

Posts: 769 | Registered: Oct 2011 | From: Texas
Unagie
♀ Member
Member # 37091
Default  Posted: 3:13 AM, May 23rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have an aversion to guns. Yes I understand it's the person behind the weapon that does the damage but I can say I still don't like guns. I give those who carry and use them responsibly and legally all the credit in the world. I personally grew up in a horrible neighborhood where bullets flew every weekend, no exaggeration. I've seen multiple people shot and have known people who had a family member get shot and go out and get a gun for some revenge. Guaranteed there would be another ambulance on our block the next weekend. My b/f in high school got held up at gunpoint when coming to pick me up one day. I never backtalked to anyone on the block for fear that they'd pull a gun on me. Insults were not taken lightly there. I know in each instance it was the person behind the gun and not the gun that was the problem but I developed an abhorrence to them. SO wants a permit, hell he wants to be a cop. His dad had a gun collection in his home in NC. When his dad passed we went down and started cataloging all of it. I refused to touch the guns. Once again this is in no way against those who carry legally and safely its just not for me and giving one reason why some have an aversion to them.

I'm glad you attained your goal and feel more confidence in ensuring your safety.


Heartbroken madhatter trying to rebuild

No longer together

"To be loyal to myself is to allow myself to grow and change, and challenge who I am and what I think."


Posts: 2761 | Registered: Oct 2012
Tawnee1969
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Member # 12358
Default  Posted: 3:41 AM, May 23rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

The difference between the US and the UK is Europe as a whole isn't a gun society. The North American continent was the last frontier so to speak. You don't venture into the woods by yourself miles and miles from the nearest human being and not have some form of protection. Because of that, guns have just been a tool of the trade. In Europe, society's elite have always been the ones to have the guns, and the populations have been rather dense for centuries. You never have to go far to find help. The US is only a few hundred years old; it's a young country. A lot of guns from the civil war and such are still around in families, having been passed down.

Same with Oz but we have stricter gun control and less gun murders per head than USA. I am happy I live here and our kids don't have to be frisked at school and can play safely on the street etc. I am soooo lucky to live where I do.


Is the f*cking you're getting, worth the f*cking you're getting?

Posts: 659 | Registered: Oct 2006
idiot85
♂ Member
Member # 38934
Default  Posted: 4:27 AM, May 23rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Living daily under threat would be horrendous, it's happening all over the world.

I think at the time it was written, it was probably a good idea. Nowadays, I root for democracy and if I were American and didn't agree with the government, I'm pretty sure I wouldn't take up arms. I'm sure Americans wouldn't either btw!!


BH-29 (me)
WW-28

Multi famam, conscientiam, pauci verentur.


Posts: 575 | Registered: Apr 2013 | From: Old Blighty
refuz2bavictim
♀ Member
Member # 27176
Default  Posted: 5:47 AM, May 23rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I just wanted you all to know that i am a PROUD Concealed Carry Permit holder now.

And my biggest most heartfelt wish on this earth is that I never ever have to use it.

Congratulations! I completely get the following sentiment. I don't want to HAVE to use it anywhere but the range!

I bought my first gun all by myself! My CC is next on my list.
My application is sitting on my table next to me filled out and ready to take to the courthouse! I won't send it in before my trip out the country next month.

I have this fear that I'll be put on some special-secret naughty list and have to endure extra pat downs!


BS:ME DDay: 7/18/09 Last of TT 7/11/10
MOW's EA/PA all were my "friends" but one


Posts: 2372 | Registered: Jan 2010
wifehad5
♂ Moderator
Member # 15162
Red  Posted: 6:06 AM, May 23rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

A general reminder to all:

Please keep politics out of this discussion. It's great to see the differing views, but politics have no place on SI.


FBH - 42
FWW - 43 (BrokenRoad)
2 kids 7&12

The people you do your life with shape the life you live


Posts: 37393 | Registered: Jun 2007 | From: Michigan
StillGoing
♂ Member
Member # 28571
Default  Posted: 6:58 AM, May 23rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Any time the Romans grew tired of anyone, they confiscated all their weapons. That's part of the reason there is no more Roman Republic. Many of the European countries also have a long history of conscription. Weapons were associated with military. Here, the revolution was fought by a bunch of farmers. When they started getting bullied, the British tried the old confiscate trick.

No, the reason there was no more Roman Republic is because there was a large section of veterans who felt ill used by their government and citizen armies had been replaced by professional standing armies. Those armies became more loyal to their leaders than to their country and in walked people like Caesar to establish the Triumvirate. It had absolutely nothing to do with weapons being taken away - if anything it had everything to do with replacing a citizen conscript army with professional standing armies.

Saying that the United States Revolutionary Army was a bunch of farmers is incredible oversimplification and almost a discredit to people like Von Steuben - while my admiration for Greene is almost childlike awe, the Revolution would have failed were it not for the training and inclusion of professional soldiers.


I hear a lot of people say they could never see a reason for regular folks to fight their own government. I often wonder what it must have been like to live daily under that threat. It was important enough for the writers of the Constitution to put it right behind freedom of just about everything. When you create a town, one of the first things you do is establish law and order. The second amendment does just that. We the people are responsible for the law and order of our country.

Except this has nothing to do with gun regulation. It's an irrelevant talking point because nobody actually wants to own a gun for the sole purpose of keeping the government in check. I think everyone should, and for that purpose, and should be required to drill with a community militia in order to retain citizenship, but most people use this as a reason while looking at firearms as an entitlement similar to vehicles without really grasping the very serious and dangerous nature of these things. It is pure divisive rhetoric to imply that one group is more patriotic than another by waving an amendment that hasn't been honestly employed since the Whiskey Rebellion, IMO.

eta:

If I'm spilling into the political too much I apologize and will back out, the historical stuff has me snared.

[This message edited by StillGoing at 6:59 AM, May 23rd (Thursday)]


"You have insulted my footwear."

Posts: 7483 | Registered: May 2010 | From: USA
aesir
♂ Member
Member # 17210
Default  Posted: 7:19 AM, May 23rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

This is what I, as a Canadian, do not understand about Americans. Unless we hunt, we do not own guns.

Don't hunt, own guns.

If we hunt, our guns are registered. Except that is, the unregistered Saturday night specials that whackos buy in the US and smuggle across the border to use in crimes.

Actually not anymore. After a waste of billions of dollars on a registry that was filled with errors, it was finally abolished. It is only handguns, and a few select rifles that look scary in pictures that need to be registered. And yes, looking scary in pictures was the sole criteria used to make that list according to documents released under Access to Information requests for all documents related to compiling the list. It was a photocopy of the industry catalog with X's through some of the pictures. FTR, Saturday Night Special is actually a racist term used to describe inexpensive handguns which were often the only affordable weapons available within certain socio-economic groups within the US.

I will never understand the obsession people have with gun murders. I think we should be talking about murders period. I personally would not feel any better if instead of being shot they were pushed out of windows. As for other differences between the US and other countries, it is almost impossible to adjust for socio-economic and cultural issues. The US is much more economically stratified than other countries, and North America has much more cultural diversity, which presents a great deal more opportunity for conflict.

CCW permits used to be a "have to know someone" kind of thing until fairly recently. It was only after Florida adopted their policy in 1987 and saw measurable positive results that other states began to issue as well.

I recall reading a study done to determine what training should be required for granting a CCW. The result of the study was that the training required to obtain a permit was a statistically irrelevant factor with respect to public safety related to the permit issue. CCW holders are far less likely to be involved in a wrongful shooting than police, and far less likely to hit an innocent bystander than police. They are also less likely to be involved in other crimes than the police. None of these comments are meant to disparage police, but since they are always being held up as the model (at the very least by themselves), then what does that say about the population that hold CCW's?

As far as the level of training that was found to be statistically irrelevant, well that varies according to jurisdiction. It ranges from something resembling a community college course, to being literate enough to fill out and mail a form. Alaska, Arizona, Arkansas, and Wyoming have recently elected to follow the longstanding example of Vermont and adopt a Constitutional Carry policy wherein a permit is not required. Convicted felons are of course prohibited from possessing firearms under any circumstances.


Your mileage may vary... in accordance with the prophecy.

Do not back up. Severe tire damage.


Posts: 14924 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: Winnipeg
idiot85
♂ Member
Member # 38934
Default  Posted: 7:22 AM, May 23rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

StillGoing- I just wanted to say, because it made me smile, we don't agree on guns but I agree with most of your last post...

I almost went there with the Romans but honestly, they're done to death in schools here so I'm still not ready to talk about them! Haha

I will say that there were many reasons the Roman Republic fell- the fact it wasn't a true republic, internal conflicts, lack of proper soldiers, tax problems, greedy officials, no police is even a factor!

In britain the army were struggling to defend against Germanic tribes- the empire was already weak. This is when we became anglo saxons, until the bloody vikings, then the pesky normans... I digress. There were many reasons, most countries have a bloody gory past- I'd like to think we're more civilised although- I'll say again, a sword would be cool- I wouldn't slay anyone I'd just speak posh and ride a horse.


BH-29 (me)
WW-28

Multi famam, conscientiam, pauci verentur.


Posts: 575 | Registered: Apr 2013 | From: Old Blighty
StillGoing
♂ Member
Member # 28571
Default  Posted: 7:27 AM, May 23rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I want to apologize to Undefinabl3 for derailing that far and say props to you. I think you have a great attitude towards CC and also hope you never have to use it.


"You have insulted my footwear."

Posts: 7483 | Registered: May 2010 | From: USA
Undefinabl3
♀ Member
Member # 36883
Default  Posted: 7:58 AM, May 23rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I want to apologize to Undefinabl3 for derailing that far and say props to you. I think you have a great attitude towards CC and also hope you never have to use it.


Listen the one thing that i LOVE about this place is the mass of information and learning I get.

I dont see it as a derailment, I see it as an oppertunity to learn something new.

There is so much I agree with here that poeople may not think that I do.

1. I don't think that everyone should own a gun. I wish that we didn't have the need for guns (other then for hunting game), but we do.

2. I am just as scare of untrained and uneducated CCW permit holders and carriers as you all are. For everyone one of my DH and I, there are probably 10 or more of those that just want a gun as a deterant and never train with it. We share this fear.

3. I do think that there needs to be more requirements to get a CCW permit. Those that wish to have one should need to complete at least 10 hours on a range with a trainer and take a class in situational awareness.

4. I compeletly respect those that dont want to have anything to do with guns (my mom is one of them, she's already ask that I not wear it when we are out and about together, and I will comply with her wish). I don't want to make people feel uncomfortable, but it's a give and take.

Here where I work we just had an "Empty Holster Protest" because we are a gun free zone. I did it along with just a handful of people. I answered more questions in that week then I have ever in my life.

There were so many people that were like "wow, while I probably wont carry, its really good to talk to someone who does."

It really is about educating yourself, even if you dont want to carry.

I love you guys!!


Me: 31 MH
Him: 37 MH
New online find 6/19/14 - shit

Posts: 1767 | Registered: Sep 2012
idiot85
♂ Member
Member # 38934
Default  Posted: 8:09 AM, May 23rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage


BH-29 (me)
WW-28

Multi famam, conscientiam, pauci verentur.


Posts: 575 | Registered: Apr 2013 | From: Old Blighty
circe
♀ Member
Member # 6687
Default  Posted: 8:28 AM, May 23rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I would be terrified of seeing someone with a gun strapped to them in a grocery store. Sometimes that person is sane and educated, other times that person is a mass murderer. How on earth are you supposed to know which one it is? I would move to another line for certain. No offense.

a scumbag pointed a gun at a mother and her 10 year old daughter and ordered them into their car. He murdered the mother, and raped the 10 year old daughter. Just imagine what the news story had been like if the mom had been armed with a gun.

The headlines would have looked the same, probably. The guy with the gun has planed this, was prepared, was on the offensive and got the jump on her. In movies someone can be at gunpoint and subtly whip a gun out of their purse and get the safety off and point the gun - all without being shot - but in reality? Not likely. The Boston marathon bombers had almost no experience with guns and they managed to kill an armed, trained police officer before he even got his gun out of his holster.

In fact that led to tons of local stories about how many victims ARE found with guns in the house, or in their car, and simply didn't have the chance to get to them.

I also think it's important that couples who have guns agree to go to counseling to deal with any anger issues and acquire better than average communication skills!

[This message edited by circe at 8:28 AM, May 23rd (Thursday)]


Posts: 3193 | Registered: Mar 2005
Undefinabl3
♀ Member
Member # 36883
Default  Posted: 8:50 AM, May 23rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I also think it's important that couples who have guns agree to go to counseling to deal with any anger issues and acquire better than average communication skills!

Ironically DH said after I got the CC Permit "man, i guess i better not piss you off now"....as if.

if he's going out, its by way of a frying pan over his head.


Me: 31 MH
Him: 37 MH
New online find 6/19/14 - shit

Posts: 1767 | Registered: Sep 2012
idiot85
♂ Member
Member # 38934
Default  Posted: 9:30 AM, May 23rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

The frying pan made me laugh- my wife once threw a teapot at me- we both remember it but can't for life of us remember why a teapot was close by- we don't drink much tea and never use a teapot!

This is the same woman that when I was bent over and my butt crack was showing poured boiling water from a kettle down as a joke "oooh sorry!! I didn't know it had boiled" - yeah right, the steam wasn't a give away!!


BH-29 (me)
WW-28

Multi famam, conscientiam, pauci verentur.


Posts: 575 | Registered: Apr 2013 | From: Old Blighty
painpaingoaway
♀ Member
Member # 27196
Default  Posted: 9:47 AM, May 23rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

lighter weight, shorter barrel pistols do have more apparent recoil
Yep, I can vouch for that.


This is the same woman that when I was bent over and my butt crack was showing poured boiling water from a kettle down as a joke "oooh sorry!! I didn't know it had boiled" - yeah right, the steam wasn't a give away!!

Are you kidding me??? And you are still with her????


me BS female 56/him WS 59
Married 33 years
D-day July 09/he gave me his slut's STD
Watch my movie: "My wayward husband's adventures in STD land":
Episode 1: youtu.be/9Jv0-d_CdYc
Episode 2: http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8Tz822H82Gk

Posts: 7099 | Registered: Jan 2010 | From: Coastal South
idiot85
♂ Member
Member # 38934
Default  Posted: 9:50 AM, May 23rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

It wasn't done in anger- she thought it was funny!! It was years and years ago!! Ha


BH-29 (me)
WW-28

Multi famam, conscientiam, pauci verentur.


Posts: 575 | Registered: Apr 2013 | From: Old Blighty
painpaingoaway
♀ Member
Member # 27196
Default  Posted: 10:05 AM, May 23rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

It wasn't done in anger- she thought it was funny!! It was years and years ago!! Ha
Wow, I would hate to see what she does when she IS angry.


me BS female 56/him WS 59
Married 33 years
D-day July 09/he gave me his slut's STD
Watch my movie: "My wayward husband's adventures in STD land":
Episode 1: youtu.be/9Jv0-d_CdYc
Episode 2: http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8Tz822H82Gk

Posts: 7099 | Registered: Jan 2010 | From: Coastal South
idiot85
♂ Member
Member # 38934
Default  Posted: 10:10 AM, May 23rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Just read my profile!!


BH-29 (me)
WW-28

Multi famam, conscientiam, pauci verentur.


Posts: 575 | Registered: Apr 2013 | From: Old Blighty
Topic Posts: 69
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