Blowing everything up right away gives you no chance to do some PI work as it gives them a chance to go further underground..
R requires complete transparency, and she's showing you she's not willing to give you that.
And I agree with Gonna. "Lunch next week?" is WAY to casual for people who haven't spoken in a long time..
Why is everyone saying wait?
1) Blameshifting and gaslighting only add to the anxiety and drama. I didn't like the *tone* of the "lunch next week"....and if there is any chance that something is going on that shouldn't be? She's gonna lie like a rug.
2) It's been a couple of years and *R* is occurring (hopefully). That's enough time to re-set the clock to an *initial*-type confrontation with evidence. As someone who was on the "we are in R"...8 months later....oh wait...."no we aren't. there's something *new*".....for a very long time? The WS gets kinda 'fat & happy' and feels as if *it's in the past*. So new discoveries bring on all of the same old shit, IME.
Unique, you have no idea how much I hope that your wife comes home tonight and tells you that the douche sent her an email and "who the hell does he think he is?!" *fingers crossed*
In my effort to be *concise*, I often come off as blunt and harsh. Sorry, don't mean to be offensive.
All the best to you mate!
My Opinion: People who confront early and don't investigate are chicken. They would rather the WS lie than to have to deal with the truth if it's not good. So they confront early so that a WS can lie, or go more deeply underground by being tipped off.
I think some of it more about personality types.
I don't tend to wait around for long - I hate having things hanging over my head.
It works both ways - I think confronting early kept my WH off balance - he had less time to come up with his blameshifting bull.
I struggle with getting the balance in this - I don't want to be trying to trip my WH up - I just want truth!
Unique, what Gonna said about the "lunch next week" - it sounds like it's something that is more casual than expected if you haven't heard from someone your not supposed to be contacting for two years. I hope that the dude is just a jackwagon and that's how he rolls, but if my wife's AP ever contacted her in that tone I'd probably suspect that they had been in contact. Almost seems there is an implied "Same time as last time" at the end of that. Good luck.
Gaaaah. Hate this drama crap. honestly, I didn't think that I would ever have to worry about that d-bag again--it was only the other OM that I had to worry about.
Someone mentioned that he was probably testing to see if emailing her at work was okay. Well, he's going to find out his answer soon. What a dumb a$$.
I had a few thoughts for you.
1. I agree that you should go into detective mode. Personally, no matter how difficult, I would need to know if they went to lunch this week.
2. Fact: She did delete the email, so there is still a chance that she did not respond. In this scenario, the only problem would be with the timeliness of her telling you.
3. Fact: He sent the email at 10:30 pm, so maybe he was bored, drunk or both.
4. Fact: He did say that he was looking through old emails, which would argue against recent contact, possibly. Yes, the "lunch next week" sounds too familiar, but it could simply be fishing.
5. Fact: She hasn't told you about the email. I don't think this email would be an easy one for her to forget about. After all, she did delete it, twice. But, it may not mean that she has reconnected with him. Se may just be avoiding the uncomfortableness of mentioning it to you. That would be the wrong thing for her to do, but would not point to infidelity, but other issues.
So, the above is the "benefit of the doubt" best case scenario. I hope that is the case.
I just don't see how you will ever really know, since she hasn't said anything, unless you have her followed to lunch every damn day this week. If they don't meet for lunch, you can talk about the email with her next weekend and reassert how important it is that she let you know immediately, etc. You can send a copy of the email to his wife, and I suppose you could call him and tell him to never contact your wife again.
Good luck. Stay strong.
I will see this week and talk to her about it next week, if nothing happens.
Then, I'll send OM's BW a copy of the email.
eta: My anxiety level is about a 7 right now, because there is part of me that thinks she is just uncomfortable bringing it up and doesn't want to rattle any cages. And, she just wants to ignore him and make it go away. (a small part of me...)
Otherwise, it would be a 10+
[This message edited by uniquenewyork at 1:23 PM, June 2nd (Sunday)]
She's a bit of a drama queen and has caused some problems for her in the past.
So your WW inserted herself into another woman's marriage and has the nerve to cry foul when that woman causes her some problems? I think the label drama queen is being applied to the wrong person here. I don't believe your WW. I think there has been other contact or at least attempts.
I would want to know.
I mean, deleting instead of telling you is deceit. She is supposed to tell you, and "I didn't want to upset you" is the very first excuse in the Lying Liars handbook.
"Lunch next week?" May have been real. Or, it may have been testing the work email waters. Either way, this guy has it under some authority that it's ok to reach out to your WW.
Oh, and not telling the OBW what's going on is not ok. Does your wife know WHY this woman causes her drama? Um, because she had an affair with her husband. The remorseful FWS accepts this as part of the package and acts on behalf of TRUTH, not self preservation.
Plain and simple, for SOME reason OM reached out to your WW, whether she invited it or is just being a coward about it. OBW deserves to hear about it. This should also serve as a bucket of ice water if they were trying to fire something else up.
If nothing else, don't let her get away from the "I was trying to spare your feelings" bullcrap. This ain't the minor leagues.
[This message edited by Jrazz at 4:03 PM, June 6th (Thursday)]
For last year's words belong to last year's language
And next year's words await another voice.
And to make an end is to make a beginning. - T.S. Eliot
she was not okay with letting OBS know. She's a bit of a drama queen and has caused some problems for her in the past.
IF there is NC, then she shouldn't give a rat's patooty about telling the BW.
If not, sounds like she's trying to minimize the damage of broken contact all around.
ETA: And let's not forget that despite her telling you she has no interest in contacting him, she still didn't tell you about it right away.
Rather, she read it, then permanently deleted it. I found that odd, seeing her other deleted emails were there.
IMO, that is completely unacceptable.
[This message edited by ajsmom at 4:13 PM, June 6th (Thursday)]
"Truth has no special time of its own. Its hour is now - always." - Albert Schweitzer
Me: BW - Him: 200+ # tumor removed 7/09
DS - 30 - Yikes!
(and I apologize for "drama queen" comment. I meant to say that, since we have known her, which started years before the A started between my W and her H, she has been known to have a bit of a temper--but, then again, my W was apparently not his first A in their marriage.)
And, believe me, I am still very wary of my W's ability to slip back into old habits. I have seen no form of contact between her an this fAP for almost two years. I check her phone/FB/work email/etc., and there has been nothing.
This is NOT to say that this is a clean slate, and at this point, I'm not sure that I would put it past her to be hiding some sort of contact. If she is lying to me now, or if I find or hear anything that contradicts her story to me, then that's it. And, she knows it.
she doesn't want to kick the hornet's nest.
And YOU are part of that hornets nest she refuses to kick. Unless you find out about these things on your own she is showing you that she isn't going to tell you. I think she has you in the same boat at the Other BS. She controls the flow of information through the use of deception, or omission, to avoid discomfort to herself.
Quite frankly, I can't understand why she feels that she should be in the drivers seat here. So what if you get upset. You have the right to be upset. It's not you she's protecting when she doesn't want you to be upset. It's herself.
Are you ok with her making decisions like that for you? I think that's a sign of very very poor boundaries. There are some decisions we simply do not have the right to make for other people. And she is still Ok with doing just that.
I think there is a great deal more here than just a problem of being contacted by the OM. I think the issue of making decisions for others without their permission, or invitation to do so, is going to cause more problems down the road than the ones you are already dealing with.
[This message edited by refuz2bavictim at 4:45 PM, June 6th (Thursday)]
Now that I think about it, she said that she wanted me to tell fAP to back off. Wanting me to do her work for her. And, then she doesn't want tell OBS.
(I told her that she can write the NC letter, then I'll read and send it.)
I will tell OBS. I told her than I hadn't made up my mind. But, now, I don't think that she even needs to know what I do in this regard.
Yeah, this issue is not over, even after our chat the other night.
You: "Hey ( whatever his piece of shit name is), this is Unique. I understand you invited my wife to lunch?"
him: Yeah. So what?
You: what makes you think this is ok?
Him: (listen closely to his answer.)
You: well, I've let your wife know that I don't think it's ok, and now I'm letting you know. So, listen closely. Stay. The. Fuck. Away. From. My. Wife.
Then hang up.
Then tell your wife what EXACTLY what you did and said.
Do you agree?