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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: Betrayed Men - Part 11
DefiledRage
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Member # 39292
Default  Posted: 10:57 AM, July 11th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

her way of showing she was worth his attention.

Mine described it as an obligation. I've felt obligated to do lots of things in my life, never been obligated enough to perform sexual acts though. That's one hell of an obligation...*cough cough*... I mean excuse.


Me:35 WW:34 M:13yrs
3 young children
Dday 1 EA 7/8/2010
Dday 2 PA 3/1/2013 same OMM for 4yrs

Mister rabbit says, "A moment of realization is worth a thousand prayers."


Posts: 429 | Registered: May 2013 | From: Two blocks from south shit and west hell
mike7
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Member # 38603
Default  Posted: 11:03 AM, July 11th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

i wanted to add, the evolutionary difference between men and women makes a wife's infidelity a "qualitative" difference.

I know you guys all know this, but I feel the need to express it anyway because i feel like blabbing.

A woman always knows if it is her child. Therefore, her husband cheating only threatens her sense of protection, partnership in raising the child, and his efforts for the family.

If a wife cheats, a man never knows if the child is his. he may struggle for 20 years to provide for his family, only to find out that he has raised another man's child. Now, I know that the modern view is that love is what matters, and raising any little child is a blessing.

But there are some things we can not override. There are fundamental drives that we can't out think. One of them is the drive to reproduce. So when your wife cheat's, the crime is much more than her simply getting her rocks off. It can deny you the rare right to have a child.

And even if you already have children with her, her cheating awakens that subconscious fear.



BH 53
WW 52
Two kids 21, 18

DDay 1/15/2013


Posts: 261 | Registered: Mar 2013
5454real
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Member # 37455
Default  Posted: 11:05 AM, July 11th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I don't disagree at all. FWW claims that she blew him and had vaginal sex only with POSER. Sexted about anal, but never happened(?). Guess what type of sex is the only kind that doesn't throw the occasional(ok, less frequent) trigger. Shit, she came home with an abrasion on her chin from all the kissing. What am I gonna do?

It's kind of an all or nothing deal. There is a special kind of fucked upness to all of this. The specialness of sex is gone with the one exception and she doesn't really enjoy that one, which kind of takes away the pleasure for me, more lube or not.

So, I'm left with acceptance. That can only occur with her true repentance. I don't have the time nor the inclination to try and deal with my triggers without her total and willing support. I'm too busy working on myself and my esteem issues to let her fucked upness intrude on that.

It seems that the healthier I get, the better the M is becoming. That's only due to her dealing with her own issues as well as dealing with the hurdles I keep throwing in her way. I know she'll fall occasionally, but it's when she doesn't get back up that I'm going to walk.

Strength


BH 50, WW 41
DS 23(Mine),SD 21,SS 19(Hers),DS 8 Ours, DGS 2 1/2
D=Day #1 5/04EA (Rugswept)
D-Day #2 3/10/12, TT til 3/13/12
Married 10yrs
“I have no love for a friend who loves in words alone.”
― Sophocles, Antigone

Posts: 2087 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: midwest
Ascendant
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Member # 38303
Default  Posted: 1:07 PM, July 11th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Mine described it as an obligation. I've felt obligated to do lots of things in my life, never been obligated enough to perform sexual acts though. That's one hell of an obligation...*cough cough*... I mean excuse.

I feel like this thread kind of sheds some light...5th and 6th posts down, I believe.
http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=500088

[This message edited by FacePunched at 1:10 PM, July 11th (Thursday)]


“Anyone who has a continuous smile on his face conceals a toughness that is almost frightening.”

Posts: 1618 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: Illinois
64fleet
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Member # 18710
Default  Posted: 1:19 PM, July 11th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

If a wife cheats, a man never knows if the child is his.

true, I really wonder about my son(13), he looks an awful lot like her boss(a pretty big guy) she had when we first got M'd. My son is taller than her already and outweighs me by 50 lbs at 13. Many pics of her right next to this guy...

Never had a clue back then--I was just too stupid and in love, ya know-someday I'll have to do the DNA thing, just cannot see how... it would crush the boy to know...


time wounds all heels

Posts: 5360 | Registered: Mar 2008 | From: deliverance land
5454real
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Member # 37455
Default  Posted: 2:31 PM, July 11th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

someday I'll have to do the DNA thing, just cannot see how... it would crush the boy to know...

Sorry the question even arises. That's gotta be its own special hell.

To you, would it really make a difference? What would change between you and him? Obvious what would change between you and her, but deep down, you know you are Dad. Always will be.

That said, with that size and weight, doesn't diabetes become a concern? Isn't there a genetic component to that?

TBH, I'm a little scared myself. I'm 5'11 and FWW is 5'8. DS 8 is projected to have a MINIMUM height of 6'4 WTF. The only thing I got that gives a little comfort right now is that DS 23 is 6'3 and was born to XWW who was 5'6.

Testing could be done under the guise of diabetes. If the results came back poorly, would you really need to tell him until health became a concern?

Again, sorry this is even a question.

Strength


BH 50, WW 41
DS 23(Mine),SD 21,SS 19(Hers),DS 8 Ours, DGS 2 1/2
D=Day #1 5/04EA (Rugswept)
D-Day #2 3/10/12, TT til 3/13/12
Married 10yrs
“I have no love for a friend who loves in words alone.”
― Sophocles, Antigone

Posts: 2087 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: midwest
reallyscrewedup7
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Member # 30825
Default  Posted: 2:47 PM, July 11th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

If a wife cheats, a man never knows if the child is his. he may struggle for 20 years to provide for his family, only to find out that he has raised another man's child. Now, I know that the modern view is that love is what matters, and raising any little child is a blessing

This is one topic that I want to say STFU to anyone who thinks they can minimize the BH's pain regarding paternity.

I understand those that mean well in saying things such as "they will always be your children..." But saying that is about as useful as saying 'you won't miss that spleen' after you've been knifed in a mugging.

Mike speaketh the truth. Women will almost always know their biological connection to the children they sacrifice time, sleep, money, and sex to provide a life for them. And the few cases where they might not are turned into Lifetime movies about babies switched at birth. Lord, talk about angst that hits some women when they contemplate that, but meh, who cares who the sperm donor was for this child? Totally irrelevant apparently.

In an era where DNA testing is ubiquitous and thankfully provides reliable data from which to evaluate paternity, we need to realize that not only are the BHs being denied a biological connection to their "children," but the children are being denied a connection to their biological father.

Seriously, what gives a woman a right to make that decision for so many people without consent? The argument that it is in the best interest of the child is specious. It is only in the best interest of the cheating wife.

I'd love to hear one person give a rational argument for why that is morally acceptable when they fire off that BHs should bow to the status quo and quit questioning the paternity of a child likely conceived out of adultery.

I need to go take my blood pressure meds now...

[This message edited by reallyscrewedup7 at 2:48 PM, July 11th (Thursday)]


Infidelity sucks shit

Posts: 879 | Registered: Jan 2011 | From: Finding my way
h0peless
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Member # 36697
Default  Posted: 2:59 PM, July 11th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

This is something that I've struggled with for a long time, not because I had kids with my ex but because all of my younger siblings bear a strong resemblance to my Dad and I don't at all. I do look a lot like my maternal grandfather and while two of my three sibs are reasonably tall (brother is 6'2" and oldest sister is 5'10"), I'm an outlier at 6'8". I've questioned my own paternity for a long time, especially given the fact that my parents' marriage dissolved due to infidelity on both parts.

For me, it wouldn't make any difference. There isn't a whole lot I could do about it anyhow. I don't know if it would make a difference for my dad.


Posts: 1326 | Registered: Sep 2012 | From: Arizona
DWBH
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Member # 35512
Default  Posted: 3:15 PM, July 11th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

If so, does it really matter where he came?

Yeah, to me it does. It was the one thing she's never done for me, in 18 years together. She knew too, as it was the detail she feared most in revealing to me.


Me: BH, 43
Her: FWW, 41 (ThornyRose)
M: 16 years, together 19
2 Daughters: 14 and 12
D Day: 9/25/2011; Lies & TT to 5/4/2012
~Double betrayal; caught them in the act~

Posts: 729 | Registered: May 2012 | From: WI
LosferWords
♂ Guide
Member # 30369
Default  Posted: 3:17 PM, July 11th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

That's gotta be its own special hell.

It really is.

we need to realize that not only are the BHs being denied a biological connection to their "children," but the children are being denied a connection to their biological father.

Another good point.

To you, would it really make a difference? What would change between you and him? Obvious what would change between you and her, but deep down, you know you are Dad. Always will be.

I can answer this question from my perspective, even though you were asking 64fleet. I'd still like to hear what 64fleet has to say, too.

I always have had a very close and loving bond with my son, and that did not change even after I got the results back from the DNA test that showed he wasn't biologically mine. This happened when he was almost seven years old. If anything, I've been even MORE protective of him, partly because of the bond he is missing, like the quote from reallyscrewedup7 above, even though my son doesn't know about it yet.

One thing that truly does bother me is that my son is a constant reminder of OM. That's just something that I've learned to suck up and deal with, in order to be a better father to my child.

Father's Day is a really tough holiday for me these days.

[This message edited by LosferWords at 3:39 PM, July 11th (Thursday)]


Posts: 4581 | Registered: Dec 2010
5454real
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Member # 37455
Default  Posted: 3:42 PM, July 11th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

DWBH,

I'm not in any way implying that it shouldn't bother you. Shit, the whole thing in and about it is/should be a deal breaker. It's when we try to R that acceptance is in play. Hence, he was going to cum, if it isn't a deal breaker outright, does it matter where?

What has she done/can she do to set this matter right? Or as right as it will ever be. Will/is this the deal breaker for you? Does she do it now? Personally I wouldn't accept no as an answer. Don't know how that would hit me though.

RSU,

I'd love to hear one person give a rational argument for why that is morally acceptable when they fire off that BHs should bow to the status quo and quit questioning the paternity of a child likely conceived out of adultery.

Hope I didn't give the impression of questioning the paternity. Absolutely question. Was asking about the results of the question. What effect would it have on the father child dynamic, not the pain it would cause.

Losfer,

I always have had a very close and loving bond with my son, and that did not change even after I got the results back from the DNA test that showed he wasn't biologically mine. This happened when he was almost seven years old. If anything, I've been even MORE protective of him, partly because of the bond he is missing, like the quote from reallyscrewedup7 above, even though he doesn't know about it yet.

I am humbled by your response. You are a great Dad.


BH 50, WW 41
DS 23(Mine),SD 21,SS 19(Hers),DS 8 Ours, DGS 2 1/2
D=Day #1 5/04EA (Rugswept)
D-Day #2 3/10/12, TT til 3/13/12
Married 10yrs
“I have no love for a friend who loves in words alone.”
― Sophocles, Antigone

Posts: 2087 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: midwest
DefiledRage
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Member # 39292
Default  Posted: 6:27 PM, July 11th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

5454:
Completely hear what your saying. If R is to happen , probably need to find a way to compartmentalize it with the other physical acts that also took place.

MissesJai had to it about right in that other thread. My ww was using sexual currency as a way to keep the emotional validation coming. She's never been over sexual to begin with, even in our hayday of youth. Made it all the more surprising she would do it with anyone else.

Therein is part of the problem with the whole BJ thing. For the majority of our dating and marriage it was never a problem, then one day (well before she even knew the poser) she was just done doing that. To dirty and degrading she says. So now she's doing that for the Poser but not me. Insulting yes!

Besides I don't have to look at her crotch everyday, but I do have to look at her face. Mind-movies galore.


Me:35 WW:34 M:13yrs
3 young children
Dday 1 EA 7/8/2010
Dday 2 PA 3/1/2013 same OMM for 4yrs

Mister rabbit says, "A moment of realization is worth a thousand prayers."


Posts: 429 | Registered: May 2013 | From: Two blocks from south shit and west hell
MC_Jack
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Member # 35016
Default  Posted: 11:48 PM, July 11th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Well I was still interested in the opinion range regarding Michelle Langley and her books.

I happenned to find a 'misplaced' PDF copy of Women's Infidelity 2 on the Internet. I've read about 2/3 of it skipping around.

It is kind of a complete turnaround from the first book. It is written to be a personal consult with a WW. She points out in the fictional dialog that the WW is "emotionally abusing" her BH by having an affair, and that this fictional WW is being cruel and only hurting her BH by cake-eating. Finally, she recommends that the WW comes 100% clean by confessing.

So what have I concluded? Well I take back what I said previously. Ms. Langley is merely a clever aggregator and repackager of others' ideas. If the first book was tailored for the market segment of remorseless entitlement minded WWs, she quickly figured out that she needed another offering to different minded cheaters. Maybe she took a lot of criticism to heart.

It is a quick read, she is no TS Eliot. Anyone here could have written it. Maybe WAL has a pseudonym and is a shameless profiteer?

[This message edited by MC_Jack at 11:49 PM, July 11th (Thursday)]


I am not a marriage counselor. I chose "MC Jack" in the spirit of a handle like "MC Hammer" or Young MC"...there is a lot of 'rapping' here, no? At the time I did not know what MC stood for on this site. Duh.

Posts: 792 | Registered: Mar 2012 | From: West Coast of Hopa-hopa-land
LosferWords
♂ Guide
Member # 30369
Default  Posted: 1:39 AM, July 12th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks, 5454. In all honesty, my son really is an exquisite and wonderful young man, which makes it that much easier for me to love him and go to bat for him. I'm willing to bet that you and most of the other guys on this thread would do the same thing for your kids if put in the same position. Can't say the same about the general population, but I feel confident in saying that about the men on this site, and the men on this thread. Thanks for the kind words.

Posts: 4581 | Registered: Dec 2010
LosferWords
♂ Guide
Member # 30369
Default  Posted: 2:34 AM, July 12th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

For me, it wouldn't make any difference. There isn't a whole lot I could do about it anyhow. I don't know if it would make a difference for my dad.

h0peless - I'm sorry you have that question in your mind about your biological paternity. I will say that I am close friends with a couple of other guys on this site in the same situation that I am in, and they have the same attitude towards their kids that I do. I hope that helps a bit. I strongly believe that my son would have been in my life no matter what. In some sort of spiritual way, I believe he chose me to be his dad. The fact that there is a biological breakage is on my wife, not on me, or my son. That bond is golden, and not a thing can break it.

I don't chime in here much, but I really appreciate the issue of paternity being brought up, because it is an issue that is very close to home for me, and it is more common than it is generally talked about. Sometimes I feel like a bit of a loner because of this particular issue.

Thanks bringing this up, and thanks for hearing me, guys.

Shit... it's now officially Friday. What kind of beer are you all drinking this weekend?


Posts: 4581 | Registered: Dec 2010
aesir
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Member # 17210
Default  Posted: 3:37 AM, July 12th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

64, Bit of a suggestion regarding the testing, instead of going with a full blown DNA paternity test, you might want to consider making a family project out of something like the Ancestry DNA project. You send in samples, and they trace the genes back to historic regional and ethnic groups, and tell you where your ancestry comes from. Your sons ancestry should look like an average of you and your wife.

Now since I seem to have brought up a whole lot of more painful sex act triggers for people, I thought maybe I should explain how the book can make blow jobs a trigger, and since with these books we are really through the looking glass anyway, I am going to protect those who want protection by burying the details in the middle of Jabberwocky by Lewis Carrol.

`Twas brillig, and the slithy toves Did gyre and gimble in the wabe: All mimsy were the borogoves, And the mome raths outgrabe. "Beware the Jabberwock, my son! The jaws that bite, the claws that catch! Beware the Jubjub bird, and shun The frumious Bandersnatch!" There is a section in the book titled something like Men Send Flowers, Women Give Blow Jobs. The premise, which I found to be true, is that a WW in switching allegiance to an AP will feel bad about having intercourse with her BH, but in order to provide cover for the affair and to keep the BH on the hook as plan B will offer blowjobs whenever it seems they are losing control of the game. Michelle Langley even states that she can often predict the frequency of the blow jobs offered by the cheater. He took his vorpal sword in hand: Long time the manxome foe he sought -- So rested he by the Tumtum tree, And stood awhile in thought. And, as in uffish thought he stood, The Jabberwock, with eyes of flame, Came whiffling through the tulgey wood, And burbled as it came! One, two! One, two!And through and through The vorpal blade went snicker-snack! He left it dead, and with its head He went galumphing back. "And, has thou slain the Jabberwock? Come to my arms, my beamish boy! O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!' He chortled in his joy. `Twas brillig, and the slithy toves Did gyre and gimble in the wabe; All mimsy were the borogoves, And the mome raths outgrabe.

[This message edited by aesir at 3:40 AM, July 12th (Friday)]


Your mileage may vary... in accordance with the prophecy.

Do not back up. Severe tire damage.


Posts: 14924 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: Winnipeg
HoldingTogether
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Member # 29429
Default  Posted: 7:29 AM, July 12th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Seems like about once or twice a year somebody posts the "Magic Eyes" story over in Recon. I understand the allegory, I get the point, it has some merit I guess, but that story consistently just rubs me the wrong fucking way.

I've decided that all the story needed was some minor tweaking. A little bit of a rewrite, just to tighten it up a bit. So I went ahead and posted a new, BH friendly version of the story onto the thread and, at the risk of seeming a bit self promoting, I am pretty pleased with the results. Check it out if you like:

http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=501490

I think most of the guys here might appreciate the edits I have made.

HT


Me:BH 41
Her:FWW40(Walkinoneggshellz)
2 Beautiful little girls 13&10
Dday: 7/24/10 1yr EA turned 5 monthPA
"I gotta hole in me now... I got a scar I can talk about."

Posts: 339 | Registered: Aug 2010 | From: New Life
jjct
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Member # 17484
Default  Posted: 7:31 AM, July 12th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Well done aesir!
Nothing like a little Jabberwocky genius to pull me out of the woodwork.

I'm not lost.
Just - as per Starfleet Regulation 2089.56 - taking it slow.

444))) & others being turned into the thing she made you -
check out "Projective Identification"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Projective_identification

Must. Avoid.

Unpacking Rotating Polyandry is a sweet and sour present.

I've been looking for *things that are true no matter what* & RP provides some clues.
wal, ats, aesir, & the brainiac otherbrothers would call it 'meta-analysis' I think, though I've never meta analysis I didn't like, so I'm biased...

- Men and women are different.
(I'm simple - so I gotta start simple)
- As we are hard-wired to be attracted to physical beauty,
women hard-wiredly respond to strength, safety, security.

It is the homologue; the "like this/like that" equivalent, as the toes are the lower extremity homologue of the fingers.

I think there's another.

Being faithful is a choice.
- for us to overcome the hardwiring
- for them to overcome their polyandric impulses

Don't know enough about 'them' yet, I'm definitely tuned to it. Radar Love baby!
...but for me the choice is not just simply keeping my dick in my pants, it extends to my eyes.
Also my ears.
It's why I require silence.
There's way too much cultural noise bent on obfuscating the truth. I will not have it.

Back to pathfinderin...and making more entries into 'Shit I Was Right About'

(The opening chapter's really long though - it's 'Shit I Was Wrong About')
Carry on Brothers!


Posts: 6032 | Registered: Dec 2007 | From: texas
jjct
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Member # 17484
Default  Posted: 7:36 AM, July 12th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

HT - like!
One change.
It's not traffic in Heaven that sucks, bro.

Posts: 6032 | Registered: Dec 2007 | From: texas
Tred
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Member # 34086
Default  Posted: 7:36 AM, July 12th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

HT,

Nice brother! That was worthy.

ETA: Welcome back JJ! Been missing your poetic logic.

[This message edited by Tred at 7:38 AM, July 12th (Friday)]


Married: 16 years (14 @JFO)
D-Day: 11/09/11
"Ohhhhh...shut up Tred!" - NOT the official SI motto (DS)

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