[This message edited by Why?? at 8:18 AM, June 23rd (Sunday)]
Youtube notwithstanding, I can't see getting both top and bottom at the same time. It doesn't take long to do both
(There's a video at Huffington Post, of all places, that describes how I do it: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/03/12/tightlining-eyeliner-makeup-tips_n_2853595.html)
I don't use kohl (too harsh for my coloring and age); you can use any gel or powder you like. (I especially like the powders that work well wet.)
After "experimenting" for what suits me, I lightly line the bottom outer lash area and then rub the eye pencil on each inner forefinger, one at a time, and smudge the top of each eye for a smokey look. I don't go up to my eyebrow and stay within the area of the eye but this gives depth and an over all exotic look.
I can't use any mascara so when I do the last pat down with neutral face powder, I close my eyes and pat it lightly there as well to help it to "stay". It will easily last over 8 hours plus.
My friend has large/wide upper eye lids & uses a wet fine brush eyeliner right over her top eyelid (next to the lashes) but this works well for her -- not me.
I guess I need to just practice some more with this. I do like how it kinda smudges a bit under my eye creating a smokey effect. The women doing the tutorials really make it look easy!!
Is Av. the name of the brand or an abbreviation, dreamlife?
There were really great reviews for a Guerlain powder kohl eyeliner on Sephora. Will wait on that before I try powder kohl
An eye pencil made in Germany of very high quality n waterproof to boot! Just a few dollars on sale so I get a bunch.
I also bought the Big Pencil in Night Glisten recently ~ wow!
I have received many compliments throughout the years for my "exotic smokey eyes".
It takes me less than 3 minutes to wash my face, brush my teeth, jump into my jeans, top, and "put my face on".
I can go as light or as smokey as I want.
*Practice makes perfect*