We WANT to trust. We don't want to expose ourselves to the truth because it HURTS. But, like the kid who eventually has to find out about Santa Claus, we cannot heal from the things we don't know about.
Find out. Poly. Var. Whatever it takes. There is very little chance you got infected long ago. This is on him.
There are so many red flags in your story, in my opinion, the chances that he's NOT cheating are incredibly low. Especially how he reacted when you walked into his office, and the fact that the tart he was with knew SOOO much about your family. Her talking about her own H is pretty classic also... "throw the BS off by telling her I'm married too so she thinks I'm a safe friend for WS".
As I am longer on "the other side", it is coming to light that no matter what -on earth or in hell-I did to "be a better wife", THERE WAS NOTHING. If cheating is going to happen, it's inevitable and nothing you could do will prevent it. I'm sorry if that's harsh, but I learned that from life and having mine and my children's life ruined at the hands of a cheating man.
I made myself physically and emotionally ill and a pawn in his hands, until I had the full knowledge of what he was really doing.
And I will tell you that he acted much as yours does-he was also very angry and shocked when I brought up the STD part of it all. He worked very hard to get out of being tested, when he could have been all done. And what I think now, is that it was forcing him to admit what he had been doing-to me and to others. He would have to look it in the eye. Many song and dance routines were to follow and that was a huge red flag.
Yes, the attitude of your WH bothers me. I saw that and even was yelled at by Happy Pants (formerly called Perv) and he defended OW and at times called me a liar.
It only took one or two "conversations" to realize that I was not going to get anywhere and his attempt at reconcilating were not real.
My STD results they tested while I go for pregnancy appointments and luckily have been all negative, but I do not mention this to Happy Pants. He didn't take things seriously before, so why would he now?
I also agree with the other posts that talked about the person your WH was with at work ...it doesn't sit well with me and that he was doing it in a room full of coworkers-just associating even at close range-it's so disrespectful to you.
Sorry for the long post, but the red flags are adding up.
There's a lot for you to think about now as you no doubt are and the quieter you can do so, the more beneficial it will be in the long run. Yes, the more you speak of it to him, the more clues it gives him.
The hardest part for me has been the shock of learning that the man I loved for 20 years is no longer even my friend or on my side. He is very willing to take from me and hurt me without second thought and at times I don't even know it.
The times, they are'a changin'! -Bob Dylan
There's just too much there for it not to be something, I'm sorry to say.
I still think you should stop talking to him and go deep into detective mode. If you keep talking to him- and listening to him- he will twist your mind up like you wouldn't believe. Take it from all of us who've been there.
I'm sorry you are dealing with this, but you aren't alone. We're all here for you.
I dealt with a lot of "I thought you just got it from some other way" kind of BS stories from him before he finally admitted to the affair. Everything was all jumbled up for me...but finding out I had HPV was the last straw in which I finally got my H to admit to the affair that I had already knew took place deep in my heart.
Please, please, please go with your GUT! I went against my gut feelings for SO long that my H had manipulated the truth so much that now I am still confused b/c he had made up so many stories! It is sad b/c you WANT to trust your spouse! you WANT what they are telling you to be true....unfortunately they often use this blind trust against us BS's.
Take care of yourself and get a full panel of STD testing...also ask for the test for Herpes as well!
Welcome to the best group you never wanted to be a part of.
Based on your comments about your WH's response, it appears he immediately tried to claim HE must have had it dormant for all these years.
Sorry, that is incriminating right there. He knows he now has HPV. He probably had a flare up of it while you were out of the country. His response was an attempt to explain away how he contracted it.
Your daughter commenting on the maybe OW is another huge red flag. Like another poster said, how the heck would she know how much your daughter has grown?
PLUS, this woman knows WAY TOO MUCH about your marriage. Your WH is sharing way too much personal information.
Lastly, my WH blew off Mother's day and my birthday during his A. He got absolutely vicious with the kids when they begged him to take them out to get me a present. In fact, all I got for my bday was an infection that looked an awful lot like trich, which my WH gave me the prescription for trich for, but which my WH insisted was a yeast infection. Giving me an antibiotic for a yeast infection makes no sense. I suspected something then, but told myself "No, can't be".
Listen to your gut HPV50. Your WH gave you an STD. If the OW has one, she very well could have others. She could also very well be sleeping with other people.
Take the 3% with a grain of salt HPV50. In reality, there is no way for researchers to absolutely determine when and where an individual has been infected, Period.
The researchers would have to obtain annual medical records for a HUGE number of people who went to the doctor every year for 20+ years and were tested. The researchers just aren't going to be able to do find those people and get those records.
That 3% are those people who the researchers really can not determine when they contracted the virus. Dormancy is only one possible explanation.
That 3% of "possibly dormant" people probably include women who have had normal pap smears for years and then their WH cheats and BOOM they test positive.
He probably doesn't think you will take him up on it - I mean he has offered so he must be telling the truth right????
You need to follow through - he may think he can beat it, you won't go through with it or you may end up with a car-park confession. What ever - it can give you piece of mind.
Get a VAR and put it in his car!
do you know his passwords to the computer?
try to get all of his phone records , and like the others have said try either a VAR (voice activated recorder) and/or a key logger on his computer to monitor who he emails.
Do not feel guilty.
This is war.
You are fighting to save your marriage.
The bottom line is that you will not feel secure again until you know the truth.
And you cannot begin to reconcile until he faces what he did and is honest and transparent about everything.
And like others have said...they lie.
When I first confronted my FWH about the suspicious overly friendly emails that I found (and I confronted him in a psychologist's office to have a third party there)my FWH's first instinct was to lie and say that he and the married co-worker were just friends and the emails were just friendly.
It took me three hours at home that night to finally get to the bottom of it all.
It was quite a scene....and it escalated as my gut kept telling me to continue to dig...I made him call the OW in front of me to tell her no more inappropriate emails.
During this call he slipped up and due to this I realized that it was much more.
that was when he finally fessed up to the truth.
It was much more than an innocent office friendship.
It was a 5 year LTA!
They lie until you have concrete proof to confront them with.
You sound level headed and wise as does your daughter. Get to the bottom of this and put the var in the car. I really think this will give you answers. It is the
time in yourshould be happy and independent. Kids are older and you can spend time on you. Think long and hard about what you want from this next phaof life. I know it is hard when the person you thought had your back put the knife in it.
180 and investigate. Hugs my friend.
[This message edited by LisaReg at 5:46 PM, June 29th (Saturday)]
My situation, I sensed something wasn't right about 2 years earlier but I did not have any evidence. I did ask him "Do you have a girlfriend? Are you seeing someone?" but he dismissed it/gaslighted me.
I read the responses and I think people are giving you good advice. I do think you might want to consider if your H is addicted to porn. People with ADHD have a tendency towards porn and affairs and secret lives.
I'm not sure what benefit there is to further sleuthing. I think you know enough already - he is cheating. TRUST YOUR INSTINCT. Do not ignore it. Cheating is usually about opportunity...and he certainly had it.
He did slip up, a little, today in MC. We were discussing boundaries, and I said that in light of our circumstances, thought i was perfectly appropriate to limit his conersations with his coworker to professional ones (eg not discussing me or the kids). He immediately said that he didnt want me leasing him too much, that he didn't have any friends and thought it was perfectly fine to discuss my job and work situation with his coworker because she also has a spouse in the same business (academics). He had told me that they weren't even remotely "friends" previously. Any way, within five minutes he made the statement that she was "one of many women I work with and no different." we'll...is she an important friend with which to commiserate, or isn't she? I immediately called him on the contradiction, and he had no response. The MC let it go, but granted, it was our first session, and she asked that the next one be solo with me. Oh, he also said that while she was in her current position for 6 months, she's worked at the church for several years, which is supposedly why she knew my daughter had grown. It still seems weird, though.
Thanks for helping me make a decision: I'm going to audit the hell out of him. I used to be a pretty decent auditor, so why NOT put those skills to use? So he probably didn't use his personal cell phone or our VISA; what else can I think of? They used to train us to think like a thief, so here goes...
List of stuff to investigate:
--work credit card
--work land line
--cash from an old bank account in his name
--personal cell phone deleted texts (he may not realize these can be restored)
--personal email deleted records
--His office desk
--His office computer
the first two I'll need his help with, but he's the CFO, so I know he has access, and those records can't be destroyed. Ill ask for these last so he wont know im auditing him. The last two I can access by showing up "too early" for a meeting with him. Lately I've been dropping by his office a lot more to establish territory so to speak (how desperate does that sound), and noticed the secretary is happy to let me into his office before he arrives. He's a memento saver of sorts, so my guess is that if they exist, they'll be in his desk. Ditto with his calendar, which is only on his work pc. I'll also have to ask him for personal email codes, but again, doubt he realizes some deleted emails can be restored. The good part in all this is that it gives me something to do that I actually can control, yay. so much is out of control lately...
The shocking part of all this is that ive been assuming he cheated while I was overseas only, but now I'm beginning to wonder if you guys are right, and he may still be seeing someone. My IC says its also possible this is an earlier stage EA, but regardless, it sucks.
p.s. I'll try a VAR in his car and maybe office.
* gym bag
* car - center console, glovebox, trunk, wheel well, under floor mats
* all pockets of all pants, work jackets, work shirts
* bathroom drawer
* tool bench & tool box
* file cabinet
I found a treasure trove of disgusting stuff in a box that contained STBX's old resumes. I also found hair-raising pictures in a box right next to our church registration.
Also forgot to mention that he offered to take a poly. He wouldn't do that if he was lying, would he?
Yeah, he would; as confused615 said, it's when push comes to shove that it matters...and oftentimes they (WSs) think that the offer's going to assuage your concern. Mine offered, too.
Listen to your gut is the best possible advice. Not a one of us here thought we would be in the position we found ourselves, I think; none of this was supposed to happen. No one wants you to be joining this not-so-merry throng, but it sure sounds like something hinky may be going on. The fact that you *feel* something is wrong is paramount.
Going into information-gathering mode may be key right now. Best of luck to you; sucks to be in this position, but I'm glad you found SI...people here will help you figure out what's really going on.
[This message edited by sad12008 at 10:26 PM, June 29th (Saturday)]